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[Eusis]

Is that the first confirmation we've had the next Mass Effect is 100% current gen only?

It's more like very heavy implication, but honestly I think they'll be kind of nuts putting anything holiday season 2015+ on PS3/360 at this point if it's not a low end indie or Japanese title (and even then!), seems sales are very heavily PS4/XB1 leaning rather than 360/PS3.

... Still seems awkward to use current gen to me. Probably because few every actually USED it in this context in prior generations, more about current gen trends or whatever.

 

[HP_Wuvcraft]

so they're not turning ME into a weird combination of MMO and F2P mobile game design

alert EatChildren

I love that now free DLC equals F2P.

Anything to continue the hate train, I guess.

 

[ThoseDeafMutes]

I love that now free DLC equals F2P.

Anything to continue the hate train, I guess.

He's not talking about DLC, he's talking about DAI quest designs. I.e. metagame missions with real-world timers. The DA series has always felt a bit like an offline MMO to be honest.

 

[Lord of Castamere]

I just hope the characters continue to improve (like DAI) but the loyalty missions return in full force.

The loyalty missions were extremely short in DAI. If they're going to be short then there needs to be more per character. Like 3 per.

 

[Astrates]

I'm glad it won't be used as a template but I have no issue with them taking pointers from DA:I. I personally think it's a magnificent game, I've never been bored playing it, even the fetch quests feel well integrated in the most part.

The one thing I want them to take from DA:I is the level design. Each area is beautifully crafted with good transition between parts of each area. I love all the little paths everywhere that just pull you on to leaving the main road.

I do agree though I'd like more story line quests as they're are only a handful in DA:I and ME2.

I can't wait for an exploration based ME. I've said before I'd love a Star Trek Voyager influenced game. One single ship lost out in uncharted space. Surviving only by the allies you make on the move against some new evil. Perfection.

 

[Dark_castle]

What what what?!!?!?

Why is your name all black?

What did I miss!?

You were my favorite mod on GAF!

Demodded, not denutted.

 

[Facism]

oh thank god.

 

[Respawn]

Not a fan of ME going for larger open areas for the Mako.

1. I don't want fetch quests scattered everywhere
2. ME has always done well with highly focused, detailed areas.
3. I'm just getting tired of open world RPGs.

Thank you.

 

[MartyStu]

Probably a good idea. While not a bad game, there is very little unique to DA:I that I think should be reused.

Especially questing.

Though to be fair, DA:I inherited most of that mess from ME1.

I'm glad it won't be used as a template but I have no issue with them taking pointers from DA:I. I personally think it's a magnificent game, I've never been bored playing it, even the fetch quests feel well integrated in the most part.

The one thing I want them to take from DA:I is the level design. Each area is beautifully crafted with good transition between parts of each area. I love all the little paths everywhere that just pull you on to leaving the main road.

I do agree though I'd like more story line quests as they're are only a handful in DA:I and ME2.

I can't wait for an exploration based ME. I've said before I'd love a Star Trek Voyager influenced game. One single ship lost out in uncharted space. Surviving only by the allies you make on the move against some new evil. Perfection.

If each area had been 1/3 to 1/2 smaller, I think I might agree to this.

As it stands, the areas are simply much too hollow.

 

[Phat Michael]

Not a fan of ME going for larger open areas for the Mako.

1. I don't want fetch quests scattered everywhere
2. ME has always done well with highly focused, detailed areas.
3. I'm just getting tired of open world RPGs.

I agree with EVERY point here. I love how ME2/3 was organised. I Love the tightly knit cities, dingy nightclubs and bars. I Loved the citadel.

I didnt love exploring planets for no reason or driving around aimlessly.

I also hate open world RPGs with "hundreds of hours" of meaningless fetch quests.

If they do it right, ME4 has the chance to not only be the best game ever, but also the best multiplayer experience ever.

ME3 multi was absolutely incredible. I had 1000+ hours into that im sure, i cant wait for the new one and how great it is going to be. The level of support bioware gave to that for free was astounding.

 

[Marvel]

*sigh of relief*

 

[Astrates]

Probably a good idea. While not a bad game, there is very little unique to DA:I that I think should be reused.

Especially questing.

Though to be fair, DA:I inherited most of that mess from ME1.




If each area had been 1/3 to 1/2 smaller, I think I might agree to this.

As it stands, the areas are simply much to hollow.

I found them enjoyable. I spent 20 hours alone in the Hinterlands just exploring, following paths this way and that. Loved it all.

 

[ElFly]

That wasn't the concern people had (myself not included). People were get the feeling the "fetch quests" and overall design of DAI would carry over exactly into the new ME which just won't be the case.

Oh I can see that.

 

[kitschbeam]

aah this is a good news. I hope the next ME will be as awesome as the trilogy

 

[The_Hitcher89]

Thank fuck for that.


On both counts.

 

[Hibiki Kurosawa]

This is very good to hear! And still super glad the Mako is back! Can't wait to hear and finally SEE some stuff on the new Mass Effect. Presumably at E3?

 

[Hyperzephyrian]

well it would be pretty weird to have mages and magical shit on mass effect

What exactly do you think biotics are?

 

[a secret-boss]

But there will be a home base and a map where u can go anywhere and do side missions.

I'm guessing there will be a sort-of War table

 

[Melchiah]

ME3 multi was absolutely incredible. I had 1000+ hours into that im sure, i cant wait for the new one and how great it is going to be. The level of support bioware gave to that for free was astounding.

I'm eagerly waiting for the ME4 MP, but at the same time I'm worried they'll do the same as with DA:I's MP portion, and make the areas too large now that the hardware allows them to do so. I'd rather have smaller tactical areas like ME3 had, not running contests from one end to another like in DA:I and Warframe.

 

[erawsd]

Where did Aaryn mention anything about horses in space? Have no idea what made you write that lol. He is clearly talking about the core design of the game.

I said that because saying (paraphrasing) "Hey, we have the Mako in this game and that has nothing to do with DA!" is a completely useless response. I don't believe anyone is saying that the next Mass Effect will be identical to DA:I or copy gameplay mechanics. The concern is more about about the general design philosophy than any specifics.

Do developers not learn from the past many times? They've been clear on what was wrong with the Mako in the past. It looks very fun to use at least in the prototype footage.

I'm not talking about the Mako in the past. Frankly, I have not played ME in so long that I barely remember anything about the original Mako -- though I do recall it being really lame. The point of that statement is to reinforce the above point and illustrate how the Mako could be corrupted by the DA:I design philosophy.

 

[shinobi602]

I said that because saying (paraphrasing) "Hey, we have the Mako in this game and that has nothing to do with DA!" is a completely useless response. I don't believe anyone is saying that the next Mass Effect will be identical to DA:I or copy gameplay mechanics. The concern is more about about the general design philosophy than any specifics.

But that's exactly what Aaryn's talking about. All Bioware games over the past decade have implemented somewhat similar formulas in core design. Things like recruiting characters, dialogue, relationships, etc have drawn off similar base design, that's not something new and it's not a bad thing. A large number of people were worried about DAI's quest design, or what some call DAI an "offline MMO" (empty "fetch quests") would carry over directly into the new ME since they believe Bioware will view its critical reception as a success, which simply isn't the case is what Aaryn's trying to get at.

I'm not talking about the Mako in the past. Frankly, I have not played ME in so long that I barely remember anything about the original Mako -- though I do recall it being really lame. The point of that statement is to reinforce the above point and illustrate how the Mako could be corrupted by the DA:I design philosophy.

There's a large number of ME fans who have clamored for the return of the Mako since the original game. There shouldn't be any reason to expect its implementation in the new game is a result of any specific design element from DAI...all Bioware needs to do is make explorable planets like the original but fill them with interesting things to do and it'll be worthwhile, that's it really.

 

[prag16]

all Bioware needs to do is make explorable planets like the original but fill them with interesting things to do and it'll be worthwhile, that's it really.

Well, if the fear is that their idea of "fill them with interesting things to do" ends up aligned with the DA:I idea of "interesting things to do", which a lot of people didn't find very interesting (myself included; definitely liked the game a lot, kind of, but a TON of superfluous boring filler). So I can kind of see why some people may still be concerned, even after Aaryn's comments. Though for me personally, his comments did help.

 

[Daemul]

All I ever used to do in Mass Effect 1 was to land on the random planet and head straight to the side quest area. I never went to explore and collect all those minerals, writings, insignia's and disks, ain't nobody got time for that shit. Exploration in ME1 was worse than the combat, and boy oh boy, was the combat bad.

all Bioware needs to do is make explorable planets like the original but fill them with interesting things to do and it'll be worthwhile, that's it really.

You know, I hear this all the time with open world games, and only a handful ever live up to the promise.

 

[prag16]

You know, I hear this all the time with open world games, and only a handful ever live up to the promise.

Yeah, that's the thing. I'm in the minority, but the GTA games bore me to tears. People clamor for more "detail" in GTA6 in the form of having EVERY building be enterable, etc. I'm sorry but that sounds awful. There's no way in hell they could make all that remotely interesting, if GTA5 was already boring as fuck.

I'm also in the minority in that I LIKED the sidequest model in ME3. The eavesdrop system felt a lot less laborious and jarring than a system of meticulously walking up to every NPC to initiate conversations, then going off on goose chases as a result. Also felt it fit in better with the sense of urgency than a conventional RPG side quest system would have.

You're right though... for a great many games, that phrase "interesting things to do" (or close variations) comes up a lot, and it almost never delivers.

But as I said, Flynn's comments DID make me feel better; he emphasized addressing what made the mako boring in ME1 as the priority, NOT making it a DA:I clone.

 

[SamuelSupreme]

I wouldn't take the statement so literally as to mean "BioWare series have absolutely no influence on each other.", but rather to mean they're going to put the design goals of each franchise first and foremost when making the next game in that franchise, and then look to other games they and other studios make for additional influences and lessons to learn on what to and what not to do.

The WRPG genre in general consists of nigh 100% open worlds now, especially on the AAA scale. I don't think it's likely you will see another game without one any time soon.

Or, to make this more explicit, they're using the same technology as Dragon Age so it's safe to assume they have things like a similar character creator. They also are going to look at what people did and didn't like with Dragon Age's approach to open worlds to help inform what they do with their own open worlds instead of sticking their head in the sand and going "I CAN LEARN NOTHING FROM OTHER THINGS." like crazy people, especially given they share a lot of lower and mid level staff.

The people who make multiplayer for their games also share a lot of the same staff and very clearly take lessons from product to product.

However, similarly, they're not going to be Ubisoft and say "Every game must have capturable garrisons and parkour and stealth kills and 3000 collectibles because it got us to 10+ million sales in one game." They mentioned that Mass Effect won't have selectable races for example because they seem to feel that the series is about playing a human.

They need to put the ability to have Dreadlocks in their character creator

 

[bathsalts]

Sorry Bioware, simply can't trust you anymore. Between the outright lies like Dragon Age Inq. being made for PC gamers to just the complete dumbing down of gameplay systems. I know they'll never achieve anything like Baldur's Gate 2 again but its still sad because their stuff used to be day one purchases I generally looked forward too, now I have to to wait for more discerning reviews. I fully expect climbable radio towers in the next ME.

 

[Sendero]

I distinctly remember member(s) of DA:I saying that their game would be a template for incoming Bioware games, so good to know each series will retain their own way of doing things (not that I needed clarification anyway).

They will still have a tons of thing in common, though. I assume they will reuse the DA: Keeper infrastructure at least. So no more excuses about endings where your decisions have no major impact. Let's hope they ditch the absolutely horrendous sidequests (to less, more complex ones), and keep the multiplayer as a separated element (with minimum microtransactions).

 

[erawsd]

But that's exactly what Aaryn's talking about. All Bioware games over the past decade have implemented somewhat similar formulas in core design. Things like recruiting characters, dialogue, relationships, etc have drawn off similar base design, that's not something new and it's not a bad thing. A large number of people were worried about DAI's quest design, or what some call DAI an "offline MMO" (empty "fetch quests") would carry over directly into the new ME since they believe Bioware will view its critical reception as a success, which simply isn't the case is what Aaryn's trying to get at.

We all know that, where do you think the concern comes from? Drawing off a "base design" isn't inherently a bad thing, but it absolutely can be a bad thing. I'm not going to make a sweeping statement, but a number of fans do not appreciate much of the ME dna that spilled onto DA. Its fine though because they reached back into the DA history and brought back tactical mode, right?

There's a large number of ME fans who have clamored for the return of the Mako since the original game. There shouldn't be any reason to expect its implementation in the new game is a result of any specific design element from DAI...all Bioware needs to do is make explorable planets like the original but fill them with interesting things to do and it'll be worthwhile, that's it really.

I didn't say that it was the result of any specific design element from DA. I said that it can easily become a vehicle (intended) for those design elements. Sure, that is "all they need to do"... and Im going to wait and see if they can.

 

[shinobi602]

Well, if the fear is that their idea of "fill them with interesting things to do" ends up aligned with the DA:I idea of "interesting things to do", which a lot of people didn't find very interesting (myself included; definitely liked the game a lot, kind of, but a TON of superfluous boring filler). So I can kind of see why some people may still be concerned, even after Aaryn's comments. Though for me personally, his comments did help.

I agree, this is specifically why Aaryn decided to comment.