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Breaking: Amy Coney Barrett Reveals list of constitutional reasons why she WON'T be voting to overturn Roe!

TKOFromTokyo

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Jul 20, 2020
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Their current living situation does have an affect on my view on abortion, because if that child was aborted they wouldn't be in the position they're in now. And I don't want this to be completely about abortion because if I had my way, the moms would give birth to the kids but would have a plan to put it up for adoption because there are a TON of families who can't have children and can't afford surrogacy who would LOVE to be a parent. Having services that work with moms to make the best decision, hopefully by guiding them to give birth and give it up for adoption, or in a worse case scenario having an abortion, is the best way to handle this imo. I think as TKO noted, life is conceptualized extremely early in pregnancy, and then it becomes a moral and societal decision as to when it's acceptable to end the life of a fetus.
I agree, that there should definitely be more resources to support women in this area. I’m not sure how to improve the situations for kids that grow up with terrible parents that are just terrible people or not really capable of being parents. It’s one thing to help kids once something has happened, but how do you be proactive and reduce the number of bad parents? Some of it can be done through education and support, but there are always going to be bad people.

I also believe that it would be most intellectually honest to frame the discussion on abortion as you have essentially agreed upon that it becomes a choice by society on what is acceptable. I think that the challenge is most people want to be considered good. Therefore, it is easier to detach ourselves from the reality of decisions and make them as black and white as possible. The same point is relevant to people like myself who are pro-life. We need to be aware of the realities of birthing a child and the consequences to a mother, the child, her loved ones, and even society. If both sides did this, I think that I could respect someone coming to a different conclusion than me much more than the current general environment on the topic.
 

Super Mario

Mario Mario
Nov 12, 2016
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Sorry your childhood was shit, truly. I'm glad you exist, but I see a lot of these kids with not much hope and no resources who still live really shitty lives bouncing from house to house. I might be biased because of what I've experienced, and there are definitely kids who live a shit life and go onto leading successful lives, but yeah that's my feelings at the most basic level.
This is one of the few areas we will agree on. I will still say you are a terrible person if you abort your child.

However, this country has a ton of other far more pressing issues than birthing more unwanted children.
 

Ornlu

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Oct 31, 2018
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I am pro 2nd amendment. I just think there should be some more regulations. Some guns shouldn't be so easy to buy, gun show loophole should be banned, there should be longer waiting periods, mandatory gun safety classes for 1st gun purchase...

Kind of how it is in Canada. Guns are legal, but I've never come across a single gun store in my entire life.
So you want Red State abortion laws? If we're applying the logic equally. Abortion laws that make it more difficult to murder your child.
 

Ornlu

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Oct 31, 2018
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Sorry your childhood was shit, truly. I'm glad you exist, but I see a lot of these kids with not much hope and no resources who still live really shitty lives bouncing from house to house. I might be biased because of what I've experienced, and there are definitely kids who live a shit life and go onto leading successful lives, but yeah that's my feelings at the most basic level.
Thank you for the kind words!

My point by saying that is that it's not up to you, or me, or the State, or even the mom or dad to decide if a child should be murdered or not. If you follow that train of logic to it's natural conclusion, you end up in a very bad place.
 
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whitehawk

leeches are the best bait when attempting to land bass
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So you want Red State abortion laws? If we're applying the logic equally. Abortion laws that make it more difficult to murder your child.
If we debate about this, it's not going to go anywhere, because we believe fundamentally different things. I don't think abortion is murder, and you do.
 

Ornlu

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If we debate about this, it's not going to go anywhere, because we believe fundamentally different things. I don't think abortion is murder, and you do.
That's fine. You don't have to believe that intentionally killing a human being is murder. I can't understand how someone comes to that conclusion, but I'm sure you have a reason.

I asked you to take your abortion logic of "making it illegal just encourages unsafe abortions" and apply it to guns, to which you replied:

I am pro 2nd amendment. I just think there should be some more regulations. Some guns shouldn't be so easy to buy, gun show loophole should be banned, there should be longer waiting periods, mandatory gun safety classes for 1st gun purchase...

Kind of how it is in Canada. Guns are legal, but I've never come across a single gun store in my entire life.
So, I'm saying that by your own logic, abortions should be "legal, but I've never come across a single place that will perform an abortion in my life." Which is basically what very Red States do. They make it legal, but more difficult to get. You would thus want legal abortions to involve a very strict, narrow definition, which is not what exists today.
 
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Jan 9, 2018
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Making a joke about a fundamental right that is being threatened to be taken away from women.

Classy.
It's not some spontaneous action by a woman; in fact, it's not an act of her own at all, she's 100% passive. It's an invasive medical procedure, which terminates life and intentionally violates the normal functioning & purposes of the body, made viable (without severe risks of death) by medical technologies, and carried out by doctors, who are in fact the only "actors" in the situation that need to be considered. So can we forbid medical practitioners from becoming butchers? Sure as hell can.

There is absolutely nothing that makes forbidding abortion more radical than forbidding doctors from assisting in suicide... and of course the involvement here of a second life beyond the patient makes it much, much more ethically pertinent than any suicide law.
 
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Jan 17, 2014
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Lolll. Not a fan would have actually preferred Ted Cruz for his expansive knowledge of patent law which def needs a revamp and he could bring some much needed clarity
 
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Elysion

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Jan 11, 2020
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Roe will never be overturned, if only because Republicans would lose the carrot they've been dangling in front of evangelicals and social conservatives for the last fifty years.
 

LordCBH

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Jun 4, 2020
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The constitution doesn’t even mention abortion. It’s legality should be left up to the states. California wants it legal? Cool. I know which state supports baby murder so I can avoid that state.
 
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OSC

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Jun 16, 2018
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When abortion falls, the lifestyle that many leftist women fall into as they get older will fall with it. I know several local (DC) bitches who go to the pussy marches, they’ve all murdered their babies.

can’t wait.
We need several things. Abortion should be a state issue. Welfare needs to be far more restricted. Child support should not send men that cannot pay due to unemployment or underemployment to jail. Women who rape children, should not be able to get child support from those children. Women who lie about the father should not get child support from someone who's not the father.

Also prostitution should be legalized nationwide. I've heard it reduces simping, and the behavior of women in an area with legalized prostitution is different from an area where it's illegal.

The same arguments used for abortion, that it'll be done anyway but more dangerous, apply for prostitution. In fact legal prostitution would not only reduce the abuse of women, reduce stds, but legal would compete with sex traffic, reducing sex slavery.

Now when you suggest optional late term abortion should be legal, you're suggesting murder should be legal because it'd otherwise be inconvenient and dangerous. That's completely different from something that reduces actual sex slavery, in addition to the dangers and abuses, as legal prostitution would.

There are more legitimate reasons to legalize prostitution than to legalize abortion.
Roe will never be overturned, if only because Republicans would lose the carrot they've been dangling in front of evangelicals and social conservatives for the last fifty years.
Some people do deliver on their promises, and Trump is one of them.
 
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Ornlu

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Roe will never be overturned, if only because Republicans would lose the carrot they've been dangling in front of evangelicals and social conservatives for the last fifty years.
Strategically, that's possible. There are definitely issues where Parties talk a much harder game than what they deliver on when they are in power.
 

haxan7

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May 9, 2016
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We need several things. Abortion should be a state issue. Welfare needs to be far more restricted. Child support should not send men that cannot pay due to unemployment or underemployment to jail. Women who rape children, should not be able to get child support from those children. Women who lie about the father should not get child support from someone who's not the father.
Let states decide if women can have a doctor murder their children, got it. God help anyone born in California. Well I guess not born would be the correct term.
 
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OSC

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Let states decide if women can have a doctor murder their children, got it. God help anyone born in California. Well I guess not born would be the correct term.
well it could be ruled illegal at a national level, but that would get massive opposition.

Still with condoms, contraceptive pills, reversible sterilization surgery, morning after pill, etc. I still don't know how many don't use the resources available to them and simply go to abortion.