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[onQ123]

Because of marketing and mind share, easily two of the biggest problems Microsoft had this gen. They had to make a console which is better than anything Sony can offer and they did. They had the image to sell a console with worse specs for a higher price and wanted to recover from that and they did exactly that. It would have been a farce to release a 3tf console because who wanted to even buy that?

OK so how is this marketing & mind share working if PS4 is still selling more consoles & when Anthem a game that was supposed to show off the power of Xbox One X is failing to do so so far (unless they make big improvements in the final game) & leading up to next gen it's going to be Sony showing off games like Last Of Us 2 & so on with nothing in the forecast that's going to show how much more powerful Xbox One X is over PS4 Pro unless they have some surprise games coming out over the next year or so.

At $499 releasing in 2017 Xbox One X could not gain a big enough install base before the shadow of the next gen consoles started to cast. Even in this thread people are blaming the lower install base for the lack of optimizing in the games where Xbox One X isn't showing it's dominance.

 

[Hendrick's]

All you really need to do is mention RDR2 and these threads should be done. We all saw what the X is capable of, but obviously the box itself has no control over how developers take advantage of it.

 

[onQ123]

All you really need to do is mention RDR2 and these threads should be done. We all saw what the X is capable of, but obviously the box itself has no control over how developers take advantage of it.

How does RDR2 change the fact that the last few games that Digital Foundry tested has been so close & even performing better on PS4 Pro at times?


Clearly something is going on right now.

 

[JareBear: Remastered]

Sony has a deep seeded secret agent planted in MS headquarters.

I smell a conspiracy

 

[c0de]

OK so how is this marketing & mind share working if PS4 is still selling more consoles & when Anthem a game that was supposed to show off the power of Xbox One X is failing to do so so far (unless they make big improvements in the final game) & leading up to next gen it's going to be Sony showing off games like Last Of Us 2 & so on with nothing in the forecast that's going to show how much more powerful Xbox One X is over PS4 Pro unless they have some surprise games coming out over the next year or so.

At $499 releasing in 2017 Xbox One X could not gain a big enough install base before the shadow of the next gen consoles started to cast. Even in this thread people are blaming the lower install base for the lack of optimizing in the games where Xbox One X isn't showing it's dominance.

The X has showed its dominance so far in so many games and there is also no trend at all to see, despite your thread.
It's more powerful than the Pro and many games show exactly that, in fact it often ran better than the hardware difference shows.
Your 3tf idea of the X would not have done anything the X offers additionally, like 4k games for some 360 games, a better boost mode than a 3tf box could've offered and actually really 4k games on a console, namely RDR2 running natively at 4k. But it was also always targeted at the hardcore audience and of course you also know that, nobody expected it to change anything but it helped to keep the sales of the One at least somewhat steady. This is what Matters Piscatella at least told us.
Also I don't think that someone talking about a lack of optimization due to market share can be taken seriously. Many games showed what is obvious to everybody out there. The X is the better hardware and that's it. Exceptions may happen but that doesn't mean the Pro is better than the X. It's as odd as the One having better fps or better AF than the base PS4.

 

[c0de]

How does RDR2 change the fact that the last few games that Digital Foundry tested has been so close & even performing better on PS4 Pro at times?


Clearly something is going on right now.

You clearly don't know the difference between causality and coincidence and for Anthem, your opinion might change until release. That's not the best data to prove anything.

 

[Horsemama1956]

DirectX has been a mess for years now so I wouldn't be shocked if the API MS is using is garbage.

 

[c0de]

DirectX has been a mess for years now so I wouldn't be shocked if the API MS is using is garbage.

Sure, RDR2 running at twice the resolution than the Pro and having a better frame rate than the Pro because the API is a mess...

 

[Danjin44]

How does RDR2 change the fact that the last few games that Digital Foundry tested has been so close & even performing better on PS4 Pro at times?


Clearly something is going on right now.

The answer is simple, Xbox one X is more powerful system and that makes developers push for full 4K resolution but this ends up games with poor performance.

 

[JareBear: Remastered]

The answer is simple, Xbox one X is more powerful system and that makes developers push for full 4K resolution but this ends up games with poor performance.

I wish they would settle on 1800p with rock solid framerate. Still a res boost over Pro in most cases

 

[onQ123]

The answer is simple, Xbox one X is more powerful system and that makes developers push for full 4K resolution but this ends up games with poor performance.

The games that this thread is about are not full 4K the resolutions are pretty much the same on both consoles or at least appear to be the same resolution in the tests but somehow PS4 Pro is preforming better at times ,

 

[Clear]

Small point to note. Yes the X is more powerful than the pro, but relative difference is going to be down to how well optimized both systems are.

For example not all Pro titles have reconstruction techniques on par with Horizon, which looks comparable with native 4k despite not rendering at that resolution. You cannot assume a consistent differential when the base engine tech might lend itself to one approach and platform more than another.

 

[Danjin44]

The games that this thread is about are not full 4K the resolutions are pretty much the same on both consoles or at least appear to be the same resolution in the tests but somehow PS4 Pro is preforming better at times ,

True is not full 4K but developers are pushing for higher resolution on Xbox One X version and that end up effecting the actual performance and I predict same thing going to happen for next gen consoles as well. We get more powerful systems but developers once again will try to push higher quality models, bigger worlds and higher resolution over better performance. All I ask is to give us the option to choose lower resolution so we can get better FPS.

 

[Armorian]

Resolution in Anthem demo appeared to be the same and Pro had better framerate (in 4K output).

 

[Danjin44]

Resolution in Anthem demo appeared to be the same yet Pro had better framerate.

Then maybe Xbox one X version has more graphical effects or better shadows.

 

[onQ123]

Then maybe Xbox one X version has more graphical effects or better shadows.

Watch the videos

 

[Hendrick's]

How does RDR2 change the fact that the last few games that Digital Foundry tested has been so close & even performing better on PS4 Pro at times?


Clearly something is going on right now.

Clearly. They One X must have been nerfed.

 

[WouldYouKindly]

That 1x power tho

 

[c0de]

Clearly. They One X must have been nerfed.

Sony unlocked a secret power for sure!

 

[onQ123]

Clearly. They One X must have been nerfed.

Nerfed by what though?

 

[Stuart360]

I think its worth remembering that in Anthem and Kingdom Hearts case, you have to do the work around with the 1080p/ no supersampling thing in the console settings.
I'm pretty sure if you could do the same thing with the X (something you cant do at the current time), both games would probably run considerably better than the Pro.
I have a feeling Microsoft will add the same options in a future X update.

 

[onQ123]

I think its worth remembering that in Anthem and Kingdom Hearts case, you have to do the work around with the 1080p/ no supersampling thing in the console settings.
I'm pretty sure if you could do the same thing with the X (something you cant do at the current time), both games would probably run considerably better than the Pro.
I have a feeling Microsoft will add the same options in a future X update.

Anthem beta perform better on PS4 Pro even without going to 1080p

 

[Stuart360]

Anthem beta perform better on PS4 Pro even without going to 1080p

Well lets see what the final release performs like on both.

 

[onQ123]

https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-2019-anthem-demo-performance-analysis


Xbox One X is 4K

Our first look at Anthem's demo from last weekend. Performance is unchanged in the latest update, but having removed post-process features, we're fairly certain that PS4 Pro renders at 1800p, while Xbox One X delivers 4K.

 

[Armorian]

They should prioritize performance, not resolution.

 

[CrustyBritches]

Props to the guys who mentioned that it looked like Anthem on the Xbox One X was running higher res than the Pro. Nice eyes.

This thread is a little awkward now? ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

[Lort]

Oh well its back to performance dosent matter now.

 

[onQ123]

Props to the guys who mentioned that it looked like Anthem on the Xbox One X was running higher res than the Pro. Nice eyes.

This thread is a little awkward now? ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

No it's not because at the end of the day they look the same but PS4 Pro is preforming better.


The take away is that Checkerboard rendering is getting so good that even people who pixel count are having a hard time seeing a difference

Perhaps the biggest surprise is that in a world where Xbox One X has established itself in consistently delivering the preferred multi-platform experience, the Anthem demo delivers higher frame-rates on both PlayStation platforms. Yes, resolutions are lower and the PS4 consoles run unlocked with no 30fps cap, but regardless, the performance from X especially isn't where it should be. In terms of pure pixel output, Microsoft's enhanced machine is delivering 44 per cent more resolution than Pro, but on default settings with all post-processing features enabled, it's difficult to tell Pro and X apart. Only by disabling these features (a welcome option in the graphics menu) and by pixel-counting were we able to discern the difference in actual play. Disabling these features also seems to remove the curious stippling-like effect that did initially suggest that we were looking at a checkerboard-style presentation.

 

[CrustyBritches]

The take away is that Checkerboard rendering is getting so good that even people who pixel count are having a hard time seeing a difference

That wasn't the take away here, it was that you created a thread claiming the Pro's secret sauce was helping it catch the Xbox One X under the assumption that the game was running identical resolution on both platforms. In reality the X1X was running 44% higher resolution, and this game isn't performant on any platform.

There's no doubt it would have substantially better performance at identical resolution. This also opens the possibility for a 1080p/60fps performance mode on the X in the future.

You seem unsure whether this game is using checkerboard rendering, did you read your source?

Cheers!

 

[Armorian]

I think in video DF said that both games looke identical in terms of resolution, now (after update I think) with PP turned off they were able to count actual resolution. Looks like in "normal" situation (PP on) there is no clear difference between 1800p and 4k in this game.

1080p mode on X1X would require developers to make this in the first place, for example RDR2 runs at 1920x2160cb and 1920x1080p on Pro (not just first resolution scaled down). Right now only games with menu options (TR) have 1080p mode on X1X.

 

[onQ123]

That wasn't the take away here, it was that you created a thread claiming the Pro's secret sauce was helping it catch the Xbox One X under the assumption that the game was running identical resolution on both platforms. In reality the X1X was running 44% higher resolution, and this game isn't performant on any platform.

There's no doubt it would have substantially better performance at identical resolution. This also opens the possibility for a 1080p/60fps performance mode on the X in the future.

You seem unsure whether this game is using checkerboard rendering, did you read your source?

Cheers!

If the pixel counters are having a hard time telling the difference in resolution but can see a difference in performance there is still something going on here.

 

[CrustyBritches]

If the pixel counters are having a hard time telling the difference in resolution but can seen a difference in performance there is still something going on here.

So you're not even going to take ownership of your erroneous creation of this thread based on a random quote from Reeee- and the assumption that the games were running the same res?

No responsibility for all the baseless speculation about FP16 and 64 ROPS, etc?

You are still unsure about how to interpret your own source, aren't you? ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ Even this thread is created based on your failure to read what your source was saying.

Cheers!

 

[c0de]

If the pixel counters are having a hard time telling the difference in resolution but can see a difference in performance there is still something going on here.

The only thing going on is the one console spends a lot more time computing pixels than the other one and thus has a slightly higher perf toll, although having a good advantage in terms of power.
Whether this can be seen is of course interesting but doesn't change the computational effort difference.

 

[Pallas]

If the pixel counters are having a hard time telling the difference in resolution but can see a difference in performance there is still something going on here.

The performance hit is clearly from the One X pushing 4K, which we can all blame on the crappy jaguar CPU. The article you quoted said the One X was pushing 44% more resolution.

There’s no secret sauce involve, CB 4K is getting to the point that when optimized correctly can look pretty similar to native.

 

[JareBear: Remastered]

So you're not even going to take ownership of your erroneous creation of this thread based on a random quote from Reeee- and the assumption that the games were running the same res?

No responsibility for all the baseless speculation about FP16 and 64 ROPS, etc?

You are still unsure about how to interpret your own source, aren't you? ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ Even this thread is created based on your failure to read what your source was saying.

Cheers!

That fucking picture made me literally laugh out loud.

Sauce, baby. More sauce.

 

[c0de]

The performance hit is clearly from the One X pushing 4K, which we can all blame on the crappy jaguar CPU. The article you quoted said the One X was pushing 44% more resolution.

There’s no secret sauce involve, CB 4K is getting to the point that when optimized correctly can look pretty similar to native.

Not to mention that CB is nothing exklusive to the Pro at all. It's even used on base Xbox One nowadays so Anthem could use it on the X, too. They should make this a performance option on the X, to be honest.

 

[onQ123]

So you're not even going to take ownership of your erroneous creation of this thread based on a random quote from Reeee- and the assumption that the games were running the same res?

No responsibility for all the baseless speculation about FP16 and 64 ROPS, etc?

You are still unsure about how to interpret your own source, aren't you? ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ Even this thread is created based on your failure to read what your source was saying.

Cheers!

This thread had nothing to do with fp16 but people made it about fp16 , the fact remains that the games are looking pretty much the same while performing better on PS4 Pro at times.


Thread still remains the same something is going on

 

[c0de]

This thread had nothing to do with fp16 but people made it about fp16 , the fact remains that the games are looking pretty much the same while performing better on PS4 Pro at times.


Thread still remains the same something is going on

There is nothing going on. Usually games run better on Xbox One X when on even ground, meaning when both consoles push the same amount of pixels. Often the X even has a performance edge when even pushing more pixels. The Pro offers disabling supersampling which for some games make games perform better on the Pro but of course IQ takes a hit. The X doesn't offer such an option and always supersamples. Then there is an odd case where a game might even perform better on the Pro but the reason for that we likely will never know but it's the exception to the rule. Done.

 

[CrustyBritches]

That fucking picture made me literally laugh out loud.

Sauce, baby. More sauce.

Sauce is on the house, boys!

 

[onQ123]

The performance hit is clearly from the One X pushing 4K, which we can all blame on the crappy jaguar CPU. The article you quoted said the One X was pushing 44% more resolution.

There’s no secret sauce involve, CB 4K is getting to the point that when optimized correctly can look pretty similar to native.

No one said anything about secret sauce the point is that these games are performing the same or better on PS4 Pro while looking pretty much the same.

 

[c0de]

No one said anything about secret sauce the point is that these games are performing the same or better on PS4 Pro while looking pretty much the same.

Which games out of how many games? What are you even implying? You yourself mentioned SDK updates and fp16 -tell us what you really think it is

 

[onQ123]

There is nothing going on. Usually games run better on Xbox One X when on even ground, meaning when both consoles push the same amount of pixels. Often the X even has a performance edge when even pushing more pixels. The Pro offers disabling supersampling which for some games make games perform better on the Pro but of course IQ takes a hit. The X doesn't offer such an option and always supersamples. Then there is an odd case where a game might even perform better on the Pro but the reason for that we likely will never know but it's the exception to the rule. Done.

How is it nothing going on when Ace Combat with both games at 1080P on both consoles is more stable on PS4 Pro?

 

[Pallas]

No one said anything about secret sauce the point is that these games are performing the same or better on PS4 Pro while looking pretty much the same.

Yet as the article you quoted, there’s 44% more resolution on the Xbox X version. So while they visually look similar, they aren’t.

 

[BigLee74]

So that's Anthem pixel counted at running a much higher resolution on the X than the Pro, and still demo code that will no doubt be optimised and patched come release. So what game does that leave where this mystical update to the Pro has seen it outperform the X? AC7? The trend is real. Only trend around these parts are laugh along threads like this.

 

[onQ123]

Which games out of how many games? What are you even implying? You yourself mentioned SDK updates and fp16 -tell us what you really think it is

I still think it was something with the SDK or devs getting the most out of PS4 Pro

 

[JareBear: Remastered]

Dude......

Maybe “Gaming” has contracted “Benjamin Button Disease,” and we’re advancing in reverse.

Quick. Someone try AC7 on a 360. Hell maybe it’s 8k/120fps on PSX now!

Report back!

 

[DeepEnigma]

RETRO is the reason for me subscribe the DF channel. I used to just read some df articles and some videos, most of console specs, but my YoutubeTV app now have a exclusive tab for DF Retro videos. Is amazing. Its a shame we could vote for the best retro video of all time because is a massive challenge between Doom Retro and Sillent Hill 2 Retro. Its a powerful source of nostalgia and make me back in time when I used to play Master System/ Mega Drive/n64. I can't just wait for SAGE 2019 video.

Oh word? It makes its own tab? I need to check mine!

 

[Pallas]

I still think it was something with the SDK or devs getting the most out of PS4 Pro

I mean I’d like to believe that since I own both an X and Pro, but I think just like the Cloud processing that Microsoft boasted a bit, it’s too soon.

 

[c0de]

How is it nothing going on when Ace Combat with both games at 1080P on both consoles is more stable on PS4 Pro?

Because it's the odd case that I mentioned on the post you quoted. Is there any game left for you that you want to discuss or is all what's left here Ace Combat?

 

[onQ123]

Yet as the article you quoted, there’s 44% more resolution on the Xbox X version. So while they visually look similar, they aren’t.

Yet somehow they can't tell the difference , so did Sony make checkerboard rendering better on PS4 Pro?