Niche is fine I just want something of actual quality, the GPD win was disappointing.
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
A Wild SteamBoy Appeared. Smach Zero. From $699...
- Thread starter Crayon
- Start date
Niche is fine I just want something of actual quality, the GPD win was disappointing.
The Greek Freak
Member
Give me real analog sticks and I'd be interested.
They are working on an add-on called Z-Pads that would allow one to play via analog sticks/emulate the controls of a console like, among others, the Gamecube:
You can't expect these small OEM to deliver Sony/Nintendo quality. GPD has years of experience of producing handhelds, If the Smach ever releases, I expect it to have rougher edges than the GPD Win.
The Greek Freak
Member
LOL these might be worse than no analog sticks at all.
I think it's a neat way of allowing emulation of a given console to be more authentic i.e. matching the button setup on the Gamecube controller while using the Dolphin, etc.
The GPD Win lacked the power I was looking for in a gaming palmtop, hence why I so enthusiastically supported the Smach Z project. That said, the recent delays and negotiations with new partners have curbed by optimism in the project so, while I hope that it comes out as a success so that we see more devices like it or the Win, i'm skeptical it won't be a shadow of its former self, especially when it comes to modularity.
It sounds like Horned Owl could be the SoC. That's promising, but the associated delays and expectations of running a 15W processor in this form factor seem like mistakes due to inexperience. This is understandable, but I'd absolutely love a company with manufacturing capability to build a Zen(2?)/Vega APU palmtop.
GhostTrick
Banned
Horned Owl might consume just too much. Let's be honest, in that form factor, the most you want is 7W for your TDP.
dragonzdogma
Member
Steam is mostly indie games right?
But I don't see a Dpad on that handheld device...is kinda strange .
But I don't see a Dpad on that handheld device...is kinda strange .
Steam is like mostly...all games. It has about every genre and anything and everything from indie to AAA.
Yeah, just indies. No AAA titles. They've announced that by 2018 they're culling anything other than text adventures.
Bit of an update on the project (by which I mean I checked out the forums and saw the posts made by the team's PR, Daniel Fernandez). Here's a quick summary:
-It turns out that ImasD's announcement violated the contract set between them, owing to a failure of meeting the signed terms (which, according to Team Smach, were set out by ImasD) and breaking the NDA in their breakup announcement. While they will provide further details in a future update, Smach's lawyers are currently taking care of the situation.
-In addition, while ImasD had completed about 50% of the project, not all their work can be re-used with their new partners, namely SoC integration. In addition, they've yet to deliver the materials for evaluation.
-Development costs likely won't change dramatically since previous costs were fixed by the contract. Their new partners are less costly and while they may vary slightly depending on the components they choose, they should remain similar to the expected costs from before.
-One of the new collaborators, Bleujour, was recommended by AMD. The other one, On Testing, is a team of five whose work will be "complemented by external companies". This was mentioned in response to a post on Reddit that was inaccurate.
-"The hardware wont be out-of-date. We cant give more details at the moment/We cant opine on leaked information." For the record: The reason we know about the Horned Owl is due to a leak.
-It turns out that ImasD's announcement violated the contract set between them, owing to a failure of meeting the signed terms (which, according to Team Smach, were set out by ImasD) and breaking the NDA in their breakup announcement. While they will provide further details in a future update, Smach's lawyers are currently taking care of the situation.
-In addition, while ImasD had completed about 50% of the project, not all their work can be re-used with their new partners, namely SoC integration. In addition, they've yet to deliver the materials for evaluation.
-Development costs likely won't change dramatically since previous costs were fixed by the contract. Their new partners are less costly and while they may vary slightly depending on the components they choose, they should remain similar to the expected costs from before.
-One of the new collaborators, Bleujour, was recommended by AMD. The other one, On Testing, is a team of five whose work will be "complemented by external companies". This was mentioned in response to a post on Reddit that was inaccurate.
-"The hardware wont be out-of-date. We cant give more details at the moment/We cant opine on leaked information." For the record: The reason we know about the Horned Owl is due to a leak.
I agree. For the form factor and performance I'd like, chances are 7nm is more appropriate.
DrROBschiz
Member
Aretak
Member
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d00I_3THLBQ
An interesting video that outright accuses the whole thing of being a scam.
An interesting video that outright accuses the whole thing of being a scam.
Well, that was 18 minutes i'll never get back.
In the first three minutes, all they've done is make obnoxious noises and joke about pronouncing the console's name before bringing up the GPD WIN as "the SteamOS console that beat the Smach Z to the door" despite the fact that the WIN doesn't run Steam OS which is misleading their viewers in regards to that missing quote, not to mention that the updates not being public isn't unique to the Smach Z kickstarter, even if I agree it's a bad decision for publicity, especially in light of recent events being covered whereas other updates have not. This isn't even touching on the content within the private updates or the forums that was clearly ignored in order to support their conspiratorial narrative. They accuse the developers of not having a prototype/the prototype being a Linx when in the very same video (which doesn't seem to be the case), they show off the prototype using the clickARM technology developed by Rhomb.io. LowSpecGamer even did a video testing it out via a developer board: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WUN1XPsKv08. they bring up Rhomb.io's now infamous breakup post without addressing the fact that they broke the contract set out between them and Team Smach Z (which was one of the reasons why the updates were so infrequent). I don't normally like to make accusations such as this, but I get the impression that StopDrop&Retro are trying to capitalize on the current confusion surrounding the project in what amounts to an unfocused ramble of a conspiracy. There are legitimate concerns to be had surrounding the current development of the Smach-Z, but calling it a scam a la PGS exposes their ignorance in terms of what constitutes a prototype.
EDIT: The developers responded: https://forum.smachz.com/forum/qa-9/topic/youtuber-stopdropretro-analysis-272/
Rhombio has opened up again, seemingly in part to accusations that they broke the NDA and the video's allegations of faking the device.
This upcoming AMA sounds like it might be interesting.
https://blog.rhomb.io/rhomb-io-will-not-support-smachz-project/
This upcoming AMA sounds like it might be interesting.
https://blog.rhomb.io/rhomb-io-will-not-support-smachz-project/
DrROBschiz
Member
Damn thats a shame
this rhombio fallout is a setback for sure
This project looks like a ways out still
this rhombio fallout is a setback for sure
This project looks like a ways out still
It was always going to suffer delays and setbacks, it's a Kickstarter project after all. What wasn't expected was how these delays would play out i.e. the Rhomb.io breakup.
See my post for why it's misleading.
NoFaceNico
Member
In case anyone is interested, Rhomb.io, the company that made the Smach "prototype" in question, will be holding a Reddit AMA tomorrow at 9:00 a.m. EST
https://twitter.com/Rhomb_io/status/887930341561970690
https://twitter.com/Rhomb_io/status/887930341561970690
This will be interesting.
I don't touch Reddit with anything less than a 100-foot pole, but some of the Smach-Z forum goers highlighted that the guy who made that poorly structured and maliciously edited "SCAM-Z EXPOSED GONE SEXUAL" video asked about an e-mail they were sent by the CEO:
In addition, it appears that Rhomb.io is withholding key documentation until they receive payment. The Smach-Z team has responded to the two parties with the following:
Right now, it looks like the Smach-Z's main cause for delay is a legal dispute between them and Rhomb.io.
NoFaceNico
Member
Not much, just a few things stood out to me:
- Smach Z has unpaid invoices to Rhomb, therefore Rhomb refuses to give them their work to date.
- They dispute that the prototype was made from a Linx tablet.
- Rhomb no longer believes in the Smach Z team "but that doesn't mean they can't do it."
- Rhomb gave the prototypes over to Smach Z, which was an important point because it seems there may have been some discussion in the private forums claiming that Smach no longer has the prototypes and therefore can't do a tear down to prove what's in them.
- All photos and video of the prototypes under construction are the property of Smach and they are in possession of them.
- It's very interesting to note that Rhomb never, not even once, refers to the device they made for for Smach Z as a "prototype" they seem to refuse to do so. Instead they describe it with the term "proof of concept" six times! In fact, they're the only ones that ever used that term in the AMA!
Tablet hack confirmed.
I don't touch Reddit with anything less than a 100-foot pole, but some of the Smach-Z forum goers highlighted that the guy who made that poorly structured and maliciously edited "SCAM-Z EXPOSED GONE SEXUAL" video asked about an e-mail they were sent by the CEO:
In addition, it appears that Rhomb.io is withholding key documentation until they receive payment. The Smach-Z team has responded to the two parties with the following:
Right now, it looks like the Smach-Z's main cause for delay is a legal dispute between them and Rhomb.io.
Thanks guys, i'm really allergic to that Reddit format!
It's all a big mess and i know the situation isn't good but i still want to hope that it will deliver in a way or another, i always cheer on new people, new things and competition.
From the forums:
This is the prototype.
Cant see a thing.
Fixed it.
Proof of concept and all that and it may not have just been slapped together and took some work to make but it is definitely a Linx 10 motherboard in there.
The kickstarter heavily implied the prototype was made with modular parts from previous devices imasD had made which is not true in the slightest.
Despite a great many doubts I still don't think this device is a scam but nonetheless I don't trust them.
I wouldn't particularly be too annoyed with them making a proof of concept like this except for one thing.
The kickstarter heavily implied the prototype was made with modular parts from previous devices imasD had made which is not true in the slightest.
Despite a great many doubts I still don't think this device is a scam but nonetheless I don't trust them.
From the forums:
This is the prototype.
"Well we found some shit in the dumpster behind Bestbuy and just started to smash things together with tape. Concept of proof."
Fixed that for you.
NoFaceNico
Member
That is one tiny ass battery. That whole fucking thing looks like a mess. How can they claim this is a prototype? A prototype is supposed to be refined into a finished product. Does anyone want to argue this isn't an engineering dead end?
To be clear, the Smach Team call it a "proof of concept" (the two batteries are supposed to go in the left & right grip) and made changes to the final design like adding in a fan. Whether or they'll deliver on it given the change in the type of modularity they're employing is another matter entirely.
NoFaceNico
Member
^ just stop. This is getting old.
Go to their campaign page. Hit Ctrl+F, type "prototype" in the search bar then tell me how many times they used the term prototype.
Go to their campaign page. Hit Ctrl+F, type "prototype" in the search bar then tell me how many times they used the term prototype.
Well, looks like its exactly the Linx 10 tablet + Steam controller hack that the youtube video said it was, with a glued heatsink.
And didn't they defended that thing as costing thousands of dollars and being a significant engineering effort instead of being something that a motivated junior high electronics student can slap together for a couple hundred at most?
And didn't they defended that thing as costing thousands of dollars and being a significant engineering effort instead of being something that a motivated junior high electronics student can slap together for a couple hundred at most?
GhostTrick
Banned
They're just cornering themselves into this because they cant just admit they overpromised.
They dont look like scammers. Just amateurs.
They should just forget the clickarm/amd 35W chip and go for a low power Ryzen APU or Intel Core M3. But here a decent cooling solution and call it a day.
Given the prototype, I now have doubts of them having the skill to do that. Maybe they can buy Steam controllers, cheap Chinese tablets and LCD screens and slap them together to deliver for their backers, but I seriously doubt on them building an original motherboard, for example.
Yep, this device is a total shitshow. I have no problems with hacked together proof of concept prototypes (it's not an unheard of concept) but the fact it took so much time and money to get to this point is not a vote of confidence.
I'm also weary about the fact they keep insisting that the final product will use an SoC that, for all intents and purposes, doesn't really exist yet, outside of AMD. How much relevant engineering can they even do at this point? How much is AMD even sharing with external developers at this point in time?
I wager it'll be years before this device is ready for market, assuming Smach Team doesn't fold first.
I'm also weary about the fact they keep insisting that the final product will use an SoC that, for all intents and purposes, doesn't really exist yet, outside of AMD. How much relevant engineering can they even do at this point? How much is AMD even sharing with external developers at this point in time?
I wager it'll be years before this device is ready for market, assuming Smach Team doesn't fold first.
NoFaceNico
Member
Can anyone confirm if these model numbers in the last response are legit? This is from the guy who says he built those prototypes.
