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[Sub_Level]

https://www.cnn.com/2018/11/13/tech/amazon-hq2-nyc-arlington/index.html

New York (CNN Business)After running a year-long competition that drew interest from hundreds of cities and a number of states, Amazon has chosen New York City and Northern Virginia to split duty as its second headquarters.
On Tuesday, Amazon announced it has chosen New York's Long Island City and Virginia's Arlington for HQ2. Both locations will receive a $2.5 billion investment from Amazon, and each will have more than 25,000 workers over time. Hiring begins next year.

Very exciting stuff. The infrastructure will be an issue but the tax incentives are well worth it.

The infrastructure concern is the reason they split it into two locations in the first place.

 

[Snoopycat]

I worked in their call centre back in college and then at their warehouse over in Fife. The difference between them was massive. In the call centre if we did well we got treated like kings. I got a bunch of free shit, discounts, vouchers, extra time off, extra breaks. I could go for a coffee or toilet break whenever I wanted as long as it wasn't too busy. They also let us trade in our holiday allowance if we wanted to leave early. I got a good wage for doing the easiest shit possible. All I did was answer emails and online chat.

The warehouse was a totally different experience. There were no breaks apart from designated ones. No free shit. I regularly saw people fainting or crying because of the pain they were in. The wages were basic as fuck and the atmosphere was horrible cos every worker was constantly monitored and treated with total suspicion. I was lucky cos I was maintenance so I had it really easy compared to most of the people there.

Anyway, my advice to anyone thinking of working for Amazon is to apply for any call centre work they have and avoid the warehouse at all costs except for the maintenance and security jobs.

 

[TheShadowLord]

Glad I am not looking for a house in Virginia or New York right about now. Because house prices are going to increase once they enter.

 

[#Phonepunk#]

it makes sense to locate your headquarters in NYC, sort of the financial center of the world, and Virginia, near the capital of the US, with the Pentagon nearby. now they are anchored on the west and east coasts. it is a symbolic claiming of territory.

what is Amazon's interest? is it American, as they are demonstrating with this move? they entertained an offer from Canada during the bidding process, so they don't really have a purely national interest at heart. tbh i have a relative who has worked for them for several years, and she enjoys working for them, she has never said anything bad about it, even when i bring up the scandalous articles and such. ive read some "scandalous" articles that seemed like they were making something out of nothing.

still, Jeff Bezos is the wealthiest man in the world and in command of an empire that includes Amazon (digital + physical media delivery) as well as the Washington Post (traditional news media), in effect a single man, the person holding the most wealth one person has ever had in human history, also possessing an immense cultural monopoly. just something to consider.

im always wary of corporate interests moving in and taking public money when that money could be going to public works in the first place. the infrastructure they develop will be based on their interests, and will be geared towards profiting them at the expense of the public. as if NYC needs more money? imo Amazon should be given a federal contract to create infrastructure across the country, including fast rail between all the major hub cities. give them massive tax breaks but they have to build an national public transportation system in the USA. currently, they are just using what little WE as a tax paying public have built. there is a big argument to make that these mega companies should give far more to the public that has made them rich.

 

[NickFire]

I never understand when deep blue states try appealing to Amazon. It's almost like their politicians are laughing at the citizens they represent. Amazon has lead to more wealth consolidation and redistribution (to the top) than any other company I can think of.

 

[Sub_Level]

Amazon brings more talent and investment into the area. It creates tech opportunities which is a field where students would leave for other states.

If you're Virginia and New York governments that means more state tax revenue. If you're a Virginian or New Yorker that means more opportunity.

 

[All Hail C-Webb]

I never understand when deep blue states try appealing to Amazon. It's almost like their politicians are laughing at the citizens they represent. Amazon has lead to more wealth consolidation and redistribution (to the top) than any other company I can think of.

It wasn't just blue states pursuing Amazon, it would be a great benefit to any state, and I'm stoked that we got it.

Good for jobs, wages, property value, taxes, and a slight inconvenience for those who ride those subway lines.

 

[led4lyfe]

Glad I moved away from crystal city, my studio was $1800 a month there, can’t imagine what it will raise to now.

 

[lil puff]

I read that they claim average salary to be 150000.

Which makes me wonder how many of the hires will be from the local area (specifically the LIC).
LIC and surroundings are not high class communities, it's at best middle class area with a mix of blue/white collars.

Individuals coming to work there will need a particular advanced skillset to earn 150K - that is a high salary average for NYC. Where are these individuals coming from and do they actually help that community? What kind of training will they offer and will they make a serious effort to reach out to that particular community?

I need to know more. How does that 150K break down? A few very high paid high level positions and tons of middle class positions seems fine. A bunch of high skill/high pay positions seems potential to change the fabric of that area. Congestion, raised rents, gentrification, etc. It's possible that this could bring new small business to the area, which could bring jobs, but you don't need Amazon to do that. That last thing you want is to once again run locals out of their areas for high skilled individuals looking for a 100K salary who can already afford to live in one of these fancy new condos being built around the city.

So I'm not so quick to say this is a net positive for that area until they are more specific with the details.

 

[Weiji]

I just don’t get this desire on their part to locate in expensive urban areas.

Downtown Seattle is disgusting, you couldn’t pay me to live there.

 

[Kenpachii]

I just don’t get this desire on their part to locate in expensive urban areas.

Downtown Seattle is disgusting, you couldn’t pay me to live there.

Maybe investment reasons?

 

[Sub_Level]

One study id be interested in:

How many shits are taken between 1pm and 5pm. Logistically the rise in workers correlates to the rise in lunches which correlates to the rise in poops.

 

[Boss Mog]

I worked in their call centre back in college and then at their warehouse over in Fife. The difference between them was massive. In the call centre if we did well we got treated like kings. I got a bunch of free shit, discounts, vouchers, extra time off, extra breaks. I could go for a coffee or toilet break whenever I wanted as long as it wasn't too busy. They also let us trade in our holiday allowance if we wanted to leave early. I got a good wage for doing the easiest shit possible. All I did was answer emails and online chat.

The warehouse was a totally different experience. There were no breaks apart from designated ones. No free shit. I regularly saw people fainting or crying because of the pain they were in. The wages were basic as fuck and the atmosphere was horrible cos every worker was constantly monitored and treated with total suspicion. I was lucky cos I was maintenance so I had it really easy compared to most of the people there.

Anyway, my advice to anyone thinking of working for Amazon is to apply for any call centre work they have and avoid the warehouse at all costs except for the maintenance and security jobs.

I always heard stories that being a "picker" in their warehouses was horrible and they treated you like shit for shitty wages. I heard they actually time you on every order and tell you to speed up if you fall behind their guidelines. It's nice to hear their call center employees are treated better. It makes me feel a little less bad about ordering from them, but in the 21st century, a lot of times, you don't really have much choice.

 

[lil puff]

I just don’t get this desire on their part to locate in expensive urban areas.

Downtown Seattle is disgusting, you couldn’t pay me to live there.

I am honestly not sure where they should locate.

But it shouldn't be areas that already have their own issues. People in LIC can barely fit on the train to commute to their jobs. I don't know how budgets work, but it seems like NYC is always looking to throw money like their priorities are off.

Build 100s of pedestrian parks, which become defacto homeless shelters rather than focus on existing shelter quality and availability.

Build multi million dollar subway system while having dozens of signal issues per day.

Arlington VA doesn't seem as iffy as Queens.

 

[Sub_Level]

I always heard stories that being a "picker" in their warehouses was horrible and they treated you like shit for shitty wages. I heard they actually time you on every order and tell you to speed up if you fall behind their guidelines. It's nice to hear their call center employees are treated better. It makes me feel a little less bad about ordering from them, but in the 21st century, a lot of times, you don't really have much choice.

Just about every piece of hardware and cloth you consume likely originates from some worker being treated even worse and for less pay. Not sayin that justifies it, but thats the truth.

If you are american, foods are the easiest to track because you can buy directly from the source. So if you want chickens who arent caged, cows who are grass fed, veggies from local farmers, etc thats easy to find.

 

[Boss Mog]

Just about every piece of hardware and cloth you consume likely originates from some worker being treated even worse and for less pay. Not sayin that justifies it, but thats the truth.

If you are american, foods are the easiest to track because you can buy directly from the source. So if you want chickens who arent caged, cows who are grass fed, veggies from local farmers, etc thats easy to find.

Oh believe me, you don't need to tell me that. I'm not one of those hypocrites who get triggered and offended by every little thing but then goes out and buys a phone made in a prison factory where suicide nets have to be installed to prevent the workers from killing themselves or name brand shoes and clothes made by kids who get paid pennies a day. I know how the world works, but I still feel bad about it cause those are things actually worth feeling bad about as opposed to feeling bad that somebody on twitter said something you find "offensive".

 

[Snoopycat]

I always heard stories that being a "picker" in their warehouses was horrible and they treated you like shit for shitty wages. I heard they actually time you on every order and tell you to speed up if you fall behind their guidelines. It's nice to hear their call center employees are treated better. It makes me feel a little less bad about ordering from them, but in the 21st century, a lot of times, you don't really have much choice.

The pickers had it the worst because they were the ones that had to go back and forth from the pick bay to the collection areas. The reader things that they carried timed them and if they didn't hit a consistant time they got fired. I was doing repairs in a room one day while a bunch of new workers were being inducted and I heard one of the trainers telling them the job would break most of them, and he was gloating about it. That attitude was normal amongst the higher ups in the warehouse. Of course none of them were walkng 15 miles every night.

 

[J-Roderton]

Warehouse pulling can be a tough job. Couldn't imagine doing it for someone as big as Amazon.

 

[NickFire]

It wasn't just blue states pursuing Amazon, it would be a great benefit to any state, and I'm stoked that we got it.

Good for jobs, wages, property value, taxes, and a slight inconvenience for those who ride those subway lines.

Is it really good for all those things on a community level? Starting with jobs - how many do they destroy outside of Amazon in relation to how many they create inside of Amazon? And how many jobs that are created are temporary until they can replace it with automation? For property values, I assume they are good for existing homeowners subject to any unaffordable real estate tax increases. But how many middle class families will soon be unable to afford either ownership or rents in decent neighborhoods? For taxes, how much of a break is the community giving them in relation to taxes paid to the same community? Federal tax payments do not come back to the local community dollar for dollar.

Perhaps they are a blessing to the community. Very well might be. But I am suspect and worry that the short term gains may be leading to long term devastation for a lot of families.

 

[lil puff]

Is it really good for all those things on a community level? Starting with jobs - how many do they destroy outside of Amazon in relation to how many they create inside of Amazon? And how many jobs that are created are temporary until they can replace it with automation? For property values, I assume they are good for existing homeowners subject to any unaffordable real estate tax increases. But how many middle class families will soon be unable to afford either ownership or rents in decent neighborhoods? For taxes, how much of a break is the community giving them in relation to taxes paid to the same community? Federal tax payments do not come back to the local community dollar for dollar.

Perhaps they are a blessing to the community. Very well might be. But I am suspect and worry that the short term gains may be leading to long term devastation for a lot of families.

In an inner city, landlords must love the idea. New influx of individuals making 150K a year.

And what if you did land a nice paying say 80K job, which was a raise from your 55K? As you suggest, jobs aren't permanent. You could be looking at a huge paycut and a big quality of life change, because there aren't (that I know of) a lot of lateral career/salary moves you can make in an inner city like NYC.

It could be good or bad, but these things need to be considered. it seems like the Mayor here is looking to jump right in. And there were plenty of dissenters from community officials, even months ago when this was hinted at.

 

[NickFire]

https://www.foxnews.com/tech/cuomo-...ntive-laden-deal-to-bring-amazon-to-big-apple

Not every day that I find myself agreeing with what people may call the far left, but today seems to be one of those days.

 

[lil puff]

Thanks for posting the article ^

Speaker Cory Johnson makes the best point here.

+1 billion public $ from NY to a multibillion dollar company. Why the fuck do they need monetary help? That already says a lot to me about their want to invest.

Why not take 1 billion and fix the damn community?

Typical shit talking 2 mouth DeBlasio.

Neither DeBlasio nor Cuomo should be trusted. These 2 corrupt dudes are in it for what for what they can get to increase their own stature. This is why they fight over our shit subways. "No you pay" "no Yooou pay"

Neither of them could wait to appear with Amazon executives at their shovel digging photoshoot ceremony.

 

[Dr.Guru of Peru]

I just don’t get this desire on their part to locate in expensive urban areas.

Downtown Seattle is disgusting, you couldn’t pay me to live there.

Top talent generally wants to live in major cities.

Also, neither of these locations are downtown.

 

[Loki]

I read that they claim average salary to be 150000.

Which makes me wonder how many of the hires will be from the local area (specifically the LIC).
LIC and surroundings are not high class communities, it's at best middle class area with a mix of blue/white collars.

Individuals coming to work there will need a particular advanced skillset to earn 150K - that is a high salary average for NYC. Where are these individuals coming from and do they actually help that community? What kind of training will they offer and will they make a serious effort to reach out to that particular community?

Not sure if you're from NYC or not, but you literally cannot afford to live in LIC (without roommates) unless you're making at least $100K. The majority of residents there are white collar professionals making $125-250K.

 

[lil puff]

Not sure if you're from NYC or not, but you literally cannot afford to live in LIC (without roommates) unless you're making at least $100K. The majority of residents there are white collar professionals making $125-250K.

Yes. The surrounding areas, not so much.

They have one of the largest Projects in the country - those are the folks that need the help.
Not the guys in the fancy condos.

edit: I Googled to double check myself.

Queensbridge is The Largest Housing Project in the Western Hemisphere.
I will eat crow if Amazon is going to provide 10000 6 figure jobs to them.

 

[dionysus]

Politicians ignoring opportunity costs as usual. Probably the only time in the world I will agree with Occasio-Cortez. Also these type of bids are a very classic example of the prisoners dilemma in game theory. Everyone would be better off if all levels of government would agree to stop offering incentives, but since you can't get that agreement it is a race to the bottom. These type of things often play out in 2 ways.

1. Offer money to companies that don't need it, literally robbing the poor to feed the rich. The amazon example.
2. Offer money to highly speculative companies that in most cases will not meet their side of the deal. Curt Schilling and Kingdom's of Amalur style.

 

[Boss Mog]

When Ocasio-Cortez and Tucker Carlson agree, you know it has to be bad:

 

[MC Safety]

Amazon no doubt got a sweetheart deal in terms of tax relief and probably state/city investments.

In an unrelated note, my parents' home is now considerably more valuable.

 

[lil puff]

De Blaiso,.. He also was behind the rise in cigar costs. For some reason, a Box of Phillies suddenly went from 5 to 15 dollars. I think he caught his tired eye son smoking. I knew that dude smoked.

No one smokes Phillies for a cigar, he knew what he was doing. He is not to be trusted.
He broke down the blunt game, and that is serious. No one is paying 15 for a box of blunts. And the stores hate it.

This Fucker needs to go down.
And bring the cost of cigars back to what they were. Asshole, is not helping the community with this.
This is what I mean when I say DeBlasio is a fake ass 2 mouth politician.

There are bodegas, if you are cool, will still sell them for 5.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

Knew it would be east coast. Surprising it was split into 2 campuses.

But good job on Amazon to get all the dirt from cities on financial incentives. Don't be surprised in Bezos sells that info to other companies looking for big HQ. Spread the news for a fee.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

Politicians ignoring opportunity costs as usual. Probably the only time in the world I will agree with Occasio-Cortez. Also these type of bids are a very classic example of the prisoners dilemma in game theory. Everyone would be better off if all levels of government would agree to stop offering incentives, but since you can't get that agreement it is a race to the bottom. These type of things often play out in 2 ways.

1. Offer money to companies that don't need it, literally robbing the poor to feed the rich. The amazon example.
2. Offer money to highly speculative companies that in most cases will not meet their side of the deal. Curt Schilling and Kingdom's of Amalur style.

Yup. That's the way big business and government work.

1,000 small businesses on the fringe need help and the government will only do so much.

But then 1 large corporation (with the parent company/HQ possibly in another state or country) gets major kickbacks.

And city officials wonder why many towns see small businesses close up shop and big franchises/companies spread like weeds to every strip mall.

 

[lil puff]

Knew it would be east coast. Surprising it was split into 2 campuses.

But good job on Amazon to get all the dirt from cities on financial incentives. Don't be surprised in Bezos sells that info to other companies looking for big HQ. Spread the news for a fee.

I think the west coast would have said nope been there done that.

 

[lil puff]

I have hope that we can stop this from happening.

 

[TheShadowLord]

When Ocasio-Cortez and Tucker Carlson agree, you know it has to be bad:

the enemy of my enemy is..... my friend?

 

[mckmas8808]

https://www.cnn.com/2018/11/13/tech/amazon-hq2-nyc-arlington/index.html



Very exciting stuff. The infrastructure will be an issue but the tax incentives are well worth it.

The infrastructure concern is the reason they split it into two locations in the first place.

The tax incentives are terrible for taxpayers though. But I'm 99% pro-Amazon, so I'm glad this finally got figured out.

 

[Torrent of Pork]

Good for Amazon, thank God it wasn't in my state.

 

[Vicetrailia]

Mixed feelings, but obviously it's great for any geography who gets the HQ's

 

[lil puff]

I believe I've overheard in the office that Amazon is not coming to Queens.
I haven't done any research yet.

I know it was a polarizing issue, but I'm glad.

I never believed that the lower income folks in that community were going to get a piece of the avg. 150K salary jobs. Those jobs would be filled by educated commuters, whom I have no issues with, but what is the priority here?

Some people think it would have improved that community, but Amazon never offered any legitimate reasons for me to believe so. They would have needed to be vocal about prioritizing training in that area and offered a hard % of people in that community that they promise to employ before I got behind it.

They also needed to confirm that they would help fund the broken MTA.

 

[MC Safety]

I have hope that we can stop this from happening.

You got your wish.

The jobs will be sorely missed, but the sweetheart deal was rotten. Amazon isn't out on the street with a tin cup.

https://nypost.com/2019/02/14/amazon-pulls-out-of-3-billion-deal-to-bring-hq2-to-queens/

 

[lil puff]

You got your wish.

The jobs will be sorely missed, but the sweetheart deal was rotten. Amazon isn't out on the street with a tin cup.

https://nypost.com/2019/02/14/amazon-pulls-out-of-3-billion-deal-to-bring-hq2-to-queens/

I could not help but to think this deal stunk of ulterior motive.

I totally support adding 150K jobs, we all know they are hard to come by.

It's just to me, more important, in what DeBlasio called (and ran on) A Tale of 2 Cities... adding these kind of jobs before offering lower class opportunity does not sync with his message.

It reminds me of the many things wrong with the city. Now take that 3 billion and fund the got damn projects so they have heat and lead free housing now. He had a lower budget for the year. Now put that money back into the services the city needs.

 

[iconmaster]

I don't know if this was good or bad for New York, but it's nice to see the will of the people can still overcome the power of massive corporations.

 

[Sub_Level]

They should come on down to Texas!

 

[lil puff]

I don't know if this was good or bad for New York, but it's nice to see the will of the people can still overcome the power of massive corporations.

And overcome 2 corrupt politicians who are considering (at least teasing) running for POTA.

 

[MC Safety]

I could not help but to think this deal stunk of ulterior motive.

I totally support adding 150K jobs, we all know they are hard to come by.

It's just to me, more important, in what DeBlasio called (and ran on) A Tale of 2 Cities... adding these kind of jobs before offering lower class opportunity does not sync with his message.

It reminds me of the many things wrong with the city. Now take that 3 billion and fund the got damn projects so they have heat and lead free housing now. He had a lower budget for the year. Now put that money back into the services the city needs.

Yeah, DeBlaso was all in for this, and he's got no one but himself in mind.

If Amazon wants a headquarters in New York, fine. The city can be accommodating without writing a blank check to a billionaire and his megaconglomerate.

 

[ThatStupidLion]

proud of you new york.

 

[Havoc2049]

I don't know if this was good or bad for New York, but it's nice to see the will of the people can still overcome the power of massive corporations.

This is a massive loss for NYC. The majority of the people wanted it as well. NY politicians f'ed up.

"While polls show that 70 percent of New Yorkers support our plans and investment, a number of state and local politicians have made it clear that they oppose our presence and will not work with us to build the type of relationships that are required to go forward with the project we and many others envisioned in Long Island City.”

Officials had estimated the project would bring in $27 billion in tax revenue to New York over 25 years and generate 25,000 to 40,000 jobs for the area with an average salary of $150,000, plus another 1,300 construction jobs per year during the 15-year building process.

 

[lil puff]

I don't trust that poll.

Who did they poll?

Where were they from?

How much research did they do. How much did they know?

What were their personal interests. Personal Financial interest.

You cannot do a poll on this.

The bottom line is that it was not going to benefit the lower class in that community, but just like other things in NYC, people don't give a shit and look the other way.

 

[lil puff]

Having a poll on something Amazon was evasive as shit about.

People saw numbers. Some folks thought that Queenbridge were getting 25000 150K salaries. Some folks only read the headlines. Some people brought up property and invested looking for a property market boost.

There simply was not enough information to trust or even judge that deal, and the Mayor and Gov tried to slip it past. Why did they bypass the process?

No thanks.