Support NeoGAF

[Seanspeed]

No, but it's possibly the closest modern series to it in playstyle. Certainly the only one that isn't an indie or completely unknown FPS. Name me something closer?

Its irrelevant. People thought the fighting game genre was dead before SSIV and the new Mortal Kombat came out. People thought 2D platformers were dead.

Doom is a big name. Unlike Serious Sam, it has the power to bring in big sales and remind the industry and the players that the older-school style of FPS games are still fun.

It doesn't need to be exactly like the old school level design. Doom 3 had a lot going on for it and would have benefitted a lot from some larger, more open areas(apprently the tech limited this). Seeing as the technology that made RAGE clearly allows for this, I wish they'd have kind of rolled with some of the stuff from Doom 3(especially the dark, evil, sci-fi atmosphere) and expanded on it. I'm not saying to make it on the same space station as Doom 3, but I'm not happy with fighting on Earth when it seems its daylight half the time. Thats not Doom to me.

I feel there's a good combination of classic Doom and Doom 3 that could be rolled into a fantastic game that had its base in older-school FPS games, but still feels fresh. This looks like they're just taking it somewhere completely different.

EDIT: Ok, that tweet is reassuring.

 

[spcd]

You're exaggerating Doom's depth, and this coming from someone who finished Alien Vendetta the other day.

I made a summation of things that I like about the gameplay in Doom. These things aren't found in modern shooters today.

I don't think it's exaggerating? Tell me what I said wrong in my post?

nonlinear maps, preserve ammo, infighting, dodge vs hitscan, pistolstart, secrets
-> I don't think so

 

[Adnor]

One thing I hope Doom 4 does is to revive the arena shooters pro scene. I mean, we have the fighting scene growing, the Starcraft strong as always and MOBAs being pretty big, but Quake tournaments aren't as big now, and I love to see the matches.

 

[peakish]

One thing I hope Doom 4 does is to revive the arena shooters pro scene. I mean, we have the fighting scene growing, the Starcraft strong as always and MOBAs being pretty big, but Quake tournaments aren't as big now, and I love to see the matches.

I think they should consider making the multiplayer of D4 free to play if it's the arena style stuff. I can't see them losing many sales over that, in return they might get some hype and a larger player base. Build it on the Quake Live platform or something

 

[Adnor]

I think they should consider making the multiplayer of D4 free to play if it's the arena style stuff. I can't see them losing many sales over that, in return they might get some hype and a larger player base. Build it on the Quake Live platform or something

Sadly Quake Live wasn't very profitable :/

 

[Combichristoffersen]

I would too. They would have to call it something else to bypass Bethesda though, like Saint Vitus or Burning Witch.

Ha, I see what you did there.

 

[peakish]

Sadly Quake Live wasn't very profitable :/

Enter hats, lol.

 

[spcd]

Sadly Quake Live wasn't very profitable :/

I hate that Quake Live exists. Quake Live killed Quake 3.

Why is that so bad? Nobody plays Threewave and Rocket Arena anymore! Quake 3 is dead! There are no good populated servers for my favourite mods.

Every regular quaker is now playing Quake Live, but id Software doesn't allow the mods on Quake Live... So id software killed a lot of work of the community.

Damn those guys

 

[Grayman]

I think multiplayer should alternate between two rulesets at id. One being the Quake 3 and Live sports style and the second being a Quakeworld/Doom/CPM with the harsher ruleset.

I hate that Quake Live exists. Quake Live killed Quake 3.

Why is that so bad? Nobody plays Threewave and Rocket Arena anymore! Quake 3 is dead! There are no good populated servers for my favourite mods.

Every regular quaker is now playing Quake Live, but id Software doesn't allow the mods on Quake Live... So id software killed a lot of work of the community.

Damn those guys

All the talk about promode standalone and PMX ruleset seemed to stop after arqon was doing some contract work on quake live too.

 

[JaseC]

Oh goody. They best show it off at Quakecon this year.

Also, can we get some Rage DLC confirmation?

Rage DLC was confirmed last August.

 

[Helscream]

One thing I hope Doom 4 does is to revive the arena shooters pro scene. I mean, we have the fighting scene growing, the Starcraft strong as always and MOBAs being pretty big, but Quake tournaments aren't as big now, and I love to see the matches.

I would like to see this as well. I think it really has to do with the skill threshold. Unreal/Quake have a really high threshold. You can clearly see the difference between a Pro, Great, Good, Average, and noob players. The other FPS games have a really low threshold. So that line that separates pro/noob is a little less definitive. Plus considering those other FPS games are more accessible, more people will have the feeling that they can participate.

Atleast that is my reasoning as to why the pro scene for arena shooter's not being as big now.

 

[Red UFO]

People saying Doom had more depth than contemporary shooters? Hahahahaha. The original Doom games were maze games with some shooting as a distraction and nothing more, made more notable for the technology that drove them.

 

[Adnor]

People saying Doom had more depth than contemporary shooters? Hahahahaha. The original Doom games were maze games with some shooting as a distraction and nothing more, made more notable for the technology that drove them.

Have you even played Doom? Because if you did, you couldn't be saying that.

EDIT:

I would like to see this as well. I think it really has to do with the skill threshold. Unreal/Quake have a really high threshold. You can clearly see the difference between a Pro, Great, Good, Average, and noob players. The other FPS games have a really low threshold. So that line that separates pro/noob is a little less definitive. Plus considering those other FPS games are more accessible, more people will have the feeling that they can participate.

Atleast that is my reasoning as to why the pro scene for arena shooter's not being as big now.

Also, the new popular shooters have the "Unlock more powerful gear the more you play" thing that kill the competitive scene. It's not Who's the Best, but Who has played more.

 

[Stallion Free]

Rage DLC was confirmed last August.

I mean like a real "here is the price and release date" confirmation.

 

[Poimandres]

People saying Doom had more depth than contemporary shooters? Hahahahaha. The original Doom games were maze games with some shooting as a distraction and nothing more, made more notable for the technology that drove them.

Shooting in Doom games was "a distraction and nothing more"?

Good luck with that!

 

[JaseC]

I mean like a real "here is the price and release date" confirmation.

I'm hoping the silence is because the DLC is relatively substantial. Another hub area, maybe? One can dream.

 

[Adnor]

Shooting in Doom games was "a distraction and nothing more"?

Good luck with that!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M4VHUXV77hA
It's the best distraction ever.

 

[mercenar1e]

How many copies did Rage sell? lol

 

[Stallion Free]

I'm hoping the silence is because the DLC is relatively substantial. Another hub area? One can dream.

I'd settle for 3 full blown missions. Two packs with 3 each. Jackal Canyon tier.

 

[JaseC]

I'd settle for 3 full blown missions. Two packs with 3 each. Jackal Canyon tier.

Yeah, that would be reasonable, provided the price is right.

How many copies did Rage sell? lol

I believe the only number we have is first-month sales of 500k on the X360 alone.

 

[infinityBCRT]

http://twitter.com/#!/id_Hooper/status/174967484506570752



He's the design director at id.

Yup, they don't show what Doom 4 is about because they canned it, fired a bunch of people, and started over.

 

[evilromero]

I'm already so pumped about Doom 4 and we have nothing to go on except this one guy's comment. YES!

 

[Grayman]

They really haven't been too creative with figuring out how to monetize it. Right now it has the feel of a flash gaming site. It needs more extra stupid visual stuff to buy, maybe they should have made it a small fee to change rail colors, etc., instead of interstitial ads like it's 2005 or something. It's just a horrendous business model compared to what current f2p games are doing.

the current f2p model would be pretty trashy for quake though.

 

[John Rabbit]

jesus doom and doom 2 are just awesome games.

 

[Elsolar]

They really haven't been too creative with figuring out how to monetize it. Right now it has the feel of a flash gaming site. It needs more extra stupid visual stuff to buy, maybe they should have made it a small fee to change rail colors, etc., instead of interstitial ads like it's 2005 or something. It's just a horrendous business model compared to what current f2p games are doing.

The current F2P model wouldn't work with Quake 3 because Q3 is actually a good game - it's nearly perfectly balanced and they're no grinding involved, so there's not much that they can add to the system as premium content without imbalancing it.

Also, here's hoping that Doom 4 brings back everything that made the original Doom games great. I'm of the opinion that Doom 2 is the greatest game ever made, and while I don't expect Doom 4 to top that by any means, seeing something that actually does justice to the design, technical legacy, art, and community of the original games would be fantastic.

 

[subversus]

the current f2p model would be pretty trashy for quake though.

The current F2P model wouldn't work with Quake 3 because Q3 is actually a good game - it's nearly perfectly balanced and they're no grinding involved, so there's not much that they can add to the system as premium content without imbalancing it.

Also, here's hoping that Doom 4 brings back everything that made the original Doom games great. I'm of the opinion that Doom 2 is the greatest game ever made, and while I don't expect Doom 4 to top that by any means, seeing something that actually does justice to the design, technical legacy, art, and community of the original games would be fantastic.

New skins would totally break the balance in the game. Totally. Quake's gameplay is all about what suit you are wearing and the color of your gun.

 

[JaseC]

New skins would totally break the balance in the game. Totally. Quake's gameplay is all about what suit you are wearing and the color of your gun.

No, it wouldn't, because you can force a specific enemy model and skin colour client-side, and weapon skins wouldn't have a tangible effect on a player's subconscious understanding of his opponent's weaponry since the models themselves are distinctive.

Edit: Even if id did in fact implement weapon skin DLC, chances are they'd also add a client/server-side cvar which forces the defaults to be used (think Valve's sv_pure). Keeping the game's aesthetics "pure" for the enthusiasts would surely be of utmost importance.

 

[Polari]

WTF. Looks like shit. Doom is about being alone on a space station facing demons from hell.

 

[luka]

WTF. Looks like shit. Doom is about being alone on a space station facing demons from hell.

doom has never taken place on a space station

 

[subversus]

No, it wouldn't, because you can force a specific enemy model and skin colour client-side, and weapon skins wouldn't have a tangible effect on a player's subconscious understanding of his opponent's weaponry since the models themselves are distinctive.

Edit: Even if id did in fact implement weapon skin DLC, chances are they'd also add a client/server-side cvar which forces the defaults to be used (think Valve's sv_pure). Keeping the game's aesthetics "pure" for the enthusiasts would surely be of utmost importance.

Weapon skins aren't about understanding the weapon, it's about looking cool or distinctive (pink lancers in Gears of War 3 for example).

And what do you mean by "forces defaults to be used"?

 

[JaseC]

Weapon skins aren't about understanding the weapon, it's about looking cool or distinctive (pink lancers in Gears of War 3 for example).

How would looking "cool or distinctive" break the balance of the game?

And what do you mean by "forces defaults to be used"?

Regardless of the skins chosen by other players, all the client would see are the default weapon skins. Each weapon would only have one standard skin, after all.

 

[TUROK]

I made a summation of things that I like about the gameplay in Doom. These things aren't found in modern shooters today.

I don't think it's exaggerating? Tell me what I said wrong in my post?

nonlinear maps, preserve ammo, infighting, dodge vs hitscan, pistolstart, secrets
-> I don't think so

Well, I love Doom, but I don't agree that it's deeper than most modern shooters. I mean, even just comparing traditional team deathmatch in Skulltag or Zdaemon vs Halo or Call of Duty reveals a level of sophistication not present in the original Dooms.

And even if the level design wasn't linear, it wasn't anywhere near as free as you're implying. Most levels require you to get the key cards or skull keys in a certain order.

 

[subversus]

How would looking "cool or distinctive" break the balance of the game?

Is it a rhetorical question? Because I don't see how it would.

 

[JaseC]

Is it a rhetorical question? Because I don't see how it would.

In that case, what did you mean by this?

New skins would totally break the balance in the game. Totally. Quake's gameplay is all about what suit you are wearing and the color of your gun.

 

[subversus]

In that case, what did you mean by this?

It was sarcasm.

 

[JaseC]

It was sarcasm.

Oh, right. Hard to tell when it's just text.

 

[Team Filler]

Also, the new popular shooters have the "Unlock more powerful gear the more you play" thing that kill the competitive scene. It's not Who's the Best, but Who has played more.

I haven't really been a part of that scene for awhile, but I was always under the impression Counter-Strike had a lot to do with the competitive Quake fanbase shrinking overall.

 

[Metal Gear?!]

doom has never taken place on a space station

I see you haven't read DOOM: Repercussions of Evil

 

[NBtoaster]

I think Doom 64 was on a space station or something.

 

[TUROK]

I think Doom 64 was on a space station or something.

Phobos and Deimos, just like in Doom 1.

 

[Saty]

I believe the only number we have is first-month sales of 500k on the X360 alone.

First month NPD:

Bethesda's long-in-development shooter Rage sold 550,000 units across three platforms in its debut month.

http://www.gameinformer.com/b/news/archive/2011/11/11/battlefield-3-batman-lead-october-sales.aspx

 

[JaseC]

First month NPD:


http://www.gameinformer.com/b/news/archive/2011/11/11/battlefield-3-batman-lead-october-sales.aspx

Bethesda seem reluctant to release sales figures beyond the month of October. Surely it's sold at least a million by now.

 

[Shadow Hog]

Well, I love Doom, but I don't agree that it's deeper than most modern shooters. I mean, even just comparing traditional team deathmatch in Skulltag or Zdaemon vs Halo or Call of Duty reveals a level of sophistication not present in the original Dooms.

I'm not entirely sure what Halo or Call of Duty added that would add a "level of sophistication not present in the original Dooms". Can you elaborate?

Note that I generally haven't played Halo or CoD online, so this is less a criticism of your argument and more genuine curiosity.

I think Doom 64 was on a space station or something.

Phobos and Deimos, just like in Doom 1.

Did Doom 64 actually specify anywhere where it took place? I can buy Phobos/Deimos, but I don't recall it actually saying at any point, other than your inevitable trip into Hell.

 

[Stallion Free]

Did Doom 64 actually specify anywhere where it took place? I can buy Phobos/Deimos, but I don't recall it actually saying at any point, other than your inevitable trip into Hell.

There are levels named Phobos/Deimos Lab and Anomaly, Phobos being in Episode 1 and Deimos being in Episode 2. At least in the PC version.

 

[Shadow Hog]

Doesn't apply to Doom 64, I'm afraid; that had its own unique campaign.

 

[Dai101]

Doom 64 is kind of a direct sequel to Doom and Doom 2:

Plot:

Following the conclusion of the original Doom series, the sole Marine who survived the horrors of hell had returned to Earth, reclaiming it from the invasion that almost eradicated the human race. Demons still lingered within the abandoned halls and complexes of Phobos and Deimos. As a last-ditch effort, the military decided to bombard the moons with extreme radiation in hopes of killing off any remaining demons. Initially it was successful, however something survived the exposure. The radiation blocked the military's sensors and allowed something to slip past them undetected. A Marine strikeforce was ordered to contain the advancing armies of hell but was mercilessly slaughtered within moments. The player's character is the sole survivor of this group.

 

[evilromero]

I LOVED Doom 64 but damn it was dark and hard as hell. I kind of wish they delivered on the sequel with some co-op.

 

[Mr Swine]

I LOVED Doom 64 but damn it was dark and hard as hell. I kind of wish they delivered on the sequel with some co-op.

I remember some footage of Doom 64 II, wished it was released

 

[Adnor]

I've never played Doom 64

 

[gaming_noob]

Doom 64 was $126 CDN back in the days. I rented it twice and beat it. I remember the final area being super scary. The music was pretty bad though.