Syph Medwes
Member
I share the same sentiments. Pretty unprofessional thing to say but I'll still give his game a try.
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Fez's dev to japanese developers: "your games just suck"
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I share the same sentiments. Pretty unprofessional thing to say but I'll still give his game a try.
Agent Unknown
Member
Yes, someone asked for his opinion and he gave a very crass, inarticulate and incredibly rude reply in a very professional public industry forum, so I think it's pretty stupid to put forth that WE are the ones making blanket statements and acting with "brazen machismo" as you seem to think. He has free speech to talk like an arrogant idiot and likewise we have free speech to point it out. Anyways, there's few things more annoying than discussion police type people who whine when people naturally want to discuss or react to something stupid someone did or said so please just stop with the lecture, OK?
DXB-KNIGHT
Member
If a Japanese developer insulted the Western games development saying that they suck just because they are all grey-brown FPS war games, will you be willing to defend such ignorance?
I don't care how great your product is, when you are being a bigot, you're being a bigot.
It's okay though, he makes indie games. If it doesn't star a cute little bird or a candy-eating monster, he'll be lucky to sell a thousand copies. Between the massive AAA releases and the established casual brands, he'll have a difficult time regardless. Enjoy the fame.
It's okay though, he makes indie games. If it doesn't star a cute little bird or a candy-eating monster, he'll be lucky to sell a thousand copies. Between the massive AAA releases and the established casual brands, he'll have a difficult time regardless. Enjoy the fame.
timetokill
Banned
All this attention is just "mission accomplished" for him
wolfmat
Confirmed Asshole
I wouldn't be so quick to judge. Times have changed. Although I think he's doing the title a disservice by being exclusively on 360.
shira
Member
Kong Fisso
Banned
Personally, I wouldn't care at all.
I agree with you man. But I really don't want this son of a bitch to get anything by it because of his crass attitude, so I'm being bitter. There are other Western, indie developers who should be acknowledged over him.
When you're in a professional position, you act professional. If I said anything like that, as a RN, about nurses/healthcare in another country, I would be hanged on a noose, for example.
You can have an opinion that can be challenging without acting like a fourteen-year old internet brat. :/
If he's a genius, then Robert Pelloni is an evil mastermind... except that no one remembers who Robert is, but people will know who Fil Phish is for a few years.
wolfmat
Confirmed Asshole
Totally!
Honesty is cool. Being a compete dick? Not so much. The way he chose to express his opinion was obnoxious and rude. There's really no justifying it after the fact.
When you're rude and obnoxious to someone for no good reason, you waive the right to complain when other people call you out on it.
If you really can't see any difference between Fish's remarks and people's response to the man himself due to said remarks, I feel sorry for you.
Well, let's see.
Calling Phil Fish an egotistical hipster doofus a-hole is calling Phil Fish an egotistical hipster doofus a-hole. Saying "your games just suck" is painting a broad brush across an entire industry filled with hundred of thousands of games and countless people.
Calling out Phil Fish for being an egotistical hipster doofus a-hole is done due to a specific event that happened. Saying "your country's games are fucking terrible nowadays" is making a broad statement over thousands of games, which I'm guessing 99% of which he most likely hasn't even played.
Pretty simple really. One is being directed at one specific person for something stupid he did, while the other is condemning an entire segment of gaming likely without much of any direct knowledge of the validity to the statement being made.
Mr. Saturn
Member
It's not that he chose to criticize Japanese games that's the problem, its how he went about doing it in an extremely rude and unprofessional manner.
Imagine if at E3 Miyamoto was asked his thoughts on Western games and he says they all suck.
The guy who asked Phil his thoughts, may not have expected him to say Japanese games are the bees knees, but I seriously doubt he was expecting him to act like such an ass.
IrishNinja
Member
true, he's clearly on a closed-feedback loop, between this and the indie film thing. really points to not supporting his effort as the best reinforcement, at least until he owns his actions.
ps shidoshi bringing in the logics, always good to see.
Uh, lol? Fez will break 100k easily.
yeah it'll get pushed like braid or limbo.
Baconsammy
Banned
I'd rather play Fez.
Night_Trekker
Member
Take any person who can deliver lines in front of a crowd, and then have that person deliver those lines with the proper tone and with a general air of confidence, authority, and conviction. No matter what the speaker is talking about--even if it's nonsensical or obviously wrong--a considerable number of the people in the crowd will applaud. Every time.
Togglesworlh
Banned
Phil Fish.
My hero.
Not reallllly, but what he says is kind of true. Japanese game design is stuck in a rut. There are certainly plenty of gems that come from Japan, but they're more often than not knocked out of the way by other games that are... too Japanese. Even a lot of the "gems" still suffer from antiquated game design.
Also, I honestly don't think he intended to come off as a dick for real. I was actually there and it seemed more like he was trying to state his opinion in a jokey-harsh way, based on his tone of voice. Obviously, it didn't work!* C'est la vie.
*Even if it had worked for the majority of native English speakers, the Japanese guy would've never gotten it, unfortunately. You could tell he was having some trouble just asking the question. Man, he walked away looking so sad and dejected. I felt really bad for him. Like, really, really bad. He totally did not deserve that. I kind of feel sick just thinking about it. That poor guy.
My hero.
Not reallllly, but what he says is kind of true. Japanese game design is stuck in a rut. There are certainly plenty of gems that come from Japan, but they're more often than not knocked out of the way by other games that are... too Japanese. Even a lot of the "gems" still suffer from antiquated game design.
Also, I honestly don't think he intended to come off as a dick for real. I was actually there and it seemed more like he was trying to state his opinion in a jokey-harsh way, based on his tone of voice. Obviously, it didn't work!* C'est la vie.
*Even if it had worked for the majority of native English speakers, the Japanese guy would've never gotten it, unfortunately. You could tell he was having some trouble just asking the question. Man, he walked away looking so sad and dejected. I felt really bad for him. Like, really, really bad. He totally did not deserve that. I kind of feel sick just thinking about it. That poor guy.
Baconsammy
Banned
Couldn't care less what he said, how he said it, or what he stands for. Make a good game and I'll play it. Make a bad game and I'll avoid it. If giving a shit about the personality flaws of people providing my entertainment mattered, I probably wouldnt watch many movies, listen to much music, or read many books.
Togglesworlh
Banned
Or, probably more accurately, "Heh, that's funny."
If I had made some inflammatory comment, whether intentional or not, I would absolutely find an apparent internet obsession with said comment amusing.
You do, by reacting to things like this?
If nobody reacted, it wouldn't be a thing.
...Microsoft hasn't paid him shit since he signed the initial contract and got that first boost of money. He lost his funding long ago. Dude hasn't made a single penny from anything for at least three years, and has been going further and further into debt.
That kills me.
Why can't it be. You're still being an ass.
Phil said something wrong. Okay don't buy his game? Trolling his twitter doesn't solve anything, and japan doesn't need anyone to defend their honor.
Or "man, these people have no fucking life. Move on" in which case he would be right.
Finaika
Member
Yes, because that's the truth.
IrishNinja
Member
aw, see, that sucks. and of course this d-bag plants his flag on it.
as a kanye fan, i get this logic - we choose our battles. there's a big Roman Polanski DF over in OT whenever his name gets dropped that runs the same angle.
if it turns out as magical as you're hoping for, i'm sure i'll net it in some indie bundle or another, but look at the post i quoted above yours - i feel okay not enabling that kinda thing from someone being propped up as a celebrity by the indie scene. it's shitty, man.
...ah, that's my cue for the evening! enjoy your drinks, ladies & gentlemen.
D
Deleted member 1235
Unconfirmed Member
I hate watching assholes be assholes to japanese people, because their manners are usually so impeccable that they end up just looking visibly shocked.
Oh well, there is plenty of other vapourware I can't play that I can imagine liking instead.
Oh well, there is plenty of other vapourware I can't play that I can imagine liking instead.
Rhazer Fusion
Member
I never even heard of this game or him. That was a very unprofessional thing to say even if you hate Japanese games. Apparently he has not played to many of them because the worst Japanese games are still better than those overrated.........let me back off on this one before I get started on this again. Any country that EXCELS in all types of games for many years and genres is awesome to me. His Indie game better be amazing for strong comments like that.
games that take five years to develop usually wind up being pretty good.
Finaika
Member
He doesn't think Japanese games are all that bad though. He thinks Japanese games are usually aesthetically better than their Western counterparts.
There's nothing wrong with people criticising him here, and doing so doesn't make one an ass. Although trolling his Twitter and dragging this thing on for days I agree is juvenile and tiresome.
KittenMaster
Member
This only makes me want Fez less. It becomes much harder to become interested a game when there's a curtain of bitterness behind it.
Deputy Moonman
Member
He was at public media event, which I would consider a professional environment. He lacked absolutely no professionalism whatsoever. So basically you're saying that random internet posters on a random forum are held up to the same standards as an actual game developer in a professional environment? I'm not sure how the criticism he is receiving from people makes them an ass. All anyone is doing is pointing out that what he did was wrong.
He said that Japanese games suck. Not sure how it can be interpreted any other way, whether it was intentional or not.
I don't know if I'd call it tiresome. This is an internet forum and people are just looking for things to read. All I do on gaf is refresh the page and look for interesting threads to scroll through. Talking about this gives me something to read, which I can appreciate.
Dog Problems
Banned
Someone posted in this thread, that was at the panel where he said they suck, and according to the poster he went on to explain a bit about what he meant.
I wish we had an exact transcript of what was said so the first post could be updated.
Togglesworlh
Banned
The original statement really wasn't that constructive at all. I can't recall exactly what was said, but it went something like this: "Japanese games suck. Your game design is stuck in a rut." *a couple seconds of silence while the audience derps* "I'M SO SORRY."
Those last three words are a direct quote, FWIW.
This was followed up by Jonathan Blow actually offering a more constructive criticism - that of Japanese developers' horrible tendency to put tutorials in their games, rather than teach the player through clever level design, as used to be the case. Skyward Sword's ridiculous handholding was cited as a very specific instance of tutorials gone wrong and way too long. And then the panel named a few Japanese games they actually like, among which was, I believe, Dark Souls and Street Fighter IV.
Dog Problems
Banned
Ah, I see. There was someone else in this topic that said the same thing you're telling but I got the impression he actually said more and explained what he meant. I guess it was Jonathan Blow who actually did that.
Oh well, it doesn't bother me like it originally did but I still think it could have all went down much more professionally on his end.
Togglesworlh
Banned
Absolutely. I don't approve of what he did (although I do think it was fucking hilarious), but I also don't think it's a huge deal (and I've already explained why). Also, it wouldn't be a huge deal if people didn't make it one.
revolverjgw
Member
Oh god that indie game movie trailer is insufferable
How much of this is Japanese design actually being "stuck in a rut" and not wildly diverging budgets, markets & tastes ("Akira, fuck yeah!" → "Animu, lol, I'm not playing that!")? Japanese games are tailored to Japanese gamers' tastes, Western games to Western gamers'. If a gamer prefers one to the other, it's rather a matter of predominant pop culture than the other being unable to "catch up". Removing characteristic differences is not catching up, it's leveling.
Dog Problems
Banned
I just wish that everything that was said after it was known and talked about from the beginning. It really isn't that big of a deal, though I do feel bad for the Japanese person who was told that in that particular way. Our way of saying, "It fucking sucks" isn't a big deal to most but for others in another country it can be taken much more serious.
What is this? It's pretty.
Dear Esther on PC.
OneMoreQuestion
Member
Alexios
Cores, shaders and BIOS oh my!
But will it beat Cave Story, a project by mostly one dude and for free?
It will beat Cave Story to a bloody pulp.
LordPhoque
Banned
ITT butthurt weeaboos
Thank you.
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