theMrCravens
Member
Slow paced (come on that intro...), boring dungeons, and the past-present thing was badly designed (it sounded cool when reading previews).
That midpoint twist was also too weird.
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New Dragon Quest 7 (3DS) features
- Thread starter TurnipFritters
- Start date
That midpoint twist was also too weird.
Wolfgang Jr
Banned
This will make me buy a 3DSXL. I'm playing DQIX now on the DS.
meltingparappa
Member
Fffffffffffffwuhgwuhuguwhggyeaaaaaaagh!!!
"Ahem, yes... I'd like to pre-order one Dragon Quest 7 please."
"Ahem, yes... I'd like to pre-order one Dragon Quest 7 please."
encephalon
Member
Is it just because it takes a long time before battles? There's still a dungeon full of puzzles in the beginning and it's not like you're not doing something.
Lots of people seem to have a major problem with there not being any battles for about an hour at the start of the game. Strangely, people are generally okay with long intros as long as they aren't interactive, because DQ7 is far from the only RPG with a long intro devoid of battles but it's one of the only ones that gets flak. Persona 4 being another, although it's not brought up that often.
encephalon
Member
I should mention that I've actually played through the intro to DQ7 before getting to the first real cave/mine dungeon area only to have my game freeze and discover huge scratches on the bottom of the copy that I own. I didn't really have a problem with the intro. I'll be playing through it again.
TurnipFritters
Member
They haven't said much about it, and since it's coming out in like a month I don't expect any radical changes.
Autumn Wind
Member
I am sold and I will be importing this from Japan (don't have a 3DS but will buy one). There is nothing I need multiplayer for right? I can play this entirely single player?
Yes.
decoyplatypus
Member
I like DQ7's intro. It sets a unique and mysterious tone for the game. Besides, walking around and talking to NPCs is a major part of DQ7 (even more than in other DQs), so it makes sense that the game would want to prepare players for that fact.
Xenosaga gets a ton of shit for this and deserves it.
Honestly I find the length of time until the Dharma temple unlocks to be the more serious offense. Most RPGs I played on the PSX were wrapping up in the same amount of time it took me to get to the meat of the job system.
No arguments there. I was thinking a couple of weeks ago about how they could reorgaize the game a little bit to put the Dharma shrine segment a little earlier in the game. I think it'd be doable; they could put it before Falrish, at the very least. I kinda doubt they did anything like that though. It'd be a fair bit of work and rebalancing, especially since you'd have Keifer at that point.
I think there's a bit of a difference between there being a ton of cutscenes and nothing to actually "play" and there simply being no battles for a long time. In DQ7, the game starts like an adventure game. You walk around, you discover stuff, there are puzzles underground, etc. It's a lot of build up, but there's still a lot of interaction and fun stuff to keep the player occupied. Unless the complaint is that the player is not interested in any of these things in a RPG and only want battles, then well... that's a matter of personal taste.
For the record, regarding Xenosaga, I think the start of Episode 1, where Shion is on the ship and you basically go through the entire ship in the beginning talking to people and checking out the various parts of the ship before the attack starts, was really compelling and a great piece of narrative and RPG design. The long-ass cutscenes were an issue, but not having combat being a focus right from the start is not a flaw.
encephalon
Member
There was combat right at the start though. Xenosaga doesn't start on the ship, it starts with the simulated dungeon. : )
Oh God, tutorials are worse than not having combat. >_<
encephalon
Member
Haha. If I remember correctly, you can skip the basic combat tutorial.
I would've liked to have seen FFXIII employ an exploratory ship a la the Woglinde to deal with the pacing issue (forgot the name of the ship you board post Ch. 7). Wouldn't have fixed the story itself though.
Yeah I remember when I hit like 40 hours on DQ7 and realized I had barely scratched the surface of the game. I could've beaten Chrono Trigger 4 times in that same span! Or FF6 like one and a half times!
You could always have Keifer's job progression pass off to his replacement. Sort of like Galuf/Kryle in FF5.
That's a weird mindset though. If you're thinking of what else you could be doing instead while playing a certain game, why not just stop playing the game. If you think there's something better you could be doing, just do it. Otherwise, it doesn't matter if you could have beaten Chrono Trigger 4 times in the same time span. The question is whether you would rather play CT 4 times. If not, why does it matter?!
decoyplatypus
Member
Moving the Dharma temple forward might also bring more of the ultimate classes within reach non-grinding players.
I think the comparison illustrates how unusual DQ7 is in opening up a major game system at the 20 to 30-hour mark. Now, the fact that DQ7's structure is unusual doesn't make it bad, but it does invite scrutiny.
That's a weird mindset though. If you're thinking of what else you could be doing instead while playing a certain game, why not just stop playing the game. If you think there's something better you could be doing, just do it. Otherwise, it doesn't matter if you could have beaten Chrono Trigger 4 times in the same time span. The question is whether you would rather play CT 4 times. If not, why does it matter?!
I think the comparison illustrates how unusual DQ7 is in opening up a major game system at the 20 to 30-hour mark. Now, the fact that DQ7's structure is unusual doesn't make it bad, but it does invite scrutiny.
I just remember the 90 minute cutscene or whatever it was and blanked the rest out.
What you present though doesn't sound as bad; sounds more like the Virtuous Mission and debriefing in Snake Eater, which while obnoxiously long was broken up with a fair chunk of actual game and an opening I really liked.
What I remember of Xenosaga Ep. 1 though was more like MGS 4's awful beginning of wall to wall cutscene.
I'm not defending the cutscenes, I'm just creating perspective of which parts are actually "good" and "bad".
I'm not defending the cutscenes, I'm just creating perspective of which parts are actually "good" and "bad".
Well it's not like I'm ever going to play Episode One ever again!
Unlike DQ 7, which I'll either play sometime later this year or next or import dejectedly in 2015 with the latest Japanese model 3DS and all the other lost cause games that never came out like Rocket Slime 3, DQM 3DS, Bravely Default and what have you.
That's a weird mindset though. If you're thinking of what else you could be doing instead while playing a certain game, why not just stop playing the game. If you think there's something better you could be doing, just do it. Otherwise, it doesn't matter if you could have beaten Chrono Trigger 4 times in the same time span. The question is whether you would rather play CT 4 times. If not, why does it matter?!
I think its just the fact that the game hadn't really even started in the same amount of time that it takes me to beat a quality JRPG like FF6. I'm not saying it as a negative per se because I didn't find the game to be meandering like a Tales game. Its just an extremely slow burn.
Just take it with you.
Member
Yeah, DQ7's intro didn't bother me as much as this did. It doesn't help that the game takes away one of your party members that you've been building up for a lengthy stretch.
DQ 7 is a commitment. It's the only game that wasn't Massively Multiplayer that I ever played during an unemployed summer that I played a good chunk of every day and still didn't beat it until school got back in session. It's quite rewarding but I fully understand measuring it's length against other RPGs back in the day.
I know a bunch of people who really liked it but ended up dropping it pretty early because every time they'd start it up again they'd just feel lost or daunted by all that was left to do and it nearly got me too but I'm so glad I stuck with it. Each little vignette is it's own well crafted mini adventure and the way it eventually weaves together is quite touching.
The only problems I have with it now are the localization, which was very so-so, the out of the way hint system for when the game decides to get tricky with you, the job system coming a bit late and not being quite as pleasant as the one from VIII and IX, the character design which you gotta just grin and bear (Toriyama's worst by a far bit) and the various issues it has with being a very late Playstation game that looks and plays like a very early Playstation game.
Three of those things are fixed from the get go with this version. It looks great, the hint system is readily available, and I'm sure if it is localized it will be done with more care. The rest isn't too bad.
I know a bunch of people who really liked it but ended up dropping it pretty early because every time they'd start it up again they'd just feel lost or daunted by all that was left to do and it nearly got me too but I'm so glad I stuck with it. Each little vignette is it's own well crafted mini adventure and the way it eventually weaves together is quite touching.
The only problems I have with it now are the localization, which was very so-so, the out of the way hint system for when the game decides to get tricky with you, the job system coming a bit late and not being quite as pleasant as the one from VIII and IX, the character design which you gotta just grin and bear (Toriyama's worst by a far bit) and the various issues it has with being a very late Playstation game that looks and plays like a very early Playstation game.
Three of those things are fixed from the get go with this version. It looks great, the hint system is readily available, and I'm sure if it is localized it will be done with more care. The rest isn't too bad.
Damon Bennet
Member
I don't feel that's really true. DQ7 has a lot of systems and a lot of content, so while more systems are still opening up way later in the game, the game has definitely started way before that. I think of DQ7 as a collection of short stories. A really thick omnibus collection. Later in the book, there are still new themes and narrative formats popping up in the stories, but that doesn't mean the stories earlier in the book were meaningless.
TurnipFritters
Member
I hadn't noticed it before, but I kinda love how the selection icon is a little anchor.
Killer Yakuza B
Member
Maybe it's the fact that I live on an island I've always wanted to get out of and couldn't, but DQ7's opening is one of my favorites in any game. Finally going somewhere else felt incredible; the longer it took me to finish it, the better it felt once it was over and I was "free." I understand how it could be made better for other people but I wouldn't change a thing.
I'm really looking forward to playing this remake.
I'm really looking forward to playing this remake.
Honestly, I used to be one of DQVII's biggest detractors much like I am of FFXII.
I never got the love and adoration DQVII got.
Like with FFXII I kept trying it and trying it and forced myself to finish it.
However, unlike FFXII I finally did see why DQVII is the best in the series. Yeah that beginning is really offputting. But after going back through it the third time with an open mind it all just "clicked" and I fell in love with it. The secret is to stop being in a hurry and let the game just spread out in front of you and take its time. It really is the best in the series. VIII has the best presentation and III comes close. But I still think VII is the best. I think it might be better than III because it was a game that proved me wrong and ergo it holds a special place in my heart.
ZOMG, a liquid metal slime! Get it!
Diddy Kong
Banned
It looks great!
Kai Dracon
Writing a dinosaur space opera symphony
I need this in my life.
Then I need a remake of DQ8 in this engine in my life.
Then I need a remake of DQ8 in this engine in my life.
Velcro Fly
Member
Will pretty much be a crime if this doesn't make it out of Japan.
I'll take the GBC version of 1-3 on the VC and a port/remake of VIII for the 3DS also. No sense in not having the non MMO games on one system.
I'll take the GBC version of 1-3 on the VC and a port/remake of VIII for the 3DS also. No sense in not having the non MMO games on one system.