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Crowder on David Reimer : Famous gender study

desertdroog

Member
Aug 12, 2008
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A radical study by doing experiments on twins?

Hmm.. who was famous for that kind of scientific work? Oh yeah, Josef Mengle, the Auschwitz "Angel of Death".


[NOTE: No Godwin's law was invoked as Dr. Mengle was not Hitler.]
 

infinitys_7th

Gold Member
Oct 1, 2006
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If you want some more in-depth history on what exactly Money did, here is a great article written after Reimer's suicide:


David’s infant “sex reassignment” was the first ever conducted on a developmentally normal child. (Money had helped to pioneer the procedure in hermaphrodites.) And according to Money’s published reports through the 1970s, the experiment was a success. The twins were happy in their assigned roles: Brian a rough and tumble boy, his sister Brenda a happy little girl. Money was featured in Time magazine and included a chapter on the twins in his famous textbook Man & Woman, Boy & Girl.

The reality was far more complicated. At age 2, Brenda angrily tore off her dresses. She refused to play with dolls and would beat up her brother and seize his toy cars and guns. In school, she was relentlessly teased for her masculine gait, tastes, and behaviors. She complained to her parents and teachers that she felt like a boy; the adults—on Dr. Money’s strict orders of secrecy—insisted that she was only going through a phase. Meanwhile, Brenda’s guilt-ridden mother attempted suicide; her father lapsed into mute alcoholism; the neglected Brian eventually descended into drug use, pretty crime, and clinical depression.

When Brenda was 14, a local psychiatrist convinced her parents that their daughter must be told the truth. David later said about the revelation: “Suddenly it all made sense why I felt the way I did. I wasn’t some sort of weirdo. I wasn’t crazy.”

David soon embarked on the painful process of converting back to his biological sex. A double mastectomy removed the breasts that had grown as a result of estrogen therapy; multiple operations, involving grafts and plastic prosthesis, created an artificial penis and testicles. Regular testosterone injections masculinized his musculature. Yet David was depressed over what he believed was the impossibility of his ever marrying. He twice attempted suicide in his early 20s.

David did eventually marry a big-hearted woman named Jane, but his dark moods persisted. He was plagued by shaming memories of the frightening annual visits to Dr. Money, who used pictures of naked adults to “reinforce” Brenda’s gender identity and who pressed her to have further surgery on her “vagina.”

When David was almost 30, he met Dr. Milton Diamond, a psychologist at the University of Hawaii and a longtime rival of Dr. Money. A biologist by training, Diamond had always been curious about the fate of the famous twin, especially after Money mysteriously stopped publishing follow-ups in the late 1970s. Through Diamond, David learned that the supposed success of his sex reassignment had been used to legitimize the widespread use of infant sex change in cases of hermaphroditism and genital injury. Outraged, David agreed to participate in a follow-up by Dr. Diamond, whose myth-shattering paper (co-authored by Dr. Keith Sigmundson) was published in Archives of Pediatrics and Adolescent Medicine in March 1997 and was featured on front pages across the globe.
So the experiment hailed as proof that gender is mostly to wholely learned was a complete failure and actually lends evidence to the opposite conclusion - gender is an intrinsic aspect of us even from as young as two years of age. And, of course, that ignores that John Money showed poor to a child and giddily filmed him and his brother having simulated sex for his "research", contributing to both of them killing themselves and obvious sexual abuse PTSD in David.

And, for receipts, John Money also defended bestiality:

 
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Breakage

Member
Mar 3, 2014
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It's remarkable how this stuff has been swept under the carpet. Thanks to this bs we now have clinics such as the Tavistock clinic here in London prescribing “puberty blockers” to children. And stories with headlines like this:

Government advises schools that transgender boys need access to free
period products

 

matt404au

Cyberbully
Apr 25, 2009
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Straya
I'm not a fan of Crowder, but I appreciate him bringing the important yet incredibly tragic David Reimer case to the attention of more people.
Why don’t you like him? I’ve found him pretty funny when I’ve seen him on YouTube. Fairly benign humour tempered by his religion as far as I can tell.
 
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Ailynn

Faith - Hope - Love
Jan 1, 2017
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Why don’t you like him? I’ve found him pretty funny when I’ve seen him on YouTube. Fairly benign humour tempered by his religion as far as I can tell.
I don't necessarily dislike him...I just find him a bit too mean-spirited at times. He may have changed a bit toward dysphoric trans people since his interview with Blaire White, though.
 
Apr 18, 2020
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It's remarkable how this stuff has been swept under the carpet. Thanks to this bs we now have clinics such as the Tavistock clinic here in London prescribing “puberty blockers” to children. And stories with headlines like this:

Government advises schools that transgender boys need access to free
period products

So females transitioning to male deserve free period products, is the implication here that girls don't?
 
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Apr 18, 2020
78
137
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USA
Why don’t you like him? I’ve found him pretty funny when I’ve seen him on YouTube. Fairly benign humour tempered by his religion as far as I can tell.
A lot of right leaning people I know actually have issue with Crowder because he comes off as an asshole, and they fear this misrepresents the right. I find him pretty funny though, and he's actually shown himself to have a nice streak, like when he showed two girls how to use a gun. He was very fatherly in that video, made me view him differently.
 
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Breakage

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Mar 3, 2014
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So females transitioning to male deserve free period products, is the implication here that girls don't?
Nah, it's about extending free period products to the following:

From the article:
It went on to explain that free period products should be available to “learners who do not identify as female but still have periods, for instance, transgender boys and non-binary learners”.

That's the crazy world we now live in.
 

Scotty W

Member
Sep 29, 2019
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Its crazy that the whole house of cards was built on a failed experiment and BS.
It is even crazier if you think about this as just another outgrowth of the replication crisis which affects decades of psychological studies. What other dogmas are untrue? What effect would the revelation of these untruths have on our society- a society which has patterned itself on these untruths?