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As bad as things seem for the Wii U, I still think NIntendo can turn things around

Yuripaw

Banned
There has been so much doom and gloom lately in the news in regards to the Wii U. Many of it is factual, and even Iwata has acknowledge that some things need to be done. I don't know what their plan is, but what I would like to see, and what I think could still save the Wii U from being a complete failure is something I didn't want to admit before: Lose the Gamepad. At least in terms of being a requirement for the system.

Let me say first that I love my Wii U. I have have had mine since launch day, and I am one of those owners who has never really regretted buying it, and have tried to defend the platform and encourage other users to give it a try, but my word alone is hardly enough. Just as an example to show I'm sincere, I even posted this on Miiverse the other day, so it's not like I'm some person who wants them to fail: https://miiverse.nintendo.net/posts/AYMHAAACAADMUKlirLDWkw

Back to my initial statement, as much as I like the Wii U gamepad, and thought it could lead to some interesting possibilities with games, it really is part of what is hurting them from reaching the sales Nintendo needs. The hardware of the system is not really the problem. Even if it is less powerful then a PS4 and Xbox One, it still is capable of producing fun and gorgeous looking games. The gamepad itself though raises the cost of the system for Nintendo, and for consumers. Nintendo gambled by thinking people would flock to the idea of a tablet controller, but it hasn't worked out that way. It doesn't help either when Nintendo themselves barely make any good use of it for their games. (a blank screen when playing DKCR:TF, that's the best they could come up with?)

This is not a new idea, but I really am starting to think the solution might be as simple enough as lowering the price of the Wii U to $199 with a pro controller and possibly a game. The current price point of the Wii U is just too close to the PS4, and as much as some people love Nintendo, the average gamer knows that the third party games ain't there, or are gimped versions because of stupid publishers; and based on sales, it seems even Nintendo fans think the price is too high to warrant purchasing the system just for Nintendo games. I think once you cut that price to $199 though, and you got a more familiar gamer style controller, it becomes much more appealing for those who do want to play Mario and Zelda games (and other Nintendo franchises of course.)

Those of you who read this and think that still wouldn't be enough based on the games out, I'd partially agree, but based on the games coming out, I still think with a system bundle at that price, and upcoming games like Mario Kart 8 and Super Smash Bros, there is still great potential for sales. Let's not forget, Mario Kart Wii was a shocking success in terms of sales numbers, with a thread I read on here from 2011 claiming it had sold at least 28 million copies at that point. That's insane! We also know that Smash Bros is a franchise that sells millions on it's own, but that one is a little further off.

You might say that even if these games and this strategy of mine about lowering the price/dropping the gamepad succeeds, they still don't hope to achieve success on the level that Sony or maybe even Microsoft could potentially achieve without third party support. I'd be inclined to agree. I don't think Nintendo can or ever will come close to the same level of success they had with Wii, or that Sony is having now with the PS4. Personally though, I don't care about that. The best I could hope for is that maybe Nintendo achieves a Gamecube level of success with the Wii U, and that the situation doesn't become worse then, and at least becomes a little positive so they can stay in the game, and come up with a better strategy later in the future.
 

JLeack

Banned
In a way I'm charmed by your hope. On the other, I think it's lunatic.

The console has almost no redeeming qualities. It's game over.

The truth will set you free.
 

Teknoman

Member
I'm happy with the system...so far, but I do wish Nintendo would dig into their money bin to net some good third party exclusives...some stuff that actually makes good use of its capabilities (both graphically and control wise).

I mean I was happy with the Wii for what it was, and even though I had my 360,PS3, and PC for other games, I enjoyed the exclusives it received (both first and third party).

If they can do something to bolster their install base, you'd think more would develop for the system since technically it should be cheaper than making a PS4/Xbox One title.

At any rate, the only systems people ask about at my local store is the PS4 and the Wii U. People are also kinda bugging about how PS4/Xbox one have "no games" at the moment, but thats just normal launch drought stuff. Of course Nintendo should've been well prepared by now to take advantage of that outside of Mario 3D World.
 

Shinta

Banned
If Nintendo has a huge E3, it can definitely change minds. Miyamoto project, Zelda, X, Fire Emblem x SMT, Yoshi's Yarn, Tokyo EAD's 2nd project, more OS update information, Hyrule Warriors and who knows what else. Couple HD remakes.

All that stuff adds up. E3 does get people's attention, and Nintendo didn't even really try last year.

DKC: TF, Bayonetta 2, Mario Kart and Smash Bros in the meantime won't hurt either.
 

McDougles

Member
Losing the gamepad is a no-brainer in my opinion. Won't save the sinking ship but will bandaid a bit

"Hey developers, remember that gamepad we had you painstakingly learn to program for and design with in mind? Well, we're abandoning it less than 2 years into the console lol."

Great way to build that always-diminishing 3rd party support!
 
You know, if they will do that, they'll probably do it at the same time as Mario Kart. I'd wager we won't find out about it until a week before too.

They won't launch a new SKU/pricedrop without a game, and they aren't announcing one too far in advance either.

I fully agree with the OP that 199.99 gamepad-less is the relative solution. I don't think they will turn it around, I think the ship has sailed and the system will fade into oblivion in 2015. With that said, I hope all of the best Wii U games are ready for whatever next system they have. I doubt Nintendo will waste the investment in such a great 3D Mario, Kart, Smash, and Zelda for them to sell 2-3 million each.
 

PBY

Banned
"Hey developers, remember that gamepad we had you painstakingly learn to program for and design with in mind? Well, we're abandoning it less than 2 years into the console lol."

Great way to build that always-diminishing 3rd party support!
No one uses it tho?
 

Mononoke

Banned
I only see this AS THAT BAD, because I truly think the Wii was a fluke. So for me, this is just the continuation of a downward trend for Nintendo. I only see it getting worse and worse.
 

Toad.T

Banned
Why are there seriously people that still have hope? Do they have to straight up cancel Smash Bros for the message to sink in?

The system is living on the borrowed time it has left. Once the few 1st party releases dry up, only indie titles will remain. Heck, I'm not even so sure about those titles, either.
 

Teknoman

Member
They arent dropping the gamepad. They stuck with the double screens, touch screens, and everything else they've ever tried, I seriously doubt things will change now.
 

Shinta

Banned
Why are there seriously people that still have hope? Do they have to straight up cancel Smash Bros for the message to sink in?

The system is living on the borrowed time it has left. Once the few 1st party releases dry up, only indie titles will remain. Heck, I'm not even so sure about those titles, either.

First party and indie titles is really all the system has ever needed honestly.
 

Yuripaw

Banned
They arent dropping the gamepad. They stuck with the double screens, touch screens, and everything else they've ever tried, I seriously doubt things will change now.

They did drop 3D though for the 3DS to an extent by releasing the 2DS. I feel like when they did that, anything is possible now.
 
The best I could hope for is that maybe Nintendo achieves a Gamecube level of success with the Wii U, and that the situation doesn't become worse then, and at least becomes a little positive so they can stay in the game, and come up with a better strategy later in the future.

Even GC numbers are out of question because it's now almost completely a Nintendo only machine, and their current output doesn't offer enough variety to get to those numbers. N64-era Nintendo might be able to get them there, but not the current Nintendo. The current Nintendo is way too safe for their own good.
 

Effer

Member
Nintendo is going to pretend they're supporting the Wii U until they've cleared through all of the manufactured systems they were hoping to sell last year (6 million plus?). Once they've burnt 6 million more fans they'll quietly end support.

I wouldn't want to write off 2 billion dollars in inventory either, let the fans shoulder some of that burden.
 

Log4Girlz

Member
Wii U may not be officially dead...but its in a vegetative state and we are just waiting for Doctor Mario to officially pull the plug.
 
Depends on your definition of "turn around," really. Will it sell more than 20 million? No. Hell, if it HITS 20 million that'll be turning it around!

You can tell from Iwata's comments at the last meeting that even he is looking towards the next console and only really superficially trying to improve the Wii U.
 

Teknoman

Member
They did drop 3D though for the 3DS to an extent by releasing the 2DS. I feel like when they did that, anything is possible now.

I guess, but is the 2DS really selling all that well? Honestly, i've stayed out of most of the Wii U is doomed conversations since I really dont have anything to add. All I can say is that I think some really good marketing to bolster the install base would help, since they havent really marketed the system well, or its games at all...name confusion aside.
 

McDougles

Member
They did drop 3D though for the 3DS to an extent by releasing the 2DS. I feel like when they did that, anything is possible now.

They released the 2DS so that young children can be bought the handheld and not have their mothers freak out over their newly-crosseyed children.
 

sonicmj1

Member
New Super Mario Bros Wii sold twenty-something million units, but New Super Mario Bros Wii U only sold a tiny fraction of that amount. That buying audience on the Wii won't necessarily dive into a new platform just because it has new versions of a few games they've enjoyed in the past.

When a platform enters a death spiral like the one the Wii U is in, it's incredibly difficult to reverse. A successful platform ensures its own growth, because a growing audience encourages more new things to appear, which encourages more people to join. But with a failing platform, no one wants to join, so no one wants to make anything for it, so nobody is encouraged to reverse the cycle.

A price drop could be the defibrillator that shocks a platform back to life, but I feel like game development cycles are so long at this point that any impact on third parties would take far too long to be felt to matter.
 

hamchan

Member
They arent dropping the gamepad. They stuck with the double screens, touch screens, and everything else they've ever tried, I seriously doubt things will change now.

All those things were huge successes though. The gamepad clearly isn't and it's a very costly addition too.
 

Guevara

Member
What does a turnout look like in numbers? Even 15 million might be a stretch. Is that a success? Would matching the GameCube (22M) be a success?
 

nightever

Member
I'm happy with the system...so far, but I do wish Nintendo would dig into their money bin to net some good third party exclusives...some stuff that actually makes good use of its capabilities (both graphically and control wise).

I mean I was happy with the Wii for what it was, and even though I had my 360,PS3, and PC for other games, I enjoyed the exclusives it received (both first and third party).

If they can do something to bolster their install base, you'd think more would develop for the system since technically it should be cheaper than making a PS4/Xbox One title.

No, high-profile WiiU games will be more expensive than current gen titles, and even Wii didn't have a larger install base than PS360. Third party exclusive is waste money as we have seen. Wii 3rd parties never enjoy success except party games and none of them are system-sellers.
 
All I know is, for sure I am HOPING they do not make another console and call it Wii Super or something. They need games that demonstrate it's a new console rather than one that sounds and looks like an upgrade. Oh, and get better marketers god damn it.

Also hoping they work with third parties better on a new console rather than building it centered around their own type of games. And do not even consider a Nintendoland 2 as a launch title - toss whoever comes up with that idea out of the damn building.
 

Fracas

#fuckonami
I don't think the Wii U is doomed, but I'm absolutely positive it will sit squarely in 3rd place for the console race.
 
with games like kart/smash/dk/x/bayonetta the platform is not dead, but coming up with the awesome and original idea that the gamepad could/should be dropped is definitely dead.
 
This is not a new idea, but I really am starting to think the solution might be as simple enough as lowering the price of the Wii U to $199 with a pro controller and possibly a game. The current price point of the Wii U is just too close to the PS4, and as much as some people love Nintendo, the average gamer knows that the third party games ain't there, or are gimped versions because of stupid publishers; and based on sales, it seems even Nintendo fans think the price is too high to warrant purchasing the system just for Nintendo games. I think once you cut that price to $199 though, and you got a more familiar gamer style controller, it becomes much more appealing for those who do want to play Mario and Zelda games (and other Nintendo franchises of course.)

I'd actually be even less interested than I already am in buying a WiiU if they drop the GamePad altogether. $199 is too high a price for hardware almost exclusively dedicated to 1st party games. In keeping the GamePad you're at least bound to have some interesting ideas you won't get anywhere else hardware-wise.

Between my PS4 and gaming PC I'd see little reason in buying another traditional console for the handful of Nintendo titles.
 

Parapraxis

Member
They arent dropping the gamepad. They stuck with the double screens, touch screens, and everything else they've ever tried, I seriously doubt things will change now.

Virtual Boy.

But yeah, they basically dropped "classic" controllers for the Wii, so not really sure you are making a very sturdy argument here.
 
As long as Nintendo keep making games for WiiU, I'll be ok. N64 is still my all time fav console and it's probably my smallest game collection.

but Who knows how long they can keep doing that and keep afloat.
 

Yuripaw

Banned
I don't think the Wii U is doomed, but I'm absolutely positive it will sit squarely in 3rd place for the console race.

I don't even really disagree with this. I guess I shouldn't have worded it as "turn things around", but I'd hate for it to end in abysmal failure on their part. I'd rather it end with being profitable to a point where they can continue on a path to make their next outing a big one.
 

Teknoman

Member
All those things were huge successes though. The gamepad clearly isn't and it's a very costly addition too.

How did they managed to kickstart the DS sales anyway? I remember everyone being very negative about the original DS for the first couple years of its life.
 

Dysun

Member
I'll be surprised if they are still making games for it in Fall 2015. I think it's done after X/Zelda U
 

Effer

Member
How did they managed to kickstart the DS sales anyway? I remember everyone being very negative about the original DS for the first couple years of its life.

New Super Mario Bros. and the DS Lite. It was the first time they played the New Super Mario card and people were just FROTHING for a classic Mario adventure. Now everyone's burnt out on Mario so they can't use it to move systems. Oh yeah and Nintendogs, they got some blue ocean players on board with that one.
 

baphomet

Member
How did they managed to kickstart the DS sales anyway? I remember everyone being very negative about the original DS for the first couple years of its life.

Nintendogs and brain age. Honestly it was selling like shit up until that point.
 

Korigama

Member
They did drop 3D though for the 3DS to an extent by releasing the 2DS. I feel like when they did that, anything is possible now.
No games on 3DS were ever dependent upon that feature, though.

Personally, I see it as being far too late to salvage the Wii U.
 

nightever

Member
If Nintendo has a huge E3, it can definitely change minds. Miyamoto project, Zelda, X, Fire Emblem x SMT, Yoshi's Yarn, Tokyo EAD's 2nd project, more OS update information, Hyrule Warriors and who knows what else. Couple HD remakes.

All that stuff adds up. E3 does get people's attention, and Nintendo didn't even really try last year.

DKC: TF, Bayonetta 2, Mario Kart and Smash Bros in the meantime won't hurt either.

You are so desperate that you have to put those games there to make the list somehow longer. Those are niche titles and others are typical Nintendo annual releases which have alread been on WiiU.

Some people asked in other thread who are still believe Wiiu can turnround, guess this theard is a answer to it.
 

Teknoman

Member
Virtual Boy.

But yeah, they basically dropped "classic" controllers for the Wii, so not really sure you are making a very sturdy argument here.

Classic controllers weren't the main selling point/control method for the Wii though.

That's a good question, I don't even remember myself. Pokemon maybe?

Either that or the DSlite + NSMB DS (even though that wasnt that great). Its strange because I remember the original version limping along with a touch title or average third party title here and there, then boom, third parties and great first party titles everywhere.
 
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