AMD Radeon Navi launch timeframe leaked, releases after 3rd Gen Ryzen

Feb 4, 2013
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We already know that AMD's Radeon Navi series of 7nm graphics cards will launch in 2019, but at the time of writing AMD has remained tight-lipped about their next-generation graphics architecture, so much so that we don't know what to expect from the series in terms of both features and performance.

Now, AMD's Radeon Navi series of graphics cards are rumoured to release around a month after the company's Ryzen 3rd Generation processors, which are expected to launch in mid-2019. This leads us to believe that Navi will release around August, potentially around Siggraph and Gamescom 2019.
As a gaming-focused product, a Navi launch at GamesCom makes a lot of sense, though it is possible that AMD will have short tech demos for Navi before this time, perhaps giving us an early showing of the architecture at Computex or E3.

This report comes from Wccftech, who had accurately reported on Mike Rayfield's departure from AMD before its official announcement and accurately reported on the Radeon VII before the product's reveal.
Navi is expected to be a major departure from AMD's older GCN-based graphics products, though at this time it is unknown exactly what the architecture will feature.

Early roadmaps for Navi reference both "scalability" and "next-gen memory". This likely references how AMD plans to scale into the high-end of the graphics market with the architecture and plan to use modern GDDR6 memory.
Some rumors previously had suggested an October launch, but as of now, AMD is telling its partners to expect the launch exactly a month after the Ryzen 7nm launch.
Those who read my original exclusive will remember that I talked about how Navi is going to be the first non-GCN GPU and the first card to break free of the 4096 SP limit imposed by the GCN macro-architecture.
Credit: Overclock3D
Source: WCCFTech

Note: be sure to read the source material, I went with Overclock3D as it's fairly short and to the point.
 
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Nov 27, 2018
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Navi is going to be the first non-GCN GPU and the first card to break free of the 4096 SP limit imposed by the GCN macro-architecture.

Great news if true. That 4096 core limit wasn't really an issue, considering most Nvidia cards hover between 1,3-3,5k cores, the problem was squeezing actual performance from those cores due to heavy CPU overload the GCN has. So if they finally figured it out, and their GPUs will be reliable and provide the same level of performance across the board, no matter which API or engine the games use, they will finally have the basis to actually compete with NV. So yeah, I hope the rumor is totally true.
 

Leonidas

"Ask me about computers"
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Glad I didn't wait for this. Turing is already great value at the low end/mid-range. This might be a marginal improvement, but isn't worth waiting another 5-8 months for, at that point why not wait for the next thing?
 
Jun 9, 2012
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AMD just released the R7 and it competes with the 2080 at the same cost but performing worse most of the time. People are only hoping for more cost efficient GPU's out of AMD. Nobody is expecting AMD to realistically match/outperform nvidia.
Radeon VII is definitely a stopgap product that exists solely so that AMD can at least show their face in the high end consumer GPU market.

Let’s all pray that R VIII is not indicative of the performance/$ that Navi will bring.
 
Feb 17, 2019
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yeah sadly WCCFTECH is as accurate as any random forum poster who has access to internet and a keyboard.
Usually the best thing is to not believe anything from WCCFTECH or even expect the opposite. When WCCFTECH says that Navi isn't GCN it is probably best to expect that the Navi micro architecture is still under the GCN Macro architecture
 
Nov 12, 2009
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Radeon VII is definitely a stopgap product that exists solely so that AMD can at least show their face in the high end consumer GPU market.

Let’s all pray that R VIII is not indicative of the performance/$ that Navi will bring.
It for sure is a stopgap and obviously out there to exhaust their remaining supply. One of those "if it sells then that is great but it won't break us if it flops" kinda things. I do really want NAVI to be a great thing for the market and competition. I have kinda been between AMD and Nvidia my whole life but never married to the idea of either company. I just bought a system with a 2080 and I am loving it but my last GPU was a laptop 1070. The difference is there but bumping my monitor to 1440p means that the 2080 really leaves a lot to be desired when wanting to play many of the latest games at max settings.
 
Sep 9, 2018
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AMD's GPU war is lost in the PC Gaming space. They're practically giving their shit away at the lower and mid tiers with AAA games and still can't flog product. Why waste time and money on a market that doesn't buy? To drop nvidia prices so people buy green anyway? lol

Their focus is consoles and rightfully so. It still blows my mind that everytime a console splashscreen pops up I never see the AMD logo, make that shit mandatory already. Gain some mindshare and help yourselves for fucks sake.
 
Nov 27, 2018
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It still blows my mind that everytime a console splashscreen pops up I never see the AMD logo, make that shit mandatory already. Gain some mindshare and help yourselves for fucks sake.
That's.... the greatest idea AMD could pull off right now. Imagine every PS4/XB1 commercial displaying "powered by [AMD logo]", the brand recognition would go off the charts.
 
Aug 3, 2014
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Cool, I guess.

That's twice now I've wanted an AMD card and didn't get one because ... they didn't have any to offer me. Hopefully when I want to ditch my 2080 they will have something worth upgrading to.

At best AMD will release cards to replace their ancient 5xx/Vega 56/64 cards and finally put out a card that can compete with the 2080 + 2080 Ti. Can't see them keeping the VII around. By the time AMD do all this then guess what'll happen? Nvidia will release their own 7nm cards and BOOM...AMD are back playing catch up.

That's.... the greatest idea AMD could pull off right now. Imagine every PS4/XB1 commercial displaying "powered by [AMD logo]", the brand recognition would go off the charts.
what's the point in that? they are console owners. they don't care about who makes the parts the same as PC owners.

plus if they want to sell their CPU + GPUs they shouldn't be targetting console owners. And it's not like they can go buy a console, except the Switch, that uses a different processor. Both Playstation + Xbox use AMD and will keep using them. It's a waste of time targeting console owners.

but yes brand recognition is good but do it right. AMD are doing great in the PC market when it comes to CPUs but when it comes to GPUs they are seen as the poor man's option because all they're good for is being cheap and playing at 1080p. Except the Vega cards but you'd need to be smacked over the head to buy them. If AMD can ever compete with Nvidia like they are with Intel then they will gain that brand recognition and respect. A lot of people grudgingly buy Nvidia products and feel forced because AMD just don't offer an option. You want the best performance in your games? Buy a 2080 Ti....but I want an AMD card!! yeah well have fun waiting.
 
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Likes: Leonidas
Feb 9, 2018
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It for sure is a stopgap and obviously out there to exhaust their remaining supply. One of those "if it sells then that is great but it won't break us if it flops" kinda things. I do really want NAVI to be a great thing for the market and competition. I have kinda been between AMD and Nvidia my whole life but never married to the idea of either company. I just bought a system with a 2080 and I am loving it but my last GPU was a laptop 1070. The difference is there but bumping my monitor to 1440p means that the 2080 really leaves a lot to be desired when wanting to play many of the latest games at max settings.
Really? I'm playing Metro Exodus at 1440p at ultra (not extreme) settings with a 1080ti, and it looks and runs great. What games are giving you issues?
 
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llien

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WCC is the real source.



Nobody is expecting AMD to realistically match/outperform nvidia.
570 wipes the floor with similarly priced 1050Ti.
The best perf/$ that nVidia rolled out is 1660Ti, but Vega 56 now costs as much, has 2Gb more power and comes with free games, but consumes 1.6-1.8 times more power (GPU only)

Had AMD really lost GPU market, nVidia would not need to give in on Adaptive Sync front.
 
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WCC is the real source.




570 wipes the floor with similarly priced 1050Ti.
The best perf/$ that nVidia rolled out is 1660Ti, but Vega 56 now costs as much, has 2Gb more power and comes with free games, but consumes 1.6-1.8 times more power (GPU only)

Had AMD really lost GPU market, nVidia would not need to give in on Adaptive Sync front.
FreeSync was basically the only reason a gamer might’ve chosen Radeon VII instead of RTX 2080. It made a lot of sense for Nvidia to enable it when they did.
 
Likes: CuNi
Apr 7, 2006
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Navi is looking really good from the leaked performance results......Everything people have been beating AMD for seems to be on board from the rumors so far.....A strictly gaming GPU? Check....A lower Power Draw GPU? Check.... A new architecture? Check....And it looks like they are going to break the 4096 SP limit of Vega........Bodes well, because they can easily offer a range of products at a great price to perf ratio which scales to the high end easily....

I like the strategy of AMD though, it's looking very likely that Ryzen 3000 will be the CPU's to have in July, better IPC, high clockspeeds etc....For too long people matched Intel processors with AMD for the best gaming performance with an AMD GPU, but that will no longer be required....I just hope AMD develops some synnergy and extra performance with a Navi+Ryzen 3000 combo......
 
Mar 14, 2019
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All I can say is this:
AMD gods in the sky, please take my money! I want to be saved from the Nvidia devils!

I had heard AMD has been doing better in open standards, and especially since I want to give GPU passthrough a try if I go back to Linux, I might just scoop myself up two AMD cards once these come out.
 
Sep 9, 2018
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what's the point in that? they are console owners. they don't care about who makes the parts the same as PC owners.

plus if they want to sell their CPU + GPUs they shouldn't be targetting console owners. And it's not like they can go buy a console, except the Switch, that uses a different processor. Both Playstation + Xbox use AMD and will keep using them. It's a waste of time targeting console owners.

but yes brand recognition is good but do it right. AMD are doing great in the PC market when it comes to CPUs but when it comes to GPUs they are seen as the poor man's option because all they're good for is being cheap and playing at 1080p. Except the Vega cards but you'd need to be smacked over the head to buy them. If AMD can ever compete with Nvidia like they are with Intel then they will gain that brand recognition and respect. A lot of people grudgingly buy Nvidia products and feel forced because AMD just don't offer an option. You want the best performance in your games? Buy a 2080 Ti....but I want an AMD card!! yeah well have fun waiting.
The console contracts are what saved the company in the graphics space. What's the point? well... Why have those splashscreens in the first place? Is this a serious question? Why having your logo visible to millions of people?
Joe Bloggs goes to try PC from his console his first reference is that AMD powered his console. Nvidias logo is ubiquitous in the pc space -Just do a quick google search for graphics cards, chances are every one will be an nvidia.
TWIMTBP is a thing for a reason, as was nvidias attempt at the GPP.

They're not doing great in the PC market, they're barely hanging on. Intel is 82 percent market share, nvidia is 75.

570 wipes the floor with similarly priced 1050Ti.
The best perf/$ that nVidia rolled out is 1660Ti, but Vega 56 now costs as much, has 2Gb more power and comes with free games, but consumes 1.6-1.8 times more power (GPU only)

Had AMD really lost GPU market, nVidia would not need to give in on Adaptive Sync front.


Look at those GPU's, not an AMD in sight.



Faster product, less expensive, still can't sell.

I bought one of those Vegas by the way. £250 with 3 AAA games means they're likely losing money on that card. Not a place any company wants to be.
 
Mar 31, 2014
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Those who read my original exclusive will remember that I talked about how Navi is going to be the first non-GCN GPU and the first card to break free of the 4096 SP limit imposed by the GCN macro-architecture.

Unexpected if true, though a pleasant surprise. "Next gen" was so conspicuously named for being the one to move past GCN.
 
Nov 25, 2015
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Great news if true. That 4096 core limit wasn't really an issue, considering most Nvidia cards hover between 1,3-3,5k cores, the problem was squeezing actual performance from those cores due to heavy CPU overload the GCN has. So if they finally figured it out, and their GPUs will be reliable and provide the same level of performance across the board, no matter which API or engine the games use, they will finally have the basis to actually compete with NV. So yeah, I hope the rumor is totally true.
Sony is said to be involved with building Navi in conjunction with AMD. The two of them working together should certainly help in turning out a powerful product.
 
Oct 24, 2017
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Sony is said to be involved with building Navi in conjunction with AMD. The two of them working together should certainly help in turning out a powerful product.
It seems a bit too much investment from Sony to be co-designing a GPU just for a console, when they did it with the CELL they had more uses in mind for it. Is Sony making a mega bet on the PS5 as the company money maker or do they have more future uses for navi based gpus? Like mobile variants for their money bleeding phone dept, or their money bleeding TV dept, or some other money bleeding dept since you can't attach a navi gpu to an insurance form.
 
Sep 18, 2017
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It seems a bit too much investment from Sony to be co-designing a GPU just for a console, when they did it with the CELL they had more uses in mind for it.
I don't think Sony's involved with the development to the same extent as they were with the Cell - I'd be assuming it's more akin to a Pro (that they want some specific features in there, for example the ID buffer and FP16 in case of a Pro; but not designing a new GPU from the ground up).
 
Likes: ColdToffee

Panajev2001a

GAF's Pleasant Genius
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CELL was a much bigger investment (new facilities, dedicated engineers, etc...) than the kind of semi-custom work they did for the original PS4 and PS4 Pro and they are not investing in new fabs either (like they did at that time), but yes they do believe in generations and not yearly updates with off the shelf parts, so it makes sense for them to be involved and invest some money into it.

Likely AMD and say Sony would meet and look at whatever technology AMD has in their full roadmap, from big ticket items to smaller isolated components / initiatives, and the expected time scales and cost for each. Sony may then make modifications suggestions and or propose new features that could make sense to have.

At that point, AMD and Sony would negotiate timelines and investment required by Sony to add features to the roadmap and/or to accelerate the evolution of others and based on these negotiation they would define the kind of GPU setup they want to have in the console. If you look at both PS4 GPU and PS4 Pro’s one you can see how they do not match exactly to any single GPU AMD had in the market at that time / time of launch.

Part of these negotiations would likely include deals such as AMD being able to use it in their own discreet and embedded parts after Sony launches their PlayStation product (... and some kind of timed exclusive on technology usable in competing consoles).
 
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Not really. AMD/ATI have recently had multiple disappointing releases (R9 Fury, 580, 590, R VII). I'd argue that before and since the Radeon 480 AMD has not brought a product to market that can actually compete with NVidia's offerings, neither in terms of performance, price or price/performance. Add to that the fact that 1) NVidia has a powerful grip on the market that allows for dirty strategies, 2) GPU innovation happens currently at Intel or Apple, 3) AMD/ATI had a brain recently and 4) that AMD/ATI (most likely) can't compete with NVidia on performance and therefore has to go for price, which is not a sustainable strategy and is frowned upon by shareholders. I also don't like the idea of AMD competing with NVidia in the server or GPU computing space, where NVidia already has a strong presence. If anything AMD had to execute a multi-year lobbying effort within the GPU computing industry in favor of more open GPU computing standards that paves the way for their hardware offerings.

I wouldn't be too surprised if Navi sees a paper release in late 2019, can't compete in price, can't compete in thermals / power consumptions, but will see success in the low-margin console market. Unless they get their power consumption under control - and we all know they won't - they won't be a factor in laptop GPUs, which besides the high-end desktop GPU market (i.e. NVidia) is currently the only relevant market segment. So ... business as usual for AMD.

Prove me wrong AMD.
 
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llien

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Feb 1, 2017
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Look at those GPU's, not an AMD in sight.
Faster product, less expensive, still can't sell.
I thought you meant better products when saying "Nobody is expecting AMD to realistically match/outperform nvidia.".

More expensive Prescott outsold faster, cheaper, less power hungry Athlon
The same story with Fermi.
So, surely, beating the big guys in market share department is not something that can happen any time soon.

AMD is still more than capable of producing great products.
 
Jun 9, 2012
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That has been the case since at least the ATi 9800 Pro.
They also had shitty drivers and GPUs that had heat problems/needed to run the fan at ridiculous (loud) speed to keep them cool.

I dropped Radeon after 5000 series and have had consistently better experiences with Geforce cards (better drivers, better stability, no need to dick around w/ fan profiles to keep the card from overheating). I know I’m not the only one.

So don’t try to turn this into a “dumb consumers irrationally buying an inferior product because they don’t know better” story (like AMD fans frequently do). The truth is that AMD lost the trust of many gamers.

That said, I have high hopes for Navi and I would be happy to switch back to AMD GPUs if they can compete with Nvidia.
 
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They also had shitty drivers and GPUs that had heat problems/needed to run the fan at ridiculous (loud) speed to keep them cool.
That didn't stop nVidia's Fermi from selling well, now did it?

I dropped Radeon after 5000 series and have had consistently better experiences with Geforce cards (better drivers, better stability, no need to dick around w/ fan profiles to keep the card from overheating). I know I’m not the only one.

So don’t try to turn this into a “dumb consumers irrationally buying an inferior product because they don’t know better” story (like AMD fans frequently do). The truth is that AMD lost the trust of many gamers.
Lost the trust based on what? Drivers? AMD's drivers and software are currently in much better shape than nVidia's. So what's the issue now? Yeah... I know what it is. The goal posts keep shifting. When AMD had the value and the efficiency, performance mattered more. When AMD had the value and performance, efficiency mattered more. The fact that the RX 570 is nowhere to be seen on Steam, but there is a bunch of 1050 Ti users is a testament to this. Give me one good reason why anyone would pick the 1050 Ti over the RX 570.

And you say to not turn this into an argument about dumb consumers irrationally buying inferior products because they don't know better, but that is what it really is, irrational consumers buying nVidia because it's nVidia. Not saying everyone that buys nVidia is like that, but the masses definitely are.

Look at the GTX 970's 3.5GB vs the RX 480 PCI-E power consumption issue. The GTX 970 3.5GB was a deliberate deception that had no fix, while the RX 480 PCI-E power consumption was a driver error/bug that was fixed in less than a week and blown way out of proportion. The GTX 970 is still seen as a great card, while the RX 480 is seen as an 'ok' card. Not to mention that the R9 390 being practically superior to the GTX 970 in every possible way except power consumption, people get the GTX 970 anyway, because higher power consumption is apparently worse than purposefully deceiving your customers. Except when it was the HD 5870 vs the GTX 480. Then all the importance regarding power consumption and heat goes out the window, and another excuse is brought up to once again buy nVidia over AMD. And that's just one of the many examples.
 
Likes: Ryujin
Jun 9, 2012
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That didn't stop nVidia's Fermi from selling well, now did it?


Lost the trust based on what? Drivers? AMD's drivers and software are currently in much better shape than nVidia's. So what's the issue now? Yeah... I know what it is. The goal posts keep shifting. When AMD had the value and the efficiency, performance mattered more. When AMD had the value and performance, efficiency mattered more. The fact that the RX 570 is nowhere to be seen on Steam, but there is a bunch of 1050 Ti users is a testament to this. Give me one good reason why anyone would pick the 1050 Ti over the RX 570.

And you say to not turn this into an argument about dumb consumers irrationally buying inferior products because they don't know better, but that is what it really is, irrational consumers buying nVidia because it's nVidia. Not saying everyone that buys nVidia is like that, but the masses definitely are.

Look at the GTX 970's 3.5GB vs the RX 480 PCI-E power consumption issue. The GTX 970 3.5GB was a deliberate deception that had no fix, while the RX 480 PCI-E power consumption was a driver error/bug that was fixed in less than a week and blown way out of proportion. The GTX 970 is still seen as a great card, while the RX 480 is seen as an 'ok' card. Not to mention that the R9 390 being practically superior to the GTX 970 in every possible way except power consumption, people get the GTX 970 anyway, because higher power consumption is apparently worse than purposefully deceiving your customers. Except when it was the HD 5870 vs the GTX 480. Then all the importance regarding power consumption and heat goes out the window, and another excuse is brought up to once again buy nVidia over AMD. And that's just one of the many examples.
Just speaking from my own experience. Here was my upgrade path:

- GeForce 6800 GT: totally rock solid

- Radeon 3870X2: HORRIBLE drivers. First game I played was Team Fortress 2, which had a terrible flickering issue in the initial driver release (yes, they apparently released a new GPU without testing their drivers on the most popular PC game on the market)

- Radeon 4870. Finicky drivers. Would sometimes overheat and BSOD. Had to manually increase fan speed to 40% to keep it stable (which made it sound like a freaking hairdryer)

- Radeon 5870: relatively stable but it sounded like a damn jet engine

- GTX 570 -> GTX 670 -> GTX 970 -> GTX 1080 -> RTX 2080 Ti: ALL completely rock solid. Zero driver issues/heat issues

Many, many other gamers were in the same boat. Went with AMD because they were the “good guys” and had better value. Only to get fed up with various driver and overheating issues.

So you’re darn right they lost trust. Say what you want about Nvidia being a slimy and greedy company, you’re probably right. But I’ve had vastly better experiences with their products out of the box compared to AMD, and so have many others.
 
Likes: Insane Metal
Jul 23, 2018
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- Radeon 3870X2: HORRIBLE drivers.
Well, considering that was a crossfire card, that was to be expected.

Radeon 4870. Finicky drivers. Would sometimes overheat and BSOD. Had to manually increase fan speed to 40% to keep it stable (which made it sound like a freaking hairdryer)

- Radeon 5870: relatively stable but it sounded like a damn jet engine

- GTX 570 -> GTX 670 -> GTX 970 -> GTX 1080 -> RTX 2080 Ti: ALL completely rock solid. Zero driver issues/heat issues

Many, many other gamers were in the same boat. Went with AMD because they were the “good guys” and had better value. Only to get fed up with various driver and overheating issues.
Fair enough, but, I have to ask. How many of those were AIBs and how many were reference cards? AMD reference cards always sucked, and well, picking an AIB used to be a lot harder than it is today. It was easy to go for a subpar one.

Many, many other gamers were in the same boat. Went with AMD because they were the “good guys” and had better value. Only to get fed up with various driver and overheating issues.

So you’re darn right they lost trust. Say what you want about Nvidia being a slimy and greedy company, you’re probably right. But I’ve had vastly better experiences with their products out of the box compared to AMD, and so have many others.
I didn't use nVidia after I felt cheated with my MX440. And honestly, after people got cheated with their GTX 970, I still don't get why those same people would buy nVidia again. I have had no major issues with ATi/AMD cards, which is what I mostly used for all my systems.
You sure upgrade a lot though. So from that perspective, I can get why you buy nVidia. Everything is up to snuff immediately, in most cases at least. They have had their drivers that kill their own cards, but I guess that was not frequently enough to damage their reputation. I'm someone that upgrades every 3-5 years. Drivers and the like are given more time to mature and I guess I never really felt the same way as you do about AMD. My upgrade path was;
MX440 -> 9600 Pro -> X1650 Pro -> HD6850 -> R9 Fury.

I never buy GPUs at launch, but when they're closer to being phased out. I guess since our necessities are different, so are our experiences.
 
Mar 31, 2014
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Great news if true. That 4096 core limit wasn't really an issue, considering most Nvidia cards hover between 1,3-3,5k cores, the problem was squeezing actual performance from those cores due to heavy CPU overload the GCN has
This isn't the only reason, else they would dominate in low level APIs. While they bridge some of the gap,they don't entirely. I.e RTX 2080 at 2944 cores vs VII at 3840.

The rest of the difference is in design philosophy. Each of Nvidias cores have more silicon and do more each, AMDs are thinner and they are able to pack more in a die for it. Same reason cross comparing Gflops doesn't work out, as one of the numbers in the calc comes from the core count.