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Day-1 Hello World, the PS Vita already hacked? (EDIT: not exactly)

Raistlin

Post Count: 9999
Well, that was unexpected. I really though Sony would have learned...
Learn what exactly? Assuming it's sufficiently sandboxed, I can't imagine patching the PSP is their most pressing concern right now.






That's a useless hack.
There is plenty of good PSP and PS1 content though, so not necessarily.

The real problem here though is that at any point Sony could patch their emulator and pack it as part of a Vita FW update. Is someone going to not upgrade their Vita in order to play PSP games, PS1 games, and PSP homebrew? I'd think obviously not.
 

Gravijah

Member
Learn what exactly? Assuming it's sufficiently sandboxed, I can't imagine patching the PSP is their most pressing concern right now.

you ever seen a sandbox man? stuff can escape quite easily. sand always ends up outside on the ground. and sometimes animals poop in it.
 
I still doubt it was knee jerk.

Given that removing OtherOS had something between zero effect and a negative effect in terms of preventing the hacking of the PS3, I certainly think it was ultimately a bad choice (measured even on pure self-interest and ignoring the company's responsibilities to its existing customers.) If it wasn't knee-jerk, then it was a decision that they thought about extensively and then did something dumb, which is probably worse.
 

test_account

XP-39C²
Given that removing OtherOS had something between zero effect and a negative effect in terms of preventing the hacking of the PS3, I certainly think it was ultimately a bad choice (measured even on pure self-interest and ignoring the company's responsibilities to its existing customers.) If it wasn't knee-jerk, then it was a decision that they thought about extensively and then did something dumb, which is probably worse.
I think it was removed for pre-caution. Proof of concept was shown, which alone i guess was enough to scare Sony. But then the PS3 jailbreak dongle came out, which opened the system, which then lead to further hacking, so there were really no need to work further on using OtherOS for the hacking. But if the jailbreak dongle didnt come out, who knows what would have happened regarding using OtherOS for hacking purposes.
 

tranciful

Member
Given that removing OtherOS had something between zero effect and a negative effect in terms of preventing the hacking of the PS3, I certainly think it was ultimately a bad choice (measured even on pure self-interest and ignoring the company's responsibilities to its existing customers.) If it wasn't knee-jerk, then it was a decision that they thought about extensively and then did something dumb, which is probably worse.

..I hope you realize that if they didn't remove OtherOS, hotz and others would have continued their efforts toward exploiting it. We simply don't know what the OtherOS exploit could have resulted in, but Sony and even Hotz himself sure thought it was serious and would lead to CFW etc.

The other exploits are irrelevant -- they would have either been redundant (because OtherOS exploit would have sufficed) or they would have been inevitable (found when OtherOS exploit was exhausted). At most, you could make the argument that it sped up the development of the following exploits. Still, it's kind of silly to say Sony should have just left the OtherOS exploit wide open.
 

M3d10n

Member
..I hope you realize that if they didn't remove OtherOS, hotz and others would have continued their efforts toward exploiting it. We simply don't know what the OtherOS exploit could have resulted in, but Sony and even Hotz himself sure thought it was serious and would lead to CFW etc.

The other exploits are irrelevant -- they would have either been redundant (because OtherOS exploit would have sufficed) or they would have been inevitable (found when OtherOS exploit was exhausted). At most, you could make the argument that it sped up the development of the following exploits. Still, it's kind of silly to say Sony should have just left the OtherOS exploit wide open.

Thing is, the OtherOS-based hack was not viable and would never lead to the catastrophic discovery of the private encryption key. All Geohotz had done was modify relatively safe unsigned files and Sony could have dealt with it in a targeted way.

You overestimate the amount of people out there who are capable of coming up with these hacks. The guys behind the USB loader were mod-chip developers, aka. straight up pirates. These guys don't have the skill to do advanced hacks like the PS3 and Wii private signing key recovery or the 360 JTAG (the last two involving very advanced equipment and exotic measures such as freezing chips and bathing them on acid).

Whether or not Sony removed OtherOS as a knee-jerk reaction or they had it planned all along is not important. The timing of it was simply utter terrible and it attracted unwanted attention from people with actual talent to discover system flaws. It also gave these people a strong motivation and a reason to not update their PS3 firmwares any longer.

Had Sony kept OtherOS around for longer, they could have dealt with USB Loader and minor exploits one at a time and reduced the hacking time window.
 

okenny

Banned
If Sony breaks my PS Vita so I can't use my Laser Printer with it anymore I am going to file a lawsuit.

In all seriousness though, Sony's new ToS are probably written so they have the right to take your life should they need to :/ When companies learn their lesson, it's not always in a manner that's beneficial to the consumer.
 
I guess a bit of an update.

Wololo says Half-Byte Loader on the way.

http://wololo.net/wagic/2011/12/23/ps-vita-exploit-confirmed-hbl-on-its-way/

That'd be nice if Sony just let this exist in this sandboxed landscape.

Interesting, if this is actually a security feature they really went all out to protect this device.
It should be noted though that the Vita is quite sensitive and crashed on me several times when it went into “sleep” mode from the exploit screen… from there – am I just paranoid? – it seems it is impossible to reboot the machine for almost 10 minutes, which made me think I had bricked my vita… could it be a anti-hacking security? If the console detects several crashes, it takes longer to boot, in order to prevent brusteforce types of attacks?
 
Even if this is emu running under an emu this is way cool. Especially since the system has not been released in the US yet.

Just way cool even if not useable.
 
Except that after the new update, you won't be able to play Vita games, and people will have to choose between a few PSP games that are already playable in PSP, or Vita ones.
 

Wario64

works for Gamestop (lol)
So how long before the Vita is no longer able to play PSP games?

They'll just remove the games that have exploits on them, like Motorstorm Arctic Edge. That went on sale on PSN, then removed immediately when it was known to have an exploit
 

xxczx

Member
they found another hack for the psp emulator. can now run psp iso loaders. no release date ETA, though.
It doesn't run ISOs though, this is Davee and he would never do that :p. It's running signed eboots, which has a limit of 700MB.
 
And so it begins...
Much ado about nothing... They're busting a nut just trying to use the old PSP exploits, and as soon as they tell anyone HOW they're gaining this access, Sony will do whatever is required to shut the hackers out again, as they demonstrated by pulling Motorstorm AC off PSN hours after they announced it had the exploit they were using to get HBL running earlier... It's all locked down too hard; the best the community can hope for is PSP emu access, and Sony are dead set on denying them even that.
 

Eusis

Member
So how long before the Vita is no longer able to play PSP games?
It's why I wish they'd fucking knock it off. It may be neat for people who want to mess with their systems, but I'd rather not see them get desperate enough to block off all PSP games, and even if it doesn't go that far I don't want to see a game I care about pulled because they figured out how to run an exploit in it. Not unless SCE can reliably get those games back up sans-exploit, but I haven't heard of Arctic Edge going back up yet.
 
I suppose that they can modify the emulator to override the hack. So first they took out the game responsable of the overflow, they analize exactly what it do, modify the PSP emulator to prevent it and add it in a mandatory Vita update, and put again the game on the store.
 

Luigiv

Member
Inside. It's a DOOM emulator running in the PSP emulator on the PSVita...

Actually from my understanding, if Doom PSP is anything like Doom Wii, it should be a proper source code port, not an emulation.

You'll notice that to get the homebrew versions running, you only need to provide the original .WAD file, not the whole game. The .WAD file only contains the assets (Graphics, Sound, Level Data, etc), so in order to do anything with it, you need a whole engine not just an emulator.
 
Sony is systematically removing Vita PSP games from the PSN store to prevent them being used for exploits. EVEN IF YOU HAVE ALREADY PAID FOR THEM.

Oh, Sony! This is just a continuation of the existing Other OS precedent where Sony think they can remove anything in the name of controlling exactly what is being run on their hardware. The Other Os thing doesn't seem so insignificant now, does it kids?

Or, to quote a comment from the above link:

This should be entertaining for weeks to come.

At this point the hackers just need to randomly pick a title every couple of weeks and announce that they've found a hole in it that they can use to run their own software on the hardware they bought. Eventually the Vita store will be empty, nobody will be able to run anything on their hardware, and Sony can declare... victory?
 

Maedhros

Member
Sony is systematically removing Vita PSP games from the PSN store to prevent them being used for exploits. EVEN IF YOU HAVE ALREADY PAID FOR THEM.

Oh, Sony! This is just a continuation of the existing Other OS precedent where Sony think they can remove anything in the name of controlling exactly what is being run on their hardware. The Other Os thing doesn't seem so insignificant now, does it kids?

Or, to quote a comment from the above link:

Thanks, slowpoke.

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?p=36434296
 

Vlaphor

Member
and it looks like PSN is now down (at least in the USA). Who wants to bet that it comes back up sans Super Collapse 3?
 
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