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Analysts Claim Sony is losing $100 per PS3 Slim

gtj1092

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Feb 16, 2008
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gregor7777 said:
Better? People seem to like images.

http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o225/gregor7777/kaz.jpg[IMG]

:lol

It can be the banner for the thread.[/QUOTE]


Do keep posting this to imply that they are losing $100 per console? If they were losing less than that on a Phat how would moving to the slim model increase cost?
 

Chauncy Talon

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May 3, 2009
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If sony losing 100 dollars on every slim, then how will they make a profit on the system to continue on making more slims? I heard that they were losing 100 dollars on all the 60 GB when they were release in 2007.
 

Psychotext

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Jun 15, 2007
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1,175
gtj1092 said:
Do keep posting this to imply that they are losing $100 per console? If they were losing less than that on a Phat how would moving to the slim model increase cost?
It wouldn't... they dropped the price by $100.

Edit - I should probably clarify that I think the $100 loss figure is utter crap... but that's aside from my post there.
 

infinityBCRT

Member
Jun 2, 2008
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0
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ivedoneyourmom said:
If they dropped the price of manufacture by 70%, doesn't that mean, even if the first PS3s costed 1000$ to make, they now would be breaking even at selling for 300$?
You have to take into account packaging & shipping & the retail cut as well
 

elrechazado

Banned
Dec 21, 2008
20,623
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far far away
Chauncy Talon said:
If sony losing 100 dollars on every slim, then how will they make a profit on the system to continue on making more slims? I heard that they were losing 100 dollars on all the 60 GB when they were release in 2007.

heh, you need to catch up on some reading. Not sure whether to start with the 2007 release, the 100 dollar loss on release, or the "how can they profit by selling a console at a loss" thing....I'll let someone else do it.
 

gtj1092

Member
Feb 16, 2008
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865
Psychotext said:
It wouldn't... they dropped the price by $100.

Edit - I should probably clarify that I think the $100 loss figure is utter crap... but that's aside from my post there.

Well yeah all logic points to a smaller loss but he posted it so many times and I was just looking for clarification as to why.
 

Ash Sparrow

Member
Jan 19, 2006
2,793
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1,430
Yeah i believe it, i wondered earlier why tretton used the razor blade model while discussiing the slim.

its a shame that they arent breaking even on these things now
 
Dec 5, 2008
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gregor7777 said:
Better? People seem to like images.



:lol

It can be the banner for the thread.
Quoting cause I still don't think people are getting it.
 

spwolf

Member
Feb 15, 2007
16,282
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Ash Sparrow said:
Yeah i believe it, i wondered earlier why tretton used the razor blade model while discussiing the slim.

its a shame that they arent breaking even on these things now

please, there would be OUTRAGE if people find out Sony was making money on PS3... Thats not the way system works :D

p.s. if Slim was priced as TV's are... it would cost... $800-$900? So even if Sony lost $10 or even made $30 on PS3, for them, it would still be razor blade model compared to the way electronic business usually works.
 

Averon

Member
Aug 27, 2008
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So Sony went from selling a PS3 that loses them $40-$50 to selling a PS3 that loses them $100?!? :lol :lol

The whole point of the Slim to lose less money, not more. Now, I do believe Sony does lose money on the Slim, but it's less that what they were losing on the 80 gigs. If I were to guess, I'll say they are losing half as much as the fats. In other words, they're losing about $20-$25 per Slim. That sounds far more reasonable.
 

Raist

Banned
Jan 27, 2007
24,543
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Psychotext said:
Technically they're already using the "lesser" parts by using only 7 of the 8 SPUs on the die. It means that they can have a much better yield.

I guess any with 6 get binned. I don't know of any commercial variants of the CELL that use 6 PPUs.

I think I read a while ago they would use chips with less SPEs on TVs etc.
That said, I'm not sure it's being used in anything else than PS3s and IBM servers.
 

laserbeam

Banned
Mar 23, 2007
6,938
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Digital-Hero said:
No it can't. He doesn't even state by how much. It could be $1 dollar for all you know. Lay off the FUD.

He is reffering to the fact people are disregarding the fact Kaz and Sonys CFO have said they are still losing money while claiming Sony is doing great now making profits etc
 
Jul 31, 2007
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*reads thread*

Maybe I should just go back to the OT side. You people are freaking nuts. From every side. Yeah, Sony is losing money... so? Get the system cheaper is a yay.

It's a win no matter what side you are on. More people get a gaming system. The industry grows. That's a good thing.
 

IrishNinja

Member
May 12, 2009
40,062
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Vice City
Thunder Monkey said:
*reads thread*

Maybe I should just go back to the OT side. You people are freaking nuts. From every side. Yeah, Sony is losing money... so? Get the system cheaper is a yay.

It's a win no matter what side you are on. More people get a gaming system. The industry grows. That's a good thing.


hah, you must be a hoot in console wars & NPD threads.
 

Giolon

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Dec 5, 2008
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www.radiantcg.com
Thunder Monkey said:
*reads thread*

Maybe I should just go back to the OT side. You people are freaking nuts. From every side. Yeah, Sony is losing money... so? Get the system cheaper is a yay.

It's a win no matter what side you are on. More people get a gaming system. The industry grows. That's a good thing.

A rare bastion of sanity in an insane thread. You are the winner, sir.
 

BushinKun

Banned
Dec 16, 2008
25
0
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Seattle
Actually SONY saved a lot of money by getting rid of redundancies in the supply line and fabs/production. You can't just consider component cost by itself, or you would fail to see the forest for the trees.
 
Nov 17, 2006
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Koga, Ibaraki, Japan
There's no way they'd drop the price by as much as they did if they were losing that kind of scratch. Just no way. It would put the gaming division at high risk and the company on the whole is not doing very well.

Mr. Thunder Monkey, if all you care about is the end result and have no care/concern for the analysis of the men behind the curtains, I think you'll find you should be playing games instead of wasting time on a message board.
 
Dec 7, 2008
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Thunder Monkey said:
*reads thread*

Maybe I should just go back to the OT side. You people are freaking nuts. From every side. Yeah, Sony is losing money... so? Get the system cheaper is a yay.

It's a win no matter what side you are on. More people get a gaming system. The industry grows. That's a good thing.

thisisgafdude.gif
 

Tylahedras

Banned
Jul 6, 2008
3,267
0
0
This has already been said I know, but I have to say it again:

70% of original cost often estimated at about 900$ has been cut.

So

.3 x 900$ = 270$

If you include the costs of shipping and such it's probably still making a little money. But I'm fairly confident the whole reason they waited till this year for the price drop was that Sony corporate wouldn't allow them to keep bleeding money on the machine since the company is starving for liquidity.
 

Loudninja

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Jul 30, 2007
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Segata Sanshiro said:
There's no way they'd drop the price by as much as they did if they were losing that kind of scratch. Just no way. It would put the gaming division at high risk and the company on the whole is not doing very well.

Mr. Thunder Monkey, if all you care about is the end result and have no care/concern for the analysis of the men behind the curtains, I think you'll find you should be playing games instead of wasting time on a message board.

They said the PS3 Slim puts them on the world to profitability , so yeah I seriously doubt they losing this much.
 

ajcastillo

Banned
Mar 7, 2009
143
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Nicaragua
OMG really guys do we mind that SONY is losing or NOT money with the new PS3 SLIM really or you guys have secret sony stocks under your beds:lol .

PS: Uhm in a post a will back is it true that the PS2 gave revenue until 5 years on production? no way like in 5 years they were like 50 million ps3 sold around the world damn, need confirmation of this please?
 

Tutomos

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Jan 14, 2006
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I thought the thing says the retail price right now is 40000 yen, not the manufacturing cost.
 

ajcastillo

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Mar 7, 2009
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Segata Sanshiro said:
If you aren't interested in the topic, you are free to not post in the thread.

My apologies didn't want to cause a stir sorry, but yeah i am interested in the topic even more in how it results, so sorry again.
 

zoku88

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Dec 25, 2006
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DKnight said:
Isn't that illegal?
Only if it's an anti-competitive move.

Look at the prices of the wii and the 360. How could pricing the PS3 at higher costs than them be seen as anti-competitive? It's more of a move to be competitive.
 
Feb 14, 2009
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My PS3 turns on and plays games. It's pretty cool and if I look closely enough at it I CAN FEEL THE TANGIBLE CONNECTION BETWEEN ME AND THIS AMAZING COMPANY THAT BUILT IT. THEY LOVE ME. THEY LOVE ME.
 

androvsky

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Sep 19, 2007
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Last Podcast Beyond one of the editors mentioned they were secretly hoping for a price cut to $249, since someone at Sony had said they got the build cost down to around $250. But if Kaz says they're losing money on even the slim PS3 at $299, then who knows?
 

elrechazado

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Dec 21, 2008
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androvsky said:
Last Podcast Beyond one of the editors mentioned they were secretly hoping for a price cut to $249, since someone at Sony had said they got the build cost down to around $250. But if Kaz says they're losing money on even the slim PS3 at $299, then who knows?

Kaz saying that they lose money on every ps3 could certainly be part of a marketing campaign.

Does it really hurt sony to again reinforce "hey look how much value you're getting if you buy this thing...it costs us more money than we sell it to you for". Perceived value is a nice tool.
 

Raist

Banned
Jan 27, 2007
24,543
0
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zoku88 said:
Only if it's an anti-competitive move.

Look at the prices of the wii and the 360. How could pricing the PS3 at higher costs than them be seen as anti-competitive? It's more of a move to be competitive.

And manufacturers can sell their products at loss as much as they want. Retailers can't.
 

Ogrekiller

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Dec 6, 2008
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Thunder Monkey said:
*reads thread*

Maybe I should just go back to the OT side. You people are freaking nuts. From every side. Yeah, Sony is losing money... so? Get the system cheaper is a yay.

It's a win no matter what side you are on. More people get a gaming system. The industry grows. That's a good thing.

Maybe you're too anal about this. There are much worse threads out there in OT.

Sony is probably confident in its software division making up for the loss it might incur in dropping the price/ pushing the slim.
 

Magnus_Bulla

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Jesus balls guys, it's not complicated. In order for the PS3 to sell at a $100 loss it would have to cost $400 to produce/ship/retail cut/etc. Keeping in mind that they've repeatedly said the production costs have dropped 70%, that means launch systems would have to have cost them roughly $1300 all told. I don't know if we know what the original cost was, but that seems hella high to me, ergo there's no way they're selling the Slim at a $100 loss.

Yes, the Slim is still losing them money, as has been said multiple times, and no, it's not a $100 loss. There's nothing left to discuss here, anything else is just madness.
 

elrechazado

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Dec 21, 2008
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Magnus_Bulla said:
Jesus balls guys, it's not complicated. In order for the PS3 to sell at a $100 loss it would have to cost $400 to produce/ship/retail cut/etc. Keeping in mind that they've repeatedly said the production costs have dropped 70%, that means launch systems would have to have cost them roughly $1300 all told. I don't know if we know what the original cost was, but that seems hella high to me, ergo there's no way they're selling the Slim at a $100 loss.

Yes, the Slim is still losing them money, as has been said multiple times, and no, it's not a $100 loss. There's nothing left to discuss here, anything else is just madness.

Not reading the thread is cool, because nobody has discussed those things at length yet.
 

Mrbob

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Jun 7, 2004
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androvsky said:
Last Podcast Beyond one of the editors mentioned they were secretly hoping for a price cut to $249, since someone at Sony had said they got the build cost down to around $250. But if Kaz says they're losing money on even the slim PS3 at $299, then who knows?

Remember manufacturing parts is only one part of the equation. Need to assemble all the parts together, package them, and ship. So I'm guessing after packaging and shipping sony is losing a little money on each system for now. I highly doubt the slim costs only about 40 dollars less to manufacture as these analysts claim.
 

OldJadedGamer

Banned
Feb 28, 2006
18,281
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CVG
Digital-Hero said:
No it can't. He doesn't even state by how much. It could be $1 dollar for all you know. Lay off the FUD.

If they lose $1 or $1,000 the fact remains that they still don't make money off the hardware even with the slim.
 
Nov 11, 2006
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The best part about this thread is GAF thinking they are leading experts on determing whether Sony is losing money or not.
 

Chumly

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Apr 3, 2007
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cartoon_soldier said:
The best part about this thread is GAF thinking they are leading experts on determing whether Sony is losing money or not.
We know they are losing money so only point that is worth discussing is how MUCH money are they losing.
 
Jan 10, 2009
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FateBreaker said:
Every single time I hear this comment I laugh. Any variation of it = laughter. Yes, why should anybody care whether or not a company profits.

I don't know if you're being sarcastic or not but I wonder why myself. If you want something and you're willing to pay the price offered for it, you get the product. As a consumer why in hell's name do i care whether it makes profit for the company. It's their price, not mine. It's my money, not theirs until I nod my head and agree to the sum. My input is in the purchase or lack of purchase of the product.
 
Nov 17, 2006
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CultureClearance said:
I don't know if you're being sarcastic or not but I wonder why myself. If you want something and you're willing to pay the price offered for it, you get the product. As a consumer why in hell's name do i care whether it makes profit for the company. It's their price, not mine. It's my money, not theirs until I nod my head and agree to the sum. My input is in the purchase or lack of purchase of the product.
Because you'd see an awful lot of the people (though perhaps not yourself) who are singing the "I don't care whether the company is making a profit or not" tune start singing a new one pretty damn fast if Sony went third party/under completely. See January 31, 2001, if you'd like some reference material.
 

KtSlime

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Feb 28, 2009
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To all those who think this discussion is pointless: who cares what you think, if people want to discuss this, they should be able to, if you don't like the discussion ignore the thread.

Frankly, I think it is interesting speculating how much it costs to build the machine, and how that will change over time while they hopefully become profitable and regain lost monies.
 

XiaNaphryz

LATIN, MATRIPEDICABUS, DO YOU SPEAK IT
Nov 5, 2005
52,177
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SF Bay Area
gregor7777 said:
Better? People seem to like images.



:lol

It can be the banner for the thread.
Yes, but to REALLY get attention you need an animated gif obviously. Go commission Mama Robotnik. ;P
 

riceandbeans

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Feb 23, 2009
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Can't see how they're still losing out on so much money. They're using cheaper plastic, parts and components. Maybe on launch Slims they're losing out, but I can't see how this would be a long-term loss.