Sir Abacus
Member
Also, the next expansion is inferred to be a level cap of 100 due to the heirloom items dropping off Garrosh.
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Blizzard Trademarks The Dark Below [Hoax, anyone can register trademarks as Blizzard]
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davepoobond
you can't put a price on sparks
Deepholm, but yeah, "inside the Maelstrom" has already been seen in Cata.
Deepholm
SillyEskimo
Member
I loved my initial play through. It was also fun to collect herbs there for some reason too, probbaly because it was so quiet. The quests were some of the best in Cata IMO. Having heaped all that praise on the zone, I've hated it on every character since and avoid it completely. It was great when it released though. I loved the story about how you end up there.
Do not even pretend that the change to talent trees has somehow improved the game, the end result is exactly the same as it was back then: cookie cutter builds still exist, they always will exist. And its not a bad thing, people who want to seriously raid or seriously PvP want to optimize, so let them? Why was this ever a issue to begin with?
So what was lost? The little customization the game had, you had 1 talent point to look forward to every time you leveled, and you could put your talents anywhere as you leveled, since it was easy and did not require the optimal build.
Now you make 6 choices from level 1 to 90, nothing was gained from this overhaul, and some part of the game were even lost. So really, they screwed around with something that was not broken in the first place, waste of their own resources.
D2 has vastly more builds with talent trees than D3 has with a similar "Pick 6 abilities you like, EXCITE!" type system, people still find optimal cookie cutter builds no matter what system you have in place.
At the end of the day, they took out what little customization the player had, add in the increased homogenization with the classes and the game feels smaller in scope, despite having more content, there is less identity amongst players and their characters than ever before. The only real difference between my Mage and your Mage might be the gear, *might* because if we both do the same thing, we likely have very very very similar characters
But whatever, they wont change it back, since that would require even more work and the end result, like i said, would still be the same. Still sucks, there might be a better system out there, but what they did with WoW and D3 is not better than the talent trees they had in old WoW and D2.
So what was lost? The little customization the game had, you had 1 talent point to look forward to every time you leveled, and you could put your talents anywhere as you leveled, since it was easy and did not require the optimal build.
Now you make 6 choices from level 1 to 90, nothing was gained from this overhaul, and some part of the game were even lost. So really, they screwed around with something that was not broken in the first place, waste of their own resources.
D2 has vastly more builds with talent trees than D3 has with a similar "Pick 6 abilities you like, EXCITE!" type system, people still find optimal cookie cutter builds no matter what system you have in place.
At the end of the day, they took out what little customization the player had, add in the increased homogenization with the classes and the game feels smaller in scope, despite having more content, there is less identity amongst players and their characters than ever before. The only real difference between my Mage and your Mage might be the gear, *might* because if we both do the same thing, we likely have very very very similar characters
But whatever, they wont change it back, since that would require even more work and the end result, like i said, would still be the same. Still sucks, there might be a better system out there, but what they did with WoW and D3 is not better than the talent trees they had in old WoW and D2.
Anyone remember that WoW expansion pack leaked listing a long time ago about what each expansion would be based around? Its been right so far.. and with this it looks like its right on track to be about the twisting nether and sargeras / burning legion.
EDIT here we go:
Draenor Set
Azuremyst Isle - 1 to 10
Bloodmyrk Isle - 10 to 20
Eversong Forest - 1 to 10
Quel'thalas - 10 to 20
Hellfire Peninsula - 58 to 62
Zangarmarsh - 60 to 64
Terokkar Forest - 61 to 65
The Deadlands - 63 to 67
Nagrand - 64 to 68
Blade's Edge Mountains - 66 to 70
Netherstorm - 67 to 70
Shadowmoon Valley - 69 to 70
Northrend Set
Borean Tundra - 67 to 70
Howling Fjord - 67 to 70
Dragonblight - 69 to 72
Grizzly Hills - 70 to 73
Crystalsong Forest - 72 to 75
Zul'drak - 73 to 76
Sholazar Basin - 75 to 79
Storm Peaks - 76 to 80
Icecrown Glacier - 78 to 80
Maelstrom Set
Gilneas - 77 to 80
Grim Batol - 78 to 81
Kul Tiras - 79 to 82
Kezan - 81 to 86
Tel Abim - 83 to 85
Zandalar - 84 to 87
Plunder Isle - 86 to 88
The Broken Isles - 87 to 90
The Maelstrom - 89 to 90
Plane Set
Pandaria - 1 to 10
Hiji - 10 to 20
Wolfenhold - 1 to 10
Xorothian Plains - 10 to 20
The Green Lands - 88 to 91
The Dying Paradise - 91 to 94
The Emerald Nightmare - 94 to 97
The Eye of Ysera - 97 to 100
Deephome - 88 to 91
Skywall - 91 to 94
The Abyssal Maw - 94 to 97
The Firelands - 97 to 100
Legion Set
K'aresh - 96 to 99
Argus Meadowlands - 97 to 100
Mac'Aree - 99 to 100
Maw of Oblivion - 100+
The Burning Citadel - 100+++
EDIT here we go:
Draenor Set
Azuremyst Isle - 1 to 10
Bloodmyrk Isle - 10 to 20
Eversong Forest - 1 to 10
Quel'thalas - 10 to 20
Hellfire Peninsula - 58 to 62
Zangarmarsh - 60 to 64
Terokkar Forest - 61 to 65
The Deadlands - 63 to 67
Nagrand - 64 to 68
Blade's Edge Mountains - 66 to 70
Netherstorm - 67 to 70
Shadowmoon Valley - 69 to 70
Northrend Set
Borean Tundra - 67 to 70
Howling Fjord - 67 to 70
Dragonblight - 69 to 72
Grizzly Hills - 70 to 73
Crystalsong Forest - 72 to 75
Zul'drak - 73 to 76
Sholazar Basin - 75 to 79
Storm Peaks - 76 to 80
Icecrown Glacier - 78 to 80
Maelstrom Set
Gilneas - 77 to 80
Grim Batol - 78 to 81
Kul Tiras - 79 to 82
Kezan - 81 to 86
Tel Abim - 83 to 85
Zandalar - 84 to 87
Plunder Isle - 86 to 88
The Broken Isles - 87 to 90
The Maelstrom - 89 to 90
Plane Set
Pandaria - 1 to 10
Hiji - 10 to 20
Wolfenhold - 1 to 10
Xorothian Plains - 10 to 20
The Green Lands - 88 to 91
The Dying Paradise - 91 to 94
The Emerald Nightmare - 94 to 97
The Eye of Ysera - 97 to 100
Deephome - 88 to 91
Skywall - 91 to 94
The Abyssal Maw - 94 to 97
The Firelands - 97 to 100
Legion Set
K'aresh - 96 to 99
Argus Meadowlands - 97 to 100
Mac'Aree - 99 to 100
Maw of Oblivion - 100+
The Burning Citadel - 100+++
SargerusBR
I love Pokken!
Interesting, this is from Ra-den's dialogue in the Throne of Thunder raid:
"You are powerful, more powerful than he was, even... perhaps you are right. Perhaps there is still hope.
But there is a yawning chasm of darkness beneath you mortals, vast, endless, and all consuming. I do not believe that you can correct this doomed course.
But you have earned the right to try. Farewell."
http://wowpedia.org/Ra-den
"You are powerful, more powerful than he was, even... perhaps you are right. Perhaps there is still hope.
But there is a yawning chasm of darkness beneath you mortals, vast, endless, and all consuming. I do not believe that you can correct this doomed course.
But you have earned the right to try. Farewell."
http://wowpedia.org/Ra-den
I don't think the Maelstrom necessarily leads to Deepholm. It was created back when the Well of Eternity collapsed, whereas the Deepholm connection came when Deathwing caused the Cataclysm and brought the Elemental Planes closer to Azeroth. There's probably some angle they could work to take us to Nazjatar instead, maybe now that DW has been defeated and the World Pillar is fixed Deepholm will start drifting away from Azeroth again.
That stopped being right the second Cata was announced.
There are quite a few things off with some of the later ones so this has gotten less accurate over time.
Trickster
Member
The name would have made sense way before MoP even existed as well.
At this point people will hate on blizzard for anything really. And I can definitely understand why people hate blizzard these days. But this tittle would make perfect sense for a wow expansion based on one or more old gods.
Wasn't that covered in the maelstrom set?
This expac would redeem Blizzard for me if it was about the Old God under Tirisfal. Could involve Tirion and Sylvanas story arc with the return of Turalyon.
Turalyon a raid boss incoming
Trickster
Member
It would certainly be more excitting than MoP, which outside of the raids and frequency of content patches was the worst expansion ever as far as I'm concerned. Though I honestly think most people are so "tired" of wow at this point, that even if they start playing when the new expansion comes out. People will drop the game again extremely quickly. Because the moment the excitement of new zones, battlegrounds and dungeons is over. The game will still be about doing what people have been doing for close to a decade now.
Ricerocket
Member
I really want to hear about a D3 expansion and see if Blizzard can completely change itemization/stats around for the game. An expansion is the perfect time to do it.
I remember being surprised when a blurb was added about him in the loading screen tips earlier in the year.
That's what frustrates me about Blizzard. They have so many story arcs that have been ongoing for over a decade and yet they just add completely new and irrelevant lore with MoP. The Horde/Alliance war means nothing if your just fighting over new places that hold no meaning or value to you or the story.
Take back Lordaeron!!!
I think blizzard is talking loot 2.0 patch for diablo 3 @ gamescom and they will announce the new d3 expansion at blizzcon this year.
Since early 2011, my entire Blizzard experience has been a month of Cataclysm, 15-20 hours of the Diablo 3 beta, and...that's it. It's been years since I've been really gripped by a Blizzard game.
Yet I'm seriously excited for BlizzCon. WoW expansions are fascinating creatures, and I'm hoping the D3 expansion will convince me to finally pick up the game (much like Lord of Destruction did for D2). It's hard to care very much about Blizzard All-Stars when MOBAs are already crowded with solid options, but I'm curious about it; and I'll almost definitely be playing Hearthstone, a card game that seems ridiculously easy to get into. Too bad it seems unlikely we'll hear anything about Titan, though.
With "The Dark Below," it seems WoW is going back to having a central enemy. It most likely has to do with one of three different settings, all of which people will probably have more positive knee-jerk reactions to than MoP.
Yet I'm seriously excited for BlizzCon. WoW expansions are fascinating creatures, and I'm hoping the D3 expansion will convince me to finally pick up the game (much like Lord of Destruction did for D2). It's hard to care very much about Blizzard All-Stars when MOBAs are already crowded with solid options, but I'm curious about it; and I'll almost definitely be playing Hearthstone, a card game that seems ridiculously easy to get into. Too bad it seems unlikely we'll hear anything about Titan, though.
With "The Dark Below," it seems WoW is going back to having a central enemy. It most likely has to do with one of three different settings, all of which people will probably have more positive knee-jerk reactions to than MoP.
Well, Metzen already confirmed Allieria and Turalyon were coming back in the next xpac.
No. Gilneas is the worgen starter zone, Grim Batol is a dungeon, and the Maelstrom is a non-leveling zone. The rest of the expansion was the elemental planes, mostly as dungeons, or conjured out of thin air. And then we know for a fact that they changed their plans for what they were going to do after Cata and went for MoP's content instead.
The whole thing is fake and always has been.
DeadByDawn
Banned
maniac-kun
Member
Hero levels. The legend says when you reach 100 you are given a hero quest and you turn you character into a hero class and gain hero levels from that point on.
This list was made before the DK was introduced as a hero class. But that was the idea back then.
davepoobond
you can't put a price on sparks
i'm not saying it "improved the game" proper. I'm saying its less annoying now since we do the same shit anyway.
why was clicking 60 times to do the same thing as the next guy important to you? cookie cutter builds exist now just as they did then, except now we have to click less to make them.
the false sense of optimizing didn't make the game better. it may have fooled you into thinking that you were doing something "cool and fun" with your talent trees, but you really weren't.
it wasn't customization. customization is making something that is undeniably yours. millions of other people were able to click the same little square in the talent tree as you did.
Transmog = customization
Old talent tree = "choice"
the only thing that was lost was gaining something from each level. now we have no use for as many levels because we don't earn a talent point each level. we may as well go back down to level 10 at this point. obviously that's not going to happen, though.
::shrug:: you say something was lost, i say something was simplified. you weren't making 60 choices, you were making maybe 3 or 4, and if you chose wrong it was wrong.
at least this way you can make a choice and it can be "useful" most of the time or at least let you play how you want to play. the glyph system is essentially the same as the talent system now, too, so you can consider glyphs as part of that talent choice matrix.
i dont think they're changing it at this point. the only thing i can see is if they entirely dump individual specs all together, and only had classes with you being able to choose particular abilities that made you a "custom" class.
SargerusBR
I love Pokken!
Considering that TITAN is back to the drawing board and most of it's dev team were reallocated, i can see WoW getting expansions for the upcoming 5 years from now.
When they resolve this thing with Sylvanas, I hope they go the corrupted by the Old God under Tirisfal route instead of her becoming the Lich Queen.
Sax Russel
Banned
I was just about to post this. Thank you <3
That list is as bad as warlock beta leather!
Time to put the lorelol cap on- I would have thought blizz would save the final Burning Legion confrontation for an Argus expansion? I could see this being the lead in expansion with a focus on a final showdown with both Azshara and the old gods, who have ties together, beneath Azeroth. Killing off all the old gods threatens the stability of the planet per established lore and, boom the titans step in to hold everything together in exchange for Azeroth's heroes going to Argus and dealing with the Legion once and for all. Ending the legion and moving to Argus after Azeroth's collapse would be a perfect finale and reset point for any future Warcraft properties they wished to do after the mmo.
Trickster
Member
That's not so much Blizzard as a whole, as it is one man single handedly fucking up the stories in all blizzard games. How Metzen manages to retain the power within the company that he has is simply beyond me. Most of the lore being put into blizzard games at this point could easily be mistaken for fanfic drivel, written by a 15 year old. It's frustrating as hell.
If that's true for WoW lore and it still turns out to be the title of the Diablo III expansion, that would be some of the most legendary trolling of a fan base of all time.
Trickster
Member
With Metzen around I wouldn't rule out anything with regards to lore...
There are good odds that once we clean this up, we'll be butting heads with the titans.
Hmm fake or not, it seems he was spot on about a lot of stuff though.
Given the nature of how content has progressed through Cataclysm and Pandaria, I'm not sure if I'd come back for the expansion. I'm kinda waiting to see if Flex Raids are the final nail in the coffin to traditional raiding.
That said, this is interesting. "The Dark Below" is more or less what Hell was described like in the original Warcraft....
That said, this is interesting. "The Dark Below" is more or less what Hell was described like in the original Warcraft....
It was a made up list to begin with that someone pretended they got in F&F vanilla. It's a curiosity and shouldn't be taken as anything more.
More than 100 unless they level squish or institute paragon. EQ's on their 19th or so expac, WoW's not going anywhere.
Agreed. The old trees were simply an illusion of choice. You picked one of the right cookie cutter specs or you made your character wrong. I don't find the choice of being persistently in error to be a particularly compelling game play mechanic.
maniac-kun
Member
Sounds like a fun place to be for a warlock.
Whats to say this (possibly being a burning legion expansion) would be the final confrontation with them? Hell we have yet to actually defeat Kil'Jaeden for real (not just shoving him back down a portal), and he seems like the perfect character to be the big bad of a Burning Legion themed expansion.
A Serious Man
Member
I'm still waiting for the underground Nerubian zone I was promised in WotLK at Blizzcon 07.
DeadByDawn
Banned
More fun for Demon Hunters, man.
I really want the Demon Hunter class, preferably being a hero class. It's what I would purchase the expansion and resubscribe for on day one.
I'm not sure what the difference would be. Lich Queen or corruption, she will never be "good" again. Whatever she becomes, I hope its because she wills it to be so, and not because of an outside force.
SargerusBR
I love Pokken!
All this chat about Sylvanas reminds me that we still need to see the conclusion of the Thassarian/Koltira storyline 
Sax Russel
Banned
From http://www.ownedcore.com/forums/wor...t-exploration/316305-preview-development.html
(tldr: a dev map that was accidentally included in one of the WotLK PTR builds)
You know that's not how it works.
Everything is corruption. Corruption encompasses all.
You too shall be corrupted.