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Halo |OT10| The Calm Before The Storm
- Thread starter GhaleonEB
- Start date
I wouldn't say 'no one', but it certainly reduces that frequency of such things happening.
It also gives everyone a denoted baseline for lobby evaluations of the upcoming game. You don't have to spend the first 30 seconds sizing up the lobby, it's a quick and easy marker that everyone understands. It's like sports teams, everyone likes to understand the strengths of the opposition compared to your own team, thus adding additional meaning to the result.
I imagine, as Reach did, and plenty of other rankless shooters have in the past, Halo 4 will feel like a series of arbitrary friendly matches played for personal gain and visual carrots. And that's dull, to me. I don't want to unlock, I want to compete and push my own abilities.
It's certainly funny to see Halo chase a certain direction, one clearly influenced by another franchise that's actually moved to fill the space Halo has vacated.
im a 54 and i have no idea what that means
Guys, ranks don't influence whether you get matches up with people of your own skill level. Trueskill handles this in both playlist with and without ranks. How well it works depends on how strict it is and how many players are in a playlist. I want ranks because they make every match count. Like I said in my previous posts it's comparable to friendly matches in sports and matches for a competition. Sure, friendly matches can be entertaining but without anything in the line it's missing something. Every match in a competition matters so losing or winning matters more than normally. It add some spice to the game which makes it more entertaining for me. So yes, that number next to my name does make the game more fun for me, but that's also the case for the hundred of millions of sports fans around the world.
I completely agree that there needs to be a system to keep matches even and fun for everyone. The first 2 weeks of release don't matter anyways though since it will probably take so many hours of games played to determine who's at what level.
Stinkles saying they're working on it could be a good thing. At least we know its being worked on. They have 3 weeks before everyone gets their hands on it so they have time to get the back end systems in check.
It is absurdly close to launch and not know what the skill matchmaking system will be like but the entire info release for Halo 4 has been a slow, drug out process. This fits the whole idea of 343 being very quite about they're doing and very selective of what they show off.
(Sorry I would quote and answer people but I'm on mobile.)
Stinkles saying they're working on it could be a good thing. At least we know its being worked on. They have 3 weeks before everyone gets their hands on it so they have time to get the back end systems in check.
It is absurdly close to launch and not know what the skill matchmaking system will be like but the entire info release for Halo 4 has been a slow, drug out process. This fits the whole idea of 343 being very quite about they're doing and very selective of what they show off.
(Sorry I would quote and answer people but I'm on mobile.)
indubitably
Member
343 isn't just trying to push copies, they also want people to keep playing. That is why they have the episodic SpOps campaign. A skill based ranking system was a big factor in Halo 2 and 3's popularity and helps a lot of people justify investing as much time as they do in the game.
how do you expect to get that?? that happened every match I played in Reach, without a ranking system but with a skill system, which is whats going in H4 I presume
So when you want to play MP on disc 1 it says to put in disc 2, install disc 2 or download the MP from Xbox Live.
So I guess if you have a friend that doesn't have the money you can just lend him disc 2 after you install it. The Xbox Live part makes me wonder if they are going to sell MP by itself on XBL.
So I guess if you have a friend that doesn't have the money you can just lend him disc 2 after you install it. The Xbox Live part makes me wonder if they are going to sell MP by itself on XBL.
That doesn't even matter, we'll see, how many people will be playing Halo 4 after a week, a month and then a year. If those numbers are going backwards like in Halo Reach, 343i knows that they did something wrong and couldn't keep their player base interrested.
Look at Over's post.
Reach matchmaking was poor because of 2 reasons:
-Shitty, loose Trueskill restrictions
-Low player count due to so many playlists. Can't get a good skill match when there's 400 people in the playlist
AllIsOneIsNone
Banned
Just dropped in for a second. So they're still working on the ranking system? Called it.
Edit: I read back a little more...biggest blow to the gut I've had while keeping up with the game. Why can't devs learn from other devs mistakes?
Edit: I read back a little more...biggest blow to the gut I've had while keeping up with the game. Why can't devs learn from other devs mistakes?
Gabotron ES
Member
no
it was poor because it had no ranks and was boring as hell
played thousands of games in both halo 2 and 3
couldn't be bothered to play more than 150 in reach
(i played more games in the beta but made up my mind right there and then it was an awful multiplayer experience)
so
damn
boring
The problem is that I don't think it will. I've posted about this before, but with the changes they've made to Halo 4 with loadouts, "perks", etc. it just makes Halo 4 this weird halfway spot between CoD and "traditional" Halo, which I don't think is going to satisfy fans in either group. For the last 6 months everything they've shown and announced has made it seem like they are trying to have their cake and eat it too, and I don't think it's going to work. They don't go far enough in either direction to satisfy either camp, and it's actively turned off most of my friends who are traditionally very hardcore Halo only.
As an example Shake specifically will know - Shake you remember Shimms, Scott, Wedge, and those guys, and how all they did as play Halo? After the disappointment with Reach and with what they've announced with 4 so far they've all moved over all the way to CoD. Scott in particular is the biggest Halo fan I know, and he told me today he's already outright written off Halo 4 MP, and he only cares about Campaign and Spartan Ops, and he's pre-ordered BO2 as he's already decided that's going to be the go-to MP game for him. These were seriously the biggest Halo fans I know, and they've just been increasingly unhappy with the moves Reach and 4 has made away from traditional Halo MP gameplay. For a faster-paced non-"traditional" shooter they prefer the way that CoD runs all the way in that direction, and the halfway point 4 attempts to make between traditional Halo and CoD is just half-assed to them and isn't what they want. I've got other friends that Shake knows as well (Goodhand, Phong, etc) who over the last couple weeks have been asking me what's up with the game and what they're hearing about it, and asking me if they should even buy it. These are also hardcore Halo heads and Halo 2/3 is what we came up on and was literally all that we played for years and years.
I think Halo 4 is going to be the most successful game in the series if nothing else based on the strength of Campaign (which looks amazing) and Spartan Ops (assuming that pans out). But in terms of competitive MP I think they're making all the wrong moves, and chasing CoD isn't going to work here. They either need to go full-on "CoD" and be willing to abandon a certain group of traditional fans to get the larger audience to accept them over CoD, or they need to stick to their guns and what made Halo popular. I just really feel like this middle ground they seem to be going for isn't going to work, and I've been saying for months that not having a public or semi-open beta for Halo 4 is going to bite them in the ass.
The fact that the game has been gold for weeks, comes out in less than a month, and we still couldn't even get confirmation on if the game will have a visible ranking system speaks to the messaging issues they've continued to have with the game.
/rant
Well duh, not talking about the actual gameplay lol. Just terrible skill matching
The Henery
Member
Oh wow, you are jo-king right? Hugely, hugely disappointing if true. What an absolute embarrassment that Halo 4 doesn't have feature parity with its five year old predecessor.
Good to see Slayer Pro being treated as the leprosy playlist right from the get go, dumped at the bottom.
Max local players on CTF at 4 means more guests corrupting my paid for experience. Hoping they're contained to as few playlists as possible. Learn the hard lessons from Reach.
Regicide, a tweaked Juggernaut variant, the sole FFA offering? No straight first to 25 kills is the winner? That's odd.
King of the Hill is an instant dead on arrival playlist, Oddball the same once the novelty of throwing the ball wears off. Populations will be double digits two weeks in.
343 started relatively strong in their management of Reach and its playlists. Then bizzare removal of unique and fresh playlists, four different pistols, no bleedthrough, bleedthrough, TUing the majority of the established game yet making the new DLC playlist Vanilla and Super Slayer happened. They're going to have to up their game significantly for Halo 4's management. It's incredibly important for the longevity of the game. No amount of EXP carrots will drive continued engagement from a playerbase compared to truly astute and thoughtful playlist management.
BeekleMatter
Member
1-50 ranks pushed me to try very hard. It would be so intense thinking the whole game, "if I lose, I'm going down a few levels. If I win, I'm one step closer to 50." I wish they were still around, but without them, I guess it doesn't really matter to me.
I'm fairly certain that a behind the scenes skill rating will exist to get you in fair matches. At RTE I believe Frankie said the game's matchmaking system will still take ranks into account when finding matches. Correct me if I'm wrong.
Nonetheless, I'm still going to buy the game and play the crap out of it. I applaud 343 on their work with it. And Kylej, that comment about getting the CoD audience to play Halo, no thanks. Just no thanks.
I'm fairly certain that a behind the scenes skill rating will exist to get you in fair matches. At RTE I believe Frankie said the game's matchmaking system will still take ranks into account when finding matches. Correct me if I'm wrong.
Nonetheless, I'm still going to buy the game and play the crap out of it. I applaud 343 on their work with it. And Kylej, that comment about getting the CoD audience to play Halo, no thanks. Just no thanks.
lol this is a stream of a stream. Can I post the real link? I dunno what is and isn't allowed with this kind of stuff.
Edit: Playing Vortex right now
ViewtifulJC
Banned
edit for spoilers I guess
glad I wasn't the only one, Halo games need a ranking system for it to have longevity to me, if nothing, it gets boring after a couple days, even if H4 is fun, which I think it will be it will still get pretty damn boring after a while, no incentive to play
Gabotron ES
Member
Extraction
Just like Reach. I agree with your post completely.
RebornYeti
Member
Honestly, ranks have never really been a huge deal for me. The most fun I get out of playing Halo is playing it with friends. Not caring whether I win or lose... It's all about the experience for me, not a silly little number.
I'm guessing the Reddit guy spotted that in the gametypes in Custom Games, which would indicate that there will probably be a day 1 playlist patch since that's definitely not in the playlist screen on-disc.
Also watching that MP stream linked above, I already hate the announcer. Some combination of his tone of voice and volume is really irritating. So glad that 343 decided to not give us the option to turn it down or off.
I...honestly can't tell if that's sarcasm or not lol. Regardless of that Reach had a host of other problems though. In Reach I think any sort of CoD "concessions" were on the pretty low-end of the problems that game had.
K
kittens
Unconfirmed Member
Uhh, no. I haven't played Spartan Ops yet, but unless there's some type of survival-mode style encounters, I won't consider that box checked. In depth customization options are also pretty mandatory.
And regarding the lack of skill ranks... I'm not too worried about it. It didn't effect my enjoyment of Reach at all, personally. As long as matchmaking works, I'm happy.
They are playing Extraction right now : http://www.own3d.tv/andreluis034/live/398769
Edit: Seems to be similar to the final Invasion wave.
i don't have friends. my only friend was my rank :-(
So much this. I've bought games that I've seen my mates constantly playing e.g. Battlefield 3, thought it was fun for a few hours then got bored because there was nothing to motivate me to keep playing. I can unlock more guns? Whoopee, all I need to do is play for a certain amount of time and I'm guaranteed to unlock it, that's no fun, I don't want to be guaranteed something, I want to have to work for it.
The P of Poland
Member
I've never needed ranks to want to win. The whole point of keeping score is to encourage you to win.
That's just how I see it.
That's just how I see it.
Gabotron ES
Member
Thank you so much!
AllIsOneIsNone
Banned
It's not just a silly little number (to me); its a number that tells you how you compare to other players, which is far more important than xp and unlocks to me.
looks like land grab
MaximumFlipFlop
Banned
God damn I got spoiled so bad for this game. Am cry :_(
We've been asking about rank for over a year and they've been getting avoided every single time.
How do you not expect that exact answer?
I am cry for you. Shove that shit in a PM and send it David Ellis's way.
How do you not expect that exact answer?
I am cry for you. Shove that shit in a PM and send it David Ellis's way.
indubitably
Member
Oh god, the kill cams are terrible. His enemy was shown firing a good 6 feet to the right of him and still getting hits.
i dunno
maybe
letting the community get what they want just once? maybe?
you can mess with mechanics... that's ok, we'll bitch. but don't remove the reasons we were playing in the first place
As an aside, what exactly is up with killcams in the game? I thought initially they had said they wouldn't be in, but they seem to be. Is it only in certain modes or something?
Also lol at people in that stream chat knocking CoD and killcams, but then using extremely offensive terms to describe those people. Good job kids, you're obviously superior.
WELCOME TO CALL OF DUTY KILLCAMS, ENJOY YOUR STAY
But in all seriousness, if I recall correctly that happens (at least in CoD) because the killcam shows what was happening on the host screen but not the player screen, or something like that. It's basically not really accurate.
Also lol at people in that stream chat knocking CoD and killcams, but then using extremely offensive terms to describe those people. Good job kids, you're obviously superior.
WELCOME TO CALL OF DUTY KILLCAMS, ENJOY YOUR STAY
But in all seriousness, if I recall correctly that happens (at least in CoD) because the killcam shows what was happening on the host screen but not the player screen, or something like that. It's basically not really accurate.
Don't want to sound too melodramatic, even though this probably will, but I'm dropping my pre-order to the standard. I'm looking forward to Halo 4, to make things clear, but the incentive for the LE was the additional maps, personally. I've outlined numerous times in the last 24 months why Halo 4 needs a visual ranking system to create longevity for me and my friends, and I've briefly, unintelligibly summed it up on this very page for those who aren't aware of my feelings on the subject.
I'm getting a £10 Amazon voucher for something I helped out with, and I'll just drop that on the price of the standard. I want the game, but seeing as the competitive element has been stripped from it, and it now is very much a drop in, earn some coins, unlock some superfluous shit type of experience, I really don't think I'll be motivated to play it all that much two months from release, let alone two years. And I'm sure most of my friends won't even bother with it given their reaction to the codification of Reach, let alone 4.
Again, don't want to sound too negative or bitter, I'm still really excited about Halo 4, and I'll still be buying it day one. I just don't feel that urge to drop an obscene amount of money on it when I don't have complete faith in the product or it's developers like I did for past Halos.
Can't wait for Campaign though, I've avoided all leaked content so far.
I'm getting a £10 Amazon voucher for something I helped out with, and I'll just drop that on the price of the standard. I want the game, but seeing as the competitive element has been stripped from it, and it now is very much a drop in, earn some coins, unlock some superfluous shit type of experience, I really don't think I'll be motivated to play it all that much two months from release, let alone two years. And I'm sure most of my friends won't even bother with it given their reaction to the codification of Reach, let alone 4.
Again, don't want to sound too negative or bitter, I'm still really excited about Halo 4, and I'll still be buying it day one. I just don't feel that urge to drop an obscene amount of money on it when I don't have complete faith in the product or it's developers like I did for past Halos.
Can't wait for Campaign though, I've avoided all leaked content so far.
vincent vega
Member
I'm getting a black screen for the mp stream
Hydranockz
Member
I thought you were around and playd long before Halo had any kind of ranks.
Were you watching the twitch stream posted earlier?
I saw someone post something about campaign, but I don't really believe it. Unless you saw actual video/pics, don't believe whatever you read