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Almost 20 million Quest 2s sold since Oct 2020, on pace with Xbox Series consoles

Dude, everybody else already seems to be in on the joke, but I just have to ask what is your investment in downplaying VR’s success?

You're imaging things that aren't happening. There is no downplaying, the market objectively has not grown, only consolidated. Me mention that is not downplaying anything because the only success here if for Quest 2, not the VR market. You're fusing two different things together completely missing what the topic is about and the point, I haven't talked directly about Quest 2 because that's not the issue, everyone already knows Quest 2 is the most successful thing in VR, what you're missing is that the VR market has not improved despite this, because the only thing that changed is consolidation around one headset primariy.

Where were you in the Reggie Films-aime thread where he pointed out the same facts? Was he downplaying VR's success? Or are you being selective?
,
 

MarkMe2525

Gold Member
It sold the same as a console in its' 4th generation.

Show us now, with proof, how this proves that VR is niche. I want receipts otherwise your post is nothing but inflammatory trolling and bait posting
That console in it's fourth generation also has very stiff competition in it's space. The Quest only managed similar numbers while being the top dog in it's marketplace. While the term "niche" is vague and hard to quantify, the Quest also isn't hitting it out of the park. Only time will tell.

Anecdotely, everyone I know who has a Quest, myself included, doesn't use it after the novelty wears off. It's probably more to do with the experiences available, but that fact still stands. This is also only a sample size of 5 people.
 

Reallink

Member
At the end of 2022, here are the actual numbers:
PS5: 30M
XBS: 18.5M
Quest 2: Close to 20M

Meta has clearly found a good formula for mainstream VR. Now they need to work on the headset comfort, battery life and getting more compelling software.

Cuckerberg recently confirmed to investors they'd spent around 4 or 5 billion on software alone the past 3 years or so (Vs. 30+ billion on VR/AR in general across the same span). For the life of me, I can't even begin to imagine how and where they could have possibly spent that much money considering the Quest's software library. It's significantly worse than even the first couple years of PCVR (2016 -2018). The biggest quadruple AAAA console games only cost like $300 million with massive marketing budgets, how in the ever living flying fuck have they spent 15x that on a Gamecube RE port and Beatsaber Song Packs?
 
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TheDreadBaron

Gold Member
Hours played would be good I'm sure, GP should be helping there by providing users with many titles to play. Though PS+ Extra is likely increasing total engagement hours on PS as well.

People that buy consoles use them, that's not really a point for debate. Whether or not people stay engaged with VR is an open question. Apparently, half the Quest users put the units on a shelf in the closet after 6 months, that's not great. Though it does mirror my experience with PSVR, a big waste for me personally. I have barely used it.
Yeah it’s not great, would like to see how many hours quest2 people that are still playing are investing. I know I play certain immersive games for hours on end, there’s every day beatsaber people, there’s competitive shooter bros, there’s vr chat folks, modding communities, lots of little communities.
You're imaging things that aren't happening. There is no downplaying, the market objectively has not grown, only consolidated. Me mention that is not downplaying anything because the only success here if for Quest 2, not the VR market. You're fusing two different things together completely missing what the topic is about and the point, I haven't talked directly about Quest 2 because that's not the issue, everyone already knows Quest 2 is the most successful thing in VR, what you're missing is that the VR market has not improved despite this, because the only thing that changed is consolidation around one headset primariy.

Where were you in the Reggie Films-aime thread where he pointed out the same facts? Was he downplaying VR's success? Or are you being selective?
,
This is the topic:

Almost 20 million Quest 2s sold since Oct 2020, on pace with Xbox Series consoles​

But carry on, people seem to be enjoying the antics
 
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damidu

Member
Hours played would be good I'm sure, GP should be helping there by providing users with many titles to play. Though PS+ Extra is likely increasing total engagement hours on PS as well.

People that buy consoles use them, that's not really a point for debate. Whether or not people stay engaged with VR is an open question. Apparently, half the Quest users put the units on a shelf in the closet after 6 months, that's not great. Though it does mirror my experience with PSVR, a big waste for me personally. I have barely used it.
basically no data.

i thought consensus was
majority of console owners buys just a couple games throughout a whole gen.

that%50 doesn’t mean anything without anything to compare against.
anecdotally my switch is collecting dust as well
 

THE DUCK

voted poster of the decade by bots
They lose money on every unit sold, estimates are in the range of $100-$200.

Considering the number of add-on peripherals offered are limited (eg, controllers, etc) the software attach rates will need to be high to overcome that. That's unlikely given most of their audience are more "casual" in nature and will gladly play just 1-2 games for long periods of time.

Do they really lose that much on some plastic, a phone chip, a bit of ram and a couple of displays buying units in the millions?
 
This is the topic:

Almost 20 million Quest 2s sold since Oct 2020, on pace with Xbox Series consoles​

But carry on, people seem to be enjoying the antics

That's nice, so you're admitting you jumped into a conversation without reading the first post? I was responding to what was said in the thread. If you want to go after people not specifically talking about the Quest 2 then you have many users to go after.

All I said was that the VR market has not grown in response to someone implying it did because of this news, because there was consolidation. Nothing controversial.
 
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TheDreadBaron

Gold Member
That's nice, so you're admitting you jumped into a conversation you didn't read first? I was responding to what was said in the thread. If you want to go after people not specifically talking about the Quest 2 then you have many users to go after.
Dude you’re nuts 😂 I read the whole thing, only directed you to the topic when you claimed I was off topic. Never change brother.
 

DaGwaphics

Member
basically no data.

i thought consensus was
majority of console owners buys just a couple games throughout a whole gen.

that%50 doesn’t mean anything without anything to compare against.
anecdotally my switch is collecting dust as well

Average attach rate is about 9 or 10 games per console, though PS tends to do better, I think they averaged 15 or so on PS4 (I don't really know where the X1 or Switch are doing there). Console gamers engage a lot on free to play titles as well though, so it is quite different.

I'm not anti VR in any way. But the 50% number was apparently from internal statistics, this is information that Meta would have and could track. Hit console games sell 5, 10, 15, even 20 million copies, most VR titles aren't do that even as the cumulative number of headsets in existence is rising. These are real issues that need to be dealt with in order for VR to thrive. If users are putting the headsets aside once that initial wow factor wears away, that makes it hard for software to ever gain ground, yet it is the software quality that needs to step up to get passed the loss of the initial wow factor. A bit of a catch 22.

What is the percentage of early Quest 2 adopters that are even open and shopping for new software at this point, etc. It would be interesting to see the complete numbers, but it's not something we are likely to ever get.
 
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Cuckerberg recently confirmed to investors they'd spent around 4 or 5 billion on software alone the past 3 years or so (Vs. 30+ billion on VR/AR in general across the same span). For the life of me, I can't even begin to imagine how and where they could have possibly spent that much money considering the Quest's software library. It's significantly worse than even the first couple years of PCVR (2016 -2018). The biggest quadruple AAAA console games only cost like $300 million with massive marketing budgets, how in the ever living flying fuck have they spent 15x that on a Gamecube RE port and Beatsaber Song Packs?

I'm sure Horizon Worlds, while poorly executed, suffered from cost mismanagement. They are now lowering the age requirements (posted thread on it) to try and get more users.

I assume they are doing that because they can't kill the project due to spending too much money on it. It's probably not their only software that has the same issue.

If Zucker can't figure out this software problem than that retention rate continues to get worse, and then people will be more cautious before buying a new Quest headset.

Dude you’re nuts 😂 I read the whole thing, only directed you to the topic when you claimed I was off topic. Never change brother.

You were off-topic in the discussion you jumped into, but you already knew that. Just like you know that Quest 2 isn't the market, and there's consolidation. You know exactly what I'm saying.

Anyway I've already repeated that multiple times so...
 

Fbh

Member
No question, the one and done thing is part of the appeal. But, I still think a solid but inexpensive inside-out headset could have a chance on PC. Windows MR gave it a go, but the headsets were early and the tracking has improved along with the benefits of going wireless if you could. Like you said though, as an additional product I think they should give it a go. Cast the widest net possible.

Yeah it would be good.
I know it's not realistic but IMO what could really help VR is if headsets were treated as a "display" more than console. Just make everything compatible with everything, want to use your Quest 2/3 on a Ps5? Go ahead, want to use your PsVR2 on PC? Sure. Though of course that would requiere some level of standardization of controllers and tech.
Because right now you've got a tech that's still fairly niche and then your are sub dividing into further niches (Playstation only VR, PC only VR, Quest, etc)
 

DaGwaphics

Member
Yeah it would be good.
I know it's not realistic but IMO what could really help VR is if headsets were treated as a "display" more than console. Just make everything compatible with everything, want to use your Quest 2/3 on a Ps5? Go ahead, want to use your PsVR2 on PC? Sure. Though of course that would requiere some level of standardization of controllers and tech.
Because right now you've got a tech that's still fairly niche and then your are sub dividing into further niches (Playstation only VR, PC only VR, Quest, etc)

Steam VR acts a bit like that now, as it serves as a go-between normalizing input for most of the headsets compatible with PC.
 
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mckmas8808

Banned
Yeah it would be good.
I know it's not realistic but IMO what could really help VR is if headsets were treated as a "display" more than console. Just make everything compatible with everything, want to use your Quest 2/3 on a Ps5? Go ahead, want to use your PsVR2 on PC? Sure. Though of course that would requiere some level of standardization of controllers and tech.
Because right now you've got a tech that's still fairly niche and then your are sub dividing into further niches (Playstation only VR, PC only VR, Quest, etc)

THIS!

I think PSVR2, PCVR, and Quest 3 will start to do that this year though. Outside of a few exclusives.
 
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NickFire

Member
Impressive sales numbers. But there's been some threads about losses in VR that make me question how much they mean.
 

Romulus

Member
People talking about original Xbox and GameCube numbers aren't taking into consideration the quest 2 has only been out a little over 2 years. Those 6th gen consoles continued to sell after their lifetimes, well over double Quest 2's life.

And keep in mind, Quest 2 doesn't have a killer app like halo or Smash bros etc + $100 hardware increase.
 

Ronin_7

Banned
Quest 2 is setting the charts on fire!

Quest 3 will be huge which means tons of Devs supporting VR moving forward.
 

Baki

Member
Cuckerberg recently confirmed to investors they'd spent around 4 or 5 billion on software alone the past 3 years or so (Vs. 30+ billion on VR/AR in general across the same span). For the life of me, I can't even begin to imagine how and where they could have possibly spent that much money considering the Quest's software library. It's significantly worse than even the first couple years of PCVR (2016 -2018). The biggest quadruple AAAA console games only cost like $300 million with massive marketing budgets, how in the ever living flying fuck have they spent 15x that on a Gamecube RE port and Beatsaber Song Packs?
R&D on computer vision and other fun stuff. It's not for making games. They pay their devs $500K a year, with half of that being stock. Gets expensive real quick. Also nothing wrong with being a cuck. Let's not get into name calling, it distracts from the rest of your post!
 
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Foilz

Banned
The quest 2 being a self contained unit is what made it so saught after. Now valve is doing the same thing with it's next unit. I want better tracking for quest 3 and a slight power boost. I'd much rather a larger battery than more graphics
 

Alexios

Cores, shaders and BIOS oh my!
It's the Wii phenomenon. A bunch of casuals buying it to play for a week then putting it away. Mobile vr sucks
Wii had an excellent attach rate to rival any system, especially before small indie downloadable games were the norm for consoles padding the numbers. Gotta love it when folks present their (willful given how easy it is to actually find some information before spewing bs) ignorance as fact in here.

Kinda how some here constantly make dumb threads that on top of having a little tidbit here and there, some fact or an opinion from someone else they want to present as fact, they always pad them with their own twisted spin thrown as fact to guide the desired narrative.

At first it was how any random VR kit announced by any nobody was a PSVR2 killer (I guess back in the day they'd be posting Polystation will kill PlayStation) because of x or y definitively superior feature but now that didn't pan out it's settled to how all of VR sucks and is going nowhere, lol 🤦‍♂️

We've gone from some leak vaguely talking about how user retention should be a focus because it's not as high as desired, or even is seen as problematic, without numbers, to apparently knowing half the people don't use their Quests so definitively randoms who don't care about VR spew it as fact.

Someone tell Gorilla Tag's dev he shouldn't have made the mistake of a f2p VR game awarding himself $25 millions so far when he could have made a flat game to rival COD and made 1000 fold instead because apparently successful games, developers and businesses aren't VR's success.

Only eclipsing flat games will be a success!!!!11 as if there aren't all kinds of success stories that target a given niche within gaming, no, everybody makes COD clones and nothing else because that's just waste of effort and VR can't be part of gaming itself (as far as GAF's concerned of course)!

If I have a PC VR kit or a VR console I must also give up on flat games and any other entertainment and not be a PC or console gamer but just a VR gamer otherwise it doesn't count! I can't play a VR game here chosen over flat games and a flat game there chosen over any, no, it's all or nothing!

I should probably replace console games like COD here with mobile games like Honor of Kings or whatever to drive the point home.

Also those x unknown millions of users all buying different games so there's no definitive title everybody has but instead a bunch of games with smaller sales is bad because what kind of game industry can you have if the one with the most marketing money can't just eclipse everyone else, so bad!

Like, don't worry, once the userbase increases a little more the usual market forces will want in on it and take hold and that will be the norm there too, that's yet to happen to a large degree, for all the good that will do at least some special lot here will acknowledge the medium as legit then, lol.

Oh well, this topic will soon be buried because the OP won't engage in self congratulating self bumps pretending to respond to people days/weeks later like someone else keeps doing.
 
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magnumpy

Member
the "big 3" are now PlayStation, Nintendo, and Meta :cool:

OFC Meta is the smallest/least successful of these big 3 (at least, regarding specifically consoles). related, Atari used to be a big console maker too. so did Sega. the more things change, the more they stay the same...
 

Spyxos

Member
I am surprised that it is so high. Maybe Zuckerberg isn't so wrong with his meta stuff after all. What do I know.
 
the "big 3" are now PlayStation, Nintendo, and Meta :cool:
REAL QUESTION is a Quest 2 a home console. Or is it a portable since you can use it tethered to a Monitor too?

Officially by Microsoft the Switch isn’t.

questions questions questions.


either way, it’s time to put respect on META. Officially a new game console enters the fight.
 

StreetsofBeige

Gold Member
It's the Wii phenomenon. A bunch of casuals buying it to play for a week then putting it away. Mobile vr sucks
Going by this article someone estimated VR Quest software sales attach rates, Wii would be leagues ahead. At least with Wii, people were buying all kinds of first party games + endless shovelware where the final attach ratio was good even though it was a fad system nobody played or talked about after 2010. Xbox 360 and PS3 actually outsold Wii late in the cycle per year as their sales were more steady (not grand total sales, but in those final few years) with longer lasting game appeal and online MP. Wii sales were such a roller coaster.

This guy estimates the number of VR games sold per Quest unit is only 2-3. No wonder so many people bail after 6 months (as per Meta article saying 50% of people bail after 6 months). The games and experience stinks so much people are bailing VR after only half a year despite lots of VR games out there at friendly prices. It's not like VR games are $70 each. Yet they still abondoned ship. Even if his estimate is low and the real number is 4 or 5 thats still ultra low. You'd think with cheap games and it being such a different cool experience than standard gamepad and m/kb gameplay a VR gamer would be buying tons of games for the killer unique gameplay, and for sake of getting their's moneys worth out of it after buying a VR set.

 
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Romulus

Member
Going by this article someone estimated VR Quest software sales attach rates, Wii would be leagues ahead. At least with Wii, people were buying all kinds of first party games + endless shovelware where the final attach ratio was good even though it was a fad system nobody played or talked about after 2010. Xbox 360 and PS3 actually outsold Wii late in the cycle per year as their sales were more steady (not grand total sales, but in those final few years) with longer lasting game appeal and online MP. Wii sales were such a roller coaster.

This guy estimates the number of VR games sold per Quest unit is only 2-3. No wonder so many people bail after 6 months (as per Meta article saying 50% of people bail after 6 months). The games and experience stinks so much people are bailing VR after only half a year despite lots of VR games out there at friendly prices. It's not like VR games are $70 each. Yet they still abondoned ship. Even if his estimate is low and the real number is 4 or 5 thats still ultra low. You'd think with cheap games and it being such a different cool experience than standard gamepad and m/kb gameplay a VR gamer would be buying tons of games for the killer unique gameplay, and for sake of getting their's moneys worth out of it after buying a VR set.



The good games are on pcvr though. The vast majority of Quest 2 owners don't have a PC and the must have games on standalone are about 3-5. Seems about right. Most everything else is lower quality. I like about a dozen of them personally.
The other thing is there are alot of free games on app lap and stuff like rec room that people eat up.
 
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coffinbirth

Member
You do realize they're counting the entire Quest line in that figure, right? That's FOUR years of sales of three different headsets, not two years of sales of one. That being said, the lions share of those sales are for Quest 2.
 

DenchDeckard

Moderated wildly
But it's pretty much the same numbers as Xbox Series X + Xbox Series S (likely a few hundred thousand more than that).

Does anybody think that Xbox Series X and S (combined) are a niche product?
Do you think the xbox is a success?

Also, did you come back to me on what products you own? I didn't see a response. I'm just intrigued on what I am dealing with lol.

Do you own a pc, xbox or Nintendo switch?
 

recma12

Member
I am surprised that it is so high. Maybe Zuckerberg isn't so wrong with his meta stuff after all. What do I know.

Would like to know how many % of the headsets were sold for professional uses tbh
Any museum you go to these days has a VR experience thingy, you can also use them in education, engineering or medicine etc.

Think the comparison with a home console doesn't work.
 

Heisenberg007

Gold Journalism
Do you think the xbox is a success?

Also, did you come back to me on what products you own? I didn't see a response. I'm just intrigued on what I am dealing with lol.

Do you own a pc, xbox or Nintendo switch?
Are you sure you're asking the right person? I don't remember you asking me which devices I own.

Anyway:
  • I think XBS sales is underwhelming, not because 20M is a bad number (it's pretty good) but only because it didn't exceed Xbox One (which was also at 20M) after spending so much money and Game Pass and everything.
  • I own a gaming PC, Steam Deck, Xbox 360, PS5, PS VR, Quest 2, etc.
 

Reallink

Member
R&D on computer vision and other fun stuff. It's not for making games. They pay their devs $500K a year, with half of that being stock. Gets expensive real quick. Also nothing wrong with being a cuck. Let's not get into name calling, it distracts from the rest of your post!

Function critical features like that would presumably fall under the remaining $30+ billion Reality Labs R&D umbrella. Otherwise it begs a MUCH bigger question of where exactly the 30 billion went if it doesn't include any of the actual R&D, Mr. Cuckerberg.
 
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TLZ

Banned
Honestly, that's pretty cool.

20 mil I think means it's coming out of that "niche" egg. This is good news and helps push VR overall.
 
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That was 3 years ago when the planet was on lock down and every one was stuck at home. Are people still buying the gimmick hardware?
 

DenchDeckard

Moderated wildly
Are you sure you're asking the right person? I don't remember you asking me which devices I own.

Anyway:
  • I think XBS sales is underwhelming, not because 20M is a bad number (it's pretty good) but only because it didn't exceed Xbox One (which was also at 20M) after spending so much money and Game Pass and everything.
  • I own a gaming PC, Steam Deck, Xbox 360, PS5, PS VR, Quest 2, etc.

I was reading that the ps5 hasn't sold past the ps4 yesterday. I think that still holds. So it sounds like ps5 isn't a success either?

And I though evidence points to the series consoles are infact still tracking ahead of xbox one when compared month to month?

Also, thanks for letting me know on what platforms you own. Seems like you may play a lot on pc and steam deck as well as ps5 so that's great.
 
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Heisenberg007

Gold Journalism
I was reading that the ps5 hasn't sold past the ps4 yesterday. I think that still holds. So it sounds like ps5 isn't a success either?

And I though evidence points to the series consoles are infact still tracking ahead of xbox one when compared month to month?

Also, thanks for letting me know on what platforms you own. Seems like you may play a lot on pc and steam deck as well as ps5 so that's great.
This is a Quest/VR related thread, so I don't want to go into a detailed discussion of PS5 vs. XSX as it would just derail this thread. This is my last post on this topic.
  • PS4 was already an extremely successful product (one of the fastest- and best-selling in the industry's history). Any other console that matches it is already a success.
  • Xbox One was widely considered a failure. If another product matches that, it'll not be considered a success either.
  • PlayStation didn't spend more than $10 billion before the PS5 launch in order to increase its market share. Xbox did, and it still didn't surpass Xbox One. That's my main point.
  • PS5 is more expensive than PS4. Xbox Series S is less expensive Xbox One.
  • Also, one big point. PS5 was supply constrained. But now that supply issues are easing up, it's recording YoY increase, so there's still room for it to close the gap (which it has been aggressively). It has already surpassed PS4 in key markets like Japan and has increased market share in the US by 2 percentage points. PS5 is on pace to surpass PS4's sales by next year. On the other hand, XSX is recording a YoY decrease, so it's not on track to exceed Xbox One and has lost 2 percentage points market share in the US.
There's a lot of differences b/w PS5 and XSX.
 

nemiroff

Gold Member
That's a lot more than I'd predict even as an enthusiast. Pretty impressive. Now, I know it's not going to happen, but I'd also like to see some usage hours / numbers over time..
 

DenchDeckard

Moderated wildly
This is a Quest/VR related thread, so I don't want to go into a detailed discussion of PS5 vs. XSX as it would just derail this thread. This is my last post on this topic.
  • PS4 was already an extremely successful product (one of the fastest- and best-selling in the industry's history). Any other console that matches it is already a success.
  • Xbox One was widely considered a failure. If another product matches that, it'll not be considered a success either.
  • PlayStation didn't spend more than $10 billion before the PS5 launch in order to increase its market share. Xbox did, and it still didn't surpass Xbox One. That's my main point.
  • PS5 is more expensive than PS4. Xbox Series S is less expensive Xbox One.
  • Also, one big point. PS5 was supply constrained. But now that supply issues are easing up, it's recording YoY increase, so there's still room for it to close the gap (which it has been aggressively). It has already surpassed PS4 in key markets like Japan and has increased market share in the US by 2 percentage points. PS5 is on pace to surpass PS4's sales by next year. On the other hand, XSX is recording a YoY decrease, so it's not on track to exceed Xbox One and has lost 2 percentage points market share in the US.
There's a lot of differences b/w PS5 and XSX.
All good points. I hear you.

Back to quest 2. It's doing well and hopefully sets a great precedent for quest 3.
 
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