Dark1x of Digital Foundry says that he noticed a odd trend of a few games starting to perform better on PS4 Pro than Xbox One X

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I am arguing about the power of the consoles itself, not how the game runs. If a console has much better resolution while just loosing some fps (obviously depends on how big is the difference), that console has better performance (say power if you want) because it’s cristal clear that at the same resolution, the xbox would have much better performance.



Whatever.

So you're making your own stupid argument when no one said anything about power of consoles just to get upset when it didn't work? lol
 
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He’s pretty much saying that Pro has a better FPS because the X has the ability to push games to 4K, in which devs take advantage of that. Which naturally reduces its FPS because of the Jaguar CPU’s. It’s not because of FP16/8TF magic.

Pro performs better in that department but honestly it needs an asterisk. Since it’s performing better under certain circumstances. But hey, both consoles are great overall.
 
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What are you trying to say? Pro have better performace than X in that game.


What? Ignorance seems to not read what he said I guess.

The resolution is higher on X but the performance is lower on DMC5... the higher resolution is worth if the game play worst?


Stop please.

If a game in 720p runs at 60fps and the other in 4k at 50fps the 720p game has better performance.

It is even common on PC to drop resolution and setthings to reach better performance... it is even ideal.

That is the definition of performance.
You quoted me completely out of place to the article, and tried to make it look like I said something I didn’t in context.

That is as dishonest as they come and now I’m really offended.

Don’t do this ever.
 
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I guess I get your confusion... power is not the same concept of performance.

And no... it is not crystal clear that using the same resolution it will performed better... sometimes the bootleneck for lower performance is not related to resolution so even dropping to 720p won’t make it increase the framerate.
I know it’s not the same concept, i was speaking about console performance not game performance. I should have talked about power though to make my point clearer.

And about the bottleneck, in such similar architectures, most of the time the difference it is resolution related.
 
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So you're making your own stupid argument when no one said anything about power of consoles just to get upset when it didn't work? lol
What? Who is getting upset here?🤣. This thread is all about which console is more powerfull and you have talked nonsense about why the ps4pro is being better many times in this same thread.

I’m sincerely in awe. I’ve been reading GAF at least for the last 10 years, and you are one of the most crazy posters i’ve just crossed words with.

You are wrong, people point why you are wrong, and you keep telling the same story. So, whatever.
 
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You quoted me completely out of place to the article, and tried to make it look like I said something I didn’t in context.

That is as dishonest as they come and now I’m really offended.

Don’t do this ever.
You called somebody ignorant when he was right to support something that was wrong... c’mon.
 
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You called somebody ignorant when he was right to support something that was wrong... c’mon.
Not in that context or in that arguement, You took my post and tried to apply it to something we weren’t even taking about.

That is a big faux paus in my books.
 
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Not in that context or in that arguement, You took my post and tried to apply it to something we weren’t even taking about.

That is a big faux paus in my books.
If I offended you the I ask for apologies but you will apologize to who you called ignorant when he said nothing wrong related to the quoted conversation? The context was DMC5 has better performance on Pro than X.
 
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What? Who is getting upset here?🤣. This thread is all about which console is more powerfull and you have talked nonsense about why the ps4pro is being better many times in this same thread.

I’m sincerely in awe. I’ve been reading GAF at least for the last 10 years, and you are one of the most crazy posters i’ve just crossed words with.

You are wrong, people point why you are wrong, and you keep telling the same story. So, whatever.
You're living in a fantasy this thread is not all about which console is more powerful & I have not said that PS4 Pro is better in this thread.

Where are you even coming from?
 
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If I offended you the I ask for apologies but you will apologize to who you called ignorant when he said nothing wrong related to the quoted conversation? The context was DMC5 has better performance on Pro than X.
Look I don’t mind having honest discussions, or even honest arguments about stuff like this.

But why?

Why do you guys use quotes out of context? Why do you use sales numbers that don’t add up?

How does this help at all? It only weakens your argument instead of reinforcing it.
 
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Look I don’t mind having honest discussions, or even honest arguments about stuff like this.

But why?

Why do you guys use quotes out of context? Why do you use sales numbers that don’t add up?

How does this help at all? It only weakens your argument instead of reinforcing it.
Wut?

You quoted somebody saying that a game didn’t perform better on Pro because it has lower resolution saying to not bother with the other ignorance that said the Pro perform better in that game.

That is the only context of the what you quoted.

FACT: Pro indeed performs better in DMC5 that X.

BTW I just use official tracker sales numbers that obvious add up unless it is an estimate that I always make clear in the post but if you want to play the victim then show me where I posted sales didn’t add up.
 
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You're living in a fantasy this thread is not all about which console is more powerful & I have not said that PS4 Pro is better in this thread.

Where are you even coming from?
The last word i say about this: just look inside this thread how many people just said to not bother arguing with you. Enjoy.
 

c0de

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You are still completely wrong.

No matter the resolution if a console is running with lower framerate it has lower performance.

I guess I get your confusion... power is not the same concept of performance.

XB1 X has more power than Pro that will never change.
In DMC5 Pro has better performance than XB1 X and that can change for better or worst with patches depending on optimizations.

And no... it is not crystal clear that using the same resolution it will performed better... sometimes the bootleneck for lower performance is not related to resolution so even dropping to 720p won’t make it increase the framerate.
It's funny because I remember by the beginning of the current gen you were quite vocal about resolution differences and how they affect gamers in shooters, for example, because you can see better at a higher resolution to make out details 😄
 
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It's funny because I remember by the beginning of the current gen you were quite vocal about resolution differences and how they affect gamers in shooters, for example, because you can see better at a higher resolution to make out details 😄
For long distance shooting and snipers? Probably.
 

Faust

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I have removed the derailing posts. Let's focus on the conversation at hand (the topic of the thread) and stop with the continued derails and petty insults.

Thank you.
 
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I find it hilrious that people still search for a power advantage over the OneX. And its hilarious that we have people that scream that the pro is better because of a 3-4 fps difference you wont notice at all lol

And we should keep in mind that with DMC we only have seen the first mission with the demo. Who knows how later levels and the final game will perform.
 
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It's funny because I remember by the beginning of the current gen you were quite vocal about resolution differences and how they affect gamers in shooters, for example, because you can see better at a higher resolution to make out details 😄
It affect long range sniper aim.

But PS4 had both resolution and performance advantage (or parity).

Performance > resolution but both are good... if you already have performance they why not have resolution too.

It is the complete opposite for some X games focusing in resolution in detriment of performance.
 
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Lort

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Lets keep it simple in the console war

Xbox one x > ps4 pro > ps4 > xbox one s

If the xbox one x is set to the same res as the ps4 pro .. it will have a higher frame rate... end of story.
 
Nov 5, 2016
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I don't care where (just far)
One of the issues with TLW is he never reply's to acknowledge something, for example. The next gen racing thread. TLW will say XBX achieves 4k 60fps on Forza 7 because it has 30fps mirrors. I say no it has 60fps mirrors, he totally ignores it then he pipes up a few weeks later saying the same thing. What the fuck is that all about.
It's all little things like that and i forgot lots more has i just don't read what he says now. It's no good for the threads or the forum and those of us who like to discuss the differences and he brings out the worst of a lot of us.
He acts and treats people in real life like he does on here, Oh man he wouldn't be able to walk the streets.
Are GAFers legally obligated to respond to every reply/mention?

For me, personally, there are many times I find myself not interested in debating/challenging/clapping back because that particular topic just isn’t my hill to die on.

Given how how things tend to escalate sometimes, I can understand that approach, situationally

Edit: typos like a MFer
 
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Lort

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Are GAFers legally obligated to respond to every reply/mention?

For me, personally, there are many times I find myself not interested in debating/challengingc/clapping back because that particular topic just isn’t my hill to die on.

Given how how things tend to esclate sometimes, I can understand that approach, situationally
His pointing out that some people push known misinformation continuoisly and that appears in his case at least to be acceptable behaviour. Ive flagged him for it and the mods responded by saying they instructed him to rein it in.
 
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You won’t play hypothetical modes.
Unfortunately, this is true.

For example, I never understood why Witcher 3 on PS4 Pro never got a 60 fps mode (with a lower resolution of course)... the CPU difference is minimal (2.13 vs 2.3 GHz).

Locked 30 fps is a shame, because the exact same game will run at 30 fps on PS5 (unless it gets yet another patch, which is highly unlikely).

Locked and unlocked fps options need to become the norm. Killzone Shadow Fall had it since day 1.

XB1X is a far more capable machine, but MS seems to have an insistence on delivering true 4K, even if you have a 1080p display. They're a software company, I'm pretty sure they can offer an option for native 1080p + higher fps.
 
Nov 5, 2016
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I don't care where (just far)
His pointing out that some people push known misinformation continuoisly and that appears in his case at least to be acceptable behaviour. Ive flagged him for it and the mods responded by saying they instructed him to rein it in.
The thing is, at this point there’s so much animosity (albeit somewhat justified) that everyone, including TLW, knows that everything he posts, whether valid or egregious, will result in at least 10 replies, everytime, for every post, ranging from articulate and intelligent rebuttals to “why the fuck isn’t this troll clown banned.”

Every time.

I can see at a certain point you just say you what you want to say and charge blindly, protected by obliviousness (is this a word)?

I mean he can’t win. There are a number of people that only want to see him banned no matter what. How do you have a discussion when you keep getting needles with those kind of replies?

I mean a couple days ago someone referenced TLW tweets and posts from other forums. What’s the obsession?

Sorry for typos
 
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Lort

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Jul 9, 2017
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Unfortunately, this is true.

For example, I never understood why Witcher 3 on PS4 Pro never got a 60 fps mode (with a lower resolution of course)... the CPU difference is minimal (2.13 vs 2.3 GHz).

Locked 30 fps is a shame, because the exact same game will run at 30 fps on PS5 (unless it gets yet another patch, which is highly unlikely).

Locked and unlocked fps options need to become the norm. Killzone Shadow Fall had it since day 1.

XB1X is a far more capable machine, but MS seems to have an insistence on delivering true 4K, even if you have a 1080p display. They're a software company, I'm pretty sure they can offer an option for native 1080p + higher fps.
There was no ability to super sample on the os level for Playstation Pro so the gaming community wanted the console to always play in 4k so you get supersampling.

Quite a few games have 1080p or the even more preferable scalable res and prioritise frame rate mode. Hopefully more devs do this in future its not really up to MS as they have said before its up to the dev to choose what modes and reolutions they offer. Some games are not 4k on the xbox one x but most are which a great outcome really since they advertised it as a 4k console.
 
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Lets keep it simple in the console war

Xbox one x > ps4 pro > ps4 > xbox one s

If the xbox one x is set to the same res as the ps4 pro .. it will have a higher frame rate... end of story.
I think its the perception or goalposts that have been moved...at the start of the gen the xbox one had better framerates on its games as it was running at a lower res..now the one x came along the argument then shifts back to the framerate
if the x put it in 1080p and unlocked the framerate they would argue about something else like the price difference or userbase size
 
I think its the perception or goalposts that have been moved...at the start of the gen the xbox one had better framerates on its games as it was running at a lower res..now the one x came along the argument then shifts back to the framerate
if the x put it in 1080p and unlocked the framerate they would argue about something else like the price difference or userbase size
I undertand completely and I won’t even argue, because this kind of thing happens with console warz.

I still don’t think constantly calling for his ban (as one or two people tend to do) is productive though
 
Likes: DeepEnigma
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The thing is, at this point there’s so much animosity (albeit somewhat justified) that everyone, including TLW, knows that everything he posts, whether valid or egregious, will result in at least 10 replies, everytime, for every post, ranging from articulate and intelligent rebuttals to “why the fuck isn’t this troll clown banned.”

Every time.

I can see at a certain point you just say you what you want to say and charge blindly, protected by obliviousness (is this a word)?

I mean he can’t win. There are a number of people that only want to see him banned no matter what. How do you have a discussion when you keep getting needles with those kind of replies?

I mean a couple days ago someone referenced TLW tweets and posts from other forums. What’s the obsession?

Sorry for typos
Straight up obsession. It's funny because some of these people don't look at the shit sitting in their own backyard while flinging it themselves.

Console warz gonna rage on.
 
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I think it’s obvious that Microsoft needs to add the option to choose between 4K or higher FPS.

Are GAFers legally obligated to respond to every reply/mention?

For me, personally, there are many times I find myself not interested in debating/challenging/clapping back because that particular topic just isn’t my hill to die on.

Given how how things tend to escalate sometimes, I can understand that approach, situationally

Edit: typos like a MFer
Yeah sure, but when he writes a novel and someone attempts to refutes it or offer a rebuttal he doesn’t respond to them, he acts like the post doesn’t exist and continues with his narrative. I mean it’s obvious he favors PlayStation by a large margin which is ok, I like PlayStation too but simply dismissing posts that challenge his way of thinking isn’t a great way to make discussion.
 
Likes: Bogroll
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There is no trend btw. All new games run/perform better on Xbox one x except Japanese games maybe. But the division 2, apex legends etc. all run/look better on X

Don’t be so delusional. Thanks.
 
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Unfortunately, this is true.

For example, I never understood why Witcher 3 on PS4 Pro never got a 60 fps mode (with a lower resolution of course)... the CPU difference is minimal (2.13 vs 2.3 GHz).

Locked 30 fps is a shame, because the exact same game will run at 30 fps on PS5 (unless it gets yet another patch, which is highly unlikely).

Locked and unlocked fps options need to become the norm. Killzone Shadow Fall had it since day 1.

XB1X is a far more capable machine, but MS seems to have an insistence on delivering true 4K, even if you have a 1080p display. They're a software company, I'm pretty sure they can offer an option for native 1080p + higher fps.
Some games can’t reach 60fps even at 720p.

PS4 CPU (including Pro) is too weak... needs to check benchmarks of The Witcher 3 to see if is the case.
 
Jun 28, 2011
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Some games can’t reach 60fps even at 720p.

PS4 CPU (including Pro) is too weak... needs to check benchmarks of The Witcher 3 to see if is the case.
Witcher 3 cannot even run at 720p 60 fps on PS4 Pro? 4.2 Teraflops should be more than enough...

Regarding the CPU, XB1X also has a Jaguar one, albeit 8% higher clocked. The difference is minimal and yet, CD Projekt RED offered a 60 fps mode only on XB1X. That's weird.

Anyway, I know that not even XB1X can reach locked 60 fps everywhere (I'm looking at you Novigrad), but it's a future-proof version that will run flawlessly on next-gen XBOX. Not so much on PS5...

Both games and OSes should offer more options. If Sony can offer an option to disable SSAA, then I'm pretty sure Microsoft can do the same. They're a software company, right?
 
Mar 19, 2013
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Witcher 3 cannot even run at 720p 60 fps on PS4 Pro? 4.2 Teraflops should be more than enough...

Regarding the CPU, XB1X also has a Jaguar one, albeit 8% higher clocked. The difference is minimal and yet, CD Projekt RED offered a 60 fps mode only on XB1X. That's weird.

Anyway, I know that not even XB1X can reach locked 60 fps everywhere (I'm looking at you Novigrad), but it's a future-proof version that will run flawlessly on next-gen XBOX. Not so much on PS5...

Both games and OSes should offer more options. If Sony can offer an option to disable SSAA, then I'm pretty sure Microsoft can do the same. They're a software company, right?
Then seems weird to not have a 60fps mode for Pro if the game is not CPU-bound.
 
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I think it’s obvious that Microsoft needs to add the option to choose between 4K or higher FPS.
Horizon 4 handled this well on the X, a 4K/30 pretty mode and a 1080/60 performance mode that use less effects to keep a solidly locked 60fps. Stuttering framerates in a racing game is shit, so it's nice that both modes are locked at a set framerate and never waver. It's one game but it's a start. I hope that any future X games offer people the option as well. It would be nice for options like AA, AF, etc to be hardware selectable as well. I know a lot of people that are more than happy to watch jaggies all day and night if it means their games run smoother.
 
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GoldenEye98

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The X1 got a massive boost in terms of GPU and memory but not CPU...so the resolution is being pushed much more than the other systems but the CPU struggles slightly with maintaining a stable FPS.

So I guess you could argue that isn't as balanced a system as the others. But at the end of the day it's still performs the best overall.
 
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LMJ

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For me it's not hard to give credit where credit's due, the Xbox x is obviously the most powerful console currently available, followed by the Pro followed by the PS4 followed by the X one, let's get that out of the way right now.

However, I think what many people continue to forget is that developers are programming for the base consoles PS4 and Xbox One. Whether you like it or not there is a power discrepancy in the opposite direction on those two systems.

I think developers that have enough man power or money ultimately find ways around this such as Red Dead Redemption 2, but I think a lot of the time what many developers do is just program for the base consoles and then just Brute Force the other consoles to make up for the weaknesses of the base.

Because of that I think we continue to see the XbX reach for the highest possible resolution and at times it hurts the overall frames per second, creating the issue in the first place at least that's my take.
 
Likes: NickFire
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The long and short of it is as follows, all of these detracting or like-minded performing games are coming from Japanese studios, but let's be real here. What is the common trend with these games aside from being Japanese?

They're 60 FPS targeting titles. What becomes less of a factor at higher framerate and what becomes more of a factor? Well games are more CPU bound than GPU bound, and I'm going to separate these a bit so things become more clear.

  • Ace Combat 7: Same 1080p resolution on X and Pro but X performs slightly worse. This is unacceptable and there's no rational reason for this aside from lazy developers.

  • Resident Evil 2: The game pushes the same 1620p resolution on the Pro and X but the X has better performance in gameplay. The X also uses better/more AA which produces a softer image but nonetheless it makes it more demanding. So you have a better framerate plus a more demanding AA implementation.

  • Kingdom Hearts III: The game is 1440p on the X while 1296p on the Pro, that's a 24% higher resolution on the X. On top of this it holds its framerate better than the Pro by a decent margin. Only when switching the Pro to 1080p by force does the Pro command a lead, and it's a small lead simply giving it the ability to hold 60 more easily than the X, but it still drops, it's maybe a 2.5% framerate improvement, but now the X has a 78% higher resolution than the Pro while nearly performing the same.

  • Devil May Cry V: The Xbox One X is rendering at 3840x2160 while the Pro is rendering at 3072x1728. The X is rendering a 56% higher resolution than the Pro, and again like Resident Evil 2 it's running better AA which again is more demanding. During normal gameplay the X seems to hold to 60 more often than not, only at the Goliath battle do things really deviate. In that instance the Pro averages about a 4 FPS advantage, but remember the resolution and AA, and also remember this is code seen at Gamescom from months ago so further optimization was no doubt done.

These are all 60 FPS titles, the differences are going to be diminished and choices are going to yield strange results not seen on typical 30 FPS games. There's no trend, the Pro didn't get some FP16 8.4 Teraflop secret sauce, there's simply a lack of context addressing these games and their development decisions.

As far as Anthem is concerned, don't get wrapped up in what you saw during that demo, it's not going to release like that.
 
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Long long time ago when we where chosing games and not consoles, those where good times.
But i hope pro will get proper divison 2 patch later with full game as first game on pro supersampling mode to 1080p looks just amazing with nearly perfect AA
 
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Witcher 3 cannot even run at 720p 60 fps on PS4 Pro? 4.2 Teraflops should be more than enough...

Regarding the CPU, XB1X also has a Jaguar one, albeit 8% higher clocked. The difference is minimal and yet, CD Projekt RED offered a 60 fps mode only on XB1X. That's weird.

Anyway, I know that not even XB1X can reach locked 60 fps everywhere (I'm looking at you Novigrad), but it's a future-proof version that will run flawlessly on next-gen XBOX. Not so much on PS5...

Both games and OSes should offer more options. If Sony can offer an option to disable SSAA, then I'm pretty sure Microsoft can do the same. They're a software company, right?
Witcher 3 could have easily had a 1080 60fps mode on PRO, now perhaps XBONEX would or should run it better in the 60fps mode, but it would not be too far apart in terms of average framerates.....

CDPR had the marketing with MS, they didn't care too much about the PS4/PRO version tbh, when PRO released in 2016, they said they were not going to do a patch for it, they waited close to the release of XBONEX to deliver a PRO patch, only because they were working on the XBONEX version.....They gave PRO a quick patch, but took their time on the XBOX version and made it the best they could.....They gave XBONEX version a Native 4k mode, a 60fps mode and implemented HDR.....The PRO patch they released had no 60fps mode, no HDR, and it's still not a locked 30fps, it still drops frames in the bog to 27fps etc......Then they took another eternity to implement HDR on the PRO only because people complained on their website, but that broke other things, made foliage look much worse, much blurrier.......This whole game has been a broken affair on consoles from the time of release..........

Prior to witcher 3, I heard many persons praising CDPR for their technical chops and continued support, but with all the shutting down of threads on their forums who asked about patches, they taking millenia to fix issues, and when they attempt a fix more things are broken as a result, I knew then that they are not as great as people said they were.....I esteem 4A Games from Europe as the most technical and accomplished multiplat dev in Europe......They gave us 60fps Metro ages ago on consoles and Metro Exodus looks insane....
 
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Are you able to qualify this statement? The Witcher 3 tends to like memory bandwidth, so that puts the Pro in a hard place.
A game at higher rez needs more bandwidth and memory over a game at lower rez......Wither 3 has been shown to run on even modest CPU's, I'm talking AMD APUS before Ryzen.......Whilst the XBONEX will excel over PRO at higher rez, performance should be closer at lower rez for a target of 60fps.....It's like this, you don't need a 2080ti to run Forza 7 at 1080p 60fps, but both an RX 580 and 2080ti can....

Look at the video below......The second half with hairworks off holds 60fps quite nicely, with max settings.....The console version of Witcher 3 is not at max settings...So yes, they could do a 1080 60fps mode on PRO with PS4 settings...