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Graphical Fidelity I Expect This Gen

SlimySnake

Flashless at the Golden Globes
Did you guys see that TLOU Part 1 on PC is steam deck verified? Thats a 1.6 tflops handheld GPU lmao. Sony tried to pass it off as a next gen only game. I remember Neil saying something like how his mind was blown when seeing the graphics lol.

It was always a PS4 game. I lost brain cells trying to argue that here on gaf.

Oh and apparently Factions is also on PS4. This is a never ending nightmare.
 
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Speaking of PS4 games, I'm replaying Uncharted 4 on PS5 after playing TLOU Remake, and it's not nearly the night-and-day difference I expected. They both look good, but I expected more from TLOU, considering it's six years on from U4.

What happened to the constant graphical bar-raising? Did Fortnite come along and convince the money-lenders that graphics don't matter like they used to? The Matrix demo was hands-down the most impressed I've been this gen, but no one's released a full game up to that standard yet. Muy sadioso.
 

Edder1

Member
Did you guys see that TLOU Part 1 on PC is steam deck verified? Thats a 1.6 tflops handheld GPU lmao. Sony tried to pass it off as a next gen only game. I remember Neil saying something like how his mind was blown when seeing the graphics lol.

It was always a PS4 game. I lost brain cells trying to argue that here on gaf.

Oh and apparently Factions is also on PS4. This is a never ending nightmare.
People arguing with you must have been straight up retards since TLOU1 looks exactly the same as TLOU2, lol. The game literally pulls assets from the second game. Some of the takes here in GAF just turn me off from engaging with comments, that's why I rarely ever get involved in these types of conversations.
 
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SlimySnake

Flashless at the Golden Globes
Speaking of PS4 games, I'm replaying Uncharted 4 on PS5 after playing TLOU Remake, and it's not nearly the night-and-day difference I expected. They both look good, but I expected more from TLOU, considering it's six years on from U4.

What happened to the constant graphical bar-raising? Did Fortnite come along and convince the money-lenders that graphics don't matter like they used to? The Matrix demo was hands-down the most impressed I've been this gen, but no one's released a full game up to that standard yet. Muy sadioso.
Yes and no. Fortnite convinced Sony to invest in not one, not two but 12 GaaS games over the next 3 years. Instead of investing in the single player 30 fps cinematic graphical powerhouses they have been shipping since they revamped their first party studios in the early PS3 era.

GaaS needs a bigger audience so they've come out and said PS5 and PC GaaS games will launch simultaneously which means these previously single SKU coding to the metal devs now have become multiplatform devs who not only have to target 60 fps but also shitty PCs and PS4 specs to reach a bigger audience. I remember a few years ago replying to someone about why multiplatform games are bad for gamers, and listing out all of these potential issues that we're now seeing play out in realtime. Game delays. Poor polish and straight up broken performance modes from prestige studios like GG who had to spend over half a year fixing the Horizon PC port. And just a lack of ambition in general. SSM and GG both went on record and said that their vision wasn't held back by the PS4, and then shipped the game with some of the most underwhelming final battles ever. GG straight up put the final battle in a cutscene lol. With ND now handling the TLOU Part 1 PC port internally, it's obvious that their resources are stretched thin and its undoubtedly affecting their next gen game's reveal.

I said no because TLOU remake is a different story. it was not an ND game. It was a VSG studios game that ND took over after shipping TLOU2 in 2020 with Neil busy with the show and having lined up nothing for the studio to work on. They simply took over what was a PS4 game and shipped it as a PS5 game likely for political reasons, but it was a PS4 game from day one. ND actually forced neil to leave the show mid production because they were like we cant be working on last gen remakes and GaaS games while you go off make TV shows. True story. So TLOU Part 1 is a slightly different story. Their next SP game will look a gen ahead of TLOU and Uncharted. Just wait till 2026-2028.

P.S The Horizon MP leak is a perfect example of the fornite effect. They couldve made a stunning PvE game with next gen Horizon graphics but they chose to make a cheap fortnite clone instead. Why? Because who gives a shit about pushing the bar in a game that is chasing whales.
 

SlimySnake

Flashless at the Golden Globes
Dont remember if this was posted (i vaguely recall posting this but dont see it) but saw this on era a couple of days ago.

This is what next gen can do.



10 tflops and 8 core 16 thread CPUs should be able to handle particles and physics simulations like this at a way better graphics fidelity than RE4, TLOU or even HFW. Maybe they might have to settle for 1080p-1440p 30 fps but definitely doable. Absolutely stunning stuff.
 

ChiefDada

Gold Member
People arguing with you must have been straight up retards since TLOU1 looks exactly the same as TLOU2, lol.

Demonstrably false. You can argue it isn't a generational leap, and I'll concede it's debatable. But your sentence, as stated, is easily disproven.



The game literally pulls assets from the second game. Some of the takes here in GAF just turn me off from engaging with comments, that's why I rarely ever get involved in these types of conversations.

Alanis Morissette Reaction GIF by MOODMAN
 

ChiefDada

Gold Member
From what I've seen the cutscenes are the only part that got any kind of upgrade. The actual gameplay looks effectively identical to me.

Ok, sounds like you didn't play it. As with any game, some levels are much more graphically intensive and impressive than others. For example, sewer level is a standout.

And who cares about cutscenes? This is a game we're talking about.

Who cares about cutscenes in a narrative driven, cutscene-heavy game?

Volunteer Hand Up GIF by Robert E Blackmon
 

Hunnybun

Member
Ok, sounds like you didn't play it. As with any game, some levels are much more graphically intensive and impressive than others. For example, sewer level is a standout.



Who cares about cutscenes in a narrative driven, cutscene-heavy game?

Volunteer Hand Up GIF by Robert E Blackmon

I freely admit I didn't play it - the main reason why not was that it looked like a totally half-arsed version of a next gen game.

My opinion is based on what it looks like on youtube vs what other next gen games look like on youtube. I understand that's not perfect but in my experience watching games on YT on a laptop tends to actually overstate how good they'll look on a big 4k tv. Obviously watching YT on a 4k tv is awful but I never do that and I'd certainly never judge a game by it.

And I've never got the cutscene thing. To me they always look shit because they're directly inviting comparison with actual filmed content, which is just never going to stand up. And all the assets are suddenly up close and exposed to scrutiny they just weren't designed for. Yeah I just don't get it really. Whether they look shit, or slightly less or slightly more shit - I find it hard to care tbh.
 

Edder1

Member
Demonstrably false. You can argue it isn't a generational leap, and I'll concede it's debatable. But your sentence, as stated, is easily disproven.





Alanis Morissette Reaction GIF by MOODMAN

Lol, you literally just posted exactly the same picture with slightly different lighting with warmer colour profile (as 01011001 01011001 below me also pointed out). There's zero deference in terms of rendering and you call that a leap in graphial fidelity??? I just can't... In the end you only proved my point.
 
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SlimySnake

Flashless at the Golden Globes
This is from TLOU2. It's the same damn engine. They might have changed some of the character models a bit but its the same PS4 engine.

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For some reason, youtube just recommended me John's 50 minute wankfest on TLOU Part 1 where he goes through each scene to show how light sources properly light up the environments, as if thats the most next gen thing we've ever seen lol. But I noticed just how poor the character models looked during gameplay even when compared to the PS3 game. yes, its an upgrade over the PS3 version, but Joel's character model during gameplay looks really bad when compared to other last gen games like HFW. The same exact issue was in TLOU2 which had drastically low quality character models during gameplay with zero hero lighting. I was shocked to see ND not employ any kind of hero lighting and how their so-called cutscene quality character models still looked extremely bad.

I mean wtf is this? Timestamped:



nSsGzf2.jpg


The environments got a big leap over the PS3 game, but the ingame character models? really meh upgrade over the PS3 and a non-existent leap over the PS4 only TLOU2. You have all this extra horsepower, Cerny's secret sauce, and you cant make these character models look like horizon forbidden's character models during gameplay?

I mean the fact that GG upgraded the ingame character models WHILE being forced to release the game on last gen systems was proof that they not only put in more effort into their game but also that ND phoned in their so-called PS5 only remake.
 

SlimySnake

Flashless at the Golden Globes
Going through my old pics and man, TLOU2 cutscene models are still the best ever. Just put them in during gameplay with some hero lighting and we're good for next gen.

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Or you know, just give us what they promised at E3 2018 on the PS4 Pro. The fact that they couldnt even do that on the PS5 is so goddamn disappointing. It was running on the goddamn PS4 Pro. Just go back to that old code/old engine and use those character models instead. Why use the launch TLOU2 downgraded code/engine for a game you are going to release as a PS5 only game??

YFFP314.gif


TLOU2_Screen_PS4Pro_E32018_00004_1528773866-1.jpg

the_last_of_us_part_2-5.jpg

the_last_of_us_part_2-3.jpg
 
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Jrecard

Member
Did you guys see that TLOU Part 1 on PC is steam deck verified? Thats a 1.6 tflops handheld GPU lmao. Sony tried to pass it off as a next gen only game. I remember Neil saying something like how his mind was blown when seeing the graphics lol.

It was always a PS4 game. I lost brain cells trying to argue that here on gaf.

Oh and apparently Factions is also on PS4. This is a never ending nightmare.
I agree with you about TLOU Part 1 being a PS4 game, but the deck has taken on multiple next gen only (or what should have been next gen only - like cp2077 and likely hogwarts) games. The 720/30fps floor + fsr helps it a lot, it's not really indicative of how good games can look on the upper end.
 

SlimySnake

Flashless at the Golden Globes
I agree with you about TLOU Part 1 being a PS4 game, but the deck has taken on multiple next gen only (or what should have been next gen only - like cp2077 and likely hogwarts) games. The 720/30fps floor + fsr helps it a lot, it's not really indicative of how good games can look on the upper end.
well, CP2077 was designed to run on a 1.3 tflops x1 and so was hogwarts. They are not next gen only games by any means.

I think a good test is the Matrix and other UE5 demos. You can find videos of people running matrix on steam deck but its a disaster. DF tested the UE5 valley of the ancient demo and found it to be straight up broken on the steam deck even at 360p fsr'd to 720p capped at 20 fps.

All of these so called last gen games like TLOU remake, Suicide Squad, Deathloop, Ghostwire tokyo, Gotham Knights and Hogwarts were designed on last gen consoles and simply ported up to PS5.

Timestamped:
 

OCASM

Banned
But I noticed just how poor the character models looked during gameplay even when compared to the PS3 game. yes, its an upgrade over the PS3 version, but Joel's character model during gameplay looks really bad when compared to other last gen games like HFW. The same exact issue was in TLOU2 which had drastically low quality character models during gameplay with zero hero lighting. I was shocked to see ND not employ any kind of hero lighting and how their so-called cutscene quality character models still looked extremely bad.

I mean wtf is this? Timestamped:



nSsGzf2.jpg


The environments got a big leap over the PS3 game, but the ingame character models? really meh upgrade over the PS3 and a non-existent leap over the PS4 only TLOU2. You have all this extra horsepower, Cerny's secret sauce, and you cant make these character models look like horizon forbidden's character models during gameplay?


Yep, the lack of SSAO is extremely evident. U4 looks better overall.

Can't trust ND when they reveal their next PS5 game. Chances of a downgrade are high.
 

rofif

Can’t Git Gud
Speaking of PS4 games, I'm replaying Uncharted 4 on PS5 after playing TLOU Remake, and it's not nearly the night-and-day difference I expected. They both look good, but I expected more from TLOU, considering it's six years on from U4.

What happened to the constant graphical bar-raising? Did Fortnite come along and convince the money-lenders that graphics don't matter like they used to? The Matrix demo was hands-down the most impressed I've been this gen, but no one's released a full game up to that standard yet. Muy sadioso.
I straight up think uc4 look better.
Tlou2 better than both
 

alloush

Member
Speaking of PS4 games, I'm replaying Uncharted 4 on PS5 after playing TLOU Remake, and it's not nearly the night-and-day difference I expected. They both look good, but I expected more from TLOU, considering it's six years on from U4.

What happened to the constant graphical bar-raising? Did Fortnite come along and convince the money-lenders that graphics don't matter like they used to? The Matrix demo was hands-down the most impressed I've been this gen, but no one's released a full game up to that standard yet. Muy sadioso.
UC4 was by far my favorite one in the series. Everything about it, the graphics, the shooting mechanics, the storyline itself, everything was absolutely fantastic. Man, I miss the UC series but I think they stopped at the right time and ended it on a high, better than dragging the hell out of it to a point where people would start getting bored of it.

Pretty big step forward imo.

His hair is not looking like straw anymore, but has actual translucent properties. Looks way more natural.
Yeah pretty impressive stuff. Hair was always one of the hardest things to render realistically in real time and always stuck out like a sore thumb, but we are finally getting there. FIFA have had it for 3 years now, and it looks hella good in-game.
 

SlimySnake

Flashless at the Golden Globes
New GG interview on PS5 only Horizon Forbidden Shores. Looks like they are using the PS5 only sku to create a battle scene only possible on PS5. Also, flying speeds might be faster thanks to better streaming tech.

PlayStation Blog: What were your first impressions when first learning about the power and capabilities of the PS5, from a developer perspective?


Mathijs de Jonge:
Horizon Forbidden West is a very visual game, so the promise of more CPU power and memory meant we were going to be able to add even more quality to the image; and gameplay-wise I was most looking forward to being able to play at 60fps. This was high on my wishlist as it works so well with our combat gameplay as you’re fighting the machines.


When I first heard about the superfast SSD, it was hard to believe that it was so capable – but it seems like loading times truly are a thing of the past. This works brilliantly for a game like Horizon Forbidden West, where long loading screens can be a real immersion breaker. From a development point of view, fast loading also helped me with reviewing the game because I could jump straight into any section without having to wait.

How have you taken advantage of PS5’s power to create Horizon Forbidden West: Burning Shores?


One of our key priorities with Horizon games is to add a ton of detail and richness to our environments. On Horizon Forbidden West, everything we added or increased was something we’d need to have a plan around how to optimize for PS4 as well. On Burning Shores, since we can just focus on PS5, we’ve been able to charge forward and we’re really excited about what we’ve been able to pull off in creating this stunning post-post-apocalyptic version of Los Angeles.


The cityscape ruins of LA and its surroundings are highly detailed and require a lot of processing power as well as fast streaming technology to run properly; especially when the player is flying over the lands and can see a lot at once. One of the settlements is situated in and around those detailed ruins, and we were able to squeeze a lot of activity in there.


Another notable one is a particular battle scene that requires a LOT of memory and processing power! To achieve this grand vision both technically and creatively, we definitely were thankful for the many advantages that the PS5 hardware brings.

Horizon Forbidden West delivers fantastic visual effects, animations and immersive audio during combat encounters, especially when battling some of the larger machines. How have you taken advantage of PS5 to deliver these rich visual performances and what can we expect from Burning Shores?

Using the PS5’s processing power we can run certain simulations at higher speed creating more lifelike results and a better gameplay experience. On PS5, the Horizon Forbidden West base game runs at a higher resolution and at a higher framerate than on PS4, and assets are more detailed which makes the overall quality much better. There is also a special lighting setup for Aloy that we normally only display during cinematics, but is active on the PS5 at all times. On PS5 we can draw at higher detail much further into the distance, displaying the stunning vistas our players encounters all across the map. We also support 40Hz Mode and Variable Refresh Rate on capable TVs for even more fluid gameplay.
 

alloush

Member
New GG interview on PS5 only Horizon Forbidden Shores. Looks like they are using the PS5 only sku to create a battle scene only possible on PS5. Also, flying speeds might be faster thanks to better streaming tech.

PlayStation Blog: What were your first impressions when first learning about the power and capabilities of the PS5, from a developer perspective?


Mathijs de Jonge:
Horizon Forbidden West is a very visual game, so the promise of more CPU power and memory meant we were going to be able to add even more quality to the image; and gameplay-wise I was most looking forward to being able to play at 60fps. This was high on my wishlist as it works so well with our combat gameplay as you’re fighting the machines.


When I first heard about the superfast SSD, it was hard to believe that it was so capable – but it seems like loading times truly are a thing of the past. This works brilliantly for a game like Horizon Forbidden West, where long loading screens can be a real immersion breaker. From a development point of view, fast loading also helped me with reviewing the game because I could jump straight into any section without having to wait.

How have you taken advantage of PS5’s power to create Horizon Forbidden West: Burning Shores?


One of our key priorities with Horizon games is to add a ton of detail and richness to our environments. On Horizon Forbidden West, everything we added or increased was something we’d need to have a plan around how to optimize for PS4 as well. On Burning Shores, since we can just focus on PS5, we’ve been able to charge forward and we’re really excited about what we’ve been able to pull off in creating this stunning post-post-apocalyptic version of Los Angeles.


The cityscape ruins of LA and its surroundings are highly detailed and require a lot of processing power as well as fast streaming technology to run properly; especially when the player is flying over the lands and can see a lot at once. One of the settlements is situated in and around those detailed ruins, and we were able to squeeze a lot of activity in there.


Another notable one is a particular battle scene that requires a LOT of memory and processing power! To achieve this grand vision both technically and creatively, we definitely were thankful for the many advantages that the PS5 hardware brings.

Horizon Forbidden West delivers fantastic visual effects, animations and immersive audio during combat encounters, especially when battling some of the larger machines. How have you taken advantage of PS5 to deliver these rich visual performances and what can we expect from Burning Shores?

Using the PS5’s processing power we can run certain simulations at higher speed creating more lifelike results and a better gameplay experience. On PS5, the Horizon Forbidden West base game runs at a higher resolution and at a higher framerate than on PS4, and assets are more detailed which makes the overall quality much better. There is also a special lighting setup for Aloy that we normally only display during cinematics, but is active on the PS5 at all times. On PS5 we can draw at higher detail much further into the distance, displaying the stunning vistas our players encounters all across the map. We also support 40Hz Mode and Variable Refresh Rate on capable TVs for even more fluid gameplay.
Cannot wait to see what they come up with with a next-gen only game!
 

mckmas8808

Banned
New GG interview on PS5 only Horizon Forbidden Shores. Looks like they are using the PS5 only sku to create a battle scene only possible on PS5. Also, flying speeds might be faster thanks to better streaming tech.

PlayStation Blog: What were your first impressions when first learning about the power and capabilities of the PS5, from a developer perspective?


Mathijs de Jonge:
Horizon Forbidden West is a very visual game, so the promise of more CPU power and memory meant we were going to be able to add even more quality to the image; and gameplay-wise I was most looking forward to being able to play at 60fps. This was high on my wishlist as it works so well with our combat gameplay as you’re fighting the machines.


When I first heard about the superfast SSD, it was hard to believe that it was so capable – but it seems like loading times truly are a thing of the past. This works brilliantly for a game like Horizon Forbidden West, where long loading screens can be a real immersion breaker. From a development point of view, fast loading also helped me with reviewing the game because I could jump straight into any section without having to wait.

How have you taken advantage of PS5’s power to create Horizon Forbidden West: Burning Shores?


One of our key priorities with Horizon games is to add a ton of detail and richness to our environments. On Horizon Forbidden West, everything we added or increased was something we’d need to have a plan around how to optimize for PS4 as well. On Burning Shores, since we can just focus on PS5, we’ve been able to charge forward and we’re really excited about what we’ve been able to pull off in creating this stunning post-post-apocalyptic version of Los Angeles.


The cityscape ruins of LA and its surroundings are highly detailed and require a lot of processing power as well as fast streaming technology to run properly; especially when the player is flying over the lands and can see a lot at once. One of the settlements is situated in and around those detailed ruins, and we were able to squeeze a lot of activity in there.


Another notable one is a particular battle scene that requires a LOT of memory and processing power! To achieve this grand vision both technically and creatively, we definitely were thankful for the many advantages that the PS5 hardware brings.

Horizon Forbidden West delivers fantastic visual effects, animations and immersive audio during combat encounters, especially when battling some of the larger machines. How have you taken advantage of PS5 to deliver these rich visual performances and what can we expect from Burning Shores?

Using the PS5’s processing power we can run certain simulations at higher speed creating more lifelike results and a better gameplay experience. On PS5, the Horizon Forbidden West base game runs at a higher resolution and at a higher framerate than on PS4, and assets are more detailed which makes the overall quality much better. There is also a special lighting setup for Aloy that we normally only display during cinematics, but is active on the PS5 at all times. On PS5 we can draw at higher detail much further into the distance, displaying the stunning vistas our players encounters all across the map. We also support 40Hz Mode and Variable Refresh Rate on capable TVs for even more fluid gameplay.

Can't wait.
 

CGNoire

Member
Yep, the lack of SSAO is extremely evident. U4 looks better overall.


Can't trust ND when they reveal their next PS5 game. Chances of a downgrade are high.
This x100.

Im pretty damm sure the e3 footage for both TLOU2 and GOT where never running on even a pro. These devs have gotten the message from gamers loud and clear that not only will there lying in advertising claims work but any who voice opposition to there claims will be ganged up on by fans. Demand better people.

The Vertical Slice excuse doesnt get close to decribing whats actually clearly been happening.
 

SlimySnake

Flashless at the Golden Globes
This x100.

Im pretty damm sure the e3 footage for both TLOU2 and GOT where never running on even a pro. These devs have gotten the message from gamers loud and clear that not only will there lying in advertising claims work but any who voice opposition to there claims will be ganged up on by fans. Demand better people.

The Vertical Slice excuse doesnt get close to decribing whats actually clearly been happening.
GG straight up created a fake level to show off their game.

Their reveal trailer is also full of scenes that were way higher fidelity than what we got in the final game. Especially the underwater scene and the final shot of her going through the lush forest. I tried finding that area for hours. It looks nothing like it.



One thing I liked about Sony studios post KZ2 and motorstorm CG debacles was that they were very honest about what was realtime and what was gameplay. To see them downgrade TLOU2 like that was shocking because before that we would routinely get upgrades from the OG reveals. That HFW reveal trailer was said to be captured running on a PS5. So why the downgrade? Just lame stuff.
 

CGNoire

Member
GG straight up created a fake level to show off their game.

Their reveal trailer is also full of scenes that were way higher fidelity than what we got in the final game. Especially the underwater scene and the final shot of her going through the lush forest. I tried finding that area for hours. It looks nothing like it.



One thing I liked about Sony studios post KZ2 and motorstorm CG debacles was that they were very honest about what was realtime and what was gameplay. To see them downgrade TLOU2 like that was shocking because before that we would routinely get upgrades from the OG reveals. That HFW reveal trailer was said to be captured running on a PS5. So why the downgrade? Just lame stuff.

It was so obvious too. The gaslighting afterward was brutal.
 

GymWolf

Member
Did you guys see that TLOU Part 1 on PC is steam deck verified? Thats a 1.6 tflops handheld GPU lmao. Sony tried to pass it off as a next gen only game. I remember Neil saying something like how his mind was blown when seeing the graphics lol.

It was always a PS4 game. I lost brain cells trying to argue that here on gaf.

Oh and apparently Factions is also on PS4. This is a never ending nightmare.
Did he really said that?

What an absolute clown...
 
This generation has gone exactly as I expected. The $500 boxes have provided $500 performance. I don't know what people expect. other than have the performance of a $1000 GPU for half the price which is not going to happen. If you want consoles to remain relatively affordable, the visible difference between each generation will get less. PC gamers have realized this as to why they have reluctantly accepted the massive prices on PC components now. The 4090 would no exist otherwise.
 

SlimySnake

Flashless at the Golden Globes
This generation has gone exactly as I expected. The $500 boxes have provided $500 performance. I don't know what people expect. other than have the performance of a $1000 GPU for half the price which is not going to happen. If you want consoles to remain relatively affordable, the visible difference between each generation will get less. PC gamers have realized this as to why they have reluctantly accepted the massive prices on PC components now. The 4090 would no exist otherwise.
No one is talking about performance in this thread. Only fidelity.
 
No one is talking about performance in this thread. Only fidelity.
I use the two terms interchangeably unless the discussion is specifically about art design. One is derived from the other. Unless we don't count resolution, framerate, ray tracing as fidelity because you need performance for these.
 

SlimySnake

Flashless at the Golden Globes
I use the two terms interchangeably unless the discussion is specifically about art design. One is derived from the other. Unless we don't count resolution, framerate, ray tracing as fidelity because you need performance for these.
And you are basing this on what? A bunch of cross Gen games? How many true next Gen games have we even seen this Gen? Microsoft hasn’t shipped one yet. Sony hasnt shipped one in almost 2 years. No third party has even bothered showing us what next gen can do. AC Unity came out 1 year after the launch of last gen consoles, the next AC 3 years after current gen launch is going to be cross gen. No next gen UE5 game has come out so far with a last gen Fortnite being the only one getting support.

Simply looking at these cross gen games and fake next gen only games like Deathloop, Ghostwire Tokyo, Gotham Knights, TLOU remake and Harry Potter to determine next gen fidelity is simply a mistake because these games were all designed with last gen in mind with devs cancelling last gen versions simply because its no longer in their financial interest to do so.

As for performance, yes I actually agree. These 10-12 tflops $500 consoles are performing exactly like what Id expect from them after having played on a 11 tflops 2080 for the last four years when it comes to resolution and framerates. Some games perform better, some worse which again is in line with how games perform on AMD cards. But when it comes to fidelity, simply bolting on RTX, increasing resolution to native 4k, framerates to 60-120 fps, and changing some setting to ultra PC settings is not next gen. PC gamers have been doing this for 20 years.

Devs simply have to go back to the drawing board and utilize new design paradigms like Lumens and Nanite to get more out of these consoles. PS5 might only have 5-8x more raw graphics horsepower, but the xbox series x? Thats 9x more in raw tflops and almost 15x more in raw GPU performance. way more than the 5x boost from x360 to x1. Right now, all of that is being used to increase framerates and resolutions, but eventually devs will have to sacrifice, yes sacrifice resolution and framerate for visual fidelity, physics, new AI routines, and other simulations. Ratchet runs at native 4k 45-50 fps on PS5. Matrix runs at roughly 1200p to 1440p 25-30 fps and looks a generation ahead of it. All CG is rendered at 1080p in 4k movies nowadays and still looks leagues ahead of native 4k games. Thats what video games need to do and you will start to see true next gen fidelity.
 
And you are basing this on what? A bunch of cross Gen games? How many true next Gen games have we even seen this Gen? Microsoft hasn’t shipped one yet. Sony hasnt shipped one in almost 2 years. No third party has even bothered showing us what next gen can do. AC Unity came out 1 year after the launch of last gen consoles, the next AC 3 years after current gen launch is going to be cross gen. No next gen UE5 game has come out so far with a last gen Fortnite being the only one getting support.

Simply looking at these cross gen games and fake next gen only games like Deathloop, Ghostwire Tokyo, Gotham Knights, TLOU remake and Harry Potter to determine next gen fidelity is simply a mistake because these games were all designed with last gen in mind with devs cancelling last gen versions simply because its no longer in their financial interest to do so.

As for performance, yes I actually agree. These 10-12 tflops $500 consoles are performing exactly like what Id expect from them after having played on a 11 tflops 2080 for the last four years when it comes to resolution and framerates. Some games perform better, some worse which again is in line with how games perform on AMD cards. But when it comes to fidelity, simply bolting on RTX, increasing resolution to native 4k, framerates to 60-120 fps, and changing some setting to ultra PC settings is not next gen. PC gamers have been doing this for 20 years.

Devs simply have to go back to the drawing board and utilize new design paradigms like Lumens and Nanite to get more out of these consoles. PS5 might only have 5-8x more raw graphics horsepower, but the xbox series x? Thats 9x more in raw tflops and almost 15x more in raw GPU performance. way more than the 5x boost from x360 to x1. Right now, all of that is being used to increase framerates and resolutions, but eventually devs will have to sacrifice, yes sacrifice resolution and framerate for visual fidelity, physics, new AI routines, and other simulations. Ratchet runs at native 4k 45-50 fps on PS5. Matrix runs at roughly 1200p to 1440p 25-30 fps and looks a generation ahead of it. All CG is rendered at 1080p in 4k movies nowadays and still looks leagues ahead of native 4k games. Thats what video games need to do and you will start to see true next gen fidelity.

We should be seeing the 2nd wave of new-gen titles by now and yet here we are with not even half a dozen of true new-gen games. Cross gen games were never a parameter to judge a console capabilities, in any gen, but until we start to get new-gen only titles (and even those will improve throughout the gen, like every gen before) people will continue with that narrative. If you were to believe those people the PS4 gen wouldn't have had a better looking game than The Witcher 2 or Battlefield 3, because that was the narrative back then. I think you can search this very forum and find these posts. They'll be proven wrong once again.
 
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Lethal01

Member
Details like this feel next gen to me… thats why I hold TLOU 2 as the standard for all future video games…


Details like and surpassing this are why Breath of the Wild feels more "next gen" than games with 10x the texture are geometry detail.
What's more the details they add in are all made to connect with other elements to multiply gameplay potential.
 
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Details like and surpassing this are why Breath of the Wild feels more "next gen" than games with 10x the texture are geometry detail.
What's more the details they add in are all made to connect with other elements to multiply gameplay potential.
Details are “next gen”… TLOU 2 is on another level.







 

01011001

Banned
This isn’t the thread for this…

it kinda is. because at what point is it pointless to waste money and time on details that need to be pointed out in youtube videos because people can easily miss them, instead of fleshing out the gameplay and design of a game?

especially in cases like Red Dead 2 where the "crazy detail" in animations and physics actually make the game feel like ass for example.
details are nice, but sometimes it feels like the focus of the studio is more on the graphics and animation details than on the actual design of the game.
and then they want you to look at all the detail of course, so interactive sequences are littered with automatically moving cameras, forced slow walking etc. which makes games less immersive and just screams pretentiousness.

you can see it in RE4 as well. many things in the remake demo have been altered for the sake of "presentation". formally interactive sequences are not interactive anymore, the game has to allow you to draw your gun because "cinematic".
the way Leon controls in the remake also feels more sluggish and imprecise, which is directly caused by the "more detailed" animations

detail is great, but it is a very mixed bag for me, where so much work is put into things that are A: not really important and B: force you to look at them because the devs want to show off to the detriment of gameplay, immersion and gamedesign.
 
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Imtjnotu

Member
GG straight up created a fake level to show off their game.

Their reveal trailer is also full of scenes that were way higher fidelity than what we got in the final game. Especially the underwater scene and the final shot of her going through the lush forest. I tried finding that area for hours. It looks nothing like it.



One thing I liked about Sony studios post KZ2 and motorstorm CG debacles was that they were very honest about what was realtime and what was gameplay. To see them downgrade TLOU2 like that was shocking because before that we would routinely get upgrades from the OG reveals. That HFW reveal trailer was said to be captured running on a PS5. So why the downgrade? Just lame stuff.




Outside of the underwater lighting system which is more realistic to California water than that clear tropical Bahamas bullshit in the E3 build, it's not much of a difference
 
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