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Bloomberg: Star Wars Is Struggling to Win Over the Next Generation of Kids

#Phonepunk#

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Ryan may have Johnson may have set the house on fire, but Abrams was the one who poured gasoline on everything.
indeed, TFA is an exceedingly poor setup, something I think everyone was willing to overlook because we wanted to give the new characters a chance. IMO it got over-praise at the time, partly as a reaction against the prequel hate, hoping things would be better this time. on reflection it is a mindless, poorly thought out, claustrophobic foundation for a trilogy.
 
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Fox Mulder

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Lucas didn't seem to have this problem even with the prequels. Star Wars sold toys until Disney took over with the shitty trilogy.

I thought the force being female was supposed to inspire a generation of young girls to become fans.
 

edomedo

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I've only watched the first 6 movies, and that's it. Everything else is shit and it should have never been made. Studios need to learn when to leave shit alone.
 
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Ichabod

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I thought the prequel trilogy was pretty awful overall, so when this new trilogy started, I was pretty hyped to see where it would go. Flash forward to now...and I might watch Rise of Skywalker if it happens to be playing on an inflight movie someday and I decide not to take a nap instead.
 

VysePSU

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People cried when Iron Man died. Not sure many people care about Rey or Kylo Ren.

The new Star Wars movies are forgettable, in my opinion, apart from the big action scenes in Solo (and the Darth Maul cameo).
 
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cryptoadam

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Lucas didn't seem to have this problem even with the prequels. Star Wars sold toys until Disney took over with the shitty trilogy.

I thought the force being female was supposed to inspire a generation of young girls to become fans.
Who would of figured that boys would want good male characters to look up to, and that boys would be the main customers of toys and action figures. Real geniuses over there.

It wasn't the Leia/Padme merch that built the Star Wars empire.
 
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oagboghi2

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Star Wars has a fanbase that is unable to be pleased, and a simple core story and theme that doesn't really support this many films and offshoots.

I know that this will be unpopular around here but at least TLJ tried to break free and become it's own thing. But now all time hack JJ is gonna come in and soothe all the manbabies.
I'm sorry but this is such a bullshit lie. There are tons of Star wars media that the fanbase adores becuase it's good.

This idea that Star wars fans are impossible to please was a bullshit excuse publicists made to defend how terrible the last Jedi was, and it's sad that this smear has stuck. Made good films and people will praise you

Stop making excuses for hacks
 
Oct 26, 2018
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The biggest movies now are super hero movies and animated flicks. These two kinds of movies are virtually guaranteed big money makers.

Star Wars movies make a lot of money too.

Problem with Star Wars is most of what people know about it comes from the movies. Super hero movies have everything from movies to tons of comics to some of them having TV shows. There's more material to keep people interested.

There's also a shitload more characters. Which means people can latch onto more characters as their favourite. With Star Wars, there's really only a handful of key heroes and villains, and half of them come from old movies which most young people don't give a shit about.

Also, I think even for veteran viewers, the whole Star Wars storyline is boring. It's been about rebels vs the dark side with all their big base building schemes. That first SW movie years back that rejuvenated the movies........... I swear the plot was the exact same as the old SW movies with Mark Hamill and Harrison Ford...... infiltrate mega base with X-wing fighters......... get chased by Tie fighters...... destroy reactor core...... escape......... the end.

With comic heroes, you can have all kinds of villains and storylines that are totally different, unlike SW which always seems to need tying every movie to Luke Skywalker or the force.
 
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GreyHorace

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JJ can direct but cant write for shit. JJ directing and Lucas writing, this is what i would do were i Disney. offer Lucas a slice of the episode IX pie but keep everything else. it would be a massive investment. it would also be a smart thing to do, so they of course they won't do it. that's fine they can just do ANH tv shows on D+ and make $6.99 X 10 million per month for the next three years. keep milking that Mos Eisley space cow.

also they should announce X, XI, and XII. everyone says Lucas had a 9 episode series plan but he also said 12 at one point. so do that and blame it on him. they could squeeze another 4 billion out of this at least. they own all of Lucas's drafts, which they are already using, however much they deny this. Lucas has been selling this project for decades, he had so many marketing ideas, official series spin offs, framing devices like the whole movie zooming out to be a bedtime story told by a wookie, etc. they can just continue to root through his life's work. self aware bad new Holiday Special with Bill Murray singing Star Wars and the SNL cast making fun of Darth Trump and Palputin? i can see that happening.

JJ is a good hype man but bad at coming up with ideas. TFA was evidence of that. this is what made Star Wars great. all the new ideas, the new fan favorite characters. it is easy to forget that Chewie was once an entirely new concept. AT-AT walkers were once an entirely new concept. Yoda was totally new. lightsabers, they were in some pulp sci fi, but again, presenting in an entirely new way. all these incredible designs presented in fresh ways with technological mastery, breakthroughs in stop motion and puppetry, matte painting and effects. ST has little new compared to this. they need to come up with something new. RJ trolling with bringing R2 out to only show the ANH Leia hologram ("A cheap trick" - he admits he is a hack with that line) might be clever or something but it isn't new. it is literally reusing old footage. plus here we are on the Millenium Falcon again. something new in 1977, 42 years ago. the new people don't even get their own spaceship? WTF. this is lazy ass product line filmmaking overall.
I have to agree. I always thought JJ Abrams to be an overrated director. I thought Mission Impossible 3 was boring but Star Trek I'll admit I like yet Into Darkness left a bad taste in my mouth. The Force Awakens did get my hyped for the new trilogy but The Last Jedi ruined it. It makes me wonder how JJ is going to fix it.

And you're right about the rehashing of ideas. It seems like Disney is content with mining the old trilogy for material but aren't creating new stuff for new audiences.

So they shit on the fanbase that helped built the franchise, and now turns out the new demographic they're pandering to don't really care about SW......ouch.....karma is a bitch



Would someone please fire this woman already? Shitting on the fanbase that made Star Wars what it is. Whoever thought that was a good idea?
 

finowns

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Best thing they could do is give Ewan McGregor an Obi-Wan movie, he'd kill it. But didn't they hire the Game of Thrones guys who are not creative at all?
 
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GreyHorace

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What doesn't help is that the new bad guy Kylo-Ren looks like a total dork. Got to be the nerdiest looking villain ever.

He looks like Joey Ramone.
Eh... I'm one of those who enjoy Adam Driver's performance as Kylo Ren. Among the new cast he's actually the most interesting and the one who actually has a character arc. He's much more intriguing compared to the bland Rey, who the writers never manage to build up to be a compelling main character. It''s a shame, cause I really like Daisy Ridley.
 

Kadayi

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indeed, TFA is an exceedingly poor setup, something I think everyone was willing to overlook because we wanted to give the new characters a chance. IMO it got over-praise at the time, partly as a reaction against the prequel hate, hoping things would be better this time. on reflection it is a mindless, poorly thought out, claustrophobic foundation for a trilogy.
A very eloquent way of putting it.

Agreed also about TFA being overpraised. I think fans were so blue-balled about SW, that they were all too willing to accept the abjectly shitty nature of the film simply because it was more Star Wars they could stroke off too. Abrams didn't possess the imagination to see any of the old characters in roles outside of what they had before. The notion that Solo, one of the heroes of the new republic would be bumming around in the same get up as the galaxies most desperate down on his luck grifter 30 years latter was pure facepalm.
 

BigAssBoy

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Eh... I'm one of those who enjoy Adam Driver's performance as Kylo Ren. Among the new cast he's actually the most interesting and the one who actually has a character arc. He's much more intriguing compared to the bland Rey, who the writers never manage to build up to be a compelling main character. It''s a shame, cause I really like Daisy Ridley.
I disagree about Kylo, he is one of the most incompetent characters of the new movies.
 

Yoda

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I use to be a hardcore Star Wars fan. Disney tried to turn it into a MCU style IP, failed and in doing so alienated the existing fan-base. I don't know that it's salvageable as a mega series anymore, I'm sure it'll always have fans, but being one of a million disenfranisched fans, I don't know what they could do to resurrect the love I use to have for series. Clearly the younger generations aren't buying the designed-by-woke-committee crap that's been getting put out; so it's anyone's guess what they can do. Also, Kathleen Kennedy is still in charge, so I don't think the suits and Disney believe they've done permanent damage to the IP/brand/series.
 

Pagemaster

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Lucas didn't seem to have this problem even with the prequels. Star Wars sold toys until Disney took over with the shitty trilogy.

I thought the force being female was supposed to inspire a generation of young girls to become fans.

The new trilogy toys aside haven't Toys in general had poor sales given that toy stores are closing down and not moving as much product as it did anymore.

Kids are playing on Ipads, phones , video games the only toys being sold are for toddlers or middle aged collectors.
 
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Super Mario

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Say what you will about the Marvel Cinematic Universe, but that franchise is trudging along to great success because it produced movies that had each individual character shine and made the audience care about them. It's no wonder Avengers: Endgame was such a huge success because people around the world were eager to see how the overarching storyline would resolve.
I don't think you can deny the success of Marvel. However, I don't see people revering them as timeless classics you will watch again and again.

I just don't see them ever again making a star wars that everyone can agree on. It's either going to be too much of the same or too different. That's what generally happens with longstanding series.

I agree that the characters are crap. Look at the original series. Han, Chewy, Vader, Yoda, Luke, Palpatine. Iconic figures. Vader was arguably the most iconic villain of all time. What's the best we have now? Emo Kylo Ren?
 

VulcanRaven

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They still weren’t Star Wars though and got heavily ridiculed for it at the time.

Far too much politics and boring filler.
I guess they kind of forgot Star Wars was an action adventure movie.
Prequels had a lot of action and adventure. There are some politics but I don't think it makes them boring. I think kids today might like the cgi action and lightsaber fights of the prequels more.
 
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Wimbledon

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I'll be honest even when i was kid my favorite movies were Lord of the rings, the Matrix, Harry potter and a few other stand alone classics. While i did see the star wars films i was never super in love with the series, and i love sci-fi. The first star wars films i watched were the prequels, a lot of people shat on episode 3, i liked it. I kinda like the original trilogy as well but honestly i'd rather watch star wars episode 3 over all of the other SW films.

While i think the overly social justice political elements strip away from what makes the new star wars great (most films really). I don't think that is entirely why those films fall flat. Creators try to capture that magic again and it's not going to work, there is such a thing as overstaying your welcome.
 
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GreyHorace

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I don't think you can deny the success of Marvel. However, I don't see people revering them as timeless classics you will watch again and again.
I don't need them to be timeless classics. I just want them to be good times at the cinema and feel that my money wasn't wasted. Plus, as a longtime comic fan, it's nice to see characters I've read on the page adapted faithfully for the most part on the big screen.

Add to the fact that since it's debut 10 years ago the MCU has maintained a consistent brand of quality with only the occasional misfire (like Captain Marvel, what a terrible film).

I disagree about Kylo, he is one of the most incompetent characters of the new movies.
That's why I like him so much. He's a fuckup who wants to desperately live up to the memory of his grandfather and utterly failing at it. That for me is compelling and honestly I give props to Adam Driver for keeping the new films interesting with his performance.

But therein to lies the problem. Your villain is much more of a draw than the heroes so who will audiences root for? Finn and Poe are boring and I think Rey they ruined after The Last Jedi. You certainly can't count on the original cast anymore since Han is dead. and Leia isn't around anymore sadly because of Carrie Fisher's passing. I think they're only bringing back Mark Hamill as Luke as an apology to how bad they handled his character in the last film. But even then he'll just be a supporting role, much like the returning Lando.

Also, why the hell did they go with the First Order as villains? I didn't need an Evil Empire redux as bad guys fighting the Rebe- er, I mean the Resistance. Is this only conflict available for this franchise to mine for story? Can't they think of more original plotlines to draw audiences in?

I really think Disney should fire Kathleen Kennedy as she has no clue what to do with Star Wars and give it to someone who'll give it a kick to the balls and inject some creativity.
 
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Ulysses 31

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Also, why the hell did they go with the First Order as villains? I didn't an Evil Empire redux as bad guys fighting the Rebe- er, I mean the Resistance. Is this only conflict available for this franchise to mine for story? Can't they think of more original plotlines to draw audiences in?

I really think Disney should fire Kathleen Kennedy as she has no clue what to do with Star Wars and give it to someone who'll give it a kick to the ball and inject some creativity.
The video I posted has a theory about a rumor that Lucas still gets a cut of anything Disney uses from the original(and prequel?) trilogy, lightsaber fights included, and so Disney rather kills off original sw characters and make something similar devoid of the soul of Star Wars to avoid paying Lucas.
 
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GreyHorace

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The video I posted has a theory about a rumor that Lucas still gets a cut of anything Disney uses from the original(and prequel?) trilogy, lightsaber fights included, and so Disney rather kills off original sw characters and make something similar devoid of the soul of Star Wars to avoid paying Lucas.
If so that is completely pathetic on Disney's part. With such a vast universe to mine ideas from it's stupid to limit yourself based on paying a guy royalties. Especially a corporation with more money than God.
 

iconmasterX

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Also, why the hell did they go with the First Order as villains? I didn't need an Evil Empire redux as bad guys fighting the Rebe- er, I mean the Resistance. Is this only conflict available for this franchise to mine for story? Can't they think of more original plotlines to draw audiences in?
For me, this is a failing only second to the handling of Luke. If rebels-versus-empire is the only story Star Wars is capable of telling, it might as well go in cold storage now.
 
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Oct 26, 2018
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Ya, I mentioned the overall plotline of rebs vs evil dark side too.

Same plot now vs. 40 years ago. Even some of the movie plots are the exact same. TFA had the same plot as the old ass SW movies where they zoom in with X wing fighters to blow up a base.

At least with superhero movies (I'm not even a bit fan of them), you get lots of characters and each movie can be it's own thing...... although to be fair, comic book movies can be lame too. Fuck, how many times has Spiderman been rebooted?
 

godhandiscen

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I am happy. Every year hundreds of millions of dollars worth of content making effort is invested in this old cow that has been milked to dead.
I can't wait until all of those investments go into more exciting properties with better stories to be told. I am done with SW; please let it die.
 
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We have come to the point where Star Wars, which wasn't that political (at the time) and more about trying to stop a Empire from dominating, vs Star Trek which was all about Political Jargon and droned on and on about acceptance and peace, have been swapped roles where Star Wars is MORE about diversity and Politics (I like Rose and Finn though), to Star Trek's more action packed series with the Politics only being a side story now. (at least to where I am seeing things).

I was never into either series when I was young except from the Lightsaber fights as I guess I liked the action more than the droning on about tactics and political infighting, but I have come to respect the older films as I gotten older, and I like how Discovery has played out so far.

I personally think the problem is Disney's handling of the Franchise throughout and catering to the SJW audience because they think this will increase more sales.

The nostalgia argument I can sadly get behind as they wish to modernise the plot by reusing some of the old films as a base but it's done in the worst way possible.
 
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StifflersMum

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And the new trilogy’s heroes, like Rey and Poe Dameron, just haven’t inspired the same fervor among young people,
Who would have thought that young boys (who usually buy these toys and are the biggest target group for Star Wars) don't like their hero getting the balls cut off by a purple haired hag in a night gown.

I for one am shocked.
 

Ulysses 31

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Not evidence or anything: but my nephew loves Star Wars, and he came out of Episode 8 silent as the grave. I felt bad for the poor kid.
Maybe you can cheer him up with all them videos mocking all the flaws of the movie? :lollipop_grinning: :lollipop_grinning: :lollipop_grinning:
 

DiscoJer

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They really should have taken the tack that the Expanded Universe did. Add new characters, but continue on with the old ones, not kill them off. Don't invalidate the old movies. Don't regurgitate the old movies.

Add new fans while not pissing off the old ones.
 

pel1300

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Star Wars has a fanbase that is unable to be pleased, and a simple core story and theme that doesn't really support this many films and offshoots.

I know that this will be unpopular around here but at least TLJ tried to break free and become it's own thing. But now all time hack JJ is gonna come in and soothe all the manbabies.
That's why they kept this franchise alive during the silent era from 1983 up until the prequels...

And then kept it alive after the prequel backlash by embracing the Clone Wars and SW videogames....

And sorry, but TLJ is anything but something that tried to break free. It hit the reset button and then proceeded to go backwards and put the state of the galaxy worse off than in Episode IV. It's mind boggling. What story hook is left after TLJ? The resistance has to grow and defeat the bad guys....that's all there is.

TLJ is just a chain of recreated scenes from Empire, ROTJ, with the result of the scenes flipped or tweaked, along with a boring slow space chase scene that is almost like the opening of A New Hope extended into a long two hour scene.

That's what makes TLJ so insulting to the audience. It tries to tell you it's doing something bold and original when it's just straight up OT rehash again. Almost every scene is a callback or reference to the OT. DJ = the Lando of TLJ......but this time he is not a good person forced in a bad situation. Phasma is even more of a poor man's Boba Fett in TLJ. Rey on the island going into a dark cave - callback to Luke going to a dark place in Dagobah and seeing himself in the "dark side". Snoke throne room scene is laughably similar to ROTJ's throne room sequence. Snoke's dialogue ripped straight from Palpatine. Snoke is killed off in the manner that fans have for decades nitpicked Luke should have done to Palpatine. The worst offense is "Hey look at these ships, your friends are dying!!" Lame Lame Lame.

Additionally, TLJ is the least subtle SW movie ever. The characters monologue directly to the audience. "You're still...HOLDING ON!!!" - translation: "Hey hardcore fans, please stop caring about the legacy characters so we can sell you these new boring ones for decades to come"....or an extra tastes the ground(WTF?) and tells us "Hey this is a salt planet, so it isn't a Hoth rip-off" just ridiculous.

SW fans seem to generally like the Timothy Zahn trilogy, so they can be pleased obviously. This shows if they loosely adapted the Thrawn trilogy the way Marvel very loosely adapted Civil War and Infinity Gauntlet.....many fans would have been pleased.
 
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CSmath22

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What doesn't help is that the new bad guy Kylo-Ren looks like a total dork. Got to be the nerdiest looking villain ever.

He looks like Joey Ramone.
Or when he's played for laughs multiple times (destroying that room with a lightsaber while stormtroopers walk past) in what is supposed to be a somewhat serious movie.
 
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Guynamedbilly

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The new movies simply aren't as good. My brother's kids watched all of the old movies and wanted to rewatch them multiple times. For the new ones, once was enough.