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Austin, TX passes ordinance allowing homeless to camp on city sidewalks; Governor Abbot promises to override it

TheSadRanger

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Yep, great documentary. It also highlights that these are drug problems first and foremost, which get no recognition from city officials. Same issue here: no mention of drugs.
Do cities not have any crimes for being inebriated in public from narcotics like alcohol? I'm just saying that even in SF if some homeless guy was walking down the street with a bottle of Jack taking swigs he'd get carted off for public intox yet you can shoot up crack and look like a zombie and that's okay??? I mean that person is just as unpredictable as the dude taking swigs of Jack if we're talking about dangerous individuals.
 
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EviLore

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Do cities not have any crimes for being inebriated in public from narcotics like alcohol? I'm just saying that even in SF if some homeless guy was walking down the street with a bottle of Jack taking swigs he'd get carted off for public intox yet you can shoot up crack and look like a zombie and that's okay??? I mean that person is just as unpredictable as the dude taking swigs of Jack if we're talking about dangerous individuals.
SF doesn't enforce its laws:

 
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Oct 26, 2018
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SF doesn't enforce its laws:

WTF.

The Toronto TTC subway can have the occasional bum or guy playing a guitar looking for change, but I have never seen in life taking the TTC (I used to use it a lot, not really anymore though) seeing swaths of druggies passed out or injecting themselves like that video.

SF government has to get it's act together. Where the fuck is all those huge influxes of taxes being used? Isn't SF full og huge companies, huge income earners, huge property tax grabs? And they can't clean up subway tunnels?
 

Manus

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WTF.

The Toronto TTC subway can have the occasional bum or guy playing a guitar looking for change, but I have never seen in life taking the TTC (I used to use it a lot, not really anymore though) seeing swaths of druggies passed out or injecting themselves like that video.

SF government has to get it's act together. Where the fuck is all those huge influxes of taxes being used? Isn't SF full og huge companies, huge income earners, huge property tax grabs? And they can't clean up subway tunnels?
Well if you're like Fresno, they are offering money to gang members to stop shootings. I'm not even kidding.

 

autoduelist

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Those videos of the camps are crazy. What kind of person votes to allow this kind of stuff? Surely they know it's gonna encourage criminality and generally make the area unpleasant.
It's worse than that. There are groups advocating for various policies that only make the problem worse. For example, essentially forcing cops to turn a blind eye to crime in these camps because otherwise you're 'targeting' homeless.

Portland is a perfect example of how disastrous liberal policy on homelessness is. The ten year plan to end homelessness? Complete failure, more homeless after than before. The safe street sleeping program? Complete failure. Promising every homeless person shelter? Total failure, blown budgets, massive number of homeless moving to portland and city taxpayers literally paying for them to stay in motels because the shelters filled so quick.

Meanwhile, crime rates rise. Budgets are blown - well meaning programs for drug abuse and other clinics, for example, get overwhelmed. Trash. Added expenses for shelters, cleanup, policing.... a giant whirlpool of suck that only increases the number of homeless the more tax payer money you throw at it.
 
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Weiji

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I work in Seattle and I am just so frustrated. I walk by crazy homeless people 2-4 times per day. I see people shooting up in alleys. I can’t stand this place, why do people allow this? I DON’T UNDERSTAND.
 
Oct 26, 2018
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The problem with government handling social services is their best way of doing it is handing out money or social services. They always seem to have zero idea how to get down and out people to be productive on their own. Which is weird since governments are usually the biggest employer in a city.

You'd think with all the money, low unemployment, and seemingly endless opportunities for low skilled people to do something aside from sitting around is to try to clean them up as a first step (if that is possible assuming they aren't a total basket case), and then offer money or a simple government job. All governments offer subsidies to get companies to hire low skilled people or students. But if companies don't want to hire these kinds of people even with free government wage help, I don't get why the governments don't enforce able minded people to work at simple government jobs for wages.

It keeps them busy so they aren't sitting around all day, makes sure something is done in return and gets them something on the resume.

Even simple shit like trying to clean up parks, or pick up trash outside government buildings or anything that is an easy job to understand. There's always work to do and not every task is done to 100% perfection by existing workers. If the government wants to isolate them because they think maybe they are a little odd to have around the existing employees at the beginning, then have them work at government buildings where they can do something out of the limelight.

It's like the government is willing to "kind of help" people by giving them some money and saying now go get lost.

Maybe government doesn't trust these people enough to do work, so that's why the gov doesn't bother trying to employ them themselves for temp work.
 
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Weiji

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While I’m sure there are some legitimate cases of down and out people who would desire to work their way out of poverty. Those simple aren’t the vast majority of homeless people.

There are so many ways to keep yourself from becoming homeless in America that if you are you basically fall into three categories.

1) drug addict - no amount of money or compassion will help if you’re an addict who doesn’t want to change. And honestly it’s not even that likely to help if you do.

2) mentally unstable - again, no amount of mine or compassion can stop someone from being crazy. Although a very large amount of both can be used to separate them from society via prison or hospital.

3) by choice - this seems by far the smallest group. And has the greatest potential to escape homelessness. These people exist this way because modern social programs allow it and they don’t want any sort of responsibility. Often they start out young and slowly turn into #1. I am sure the vast majority would return to work and housing if social programs were removed. But hey, kill em with kindness instead, why bother with consequences and hard choices when you can virtue signal instead?

I’d say that’s 99.99% of the homeless population. Not an easy problem to solve and ironically one that gets worse the more money you add.
 

desertdroog

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I would love to see a restart of the WPA from the Roosevelt era to rebuild our infrastructure. Pay people a fair trade wage, empower them with a skillset and get them off the street.

I bet those who get a chance like that could not only stay off the streets, but you will see a boom in sole proprietorship for the trades.
 
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Breakage

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It's worse than that. There are groups advocating for various policies that only make the problem worse. For example, essentially forcing cops to turn a blind eye to crime in these camps because otherwise you're 'targeting' homeless.

Portland is a perfect example of how disastrous liberal policy on homelessness is. The ten year plan to end homelessness? Complete failure, more homeless after than before. The safe street sleeping program? Complete failure. Promising every homeless person shelter? Total failure, blown budgets, massive number of homeless moving to portland and city taxpayers literally paying for them to stay in motels because the shelters filled so quick.

Meanwhile, crime rates rise. Budgets are blown - well meaning programs for drug abuse and other clinics, for example, get overwhelmed. Trash. Added expenses for shelters, cleanup, policing.... a giant whirlpool of suck that only increases the number of homeless the more tax payer money you throw at it.
I watched the entire 29-minute video posted earlier in this thread. The scale is ridiculous -- it's a real eye opener for someone like me who lives outside the US.
I just find it incredible that people encourage this stuff. I mean, the people who advocate for the policies presumably have to navigate through these camps to go to work, leisure activities, shopping etc. And they are ok with that? Or do they tend to live away from the blocks where these camps exist and therefore do not directly experience the problems caused by this issue?
 
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Teletraan1

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Cities can always find buildings that can be turned into shelters. The problem is that these shelters have rules that people don't want to follow like no drugs so they choose street. Programs need to be set up in conjunction to shelters to assist kicking drug habits and provide a path to a normal life for these people. The people not willing to accept a hand up round them up and put them in jail. It is cheaper than what cities like SF spend per homeless person.
 

Mihos

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What is baffling to me, is they already qualify for free healthcare, welfare, food stamps, and in most cases, even housing and rent vouchers. That's not even including non-profit and things like SSI for mentally ill.

In many cases, these benefits outweigh any incentive to work... in others, they may not be taking advantage of what is already available. I think it was one of the dudes Obama brought up on stage talking about how he has no insurance, actually qualified for 3 different plans already.
 

ssolitare

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SF doesn't enforce its laws:

I know how this will end. It's gonna get so bad that SF is going to use the police to round up and clean up, and it's going to be a disaster. Of course, it's the cities fault the entire time with NIMBY and other things.

It's either that or anti homeless shelter advocacy groups get forced to submit.
 
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Saruhashi

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I watched the entire 29-minute video posted earlier in this thread. The scale is ridiculous -- it's a real eye opener for someone like me who lives outside the US.
I just find it incredible that people encourage this stuff. I mean, the people who advocate for the policies presumably have to navigate through these camps to go to work, leisure activities, shopping etc. And they are ok with that? Or do they tend to live away from the blocks where these camps exist and therefore do not directly experience the problems caused by this issue?
Same. Makes me think that places like Los Angeles and San Francisco have this amazing "Hollywood" public image but the reality is very far removed from that.

It's probably just likely that the people who encourage this stuff don't, and won't, actually have to deal with it so they don't really care.

If you started rounding up all the homeless there and bused them to rich neighborhoods where they could go door to door asking for some money, or a spare room to spend the night or even a spot on their property to put up a tent and have a safe nights sleep? The rich would shut that shit down instantly.
 

rorepmE

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Same. Makes me think that places like Los Angeles and San Francisco have this amazing "Hollywood" public image but the reality is very far removed from that.

It's probably just likely that the people who encourage this stuff don't, and won't, actually have to deal with it so they don't really care.

If you started rounding up all the homeless there and bused them to rich neighborhoods where they could go door to door asking for some money, or a spare room to spend the night or even a spot on their property to put up a tent and have a safe nights sleep? The rich would shut that shit down instantly.
You don't see any tents popping up on Rodeo Drive.

Gee I wonder why...?
 

NahaNago

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I never said it was only about money.

But you have to resolve it some how. That's the solution, regardless if you like it or not.
That isn't a solution all you said was create a social assistance program to help homelessness. That would be like me saying the solution for the immigration problem would be a to create an immigration assistance program.
 
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dragonfart28

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That isn't a solution all you said was create a social assistance program to help homelessness. That would be like me saying the solution for the immigration problem would be a to create an immigration assistance program.
Yes, and?

Is the idea of a program a novel concept for you guys?
 
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NahaNago

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Yes, and?

Is the idea of a program a novel concept for you guys?
You gave a child like simplistic answer to a massive problem. So you create a program, but how exactly is the program suppose to tackle the issue is what everyone would like to know.
 

HeresJohnny

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I never said it was only about money.

But you have to resolve it some how. That's the solution, regardless if you like it or not.
Making laws that allow free needles, sidewalk tenements, and pooping in the streets seem to be going the opposite direction.
 

dragonfart28

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You gave a child like simplistic answer to a massive problem. So you create a program, but how exactly is the program suppose to tackle the issue is what everyone would like to know.
Dunno, but that's the starting point and some places already manage it well, so emulate them.
 

Super Mario

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I would love to see a restart of the WPA from the Roosevelt era to rebuild our infrastructure. Pay people a fair trade wage, empower them with a skillset and get them off the street.

I bet those who get a chance like that could not only stay off the streets, but you will see a boom in sole proprietorship for the trades.
Brilliant idea. I wonder why no one has ever tried to get them to work before?

This is how nearly every social program ends. In failure. It's quite easy to not be homeless. Go be homeless somewhere else.
 

Rentahamster

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It's quite easy to not be homeless.
You are addicted to meth, have a mild case of schizophrenia, have zero dollars in assets, are in debt, have no friends or family who wants anything to do with you anymore, and you're a redhead.

How is easy is it to not be homeless in that situation?
 

pennythots

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You are addicted to meth, have a mild case of schizophrenia, have zero dollars in assets, are in debt, have no friends or family who wants anything to do with you anymore, and you're a redhead.

How is easy is it to not be homeless in that situation?
dye your hair obviously.
 
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Kenpachii

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You are addicted to meth, have a mild case of schizophrenia, have zero dollars in assets, are in debt, have no friends or family who wants anything to do with you anymore, and you're a redhead.

How is easy is it to not be homeless in that situation?
That's why you have social structures going.

If the guy is on drugs, he gets therapy he gets somebody of the government assigned towards him that oversee's his financials and makes deals with his dept departments. They rent a house for him and give him enough money to buy food for. He needs to show up every month to talk about his financials and ways to go forwards. After 3 years if his dept is so big he will be rid of it and he will get a steady income in order to push himself forwards and move forwards. He won't get more then 20 bucks to eat from for a week. and that's it.

if he decides to not show up, police will be involved and he will get warmings until they lock him up or put him into rehabilitation cent rums. If he has mental problems because of brain damage he will be checkt out and they will see what to do with him or basically put him for life long on unemployment and a basic income that barely gets him by. But atleast gets him off the streets.

I have yet to see a single homeless person over here. The people that are "homeless" all got a house to sit in and all got enough to get by. However they have zero luxery stuff because they can't pay for it. There kids get free entrances towards water parks and clubs because they can't help there got born with those parents so they are not left out.

It gets really old if you sit in that situation. And government will check you out every month and ever 2 weeks or whatever and make a entire profile of you and how to help you out individually. Most of these people end up in call centrums or other low paying jobs that the government oversee's and subsidizes heavily in order to push these people back into the market again.

Just giving a blank check with money is absolutely idiotic. Building more homeless shelters is stupid as hell and does nothing.

Some people simple are not capable to look after themselves as they grow up or ended up in a bad situation. It's not your job as human being to kick them further down the rabbit hole. Its your job to help them further and push them forwards. Basically they get a artificial parent that looks over them.

If i tommorow get screwed financially, fired and i have nobody to catch me up. I sign up at the government and they will help me out until i am on my feet again.

That city looks like, they just throw you in a garbage bin and say, fuck off when you are in a rough spot. It's disgusting.
 
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KINGMOKU

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LA article. Solid read, worth the time.
Interesting read for sure.

In the article is talks about a 38 year old guy from Hawaii that's been homeless for 8months, implying he came to L.A. and is now homeless.

He traveled to be homeless? Why not go back home?

I am often vexed by homelessness, and a real solution to it. A real change needs to be made. Something tough, and someway of weeding out the those who are lazy, those who are addicts, those who are mentally I'll, e.t.c.

Maybe forced job seeking, or constant movement. Not allowed to put up tents period.

I dont know. One thing I do know is I got a laugh out of people in the article talking of fines over the planters, and fences but homeless people and drugs prostitution e.t.c
Everywhere.

Wierd, and seemingly hopeless honestly.
 
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autoduelist

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I am often vexed by homelessness, and a real solution to it. A real change needs to be made. Something tough, and someway of weeding out the those who are lazy, those who are addicts, those who are mentally I'll, e.t.c.
The longer we let it fester, the worse the solution will be, i can tell you that.

The answer we used to have is 'move along' for the life long traveler, prison for the addicts/criminals, and asylums for the mentally insane.

It wasn't perfect, but it doesn't take many photos to realize neither is what we are doing now,