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[MiyazakiHatesKojima]

I cannot believe that Cerny and his team were able to achieve 10.28 Teraflops with just 36 CUs!

XSX needed 52 CU's (16 additional CU's) to achieve an additional 1.87 Teraflops, which is not much of a difference when you really think about it. I guess one of the senior engineers at Microsoft really loves Blink-187 and wanted to pay homage to them in a way.

The power consumption of the XSX will be massive because of its heavy reliance on 52 CU's while the PS5 were cost and power consumption effective with just 36 CU's.

This thread is to start a conversation about whether the XSX's 52 CU's was efficient or not to achieve that additional 1.87 Teraflops gain or not.

 

[Rightisright]

You're off base. Power usage against frequency isn't linear.
The higher you go, your power usage is at a higher penalty.

 

[MiyazakiHatesKojima]

You're off base. Power usage against frequency isn't linear.
The higher you go, your power usage is at a higher penalty.

Elaborate more?

 

[lynux3]

It is pretty insane. They definitely squeezed as much as they could out of just 36CUs. I'd like to see the power consumption at 2.23GHz and I find it insane that Cerny says 2.23GHz can be sustained.

 

[TyphoonStruggle]

Elaborate more?

expect PS5 to consume disproportionately more power and heat

perhaps provide inconsistent performance and subject to more failure

 

[MiyazakiHatesKojima]

expect PS5 to consume disproportionately more power and heat

perhaps provide inconsistent performance and subject to more failure

I'll need someone like a tech vetted dev on GAF to elaborate more on this.

 

[VCL]

"up to" 10.28 tf

 

[JareBear: Remastered]

What is the key factor behind implementing only 36 CUs? Why not use, like, 48, or whatever?

Cost? power consumption?

 

[SleepDoctor]

10.28 tf max while overclocking

Otherwise single digits

 

[MiyazakiHatesKojima]

10.28 tf max while overclocking

Otherwise single digits

This is not true at all.

I don't remember reading anything about overclocking from the Eurogamer article.

 

[DynamiteCop!]

Yeah it's "up to", the reality is the GPU will likely operate generally around the 9.8 Teraflop range while the Series X is a fixed 12.155 Teraflops.

The GPU in the SX is effectively 1.75 PS4's more powerful than the PS5.

Sorry.

 

[longdi]

Imma going to bet series X will have 250w tdp while ps5 hits 280w.

 

[Self High Five]

"up to" 10.28 tf

 

[MiyazakiHatesKojima]

The GPU in the SX is effectively 1.75 PS4's more powerful than the PS5.

Let's stick to the minimal difference which is 1.87-1.98 Teraflops, and not use "Gamecube taped" analogy terminology.

 

[DynamiteCop!]

Imma going to bet series X will have 250w tdp while ps5 hits 280w.

One will also be louder, and one will also be hotter, and one will also be more suseptible to hardware failure.

I'll let you figure out which.

Let's stick to the minimal difference which is 1.87-1.98 Teraflops, and not use "Gamecube taped" analogy terminology.

How about let's not, this isn't fantasy island.

 

[SleepDoctor]

What is the key factor behind implementing only 36 CUs? Why not use, like, 48, or whatever?

Cost? power consumption?

Most likely cost. They cheaped out on the Pro and did the same with the Ps5. People said X was more powerful cuz they had an extra year but now ms announced first and still weaker.

 

[MiyazakiHatesKojima]

One will also be louder, and one will also be hotter, and one will also be more suseptible to hardware failure.

Cerny already spoke publicly about these issues and how the PS5 architecture mitigates this issue precisely.

 

[Dane]

10.28tf boost, xbox 12.15tf is standard.

So the PS5 standard could be on the range of the 9.2tf.

 

[MiyazakiHatesKojima]

How about let's not, this isn't fantasy island

This doesn't make sense lol.

Let's stick to the hard numbers and not "PS4 stacked on top of each other" analogies.

 

[DynamiteCop!]

Cerny already spoke publicly about these issues and how the PS5 architecture mitigates this issue precisely.

Cerny is of no consequence to the power requirements. thermal implications and noise output of pushing frequencies that high.

He got out-engineered day and date by Microsoft employees, something people said was impossible. The man isn't a god.

 

[DynamiteCop!]

This doesn't make sense lol.

Let's stick to the hard numbers and not "PS4 stacked on top of each other" analogies.

It's not an analogy, it's context for the kind of power disparity there is here.

 

[siekro1983]

This is not true at all.

I don't remember reading anything about overclocking from the Eurogamer article.

actually it's true, its a boost mode. he even said some games pushing the envelope will run at most likely single digits.

 

[dottme]

What is the key factor behind implementing only 36 CUs? Why not use, like, 48, or whatever?

Cost? power consumption?

Both. But cost is a big one. The bigger the die area, the more expensive the chip is to produce.

 

[MiyazakiHatesKojima]

Cerny is of no consequence to the power requirements. thermal implications and noise output of pushing frequencies that high.

He got out-engineered day and date by Microsoft employees, something people said was impossible. The man isn't a god.

You're clearly taking this topic too personally as if Cerny is the focus of the topic at hand.

For the 3rd time, let's stick to the hard numbers and technical aspects of the topic.

Cerny and his team already provided information that has been validated by Digital Foundry and other developers to be valid technological architecture that can technically mitigate the issues of overheating.

 

[SleepDoctor]

actually it's true, its a boost mode. he even said some games pushing the envelope will run at most likely single digits.

9.2 to be exact

 

[MiyazakiHatesKojima]

It's not an analogy, it's context for the kind of power disparity there is here.

Stick to the hard numbers, please.

 

[Stuart360]

You're clearly taking this topic too personally as if Cerny is the focus of the topic at hand.

For the 3rd time, let's stick to the hard numbers and technical aspects of the topic.

Cerny and his team already provided information that has been validated by Digital Foundry and other developers to be valid technological architecture that can technically mitigate the issues of overheating.

Yes by lowering the clocks Myazaki.

 

[MiyazakiHatesKojima]

9.2 to be exact

Where did anyone mention 9.2?

Did Cerny reveal it? Did Eurogamer reveal it?

 

[MaulerX]

Both the PS5s CPU and GPU are labeled as having "variable frequency". The numbers they provided are peak performance. Which means it will most likely be less in real world scenarios. Aside from the SSD, the Series X is the more capable console in every other metric.

The heat and noise that will come out of the PS5 with those clocks might be a cause for concern.

 

[DynamiteCop!]

You're clearly taking this topic too personally as if Cerny is the focus of the topic at hand.

For the 3rd time, let's stick to the hard numbers and technical aspects of the topic.

Cerny and his team already provided information that has been validated by Digital Foundry and other developers to be valid technological architecture that can technically mitigate the issues of overheating.

They're pushing the same shader cores as in the Xbox Series X to a 21% higher frequency, I don't care what the man says, it's going to be hot, it's going to use a lot of power, and it's no doubt going to be quite audible.

 

[MiyazakiHatesKojima]

Yes by lowering the clocks Myazaki.

So, the variable clocks was directly related to the overheating issues?

They're pushing the same shader cores as in the Xbox Series X to a 21% higher frequency, I don't care what the man says, it's going to be hot, it's going to use a lot of power, and it's no doubt going to be quite audible.

From what i recall, Cerny and his team in the presentation talked about the overheating and fan noises in the panel and said how the architecture and cooling system will mitigate these issues which will be revealed during the breakdown event.

 

[Stuart360]

Where did anyone mention 9.2?

Did Cerny reveal it? Did Eurogamer reveal it?

Digital Foundry said it. Thats why there have been threads about Github believers getting apolagies for the abuse they got on here by fanboys. PS5 running at 2.0ghz = 9.2tf, which is what the Github leaks said. The leaks just didnt have the boost on at that time

 

[Gamernyc78]

Both the PS5s CPU and GPU are labeled as having "variable frequency". The numbers they provided are peak performance. Which means it will most likely be less in real world scenarios. Aside from the SSD, the Series X is the more capable console in every other metric.

The heat and noise that will come out of the PS5 with those clocks might be a cause for concern.

Concern? Isn't everyone saying psv splurged on a great cooling system? Hellooo thts why thy opted for a good cooling system so it does t have those issues

 

[Roxkis_ii]

They're pushing the same shader cores as in the Xbox Series X to a 21% higher frequency, I don't care what the man says, it's going to be hot, it's going to use a lot of power, and it's no doubt going to be quite audible.

Oh wow, thats crazy that you know more about the ps5 then the lead systems architect.

 

[MiyazakiHatesKojima]

Digital Foundry said it. Thats why there have been threads about Github believers getting apolagies for the abuse they got on here by fanboys. PS5 running at 2.0ghz = 9.2tf, which is what the Github leaks said. The leaks just didnt have the boost on at that time

They said it today or during the Github leaks?

 

[SleepDoctor]

It seems the only thing osiris was right about was the dev kit running hot and loud.

Another jet engine incoming? Hope not

 

[Mattyp]

This thread is to start a conversation about whether the XSX's 52 CU's was efficient or not to achieve that additional 1.87 Teraflops gain or not.

Can we have a discussion on if 2200 boosted clock speeds are an efficient way to get out of the single digit TF?

Microsoft should wind up from 1850 to 2200 also

 

[MiyazakiHatesKojima]

Can we have a discussion on if 2200 boosted clock speeds are an efficient way to get out of the single digit TF?

Microsoft should wind up from 1850 to 2200 also

The XSX didn't achieve 12 Teraflops efficiently since they needed 52 CUs to achieve a mere 1.87 Teraflops difference.

Again, this thread is to start a conversation about whether the XSX's 52 CU's was efficient or not to achieve that additional 1.87 Teraflops gain or not.

 

[Stuart360]

They said it today or during the Github leaks?

I'm pretty sure they mention it in their PS5 vid. Fact is Sony are pushing the clocks to ridiculous levels (even by PC standards) to make the difference seem not as big. 10.3tf vs 12.1tf looks a hell of a lot better than 9.2tf vs 12.1tf.

 

[DynamiteCop!]

Oh wow, thats crazy that you know more about the ps5 then the lead systems architect.

Shocking, it's not as if we haven't had PC hardware for the last 40 years to figure out thermal workloads and the resulting outcropping from them.

There's a reason Microsoft went with more typical clockspeeds and more CU's.

 

[Foamy]

I cannot believe that Cerny and his team was able to achieve 10.28 Teraflops with just 36 CUs!

XSX needed 52 CU's (16 additional CU's)to achieve an additional 1.87 Teraflops, which is not much of a difference when you really think about it. I guess one of the senior engineers at Microsoft really loves Blink-187 and wanted to pay homage to them in a way.

The power consumption of the XSX will be massive because of its heavy reliance on 52 CU's while the PS5 were cost and power consumption effective with just 36 CU's.

This thread is to start a conversation about whether the XSX's 52 CU's was efficient or not to achieve that additional 1.87 Teraflops gain or not.

Sad man attempts sad spin after crushing defeat.

 

[Stuart360]

The XSX didn't achieve 12 Teraflops efficiently since they needed 52 CUs to achieve a mere 1.87 Teraflops difference.

XSX clocks are LOCKED, meaning there is a ton of headroom available if needed. You cant flat lock clocks without massive headroom.

 

[DynamiteCop!]

XSX clocks are LOCKED, meaning there is a ton of headroom available if needed. You cant flat lock clocks without massive headroom.

Yeah, it seems Sony's system has a turbo mode for intermittent workloads where performance on the system might be about to tank and then it adjusts the frequency on the fly.

That's not going to be sustained by any means, it's their headroom for hiccups.

 

[Stuart360]

It seems the only thing osiris was right about was the dev kit running hot and loud.

Another jet engine incoming? Hope not

Osiris pretty much admitted he's been bullshitting, before the reveal started. He will be banned soon i'm sure.

 

[Great Hair]

Without the "gpu boost (2.23Ghz)", the gap is actually bigger than 2Tflops. At 2Ghz the PS5 has only 9.2Tflops, weak arse crap ... but at least they can fill it up so fast thanks that 10GB/s ssd ... only sony studio will take advantage.

9Tflop = no matter how sexy rdna2 is, how fast it si, how good it blows ... 9 = is weak ass. Unforgivable to have wasted so much TIME and MONEY (R&D) on that SSD and shitty 3D audio SOCOM on the PS2 already had ffs.

$299 max., no matter how much it cost them. Sony has to subsidize it af. Just imagine that consoles get postponed to 2021 :

Are you going to buy a weak PS with 9Tflops, only 3 more than XBone One X in the year 2021? for $400 or more? NOPE

They for sure can not wait another month before sharing FULL detail, techdemos, game footage, projects, new ips, dualshock 5, vr plans and so on. Even the PS4 reveal one in new york was more intersting.

 

[siekro1983]

Concern? Isn't everyone saying psv splurged on a great cooling system? Hellooo thts why thy opted for a good cooling system so it does t have those issues

if it's such a amazing cooling system why is it not a locked at 2.23ghz? it's Bunch of PR BS.

 

[thismeinteil]

Lol, it's not enough that they have a 12.1 vs 10.3 scenerio, Xbox fans have to spread even more FUD. Are you guys still that worried about the PS5? Cerny said that the system will be running constantly in Boost Mode, due in large part to their cooling system being able to handle that kind of heat. 10.3 Tflops isn't just a rare occurence. That is what it will run at the vast majority of the time. And it will only downclock slightly if the CPU is demanding more.

 

[Filippos]

Lol, it's not enough that they have a 12.1 vs 10.3 scenerio, Xbox fans have to spread even more FUD. Are you guys still that worried about the PS5? Cerny said that the system will be running constantly in Boost Mode, due in large part to their cooling system being able to handle that kind of heat. 10.3 Tflops isn't just a rare occurence. That is what it will run at the vast majority of the time. And it will only downclock slightly if the CPU is demanding more.

Any proof? Why the boost mode then? MS is locked and fix for everything all the time.
But we will see, when they get released. DF will proof it

 

[SleepDoctor]

Osiris pretty much admitted he's been bullshitting, before the reveal started. He will be banned soon i'm sure.

Really? Link?

Im not surprised, it seems the Sony warriors are just the best targets. Look at Tommy too.

 

[Mattyp]

The XSX didn't achieve 12 Teraflops efficiently since they needed 52 CUs to achieve a mere 1.87 Teraflops difference.

Again, this thread is to start a conversation about whether the XSX's 52 CU's was efficient or not to achieve that additional 1.87 Teraflops gain or not.

Yes it is, and I half answered that in my comment in a tongue in cheek way. They need less clock speeds, which means less heat and less noise, less problems.