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Bloomberg: New Switch to feature DLSS and more

Sub Boss

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Mar 6, 2013
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Because I don’t want another console that is years behind gaming technology on the day of release? The Switch has suffered greatly because of its lack of power. That is the reason we are getting this update to begin with. On top of that the PS5 has far more advanced, and better utilized, tech in its controller as well. Like, Nintendo doesn’t even have that claim anymore. The joycons are terrible controllers. Full stop. And if you want a controller that isn’t shit you have to spend $60 more on a Pro controller whereas $400 will get you a PS5 console and the controller included in that price.
Dude, its just a $300 tablet that can play on TV.

But, if these rumors are true, with this DLSS and OLED Nintendo is taking a huge step forward in image quality, they are using brand new tech to make their games outpout resolution look much higher than PS4ONE could do, its impressive because again its just a tablet we are talking about.

going from 360p in Xenoblade and other games to 720 OLED and '4K docked at little cost in rendering is HUGE and will be a revelation, the fact that iq advanced so much in a Pro revision is exciting news for Nintendo fans because they always been far behind in the resolution game.

Edit:i don't think the Switch has 'suffered' due to lack of power at all, its success is insane😁sorry but a more powerful Nintendo home console would be shit and not attract people at all, the hybrid model is essential to its popularity and success

yeah the Switch is breaking sales records but it suffers so much! POOR thing!!!😢🤧
 
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Sub Boss

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Mar 6, 2013
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I just want so badly for this to be true.

I'm more scared than ever that the rumors are way off.
The coolest thing is that DLSS will stay for the future as well

Imagine Switch 2 being 4k ready, not needing that many resources going to pushing the screen resolution and instead going to prettier graphics and framerate without sacrificing image quality it almost sounds too good to be true 🤤
 
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Azelover

Titanic was called the Ship of Dreams, and it was. It really was.
Dec 3, 2004
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I just want so badly for this to be true.

I'm more scared than ever that the rumors are way off.
Yeah, it's getting more ridiculous each day. I remember the dreaded times of WiiHD.

The silence suggests that something is indeed up, but until they announce it properly, it's gonna be this torturous speculation. Most which is probably inaccurate.
 
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Ryu Kaiba

Member
Sep 12, 2018
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This exactly. Gonna be a 3ds>new3ds type upgrade

That twite looks like fanboy wet dream.
Its Nintendo we talking about. You will get an overpriced weak ass machine
it's not Nintendo It's Nvidia we're talking about and putting DLSS in a mainstream gaming console is a fantastic move for them of course they would. I have a video from digital foundry from over a year ago talking about how Nvidia was prepping for this, when I find it i'll post it in this thread.
 
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Ryu Kaiba

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Sep 12, 2018
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I'mma press X to doubt on this one.
Knowing Nintendo it's probably just a new Tegra X1++ revision innit.

I keep telling everyone this is basically a Switch 2 yet people remain skeptical.
Nvidia has every reason to provide a powerful custom chip at a low cost to nintendo. They know the switch is already a success, and this new one will be their poster child, a portable advertisement for their tech.
Here's John saying that the next chip Nvidia makes for the switch is likely a custom chip
 

Raploz

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Mar 23, 2018
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Stupid theory time: With so much being leaked (considering Nintendo has always been careful with leaks like that), with so many speculations of them using the latest technologies and also knowing Nvidia is already deeply involved with Switch's software side since launch (c'mon, they developed an entirely exclusive API for Switch), I wonder if it's really Nintendo deciding about Switch's hardware here.

I'll start a little conspiracy theory and say Nvidia is using Nintendo to force developers to include Nvidia exclusive tech in Switch titles, and they're doing that by strategically giving Nintendo a very really good deal. With Nvidia forcing Nintendo to adopt their latest technologies, those features will also be easily ported to PC. Nvidia has the interest of forcing the industry to adopt their proprietary technologies like DLSS in most games to keep their competitive advantage over AMD in the PC space.
 

Mista K

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I’ll wait to see the build quality before upgrading. With my luck I’d end up with another lemon
 
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I'm sceptical about this.
These leaks seem like a shield 2 instead of a switch upgrade.
Nintendo never made big improvements in hardware refreshes, just a minor frequency and ram bump here and there, bigger screen, bigger battery, etc.

I just think that maybe a revised version of switch will release this year, something with camera and microphone like DSi, instead of these crazy specs.
I also think that a new Nvidia Shield will be announced soon and the leaks are just confusing the two devices.
 
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e&e

Member
Nov 17, 2020
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Because I don’t want another console that is years behind gaming technology on the day of release? The Switch has suffered greatly because of its lack of power. That is the reason we are getting this update to begin with. On top of that the PS5 has far more advanced, and better utilized, tech in its controller as well. Like, Nintendo doesn’t even have that claim anymore. The joycons are terrible controllers. Full stop. And if you want a controller that isn’t shit you have to spend $60 more on a Pro controller whereas $400 will get you a PS5 console and the controller included in that price.
The Switch has suffered? Did the PS4 and XOne suffer because they had midgen upgrades? Gtfo with that nonsense lmao!
 
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Aldric

Member
Feb 15, 2016
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Nintendo never made big improvements in hardware refreshes, just a minor frequency and ram bump here and there
The New 3DS was a pretty big spec bump it's just that the base hardware was so shit it didn't really show but I'm pretty sure New 3DS' CPU was 3 to 4 times faster, that's not minor and applied to Switch that'd be a significant improvement, in fact it's in line with current rumors about this new model.

Also that whole "this is Nintendo" reasoning is faulty because it's not like Nintendo haven't changed their ways multiple times during their history. Miyamoto has expressed regret at the Wii not being a HD system for instance, it's perfectly possible they've learned from the Wii's rapid decline on the market and want to ensure the Switch ecosystem stays relevant for the next few years.
 

Woopah

Member
Jun 15, 2019
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Stupid theory time: With so much being leaked (considering Nintendo has always been careful with leaks like that), with so many speculations of them using the latest technologies and also knowing Nvidia is already deeply involved with Switch's software side since launch (c'mon, they developed an entirely exclusive API for Switch), I wonder if it's really Nintendo deciding about Switch's hardware here.

I'll start a little conspiracy theory and say Nvidia is using Nintendo to force developers to include Nvidia exclusive tech in Switch titles, and they're doing that by strategically giving Nintendo a very really good deal. With Nvidia forcing Nintendo to adopt their latest technologies, those features will also be easily ported to PC. Nvidia has the interest of forcing the industry to adopt their proprietary technologies like DLSS in most games to keep their competitive advantage over AMD in the PC space.
I don't think Nvidia is forcing Nintendo to do anything. DLSS is the perfect tool for Nintendo and it benefits both parties to implement it in a Switch revision.
 

Mister Wolf

Member
Sep 21, 2014
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I don't think Nvidia is forcing Nintendo to do anything. DLSS is the perfect tool for Nintendo and it benefits both parties to implement it in a Switch revision.

With a major company like Nintendo buying in to DLSS. I expect the tech to now evolve at a rapid pace.
 

Woopah

Member
Jun 15, 2019
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With a major company like Nintendo buying in to DLSS. I expect the tech to now evolve at a rapid pace.
Switch third party support is still increasing so I do expect more and more developers to have their games be DLSS enabled (especially in Japan).
 

Zuzu

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Jun 12, 2020
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I hope they'll also upgrade the speakers in the next Switch because they're really lacklustre.
 

demigod

Member
Apr 17, 2007
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Guys, guys Bayonetta 3 and 2 @4K 😍

Dude, its just a $300 tablet that can play on TV.

But, if these rumors are true, with this DLSS and OLED Nintendo is taking a huge step forward in image quality, they are using brand new tech to make their games outpout resolution look much higher than PS4ONE could do, its impressive because again its just a tablet we are talking about.

going from 360p in Xenoblade and other games to 720 OLED and '4K docked at little cost in rendering is HUGE and will be a revelation, the fact that iq advanced so much in a Pro revision is exciting news for Nintendo fans because they always been far behind in the resolution game.

Edit:i don't think the Switch has 'suffered' due to lack of power at all, its success is insane😁sorry but a more powerful Nintendo home console would be shit and not attract people at all, the hybrid model is essential to its popularity and success

yeah the Switch is breaking sales records but it suffers so much! POOR thing!!!😢🤧

What the shit, this is NOT going to happen. You don't know how DLSS works.
 
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Sean Mirrsen

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What the shit, this is NOT going to happen. You don't know how DLSS works.
DLSS 2.0 in Performance mode would upscale 360p to 720p, or 720p to 1440p. Ultra Performance would take 360p to 1080p, or 720p to 4K. The framerate it can do it at is only a matter of how many Tensor cores the chip has, and obviously there would be artifacting going so far up in resolution, but it's extremely plausible.

 

Sub Boss

Member
Mar 6, 2013
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What the shit, this is NOT going to happen. You don't know how DLSS works.
Yeahim sure they will upgrade the resolution anyways with the added power of the Pro ,more like using DLSS to make 720p/1080p look nicer on large tvs, bu even in undocked mode it could help even 540p would look nicer no?
 
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demigod

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Apr 17, 2007
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Yeahim sure they will upgrade the resolution anyways with the added power of the Pro ,more like using DLSS to make 720p/1080p look nicer on large tvs, bu even in undocked mode it could help even 540p would look nicer no?
Games have to support the feature or patched. Don’t hold your breath on it being patched.
 

Sean Mirrsen

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Sep 30, 2020
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So I found this little graph. According to it, a 2060 Super will take 2.5ms to reconstruct a 4K image using DLSS 2.0.

The Super has a few more Tensor cores than a regular 2060, but for the sake of some number fudging let's assume that 48 Tensor cores at 800MHz (the 10W TDP mode of a Jetson Xavier NX) still results in about 1/10th of the total Deep Learning Accelerator performance. So an equivalent task, reconstructing a 4K image, would take the brave but dinky little SoC right around 25 milliseconds.

That's... not particularly good, but honestly not quite as bad as I thought it would be. It's within the realm of "just about maybe possible". All it would take - and I better use some massive air quotes there, "all it would take" - would be to have double the Tensor performance, whether it's by doubling the number of cores or by somehow having the Tensor cores run at double clock. It'd push the frame time overhead down to 12.5ms, which combined with the 16.6ms needed to render a 1080p image for a 1080@60 output, results in under 30ms, or enough to run a DLSS-powered output of 4K@30, upscaling from 1080p to 4K using regular Performance mode.

So I'm liking my theory of the new Switch chip being some iteration of the Xavier NX more and more now. It just seems to fit. :p
 
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StateofMajora

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The New 3DS was a pretty big spec bump it's just that the base hardware was so shit it didn't really show but I'm pretty sure New 3DS' CPU was 3 to 4 times faster, that's not minor and applied to Switch that'd be a significant improvement, in fact it's in line with current rumors about this new model.

Also that whole "this is Nintendo" reasoning is faulty because it's not like Nintendo haven't changed their ways multiple times during their history. Miyamoto has expressed regret at the Wii not being a HD system for instance, it's perfectly possible they've learned from the Wii's rapid decline on the market and want to ensure the Switch ecosystem stays relevant for the next few years.
New 3ds cpu was 6x more powerful. Triple the clockspeed, double cores.

If switch can get a bump like that, esp. over its 1.7ghz mode (used for loading in certain games), would be a really good upgrade.
 
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ultrazilla

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All those years of people saying they just would like to see Nintendo release a "powerful" system are finally going to see one.

There's no doubt in my mind that what Nintendo is doing with their new Switch will drop some jaws and surprise even the most jaded of gamers.

The first video game console ever to feature DLSS. That is a game changer(pun not intended). With this feature, we *WILL* see "next generation" ports
from PS5 and Xbox Series X.


Witcher 3 will get patched. Cyberpunk 2077 will be announced. Grand Theft Auto 5: Definitive Edition. Borderlands 3. TLOZ: BOTW will get a 4k/60fps patch.
Mario Kart 8 4k patch(already 60fps). Astral Chain 4k/60fps patch. Xenoblode Chronicles 4k/60fps patch. Xenoblade Chronicles 2 (4k/60fps patch) and tons more.

Believe it. Bookmark this post.

 

Woopah

Member
Jun 15, 2019
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390
All those years of people saying they just would like to see Nintendo release a "powerful" system are finally going to see one.

There's no doubt in my mind that what Nintendo is doing with their new Switch will drop some jaws and surprise even the most jaded of gamers.

The first video game console ever to feature DLSS. That is a game changer(pun not intended). With this feature, we *WILL* see "next generation" ports
from PS5 and Xbox Series X.


Witcher 3 will get patched. Cyberpunk 2077 will be announced. Grand Theft Auto 5: Definitive Edition. Borderlands 3. TLOZ: BOTW will get a 4k/60fps patch.
Mario Kart 8 4k patch(already 60fps). Astral Chain 4k/60fps patch. Xenoblode Chronicles 4k/60fps patch. Xenoblade Chronicles 2 (4k/60fps patch) and tons more.

Believe it. Bookmark this post.

My person take on this:

Believe:

  • Witcher 3 will get patched
  • Borderlands 3
  • BOTW will get a 4k/60fps patch
  • Mario Kart 8 4k patch(already 60fps)
  • Xenoblode Chronicles 4k/60fps patch
  • Xenoblade Chronicles 2

Disbelieve:

  • Cyberpunk 2077 will be announced
  • Grand Theft Auto 5: Definitive Edition (if this does get announced it'll be for all Switch systems)
  • Astral Chain 4k/60fps patch

Guess we'll see who is right!
 
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Dampf

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Jun 28, 2020
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All those years of people saying they just would like to see Nintendo release a "powerful" system are finally going to see one.

There's no doubt in my mind that what Nintendo is doing with their new Switch will drop some jaws and surprise even the most jaded of gamers.

The first video game console ever to feature DLSS. That is a game changer(pun not intended). With this feature, we *WILL* see "next generation" ports
from PS5 and Xbox Series X.


Witcher 3 will get patched. Cyberpunk 2077 will be announced. Grand Theft Auto 5: Definitive Edition. Borderlands 3. TLOZ: BOTW will get a 4k/60fps patch.
Mario Kart 8 4k patch(already 60fps). Astral Chain 4k/60fps patch. Xenoblode Chronicles 4k/60fps patch. Xenoblade Chronicles 2 (4k/60fps patch) and tons more.

Believe it. Bookmark this post.

However true next gen support will only come when it has hardware accelerated Raytracing.
 

Dream-Knife

Member
Feb 22, 2021
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These rumors get crazier and crazier.

I don't think Nintendo is going to throw away its current 80+ million install base with a huge leap like this.

I think we're either having this rumor combine with the Shield 2, or Nintendo's next system thats a year or two down the line.
 

Woopah

Member
Jun 15, 2019
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These rumors get crazier and crazier.

I don't think Nintendo is going to throw away its current 80+ million install base with a huge leap like this.

I think we're either having this rumor combine with the Shield 2, or Nintendo's next system thats a year or two down the line.
Nintendo won't be throwing it away. All their games for the next couple of years will run on all Switch devices. Third parties may port over games that only run on the Pro.
 
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Xellos

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Jun 10, 2004
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So I found this little graph. According to it, a 2060 Super will take 2.5ms to reconstruct a 4K image using DLSS 2.0.

The Super has a few more Tensor cores than a regular 2060, but for the sake of some number fudging let's assume that 48 Tensor cores at 800MHz (the 10W TDP mode of a Jetson Xavier NX) still results in about 1/10th of the total Deep Learning Accelerator performance. So an equivalent task, reconstructing a 4K image, would take the brave but dinky little SoC right around 25 milliseconds.

That's... not particularly good, but honestly not quite as bad as I thought it would be. It's within the realm of "just about maybe possible". All it would take - and I better use some massive air quotes there, "all it would take" - would be to have double the Tensor performance, whether it's by doubling the number of cores or by somehow having the Tensor cores run at double clock. It'd push the frame time overhead down to 12.5ms, which combined with the 16.6ms needed to render a 1080p image for a 1080@60 output, results in under 30ms, or enough to run a DLSS-powered output of 4K@30, upscaling from 1080p to 4K using regular Performance mode.

So I'm liking my theory of the new Switch chip being some iteration of the Xavier NX more and more now. It just seems to fit. :p

I think we might see 720p native in portable mode (no DLSS), then 4x scaling for 720p->DLSS 1440p in docked mode, output as 4K to the TV. Less than half the cost of DLSS to 4k, and it would still look pretty good.
 
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Thesuffering79

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Feb 27, 2021
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I think we might see 720p native in portable mode (no DLSS), then 4x scaling for 720p->DLSS 1440p in docked mode, output as 4K to the TV. Less than half the cost of DLSS to 4k, and it would still look pretty good.

You have to remember thing are downclocked for the handheld mode to preserve battery. It could very well be 1080p to 4k. That said it would only affect first part games imo. Most people put this thing at 1-1.5 TFLOPS. Even considering NVidia TFLOPS, i tthing it still wont reach the 10 tflops 4k shrunk down to 1080p. But perhaps it will be a bit better than the PS4/XBO -> Switch scenario for games.
 

jdforge

Member
Jul 20, 2004
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All those years of people saying they just would like to see Nintendo release a "powerful" system are finally going to see one.

There's no doubt in my mind that what Nintendo is doing with their new Switch will drop some jaws and surprise even the most jaded of gamers.

The first video game console ever to feature DLSS. That is a game changer(pun not intended). With this feature, we *WILL* see "next generation" ports
from PS5 and Xbox Series X.


Witcher 3 will get patched. Cyberpunk 2077 will be announced. Grand Theft Auto 5: Definitive Edition. Borderlands 3. TLOZ: BOTW will get a 4k/60fps patch.
Mario Kart 8 4k patch(already 60fps). Astral Chain 4k/60fps patch. Xenoblode Chronicles 4k/60fps patch. Xenoblade Chronicles 2 (4k/60fps patch) and tons more.

Believe it. Bookmark this post.


Would have been perfect as the Neogaf logo as the crystal ball.

Believe.
 
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MAtgS

Member
Dec 13, 2008
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All those years of people saying they just would like to see Nintendo release a "powerful" system are finally going to see one.

There's no doubt in my mind that what Nintendo is doing with their new Switch will drop some jaws and surprise even the most jaded of gamers.

The first video game console ever to feature DLSS. That is a game changer(pun not intended). With this feature, we *WILL* see "next generation" ports
from PS5 and Xbox Series X.


Witcher 3 will get patched. Cyberpunk 2077 will be announced. Grand Theft Auto 5: Definitive Edition. Borderlands 3. TLOZ: BOTW will get a 4k/60fps patch.
Mario Kart 8 4k patch(already 60fps). Astral Chain 4k/60fps patch. Xenoblode Chronicles 4k/60fps patch. Xenoblade Chronicles 2 (4k/60fps patch) and tons more.

Believe it. Bookmark this post.

Cyberpunk doesn't even run worth a damn on XB1/PS4, Switch Pro ain't getting it.
 

Dream-Knife

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Feb 22, 2021
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Hah yeah. Sometimes I feel like I'm transported back to the N64 era when playing that game. It's a slideshow at times.
Oddly, outside of slowdown in Perfect Dark and Goldeneye (Jungle), I never really notice frame rate issues on 64.
 

plank

Member
Aug 29, 2006
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So I found this little graph. According to it, a 2060 Super will take 2.5ms to reconstruct a 4K image using DLSS 2.0.

The Super has a few more Tensor cores than a regular 2060, but for the sake of some number fudging let's assume that 48 Tensor cores at 800MHz (the 10W TDP mode of a Jetson Xavier NX) still results in about 1/10th of the total Deep Learning Accelerator performance. So an equivalent task, reconstructing a 4K image, would take the brave but dinky little SoC right around 25 milliseconds.

That's... not particularly good, but honestly not quite as bad as I thought it would be. It's within the realm of "just about maybe possible". All it would take - and I better use some massive air quotes there, "all it would take" - would be to have double the Tensor performance, whether it's by doubling the number of cores or by somehow having the Tensor cores run at double clock. It'd push the frame time overhead down to 12.5ms, which combined with the 16.6ms needed to render a 1080p image for a 1080@60 output, results in under 30ms, or enough to run a DLSS-powered output of 4K@30, upscaling from 1080p to 4K using regular Performance mode.

So I'm liking my theory of the new Switch chip being some iteration of the Xavier NX more and more now. It just seems to fit. :p
Isn't Xavier too big? Plus Volta's tensor cores are not good for DLSS.
 

wipeout364

Member
Jun 13, 2004
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People saying Nintendo will release anything cutting edge are crazy. I would be more than happy for an upgraded switch with a better screen but Nintendo is all about cost containment, then making sure their games run smooth as possible on the tech. The last cutting edge tech they ever released was Nintendo 64.
 

Thesuffering79

Neo Member
Feb 27, 2021
41
21
90
Cyberpunk doesn't even run worth a damn on XB1/PS4, Switch Pro ain't getting it.

People saying Nintendo will release anything cutting edge are crazy. I would be more than happy for an upgraded switch with a better screen but Nintendo is all about cost containment, then making sure their games run smooth as possible on the tech. The last cutting edge tech they ever released was Nintendo 64.

Gamecube was cutting edge. It just didn't have proper DVD.
 

Sean Mirrsen

Member
Sep 30, 2020
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Isn't Xavier too big? Plus Volta's tensor cores are not good for DLSS.
Tensor cores are Tensor cores. They're just Deep Learning Accelerators, processors with a focus on a specific type of operation (matrix multiplication, IIRC). There's nothing so special about DLSS that makes it impossible to use on Volta-era Tensors, much like crypto-mining doesn't really need to be done with GPUs. It just requires a lot of a particular type of calculation, and for deep learning applications like DLSS, Tensor cores excel at that type of calculation.

Also yeah, Xavier is larger. But not, I think, insurmountably so. The NX module is the same size as the TX1 module, just more densely packed. It'd obviously necessitate a redesign of the Switch motherboard, just because of the memory arrangement, but all told the NX SoC with its memory chips and ancillary components takes up maybe 30% more space. If the new Switch is a little larger, or thicker (allowing the battery to be thicker and thus smaller in area), I think it'll fit in there just fine.