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Project Eternity GAF Inn Design Discussion - Let your voice be heard!

Atruvius

Member
This needs to be a picture on the wall

3CXSqkh.jpg


Maybe replace the plane with a goose :lol

I think it would be cool to have a painting of a knight riding in to the sunset. Or replace the knight with some mass transit of that world. Though that goose would work too if the inn's name is Goose And Fox.
 

Violet_0

Banned
totally approve of using the sunset meme, doesn't get much more subtle than that. It's kinda missing the context, but it will do fine as wall painting in the background or something
 

dude

dude
Yeah Tome of Evilore ..also Bish the barkeep with his ban hammer behind the counter(just restating someone else's idea). Honestly the more references the better. Just don't make them stupidly obvious or out of place.

I really dislike the banhammer meme and I don't think we should use it. Basically every forum on the internet has a banhammer joke. We should focus on stuff that are unique to GAF.
 

A Human Becoming

More than a Member
I really dislike the banhammer meme and I don't think we should use it. Basically every forum on the internet has a banhammer joke. We should focus on stuff that are unique to GAF.
So something like...
_____ just stabbed themselves in the foot.

I don't know how much the rest of you know about _____ culture (I'm an expert), but honor and shame are huge parts of it. It's not like it is in _____ where you can become successful by being an asshole. If you screw someone over in _____, you bring shame to yourself, and the only way to get rid of that shame is repentance.

What this means is the _____ public, after hearing about this, is not going to want to purchase goods for either _____, nor will they purchase any of _____'s goods. This is HUGE. You can laugh all you want, but _____ has alienated an entire market with this move.

_____, publicly apologize and cancel _____ or you can kiss your business goodbye.
 

mclem

Member
Riffing on the idea of banning:

If people cause trouble in a pub in the UK, they can get barred from it. Handled deftly, I think the Goose and Fox should be very willing to bar people. Even the players? Maybe it has a bit of a reputation outside thanks to that. Can you sneak back in if you get barred? How would the bars be enforced? Clearly there needs to be some muscle behind it. Paint it as an organised crime dive? A friendly face, but with shady influence beyond the Inn? Getting dangerous, too self-referential. Needs to be handled with care.


Maybe "The new goose and fox"? Just to make the reference a bit clearer.
Needs dialogue for "What happened to the old goose and fox?". Which could tie in. "There was a brawl. Destroyed most of the furniture. When we renovated, we introduced the barring policy".


What I'm trying to think through is that the Inn needs to feel like it *exists*; like it has backstory, like it has a reason for being what it is. References need to be handled very carefully.
 

dude

dude
What I'm trying to think through is that the Inn needs to feel like it *exists*; like it has backstory, like it has a reason for being what it is. References need to be handled very carefully.

Agree 100%. We need to carefully consider everything so that it makes sense as references but also not break immersion.
 
No memes or references to individual posters would be nice.

Ultimately agree, but man that drawing with the characters was pretty awesome. I can't remember who drew it. I would feel left out because I wouldn't make the cut of representation, as I'm sure many would feel.

Nice sign, Jocchan, really dig it. Still love 'The Goose and dFox'.
 
The Inn should have a smoke filled basement full of old, grizzled, sweaty guys arguing about long-over wars and how old tactics are better than modern tactics, a main level full of young people arguing over whether the world is full of art or experiences, and a top floor rookery for passenger pigeons managed by 30 year old men wearing little girl masks.
 

wilflare

Member
hope the inn has a bulletin board of sorts..
where the latest and hotly-contested news will be featured.
e.g.
"Patcher says..."
"Susan Wilson..."

yada
 

mclem

Member
no memes means no drunken kicked off dennis dyack near the inn entrance?

I'd say "Not memes, but themes". Because it rhymes, basically. Drunken kicked off Dennis Dyack? No. Guy who was barred from it turning up in another inn and badmouthing it to you? Sure. Stuff that conveys an *idea* of things about GAF without being explicit references, and only so much as we can get into a traditional fantasy inn without it feeling crowbarred in unnecessarily.
 

OTIX

Member
My two cents:

We can't expect many custom assets to be made for the tavern. Maybe a sign and little more. Speaking of the sign, what did you have in mind? Something like this (apologies for the crude sketch)?

VjTniHn.png

I was thinking an orange fox and a grey goose could be made to resemble the GAF logo, but that might look a little contrived. The background in your version could be an orange sunrise over a grey mountain.

I like the idea that the tavern owner is an unusually prickly fellow that is known to kick people out of his establishment if they don't live up to his standards of good behaviour.
 

Anoregon

The flight plan I just filed with the agency list me, my men, Dr. Pavel here. But only one of you!
I like the idea that the tavern owner is an unusually prickly fellow that is known to kick people out of his establishment if they don't live up to his standards of good behaviour.

There is an awesome hole-in-the-wall diner like that where I went to college. They weren't 24-hour, but on Friday nights would stay open late so people could get food after the bars closed. They had a strict no-cursing policy, so if you stumbled in there and were acting like a drunk ass they would kick you out. The food was delicious.
 

F!ReW!Re

Member
My two cents:
VjTniHn.png

I really like that sign!

What we also could do is having the Fox fighting the Goose in a sort of Yin/Yang symbol on the floor of the inn;
- a carpet
- a mosaic
YinYang-web.jpg

orange-black-lentil-forming-yin-yang-symbol-27983152.jpg


I think we should keep the meme's to a minimum. I rather have a quest/mini dungeon that relates to GAF than having multiple meme's that a lot of people won't even get.
I hope we also get to design the actual building (outside and inside). I've got some suggestions if they allow us to do that.
I also like the idea that tavern is split-up in multiple sections, one focused on games (gambling) while the other is focused on talk/discussions..
 

deleted

Member
Someone in the Inn could tell the tale of the singer Dennis the Duck, who spread songs everywhere about 'Goose and Fox' and it's visitors being responsible for everything bad in the world, until he was finally banished and sank with his ship, the 'pars quinque'
 
There is an awesome hole-in-the-wall diner like that where I went to college. They weren't 24-hour, but on Friday nights would stay open late so people could get food after the bars closed. They had a strict no-cursing policy, so if you stumbled in there and were acting like a drunk ass they would kick you out. The food was delicious.

sounds like a place here in Buffalo. The hours , I believe are definitely to restrict the drunk crowds of the university area.

I just want this Inn to be fucking rad and well thought out. I know we can do it GAF.
 

Rapstah

Member
A fox holding a dead goose in its mouth seems way more appropriate for an inn sign and could probably be made to look a lot like the GAF sphere.
 

Violet_0

Banned
will be interesting to see how much creative input we will have. My guess is, aside from text and conversations, not much. We'll probably just get a pre-made tileset that looks like the other inns that can be modified a bit
 

Khar

Member
The Goose and Fox is OK but the disadvantage of picking an actual real-life pub name is that it sounds a little mundane in a fantasy game.

Perhaps we could fantasy it up a bit?

Gryphon and Fox
Gremlin and Flames

Not those though. Something unique. It'd be rad if it could be a uniquely Googleable name. That way when someone Googles the name they'll get straight to the inevitable Project Eternity wiki pages not some pub in Somerset.

Some of my favourite RPG tavern names are a little more interesting than a plain Black Horse/Rose & Crown type of moniker e.g.

Smoldering Corpse Bar
Wink and Tickle
Copper Coronet
The Hanged Man (despite the terribleness of DA2)
 
While we're on the subject, The Hairy Bear is my favourite videogame pub name (The Witcher 1). We have a pub here in York called The House of Trembling Madness, which is also great.
 
This is tough.

Lots of people saying "no memes," which is great, but then lots of people saying "let's hide such-and-such in the game by doing this."

I think if even two or three things are "hidden" (go ly dow, I'm an expert, Bish at the bar, tome of evil lore, GAF shield, people arguing over weapons, hating things without trying them, etc.) it's going to feel really forced.

Most taverns in the game are going to be one room with two interesting people to talk to, and then you go to this one and there's 10 people all talking about wildly disparate things that sound vaguely out of place but it's tough to put your finger on it.

Honestly I think it would be best to have the name, a piece of equipment, and maybe one dude who says something reminiscent of GAF. And that one dude would be really tough to decide on.
 

zkylon

zkylewd
yeah this seems like it'll be some fallout 2 pop culture reference dump like stuff.

I like the new goose and the fox tho, that's gotta stick
 

Dresden

Member
The Goose and Fox is OK but the disadvantage of picking an actual real-life pub name is that it sounds a little mundane in a fantasy game.

Perhaps we could fantasy it up a bit?

Gryphon and Fox
Gremlin and Flames

Not those though. Something unique. It'd be rad if it could be a uniquely Googleable name. That way when someone Googles the name they'll get straight to the inevitable Project Eternity wiki pages not some pub in Somerset.

Some of my favourite RPG tavern names are a little more interesting than a plain Black Horse/Rose & Crown type of moniker e.g.

Smoldering Corpse Bar
Wink and Tickle
Copper Coronet
The Hanged Man (despite the terribleness of DA2)

Nordic Guys and Falafels
 

Labadal

Member
If people don't want the Goose and the Fox (I like it).

The Golden Ale Fellowship.

They see themselves as the elite. Everyone else sees them as snobs.
 
I don't like the New Goose and Fox. Goose and Fox alone is fine.

It feels like an addition just to go "eh? EH?" a little bit harder, while losing something in the process.

I know you can explain it, saying the old tavern burned down or whatever. I am just used to the names being straightforward. The Green Dragon. The Slaughtered Hog. It doesn't need anything else. It sounds kind of weird and then demands explanation that's then just going to be yet another reference along with the rest.
 

Jocchan

Ὁ μεμβερος -ου
I like the Golden Ale Fellowship!

This is tough.

Lots of people saying "no memes," which is great, but then lots of people saying "let's hide such-and-such in the game by doing this."

I think if even two or three things are "hidden" (go ly dow, I'm an expert, Bish at the bar, tome of evil lore, GAF shield, people arguing over weapons, hating things without trying them, etc.) it's going to feel really forced.

Most taverns in the game are going to be one room with two interesting people to talk to, and then you go to this one and there's 10 people all talking about wildly disparate things that sound vaguely out of place but it's tough to put your finger on it.

Honestly I think it would be best to have the name, a piece of equipment, and maybe one dude who says something reminiscent of GAF. And that one dude would be really tough to decide on.
Truth is: remove the memes and references, and it's not a GAF tavern anymore.
It doesn't necessarily have to be, it could easily be the hideout of the Random Guild of Whatever, but if we want a GAF theme we need to reference GAF somehow.
 
Truth is: remove the memes and references, and it's not a GAF tavern anymore.
It doesn't necessarily have to be, it could easily be the hideout of the Random Guild of Whatever, but if we want a GAF theme we need to reference GAF somehow.

But it is. The names and the colors/logo are all you really need. It's nice of them to offer more than that, but it's still GAF appearing in a game.

It'd be fine if it was just populated with some cool ideas by GAFfers that aren't even references to GAF, just some nice in-universe stuff that we came up with. Being able to look back years later and say "yeah, that NPC was voted in by GAF members, isn't he awesome?" whether it's a reference to something or not. Still made by the community. Isn't that enough?
 

El-Suave

Member
Some dialogue in a quest or the background where the player has to choose if he's "for" or "against" something would be all I ask for - it's such a memorable GAF moment for me. The doesn't need to be any consequence for the choice of course.
 

Jocchan

Ὁ μεμβερος -ου
But it is. The names and the colors/logo are all you really need. It's nice of them to offer more than that, but it's still GAF appearing in a game.

It'd be fine if it was just populated with some cool ideas by GAFfers that aren't even references to GAF, just some nice in-universe stuff that we came up with. Being able to look back years later and say "yeah, that NPC was voted in by GAF members, isn't he awesome?" whether it's a reference to something or not. Still made by the community. Isn't that enough?
I meant, for the tavern to be a GAF tavern it needs something related to GAF. Are the colors really enough? Maybe. Or maybe it would just be a tavern with some orange and grey, and a name about foxes and goose.
I'm not advocating the overt use of silly memes, just saying that if the theme is indeed GAF, it needs to have something to do with GAF. Otherwise, if you strip away everything, you end up with a bland and empty room decorated with nice colors.
 
Oh man. Long email is long! It has begun!!

Hello. My name is Brandon and I am the producer on Project Eternity. I am contacting you because, now that we are entering production, we will need to collect info from you regarding your inn design. This info would normally be collected from our backer site, but we are still in the process of revamping it.

Our lead area designer mentioned that he would like to call you. If you don't mind, you can send me a number you would like to be reached at and a good time to contact you. If that doesn't work, we can always do the email thing.

Below is a basic form that we will be providing from our website. You don't necessarily have to fill this out, but you may want to review it so when you interact with Bobby you will have an idea of what you want. Again, the form is a very basic one, so if there are any special things that need to be worked out (within reason), Bobby will be the one to speak to about it.

Thanks,

-B


Art:

· Floors
o Wood
o Stone

· Walls
o Brick
o Plaster

· Windows
o Square
o Round

· Tables
o Long Tables
o Square Tables
o Round Tables

· Wall Art
o Portraits
o Landscapes

· Trophies
o TBD

· Lighting
o Bright and Lively
o Dark and Moody

· Room Types
o Luxurious (large bed room with high class accessories)
o Functional ( single bed room with matching accessories)
o Common ( bunk beds and chairs)

· Exterior Sign Template:
o TBD

Design:

We will be using your ideas to design an inn or tavern for the game! The text you enter here will not be used verbatim, but will be the starting point for our design. We will do our best to achieve your vision, but some changes may need to be made to accommodate the general game design. Additionally, there may be technical limitations that prevent us from implementing specific visual elements, but will we do our best to meet the spirit of your design.

· What would you like the name of the inn/tavern to be? (Please keep under 30 characters)

· What would you like the innkeeper's name to be? (Please keep under 30 characters)

· In 50 words or less, describe the basic concept of what the innkeeper.

· In 50 words or less, describe the basic concept of what the inn/tavern. E.g.: "High class inn where nobles and important business men meet to discuss future deals."

· In 75 words or less, describe the appearance of the inn/tavern. E.g.: "High end furniture with lots of polished metal fittings are neatly arranged in the main room. The walls are draped with fine art and the whole place has a feeling of class and sophistication."

· In 100 words or less, describe the concept for the history of the inn/tavern. E.g.: "The tavern was founded by Jonas Sayne, a merchant from a noble background. Realizing that Defiance Bay lacked a place for the rich and powerful to meet to discuss business, Sayne commissioned the creation of The Discreet Gentleman in the business friendly Copperlane disctrict. It is rumored a backroom of the tavern houses an entrance to the city jail dungeons."
 
Given that the whole idea behind neoGAF has always been to have a minimalistic approach design wise, maybe it would be nice if that was how the inn felt like as well, so any GAFer would immediately feel at home. ;-)
 

mclem

Member
· In 50 words or less, describe the basic concept of what the innkeeper.
I do hope the game has better proofreading :)

One thing I was musing on: would referencing Elvish lore be a better fit than Evil lore? It's just that Evil's a bit of a, well, blunt word. Unwieldy. It's lore, it's history, it's stories, it can't inherently be evil. If I was writing a tome on the lore of the demonic (for example), I wouldn't title it "Evil Lore".

Elvish retains the same approximate scansion but also fits thematically better. Eldritch differs phonetically more from 'Evil' but keeps a similar meaning.
 

Labadal

Member
We should do a separate thread for inn backers and have the discussion there. It's the only way we'll get our voices heard.
 

chaosblade

Unconfirmed Member
I wonder if the area designer could get a GAF account so he could be involved here instead of just shagg doing it over the phone/email.

I'm not really the creative person to come up with ideas but I'll join in on the discourse of other's ideas.

We should do a separate thread for inn backers and have the discussion there. It's the only way we'll get our voices heard.

I thought that's what this thread was.
 

Keasar

Member
We should do a separate thread for inn backers and have the discussion there. It's the only way we'll get our voices heard.

Pretty sure this thread is just that.

And I like OTIX's idea for the inn sign, have a fox jump onto the goose and make that vaugely resemble the GAF logo.
 

Labadal

Member
· Floors
o Wood
o Stone <<<

· Walls
o Brick<<<
o Plaster

· Windows
o Square<<<
o Round

· Tables
o Long Tables
o Square Tables<<<
o Round Tables

· Wall Art
o Portraits<<<
o Landscapes

· Trophies
o TBD

· Lighting
o Bright and Lively<<<
o Dark and Moody

· Room Types
o Luxurious (large bed room with high class accessories)<<<
o Functional ( single bed room with matching accessories)
o Common ( bunk beds and chairs)

What would you like the name of the inn/tavern to be? (Please keep under 30 characters)
Golden Ale Fellowship

· What would you like the innkeeper's name to be? (Please keep under 30 characters)
Levi van Erol

· In 50 words or less, describe the basic concept of what the innkeeper.
An old retired mercenary that decided he had seen enough death for several lifetimes. He decided that making coin in an inn is safer and he's less likely to end up with his guts spilled out on the ground. Pretends to be a simple man, but those who know him...

· In 50 words or less, describe the basic concept of what the inn/tavern. E.g.: "High class inn where nobles and important business men meet to discuss future deals."
The Golden Ale Fellowship is an inn for nobles and wealthy businesses men, but anyone with decent enough clothing and a purse full of coins is welcome as long as they behave. In here many alliances have been forged and many contracts sealed: assassinations, arranged marriages, and other secret contracts.

· In 75 words or less, describe the appearance of the inn/tavern. E.g.: "High end furniture with lots of polished metal fittings are neatly arranged in the main room. The walls are draped with fine art and the whole place has a feeling of class and sophistication."
The biggest Inn in the city, it houses some of the finest furniture from all around the world. Almost all of them with intricate patterns in different colors. The white walls are decorated with portraits of important people from history and banners of many kinds. There are VIP rooms in the back that are always booked, it seems. These backrooms are simpler with wooden couches and tables. These rooms are not used for their comfort.

· In 100 words or less, describe the concept for the history of the inn/tavern. E.g.: "The tavern was founded by Jonas Sayne, a merchant from a noble background. Realizing that Defiance Bay lacked a place for the rich and powerful to meet to discuss business, Sayne commissioned the creation of The Discreet Gentleman in the business friendly Copperlane disctrict. It is rumored a backroom of the tavern houses an entrance to the city jail dungeons.
Having ended his mercenary career at the age of 34, Levi and some of his men bought an empty building in the Market District. It had previously belonged to a former nobleman. Thinking about what sort of clientele he was looking for, he came to the conclusion that it would be very likely that many of his former employees would do business there. The reason being that he was known to be a very discrete man, something that can’t be said about mercenaries in general. And so it came to be that the Golden Ale Fellowship was founded four years ago.
 

Azih

Member
Hrm. This is where things gets tricsky

Art:

· Floors
o Stone

· Walls
o Brick

· Windows
o Square


· Tables
o Round Tables <-- Better for discussion which is what GAF is all about

· Wall Art
o Portraits <-- The Posters are the important part of GAF


· Trophies
o TBD

· Lighting
o Dark and Moody <-- I don't think Bright and Lively fits GAF.

· Room Types
Can we ask for it be a mix of High End and Functional?

· What would you like the name of the inn/tavern to be? (Please keep under 30 characters)

The Goose and Fox

· What would you like the innkeeper's name to be? (Please keep under 30 characters)

The Bishop
 

mclem

Member
Minor point about the lighting: I can't help but think that *most* backers of this level will be pushing for a dark and moody inn; given it was pitched at communities who may be a bit close-knit and insular and that would fit their self-image.

I don't see GAF like that. It's quite content to welcome and accept *everyone* - eventually - although it's also quick to remove... undesirables. From that standpoint, I do think bright and lively would actually both be a better fit for GAF *and* serve to distinguish itself from the other backed inns.

(Of course, someone from another forum could easily follow similar logic and come to the same conclusion!)
 
I agree about the lighting and atmosphere - it should be well-lit and accomodating... with the possible exception of a dark and slightly nasty cellar underneath!

In terms of the room types available, there should be an assortment of quality / themes to represent the wide variety of users here. Likewise, having a mixture of portraits on the wall and landscapes showing other lands would be cool.
 

Rapstah

Member
It should be made clear that the name of the inn is supposed to be a GAF or NGAF initialism if they can change it so it fits better with the game's lore. Same thing with whatever the inn owner's name is supposed to refer to.

Edit: And if we're going to have to pick, I'd rather have all of one smart person's ideas go through than a mixture of several people's, for coherent design reasons.
 
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