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Bloomberg - Sony cuts PS5 production by 4 million units, $449 and $399 price
- Thread starter Craig of War
- Start date
reinking
Gold Member
I see. I thought the original article was pointing to March 2021 for the 10 million. I remembered it had discussed not all 10 million would be available by end of holiday 2020 so it threw me off. Still, I see no reason to panic since the PS5 production, even with the yield issues, seems to be on pace with PS4 production.
LarknThe4th
Member
Those prices would be a big problem for Microsoft
cryptoadam
Banned
very interesting, first 600, now 399. Low end and high end covered, Sony comes right in 449/499.
Cant imagine any lower if they are having yield problems and lowering forecast.
Cant imagine any lower if they are having yield problems and lowering forecast.
supernova8
Banned
They should play this in the background as they present their sizzle reel, and then have Kaz Hirai appear right at the end and say... "399 US dollars"
D
Deleted member 775630
Unconfirmed Member
If they have these issues, aren't chances also higher that they'll have more consoles with issues at launch?
Could be the node they chose, perhaps they went with more EUV layers which will be cheaper when it works properly. Could be the SoC is surprisingly large or it could be that reliably hitting 2.23Ghz GPU clocks is not that easy. Might even be a combination of factors.
Viking Warrior
Member
This is absolutely untrue,Sony never had any plans to produce 15 million PS5's,they were going to produce 5 million,they doubled this number to 10 million after finding out the yields were so good,if the yields were 50% defective,they would have never doubled production,they would slashed production dramatically.
The PS5 APU's have been in production since mid june,does anyone know todays date?They have been in prduction for 3 months and on the week of a big
Sony reveal you have this rumor right on schedule.Come on none of you are this gullible are you?
The PS5 APU's have been in production since mid june,does anyone know todays date?They have been in prduction for 3 months and on the week of a big
Sony reveal you have this rumor right on schedule.Come on none of you are this gullible are you?
supernova8
Banned
hemo memo
Gold Member
Early adopters are beta testers. That’s known.
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ReBurn
Gold Member
No big deal. The good games won't come out until next year anyway.
Panajev2001a
GAF's Pleasant Genius
Not going to undervalue how much you are milking the F.U.D. for all its worth. It seems this is still higher than PS4 launch window shipments, but sure let’s ride on the title and OP forgetting that bit and build a nice big castle on top
.
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FranXico
Member
Console warriors are desperate for bad PS5 news.
SatansReverence
Hipster Princess
clocks and embedded ram would be the reason for such poor yields.
Panajev2001a
GAF's Pleasant Genius
SRAM tends to have a highly repeatable structure (hence minor duplication gets rid of intolerable faults), clock I will give ya, but I would be curious about their die size as they should have a much smaller due than XSX unless the I/O complex is some monster beast XSX does not have and in that case well the I/O performance of the two consoles is more put in context than before.
Kagey K
Banned
I don’t believe you actuality think this. After seeing all the threads you post in.
Why bother stirring the pot?
prinz_valium
Member
Definitely reads like that
Panajev2001a
GAF's Pleasant Genius
D
Deleted member 775630
Unconfirmed Member
Not going to undervalue how much you are milking the F.U.D. for all its worth. It seems this is still higher than PS4 launch window shipments, but sure let’s ride on the title and OP forgetting that bit and build a nice big castle on top
Why is it FUD? It's an article by Bloomberg...
SatansReverence
Hipster Princess
Apparently cerny's PS5 announcement marketing speech.
TRUTHFACT: MS having eSRAM yield problems on Xbox One
So this was in the previous Kinect demo thread, and the conversation shifted completely to a rumor that XBox One was getting a huge GPU clock downgrade. While that seems to still be debated, all insiders do agree that MS is having problems with the yields on eSRAM. Here's a small sample of...
Embedded ram causes issues.
The embedded ram on the xbox one took up as much space on the die as the entire GPU. This idea that the PS5 apu is small bEcAuSe LeSs CuS is laughable.
Secret xbox discord hacked bloombergs websites to post false articles obviously.
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FranXico
Member
This rumour completely contradicts what they reported before, and the timing is ideal for click-baiting. Somebody likely was fed bad information and they chose to run with it.
And yet, people are throwing their critical thinking out the window.
It's either because people are that naive, or they want this to be true.
Suspecting sensationalism, I prefer to doubt Bloomberg on both reports.
prinz_valium
Member
Yes, Ps4 was staggered, tooDespite this being a higher shipment than PS4 in the same period?
This time around, they also need to supply Japan day one.
Demand is higher.
It will be a staggered launch and might be a little later in time than Ps4 even.
Azurro
Banned
This is such a weird rumor. We have heard for months that the yields for the APU are really, really good and that Sony was planning on shipping 10 million units before the end of the fiscal year.
Now this report says it was slashed down to 11 million from 15 million? And that yields are poor? Makes no sense, they have been producing these things for months.
Btw, you Xbox fans here that believe the PS5 costs 600 to produce, you people are nuts, but keep on fighting the good FUD fight.
Now this report says it was slashed down to 11 million from 15 million? And that yields are poor? Makes no sense, they have been producing these things for months.
Btw, you Xbox fans here that believe the PS5 costs 600 to produce, you people are nuts, but keep on fighting the good FUD fight.
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D
Deleted member 775630
Unconfirmed Member
Yeah but this is worse than normal otherwise they wouldn't write an article on it. Might be a RROD level of failure
kuncol02
Banned
2.23GHz is going on.
Kagey K
Banned
Why on the eve of the announcement would this Rumor come out?
It should be one easily dismissed In under 24 hours.
Seems like it wouldn’t be worth it in the long run. (Unless there was some truth in it)
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RoadHazard
Gold Member
It's gonna be $400 and $500. $50 is too small a difference to justify both existing, and wouldn't drive enough people to get the DE.
If yield for the SoC is only 50% it has to be because of huge parametric failures like not meeting clock, voltages etc rather than defective chips. The chip should be around ~300mm^2 so should be >80% yields with the D0 rates TSMC has given us publicly.
I tend to think the same because the failure rate does not mesh with the known defect density.
The only other option is that they went with a revision of N7 that uses more EUV layers but I don't think this will be it.
Edit to add. I expect the issue is hitting 2.23Ghz in a power envelope their cooling solution can handle is proving tricky at the moment. This is part of the reason I was skeptical of a highly clocked narrow architecture GPU prior to the spec announcements.
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yurinka
Member
I think they'll have a $50 difference will happen, but that the prices are going to be 499 and 449 instead. That would be enough to dominate again the generation and to beat the PS4 gaming history records. I see 399 and 449 too cheap for that they should cost to make. But if real, then PS5 will totally destroy their competition.
Regarding their production forecast being rised months ago and now reduced because they won't be able to achieve it these levels of production, I think there is another reason to do it:
Looking at the new PSN users gamstat.com graph, we can see that during the lockdown months of the main PSN countries there was a huge unusual spike. So back then maybe they thought that it was going to last until the pandemic will basically 'end' in the main countries in a year or two from now aprox. with the vaccines and new treatments. So back then they highly increased their forecast.
But later they saw that as these regions left the lockdown the numbers went back to normal, so unless there's a new lockdown it's pretty likely that this unusual peak won't happen again. So they reduced the forecast.
And as comparision, aligning launches PS4 is the best selling (well, shipped) home console ever until its current life cycle point (7th fiscal year). That 7.5M consoles shipped on their launch fiscal year (it really was just 4 months) already was the biggest shipment on a launch fiscal year. So 11 millions produced very likely means they will ship over 7.5M units, which would set another gaming history record.
Regarding their production forecast being rised months ago and now reduced because they won't be able to achieve it these levels of production, I think there is another reason to do it:
Looking at the new PSN users gamstat.com graph, we can see that during the lockdown months of the main PSN countries there was a huge unusual spike. So back then maybe they thought that it was going to last until the pandemic will basically 'end' in the main countries in a year or two from now aprox. with the vaccines and new treatments. So back then they highly increased their forecast.
But later they saw that as these regions left the lockdown the numbers went back to normal, so unless there's a new lockdown it's pretty likely that this unusual peak won't happen again. So they reduced the forecast.
PS4 shipped 7.5M consoles in that first 4 months period, where according to Bloombert they are going to produce 11M. So I'd say they would be able to ship way more than 7.5M consoles in that period.
And as comparision, aligning launches PS4 is the best selling (well, shipped) home console ever until its current life cycle point (7th fiscal year). That 7.5M consoles shipped on their launch fiscal year (it really was just 4 months) already was the biggest shipment on a launch fiscal year. So 11 millions produced very likely means they will ship over 7.5M units, which would set another gaming history record.
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Jon Neu
Banned
The_Mike
I cry about SonyGaf from my chair in Redmond, WA
If I were buying a PS5, I would without a doubt buy the bd one as I wouldn't trust Sony on their digital only part.
Swift Hunta
Member
Amen to this post haha
Jon Neu
Banned
Swift Hunta
Member
All you Sony folk are sure a funny breed when something negative comes about a not even released console. Also the guy states those are the lowest prices he can see them at. Doesn’t mean that’s the price you goofs lol.
Azurro
Banned
I think I'm going to let other people be the beta testers of the PS5.
This thread keeps on giving, yes, the white knight of Xbox warriors, the Don Quixote of Xbox, fighting for the honor of Phil Spencer and believer that every game will be made for Series X and then downported, was going to get a PS5.
Come on guys, don't you get a bit tired of spreading FUD? Are you expecting it to do more other than annoy forum dwellers? It's not exactly going to change sales figures.
Jon Neu
Banned
Panajev2001a
GAF's Pleasant Genius
TRUTHFACT: MS having eSRAM yield problems on Xbox One
So this was in the previous Kinect demo thread, and the conversation shifted completely to a rumor that XBox One was getting a huge GPU clock downgrade. While that seems to still be debated, all insiders do agree that MS is having problems with the yields on eSRAM. Here's a small sample of...www.neogaf.com
Embedded ram causes issues.
The embedded ram on the xbox one took up as much space on the die as the entire GPU. This idea that the PS5 apu is small bEcAuSe LeSs CuS is laughable.
It has a lot less CU’s (and those are bot and... psst pssst... all the L1 and L2 caches on CPU and GPU are all embedded RAM!!!! A scratchpad will also tend to use less complex logic than a cache. Die size, very large portions of repeatable logic patterns, etc... tend to lead to more fault tolerant designs than you may think. It is complex unique logic that would put the design in jeopardy normally.
Lots of small repeated blocks actually allow for a bit higher redundancy to reduce critics faults that would cause you to throw the chip away. That is quite odd to debate a non issue with chip design really.. it is not like it is up to debate in any circle really.
CPU’s with far more SRAM than Xbox One are able to ship in good quantities with low yields. Then again there can be design specific oddities that may not help.
MS with the Xbox One called attention to the wide and very high bandwidth SRAM scratchpad and wanted to mention both they had embedded memory but low latency (embedded SRAM/ESRAM). Normally people put attention on eDRAM as It normally uses a widely different process than the one used for logic (1 transistor and 1 capacitor for DRAM vs 4 or 6 transistors for most SRAM designs).
Sure, I was not thinking for a second about the SRAM in the I/O unit in the SoC (not sure the size has been disclosed), but it made sense to be the less dense SRAM of the I/O unit is embedded in the main SoC (they are normally implemented using dense DRAM).
Crimson_Fate
Member
Not that I believe this happened but what if Sony decided to go with 38CU's because the yields were initially very good and once they started they found out that they could not maintain that quality. They are sticking with 38 CU's but it means the overall yields will be lower.
Azurro
Banned
Fair enough, I haven't had my coffee this morning yet, silliness and dumb posts get to me easier.
