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News Brexit: Deal 'essentially impossible' after PM-Merkel call - UK PM office

MilkyJoe

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Just released


PM statement on negotiations with the EU: 16 October 2020
Prime Minister Boris Johnson made a statement on Brexit negotiations.
Published 16 October 2020
From:Prime Minister's Office, 10 Downing Street and The Rt Hon Boris Johnson MP

Delivered on:15 October 2020 (Transcript of the speech, exactly as it was delivered)
Good morning,
We left the EU on January 31 and delivered on the largest democratic mandate in the history of this country.
And since then we have been in a transition period obeying EU law, paying our fees – as a non-voting member – working on the future relationship we hope to enjoy with our friends and partners from January.
And from the outset we were totally clear that we wanted nothing more complicated than a Canada-style relationship, based on friendship and free trade.
To judge by the latest EU summit in Brussels that won’t work for our EU partners. They want the continued ability to control our legislative freedom, our fisheries, in a way that is obviously unacceptable to an independent country.
And since we have only ten weeks until the end of the transition period on January 1, I have to make a judgment about the likely outcome and to get us all ready.
And given that they have refused to negotiate seriously for much of the last few months, and given that this summit appears explicitly to rule out a Canada-style deal, I have concluded that we should get ready for January 1 with arrangements that are more like Australia’s based on simple principles of global free trade.
And we can do it, because we always knew that there would be change on January 1 whatever type of relationship we had.
And so now is the time for our businesses to get ready, and for hauliers to get ready, and for travellers to get ready.
And of course we are willing to discuss the practicalities with our friends where a lot of progress has already been made, by the way, on such issues as social security, and aviation, nuclear cooperation and so on.
But for whatever reason it is clear from the summit that after 45 years of membership they are not willing – unless there is some fundamental change of approach – to offer this country the same terms as Canada.
And so with high hearts and complete confidence we will prepare to embrace the alternative.
And we will prosper mightily as an independent free trading nation, controlling our own borders, our fisheries, and setting our own laws.
And in the meantime the government will be focussing on tackling COVID and building back better so that 2021 is a year of recovery and renewal.
Thank you very much.

Published 16 October 2020

 
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NickFire

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Hopefully the EU warms to the concept of freedom and the two sides work things out. If not the UK will be just fine.
 

Peter303

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I see he drops the globalist phrase "build back better" in at the end, just to remind you that you haven't really escaped and nothings really going to change for the better.
 

cormack12

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Still regretful we're leaving the EU from a personal perspective, having said that since COVID I think it's clear that there are other things that tank the economy in devastating fashion. You reach a point where thr cost of preservation is at the edge of making you bleed out. Either way we need to sort it out.
 

Jezbollah

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I hope we do not cave now. The EU have behaved like entitled cunts to try and wrap their tenticles around things they shouldnt touch.

I 100% bet we're going to hear soundbytes like them like some kind of vitrolic fruitloop girlfriend who just got dumped.
 

Stilton Disco

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I voted remain because I'm a cautious bugger and still naively thought we could help stop the EU going full retard.

The whole brexit negotiation process, and the utter balls up that has been the EU's handling of both Covid and right wing member states, has told me it's beyond hope, needs to fail, and that we are definitely better off out of its influence.

No deal will be painful, chaotic, and harm many jobs and industries in the short term.

In the long term though, being able to start from scratch, with no legal obligations to any country beyond those we choose to make, on a case by case basis, from here on out, that undeniably gives us the best possible chance for the strongest possible future for the country.
 
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MilkyJoe

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I hope we do not cave now. The EU have behaved like entitled cunts to try and wrap their tenticles around things they shouldnt touch.

I 100% bet we're going to hear soundbytes like them like some kind of vitrolic fruitloop girlfriend who just got dumped.
Daft cunts already said as far as they are concerned the negotiation resumes Monday 😂
 
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Turnt

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Yeah I noticed that. It's fucking creepy how that phrase is spreading around.
Last weekend The Sunday Times was reporting Boris is fairly sure Biden is going to win so has already started cozying up to him. I wonder if that’s another example of it.
 
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IDKFA

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Since 2010 the Tories have been nothing short of incompetent.

Where's this 'oven ready deal' Bojo?

What the fuck happened to the 'easiest deal in history'??

What happened to 'only a mad man would talk about leaving the single market'

What happened to the German car industry ensuring we'd get a good deal with the EU and stopping a no deal exit.

Even my 86 year old UKIP/Brexit Party voting Nan told me today that she didn't vote Brexit to leave without a deal.

I voted Brexit, but I didn't vote for leaving without a deal. Go back to 2016 and you won't find any prominent Leave leaders mentioning there was a risk of us leaving without a deal. None at all.

Leave voters have been taken for granted and fed a diet of lies and deceit.

The economy can't handle leaving without a deal on top of the damage already caused by the COVID-19. The only people who think otherwise are the political, rich elites like Jacob Rees Mogg, who would more than likely make a mint from a no deal (JRM's dad wrote a book about making a mint from economic disaster)

Not in my name Bojo............cunt.
 

MilkyJoe

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Since 2010 the Tories have been nothing short of incompetent.

Where's this 'oven ready deal' Bojo?

What the fuck happened to the 'easiest deal in history'??

What happened to 'only a mad man would talk about leaving the single market'

What happened to the German car industry ensuring we'd get a good deal with the EU and stopping a no deal exit.

Even my 86 year old UKIP/Brexit Party voting Nan told me today that she didn't vote Brexit to leave without a deal.

I voted Brexit, but I didn't vote for leaving without a deal. Go back to 2016 and you won't find any prominent Leave leaders mentioning there was a risk of us leaving without a deal. None at all.

Leave voters have been taken for granted and fed a diet of lies and deceit.

The economy can't handle leaving without a deal on top of the damage already caused by the COVID-19. The only people who think otherwise are the political, rich elites like Jacob Rees Mogg, who would more than likely make a mint from a no deal (JRM's dad wrote a book about making a mint from economic disaster)

Not in my name Bojo............cunt.
He's a complete cunt in all aspects, but the May deal is fucking terrible, he amended his bill to get it through parliament, with no intention of giving them that shit, you'd have to be blind to not have seen that after all this time. Even Boris is not as big of a cunt to let the EU have full access to our natural resources, last say on whether we bail out any of our industry, or let them tell us we can't out bid the EU on new business. No other independent country they have a deal with has anything like what they demanded of our sovereignty.
 

Hissing Sid

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I wouldn’t get the flags out just yet. Telling peeps to begin to ‘prepare’ for no deal isn’t saying we’re definitely going to no deal.

The language used by mop-head and co deliberately leaves wriggle room should the EU decide to stop fucking about and agree to the UK’s terms. We may yet end up with a deal.

Edit : And lets just remember that this is Pound-land Churchill we're talking about here, he's done more u-turns than a busy driving school.
 
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IDKFA

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He's a complete cunt in all aspects, but the May deal is fucking terrible, he amended his bill to get it through parliament, with no intention of giving them that shit, you'd have to be blind to not have seen that after all this time. Even Boris is not as big of a cunt to let the EU have full access to our natural resources, last say on whether we bail out any of our industry, or let them tell us we can't out bid the EU on new business. No other independent country they have a deal with has anything like what they demanded of our sovereignty.
I'm not saying any deal presented is perfect, but it's fucking better than leaving without a deal and causing further economic harm.

My issue with Brexit, which I'll remind people that I voted for, is that it was rushed. There was no need to pull the trigger on A50 that quickly. I remember the Vote Leave campaign making a big song and dance that leaving the EU wouldn't be rushed.

We needed to take time to come up with a coherent exit strategy that didn't cause economic harm. Instead we busted a nut on the first stroke and now look at us.

I also have an issue when the Brexit that was sold in 2016 which earned my vote, to the Brexit we're now getting, but that's a different rant for another day.

Another reason I'm so fucked off with this is because Brexit needed to be successful. Not in 50 years like JRM harped on about, but early on to show other EU member states it can be done.

I really, really dislike the EU and how it's morphing into a unified federal state, but do you think any other member state is going to want to leave after watching our car crash exit. Even Marine Le Pen has gone off taking France out of the EU and there doesn't appear to be a hunger elsewhere in the EU to leave the club. If Brexit was successful then others would follow. We could have shown the rest of the members that it can be done with a well thought out and sensible plan, instead the Tories fucked it and fucked us over in the process.
 

YCoCg

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So Scotland can leave now right? That's all promises broken and spat on from the 2014 agreement.
 

IDKFA

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Tories gonna Tory.

May should have held a 2nd referendum on the subject to find out what kind of brexit, from no deal wto to Norway style, the people wanted.
Maybe. The people voted once. I believe the Tories should have been held to account for the Brexit that they and the Leave campaign promised the people in 2016. If they knew this vision of Brexit was impossible, then they should have been honest and said:

"Look, that Brexit from 2016 we promised you was pie in the sky stuff. Not possible. Still fancy going ahead? If so, we'll probably leave without a deal. Any takers?"

Then, maybe we could have debated a second vote. I don't like the idea of a second vote, but the alternative was the Tories just making it up as they went along.
 

NeilH1982

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What a shame. Poor Uk have to fend of the whole world on their own. I'm sure they'll manage well enough. It's kind of their thing, you know
 

Saturnman

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What a shame. Poor Uk have to fend of the whole world on their own. I'm sure they'll manage well enough. It's kind of their thing, you know
Managing decline is their thing.

I wonder which part of the UK will break off first. Northern Ireland or Scotland?
 

NeilH1982

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Managing decline is their thing.

I wonder which part of the UK will break off first. Northern Ireland or Scotland?
That won't neccesarilly make anything better for them. Remember the EU already told them they would have to apply like any other nation. Granted, they pretty much tick all neccesary boxes for membership but we're still talking 5 years at least. Lots of things can change over such a timespan. Add to that the strain the pandemic is putting on the European Union. Lots of unhappy agreements going on now and a palpable change in the feeling under the populace. I wouldn't be surprised if we see another one or two nations leave in that 5 year time span.

Europe is pulling to the right, that's going to cause a lot of strife.
 
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Saturnman

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That won't neccesarilly make anything better for them. Remember the EU already told them they would have to apply like any other nation. Granted, they pretty much tick all neccesary boxes for membership but we're still talking 5 years at least. Lots of things can change over such a timespan. Add to that the strain the pandemic is putting on the European Union. Lots of unhappy agreements going on now and a palpable change in the feeling under the populace. I wouldn't be surprised if we see another one or two nations leave in that 5 year time span.

Europe is pulling to the right, that's going to cause a lot of strife.
The UK is still more likely to break off (without necessarily being a certainty). There's already enough support in Scotland for it, in part because of the contrasting Covid-19 responses as handled by Edinburg and London, on top of wanting to stay within the EU and honoring the good friday agreement.

Brexit might have been a precedent for the EU, but it also serves as a pretty stern warning for any delinquent EU member who might think they'd be better off on their own.
 

NeilH1982

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The UK is still more likely to break off (without necessarily being a certainty). There's already enough support in Scotland for it, in part because of the contrasting Covid-19 responses as handled by Edinburg and London, on top of wanting to stay within the EU and honoring the good friday agreement.

Brexit might have been a precedent for the EU, but it also serves as a pretty stern warning for any delinquent EU member who might think they'd be better off on their own.
The same thing is happening to the EU. A lot of strife and unhappy agreements. Add to that the last failed expansion attempts and disgruntlement between north and south Europe which is only growing more and more as Southern Europe stalls reform
 

hariseldon

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The UK is still more likely to break off (without necessarily being a certainty). There's already enough support in Scotland for it, in part because of the contrasting Covid-19 responses as handled by Edinburg and London, on top of wanting to stay within the EU and honoring the good friday agreement.

Brexit might have been a precedent for the EU, but it also serves as a pretty stern warning for any delinquent EU member who might think they'd be better off on their own.
Scotland has just had the benefit of a supine press never questioning the wisdom of Herr Sturgeon. Boris on the other hand has the press begging for lockdown and berating him fornot doing enough of it.
 
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Stilton Disco

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I'd say the total shambles negotiations have been, the broad incompetence of May's leadership, lack of willingness by the EU to accept they can't control us, Boris' lack of firm vision and direction and the petty indifference elites in government, the media, the press and globalists of all stripes have shown towards the British people, is proof positive that a no deal Brexit is the only good option available to us.

If anyone involved in these negotiations, or who realistically could be involved with them, gave the slightest shit about what was best for the ordinary citizens they represent, then we would have a deal that works in the peoples interests while respecting their right to choose who governs them.

But we don't have that. We can't have that.

So let's be grateful we're getting out of the mess that is the EU without any strings attached, since that means none of these bastards were able to screw us over.
 

Danteyke223

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So let's be grateful we're getting out of the mess that is the EU without any strings attached, since that means none of these bastards were able to screw us over.
Excellent...fuck the Brussels Euro Trash.

Now they're going to get exactly what they so desperately wanted to avoid, a major economy on their doorstep, completely free of their rules & political control.

Next, we just have to deal with that seditious little cunt, Sturgeon and her cohorts.
Or you know, they'll redirect trade to ports in the Netherlands. This whole Brexit thing is just dumb, and could have been handled better. Ah well. let's see what 2021 brings.
 

Marlenus

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So let's be grateful we're getting out of the mess that is the EU without any strings attached, since that means none of these bastards were able to screw us over
No deal will hurt a lot of people, still the people voted to leave and they voted to put the Tories in charge of it so we get what was voted for whether we want it or not.
 

MilkyJoe

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No deal will hurt a lot of people, still the people voted to leave and they voted to put the Tories in charge of it so we get what was voted for whether we want it or not.
No deal is far better than the level playing field and the EU deciding on whether we can support our own industry. Have a long hard think what that means.
 

Cato

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No deal is far better than the level playing field and the EU deciding on whether we can support our own industry. Have a long hard think what that means.
UK will be fine.
So january 1, ag products from ireland will suddenly become 15% more expensive?
Australia can live with that, a fast tracked trade deal with au and nz will make their ag products suddenly 15% cheaper.

A swing in 30% pricewise against irish producers is sure going to hurt big time.

Bring it. We in oz are ready and willing to trade with you.
 

MilkyJoe

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UK will be fine.
So january 1, ag products from ireland will suddenly become 15% more expensive?
Australia can live with that, a fast tracked trade deal with au and nz will make their ag products suddenly 15% cheaper.

A swing in 30% pricewise against irish producers is sure going to hurt big time.

Bring it. We in oz are ready and willing to trade with you.
What do we buy from Ireland anyway? Mud? Guinness is brewed under licence here already...
 

Cato

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What do we buy from Ireland anyway? Mud? Guinness is brewed under licence here already...
A LOT of ag products. Meat, milk, grain, ...

I don't have the numbers in front of me but I recall a substantional part of irish ag exports, maybe even the majority, went to uk, which is to be expected due to their geographical nearness
 
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Stilton Disco

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A LOT of ag products. Meat, milk, grain, ...

I don't have the numbers in front of me but I recall a substantional part of irish ag exports, maybe even the majority, went to uk, which is to be expected due to their geographical nearness
We can also produce a lot of this ourselves.

Hell we used to produce a huge amount more than Ireland now provde, but due to the EU single market, it was cheaper to import than buy our own, so the industry declined.

Even without the inevitable deals we'll likely make with A/NZ and the like, our own produce will now be cheaper than imports, so there will actually be far less of a price increase than the full 15% that is being banded about.

Doing so will also help farmers that have been struggling to compete with the rest of the EU for decades, and keep more of our money in the country

Sure, there will be short term shortages and likely minor price increases, but down the road we have potential to be better off overall, both with the deals we can make now being more favourable, and in helping our own farmers.

Sucks for the Irish of course, but it's not like they can't leave the EU themselves if it's that important to them.
 
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Marlenus

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No deal is far better than the level playing field and the EU deciding on whether we can support our own industry. Have a long hard think what that means.
The same will apply to any trade deal with a larger economy. If we want a deal with the US or the EU we will have to make concessions. The question is what set of concessions are least bad.

Even without the inevitable deals we'll likely make with A/NZ and the like, our own produce will now be cheaper than imports, so there will actually be far less of a price increase than the full 15% that is being banded about.

Doing so will also held farmers that have been struggling to compete with the rest of the EU for decades, and keep more of our money in the country
Sure but it is a question of time frame. If these farmers knew in 2016 that we would be leaving without a deal at the end of 2020 they could have invested in scaling up their operations to supply the UK market.

The fact we are 10 weeks away and nothing is set in stone is a complete shambles. How can any cash strapped business plan for the future when they have no clue what the future is going to look like.
 

hariseldon

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The same will apply to any trade deal with a larger economy. If we want a deal with the US or the EU we will have to make concessions. The question is what set of concessions are least bad.



Sure but it is a question of time frame. If these farmers knew in 2016 that we would be leaving without a deal at the end of 2020 they could have invested in scaling up their operations to supply the UK market.

The fact we are 10 weeks away and nothing is set in stone is a complete shambles. How can any cash strapped business plan for the future when they have no clue what the future is going to look like.
Businesses are great at adapting when a market changes. It doesn’t happen by diktat, it happens organically. More demand will give them more for their produce and their income will grow allowing them to invest in expanding. That’s how capitalism works.
 

Cato

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We can also produce a lot of this ourselves.

Hell we used to produce a huge amount more than Ireland now provde, but due to the EU single market, it was cheaper to import than buy our own, so the industry declined.

Even without the inevitable deals we'll likely make with A/NZ and the like, our own produce will now be cheaper than imports, so there will actually be far less of a price increase than the full 15% that is being banded about.

Doing so will also help farmers that have been struggling to compete with the rest of the EU for decades, and keep more of our money in the country

Sure, there will be short term shortages and likely minor price increases, but down the road we have potential to be better off overall, both with the deals we can make now being more favourable, and in helping our own farmers.

Sucks for the Irish of course, but it's not like they can't leave the EU themselves if it's that important to them.
I see. That is even better than I thought. You need a solid base of domestic ag industry.
The same will apply to any trade deal with a larger economy. If we want a deal with the US or the EU we will have to make concessions. The question is what set of concessions are least bad.



Sure but it is a question of time frame. If these farmers knew in 2016 that we would be leaving without a deal at the end of 2020 they could have invested in scaling up their operations to supply the UK market.

The fact we are 10 weeks away and nothing is set in stone is a complete shambles. How can any cash strapped business plan for the future when they have no clue what the future is going to look like.
No one is going to starve. If it means that prices go up by 5% and there is a shortage. If they need to, companies will start flying 747s chock full of Australian lamb, Argentinian beef, NZ dairy products to UK within 24 hours.
You drop 15% tariff and then there will be a shitload of imports available to you that suddenly becomes profitable,
even if the exported needs to lease a 747 to deliver it to you.
Until you ramp up your domestic ag production that is.
(but once you taste AU lamb you might not want to switch to non-AU lamb :)

This people will starve narrative is nonsense. There is food available globally and a modest increase in price will get you unbounded amounts of food to your doorstep within days.

EDIT: Hey, you need to ship 50 tonnes of lamb cutlets to the UK from Australia once every 6 hours?
No problem. Just dial up AirItalia ask them if they have a few dozen big, to be converted to freight planes, aircrafts and how much it would cost.
If there is a market there is a supply.
 
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Stilton Disco

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The same will apply to any trade deal with a larger economy. If we want a deal with the US or the EU we will have to make concessions. The question is what set of concessions are least bad.



Sure but it is a question of time frame. If these farmers knew in 2016 that we would be leaving without a deal at the end of 2020 they could have invested in scaling up their operations to supply the UK market.

The fact we are 10 weeks away and nothing is set in stone is a complete shambles. How can any cash strapped business plan for the future when they have no clue what the future is going to look like.
Oh I fully expect it to be a total shit show for the first 6 months. Major shortages, prices all over the place, chaos at the ports, leading to surrounding counties main transport routes turning into carparks, and major job losses and the economy tanking.

But like the chaos and shortages caused by Covid early in the year, supermarkets and wholesalers will quickly find alternatives, business that can pivot to fill the gaps will, and new business opportunities will arise.

I expect things to be harder then they would have been until 2025 at the most, before we start to see overall improvements over what's going on in a lot of the EU, which I see having less of a harsh transition, but being far less able to adapt to such a major part of the common market having buggered off, because we've seen what an incompetent and counterproductive bunch of gits their beurocrats are that will be trying to fix the mess on their side.
 

Marlenus

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Businesses are great at adapting when a market changes. It doesn’t happen by diktat, it happens organically. More demand will give them more for their produce and their income will grow allowing them to invest in expanding. That’s how capitalism works.
Demand won't just grow though, it will spike which means shortages and or price hikes until demand can be met, which with lead times in farming can be several months or longer.

It is one thing when demand outstrips supply on a luxury good like a 3080 but totally different when that good is a basic necessity like food.

This people will starve narrative is nonsense. There is food available globally and a modest increase in price will get you unbounded amounts of food to your doorstep within days.
There is already plenty of food poverty in this country. Even small price hikes will impact many people.

Oh I fully expect it to be a total shit show for the first 6 months. Major shortages, prices all over the place, chaos at the ports, leading to surrounding counties main transport routes turning into carparks, and major job losses and the economy tanking.
Agreed but a lot of the damage could have been avoided by proper planning but all the government has done since the referendum is shoot from the hip.