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Days Gone Director John Garvin Says Metacritic Score Is Everything to Sony

Jul 2, 2014
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So you believe something like GOW is as similar to TLoU2 as Iron is similar Avengers?

Even in films, the genre "action adventure" encompasses a variety of differing films. For example Avengers is considered and action adventure film but so is something like Dunkirk. Are Dunkirk and Avengers the same type of film? Spacker.

Yeah you're definitely missing something but it's not games, it's a brain.

All the sony exclusives are gameplay light, cinematic, third person games.

Please don't try and pretend god of war is a massively different kind of game. It's following a similar formula and feel. It's very clearly a message from the top. And I don't like that.
 

Haggard

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All the sony exclusives are gameplay light, cinematic, third person games.

Please don't try and pretend god of war is a massively different kind of game. It's following a similar formula and feel. It's very clearly a message from the top. And I don't like that.
If something like GoW, GoT, R&C, Horizon etc etc is gameplay-light then that would also apply to 99% of all other 1st or 3rd person action games out there......basically the whole action-genre.

Cinematic presentation and gameplay are not necessarily opposite things....
 

Saber

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This is sad news to me. Didn't they have lowered scored games in the past? Wasn't R&C fair in terms of score? And now all the sudden they totally care about metacritic, even though LoU2 fans brigade were doing a drama against it saying there was a massive review bomb?
I hope this backfire at them.
 

Dr. Suchong

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saintjules

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Days Gone game director also says don’t complain that the game doesn’t have a sequel if you didn’t support it at release






Just an aside (not related to the person I'm quoting), I always see people saying they don't like x y z game, but will get it on a sale when it's $20....What? Why even buy / support the game if you already stated you don't like it to begin with? Just say you can't afford the game, makes more sense lol
 
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Aion002

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Just an aside (not related to the person I'm quoting), I always see people saying they don't like x y z game, but will get it on a sale when it's $20....What? Why even buy / support the game if you already stated you don't like it to begin with? Just say you can't afford the game, makes more sense lol

Because sometimes the videos and/or demos are not enough to make the said person pay 60 usd for the game... And they feel that for 20 or less the game is worth?

Yeah... Crazy right? Each person values stuff differently...
different GIF
 

GymWolf

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All the sony exclusives are gameplay light, cinematic, third person games.

Please don't try and pretend god of war is a massively different kind of game. It's following a similar formula and feel. It's very clearly a message from the top. And I don't like that.
Lol...

Some fights in gow and horizon on max diffculty are as challenging as any souls title, gameplay light my ass.
 
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MrSarcastic

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soccer team? are you talking about sports? completely different situation here mate
No completely, is quite similar. In fact, there are tons of industries that use metrics to enable workers to have bonuses at the end of the year.
 
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When I first saw this chart years ago (there's many very similar), I couldn't believe it. So fucking true.

You modern gamers should read some old mags from the 80s. One was called Computer and Video Games (1984-ish). Games rated A+ to F-. There were a fair share of Ds and Fs.

But when you got previews, gold copies and banner ads fees to scrounge up, modern day reviews skew high to keep game makers happy.

Every once in a while, this chart pops up or someone makes a thread about game reviews, and I've never seen once a dev or reviewer chime in to explain themselves about skewed review scores.

Asshole sell outs. Anything for a buck and free swag.
 
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Brofist

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Just an aside (not related to the person I'm quoting), I always see people saying they don't like x y z game, but will get it on a sale when it's $20....What? Why even buy / support the game if you already stated you don't like it to begin with? Just say you can't afford the game, makes more sense lol
This must be one of the dumbest things I've read in a while. If you had said bought it used you may have had a point, but if you don't want to buy a game at full price don't bother? Wtf does that even mean?
 
Oct 26, 2018
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Just an aside (not related to the person I'm quoting), I always see people saying they don't like x y z game, but will get it on a sale when it's $20....What? Why even buy / support the game if you already stated you don't like it to begin with? Just say you can't afford the game, makes more sense lol
Probably has to do with not hating the game, but hating it at $60.

I'm the same. I've havent bought a full priced game in eons. Why should I? Games get dumped fast on deal. If Garvin wants killer sales and full pop, then make a good game which people want day one. COD and FIFA do it. Just about every first party Nintendo game does it. Many Sony games sell a ton at full price at launch.

If guys like Garvin don't like selling at deal prices, then just lock and load full price like Nintendo for 5 years while doing once a year sales at $40. But whomever sets the price at Sony has to dump it because the game isn't selling at $60.
 
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MrSarcastic

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No friend, they don't. Check metacritic.
you are talking about the scale itself?. That´s another topic. I am talking about movie/TV studios using review scores aggregates (especially rotten tomatoes) as one metric of success.
 
Oct 26, 2018
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you are talking about the scale itself?. That´s another topic. I am talking about movie/TV studios using review scores aggregates (especially rotten tomatoes) as one metric of success.
Maybe they do.

But at least publicly, I have never seen or read about any movie studio talking about Rotten Tomato scores as an internal metric.

And going by movie critics, it seems they dont give a shit either, since movies run the gamut between awful movies at moldy green 10% Tomato scores to 95% must-see movies. And the critic, website or newspaper that shows bad critic scores doesn't seem to care either about early access to a movie or risk of ad revenue.
 

Fake

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you are talking about the scale itself?. That´s another topic. I am talking about movie/TV studios using review scores aggregates (especially rotten tomatoes) as one metric of success.

Stop changing the subject. Movies don't follow metacritic.

Don't care about series, tv show. I talking about movies.
 

AgentP

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This is what happens when people use reviews and don't buy games. Of course Sony values review score, they translate into sales. Only MS can afford a bunch of 6/10 games since they go to Crackle, I mean Game Pass. Now that the game was free people want a sequel, should have bought it for real money.
 
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MrSarcastic

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Maybe they do.

But at least publicly, I have never seen or read about any movie studio talking about Rotten Tomato scores as an internal metric.

And going by movie critics, it seems they dont give a shit either, since movies run the gamut between awful movies at moldy green 10% Tomato scores to 95% must-see movies. And the critic, website or newspaper that shows bad critic scores doesn't seem to care either about early access to a movie or risk of ad revenue.
They do care. I was not aware of that aspect of movie marketing until all the drama behind the DC movies and their fail attempt to make a cinematic universe, then Star Wars drama too. Also, I was watching one of the investors' things that Disney makes and in that presentation, one executive uses the review scores to say: "our shows average this level of quality".

Just recently Wonder Woman 1984 had something fishy about how the studio provided early access to people they knew like the movie, therefore, the early review score was pretty positive then the score drop quite rapidly when more critics were able to post their review.
 
Oct 26, 2018
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They do care. I was not aware of that aspect of movie marketing until all the drama behind the DC movies and their fail attempt to make a cinematic universe, then Star Wars drama too. Also, I was watching one of the investors' things that Disney makes and in that presentation, one executive uses the review scores to say: "our shows average this level of quality".

Just recently Wonder Woman 1984 had something fishy about how the studio provided early access to people they knew like the movie, therefore, the early review score was pretty positive then the score drop quite rapidly when more critics were able to post their review.
Good point.

I guess the difference is movie employees dont seem as vocal as gaming employees.
 

MrSarcastic

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Stop changing the subject. Movies don't follow metacritic.

Don't care about series, tv show. I talking about movies.
you are changing the subject or misunderstanding it. The fact is that Review scores are pretty important for Film, TV, videogame studios, etc. They use them as a metric of success. They are so important in fact, that Films (as same as videogames) have The Embargo Day accordingly to how they think the movie is going to be received.
 

Alebrije

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Sony's AAA IPs are good and they have lots of them, this is why a game like Days Gone is to them a AA one not worth for a sequel now.

Guess that if Days Gone were a Xbone exclusive would be a AAA franchise due to the lack of IPs they have. Days Gone 2 surely would be ready to launch on Series X.

DG is a nice game, i liked it but its not a game that is at the level of Ghosth of T. Or even Niho..in terms of new IPs .
 

yurinka

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Launched a game that was extremely buggy. Ohhhhhhh oh it's Sony's fault
He said he wasn't talking about DG in particular. He said he doesn't know if Sony greenlighted or not the sequel, because he left a few days after they released DG.

He said this is was his personal opinion, explaining what it's the common sense according to him, and not how Sony works because as creative director he works in the development/creative/narrative part of the game and not in the business/marketing/corporate/production/numbers part of the game.
 

Kumomeme

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No completely, is quite similar. In fact, there are tons of industries that use metrics to enable workers to have bonuses at the end of the year.
no it is different. the one similliar is probably rottentomatoes rating for film. there tons of complaint from devs, tons of journalist bring this issue few years back about how big company abuse the system against developers. you can google it out. it once a hot topic and im sure it gonna surface again. one of example is how management refuse to pay bonus despite their game has made tremendous sales, although their game just lacking 1 number behind the rating. the company profited but the one work hard didnt get properly rewarded. unlike sports who player play in seasons, individual performance that get rewarded based on contribution, has high salary etc, compared to a single game development especially AAA took atleast 3-4 years. there lot of work ettique complaint, lack life balance, low salary, crunch etc. one of reason soccer club for example implement that system also to avoid club's excessive expense. completely different situation here. not all metric system in industry is same. also rating didnt reflect everything. rating not the most correct way to rate a game which is has lot of element to consider. gameplay, art, visual, music, storyline, fun etc. some game should gain more attention but the rating 'prevented' it. you can search more about it. even there is people claim rating like rotten tomatoes also already affected certain part of film industry.

this is about game development/production. sports is about competition. they enter league. completely different.
 
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Dolomite

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If this was true Knack 2 would never happened.

All publishers care about how they games are reviwed and received. But most important is how they sell. And Days Gone sold quite well.
Knack is Cerny's love affair, a sequel was never in question
 

DForce

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All the sony exclusives are gameplay light, cinematic, third person games.

Please don't try and pretend god of war is a massively different kind of game. It's following a similar formula and feel. It's very clearly a message from the top. And I don't like that.
Sounds like a person who never played any Sony exclusives.... that or you just want to lie and embarrass yourself.
 
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SSfox

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Imagine Metacritic would be everything for you
 

SSfox

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All the sony exclusives are gameplay light, cinematic, third person games.

Please don't try and pretend god of war is a massively different kind of game. It's following a similar formula and feel. It's very clearly a message from the top. And I don't like that.
I've seen ignorant comments, but this is next level
 
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Since when does a good MC equal a good game? We’ve seen numerous times where there’s a big divide between what gamers consider a good game and what critics consider a good game.
I mean of course it isn't great, but what other metric is there to determine a "quality" game? Does Sony use vote threads on message boards? Ask Jim Ryan's son what his favorite games are? If Sony has really decided that they want to favor quality over everything else, I don't really know how else they can determine that that.

I sincerely doubt that games live or die at Sony based just off metacritic. I would expect that decisions are based on a variety of different kpi's.
This is really the correct answer though. There are many dimensions you could judge the success of a game on, and I don't think you can use just one. Even profitability or sales wouldn't tell the whole story.
 
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MrSarcastic

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I mean all subjects have a lot of nuances so, trying to convey all of the sides would be time-consuming and outside of the point I was exemplifying. Wich was that not only videogames companies use some kind of metric to measure success (scores are just one of the metrics).
 

FireFistAce

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I mean of course it isn't great, but what other metric is there to determine a "quality" game? Does Sony use vote threads on message boards? Ask Jim Ryan's son what his favorite games are? If Sony has really decided that they want to favor quality over everything else, I don't really know how else they can determine that that.


This is really the correct answer though. There are many dimensions you could judge the success of a game on, and I don't think you can use just one. Even profitability or sales wouldn't tell the whole story.
User score on MC is a better metric than the critic score.
 

Bo_Hazem

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Just an aside (not related to the person I'm quoting), I always see people saying they don't like x y z game, but will get it on a sale when it's $20....What? Why even buy / support the game if you already stated you don't like it to begin with? Just say you can't afford the game, makes more sense lol

 
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ZywyPL

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When I first saw this chart years ago (there's many very similar), I couldn't believe it. So fucking true.

You modern gamers should read some old mags from the 80s. One was called Computer and Video Games (1984-ish). Games rated A+ to F-. There were a fair share of Ds and Fs.

But when you got previews, gold copies and banner ads fees to scrounge up, modern day reviews skew high to keep game makers happy.

Every once in a while, this chart pops up or someone makes a thread about game reviews, and I've never seen once a dev or reviewer chime in to explain themselves about skewed review scores.

Asshole sell outs. Anything for a buck and free swag.

Honestly, at this point reviewers should just switch entirely to binary score system with either 0 or 1...
 
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Panajev2001a

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Just an aside (not related to the person I'm quoting), I always see people saying they don't like x y z game, but will get it on a sale when it's $20....What? Why even buy / support the game if you already stated you don't like it to begin with? Just say you can't afford the game, makes more sense lol

Especially the NEW IP which everyone wants or says they do from maybe a studio taking risks…

“oh not worth $XYZ” —> *Buys it on a sale a year later* —> “FU Publisher, what do you mean you are not making a sequel to this gams I like so much and I am totally willing to support?!?” —> *Publisher maybe makes a sequel (see Gravity Rush 2)* —> “actually it is too expensive, I think I will buy it on a sale, too busy spending money on super duper sequel of mega series ABC” —> “what do you mean the team has been disbanded and the series canned for good? 4theplayers huh? Greedy!!!”.

Price erosion with Netflix style gaming would just add further complications to this… but hey, people will see it in time…

If one cannot afford it genuinely it is another issue, but still understand that money is not a problem only to you but to the developers and publishers behind that game too.
 
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Bo_Hazem

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Especially the NEW IP which everyone wants or says they do from maybe a studio taking risks…

“oh not worth $XYZ” —> Buys it on a sale a year later —> “FU Publisher, what do you mean you are not making a sequel to this hame I like so much and I am totally willing to support?!?” —> Publisher maybe makes a sequel (see Gravity Rush 2) —> again “actually will buy it on a sale, too busy spending money on super duper sequel of mega series ABC” —> “what do you mean the team has been disbanded and the series canned for good? 4theplayers huh? Greedy”.

If one cannot afford it genuinely it is another issue, but still understand that money is not a problem only to you but to the developers and publishers behind that game too.

I personally bought it at around $42 because of the press + I don't like zombie games in general. If I knew how good it is I would've bought it day one. So I count myself part of the problem.
 
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Panajev2001a

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I personally bought it at around $42 because of the press + I don't like zombie games in general. If I know how good it is I would've bought it day one. So I count myself part of the problem.
Hey, you are not one yelling at Sony as if game profitability did not matter. You are NOT part of the problem, you have no moral obligation to spend your money :).
 

Rhazer Fusion

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For all the people saying that this is a good thing. I disagree. Since when is Metacritic the golden standard or measurement of a video game’s quality? I’m sure they have some influence of course, but at the end of the day aren’t they just so called professional “opinions” basically?
 

Bo_Hazem

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Hey, you are not one yelling at Sony as if game profitability did not matter. You are NOT part of the problem, you have no moral obligation to spend your money :).

Yes, I'm actually 100% with moving on to a new IP, which seems bigger and much focused, than making the sequel now and probably have very little to add compared to the first one, which seems to be the case. A breathing time would give the sequel more time to gather more interesting ideas, or utilize the PS5 hardware to provide a noticeable upgrade over Days Gone 1.

I really hate zombie games, but TLOU and Days Gone are just too good to miss out. Also preorder and buying season passes/gold editions is my habit so spending on games isn't an issue, thank God.
 
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I don't understand why Days Gone is so well received (despite those numeric values on metaciritic and similar scores). I played it on release and it was quite good technically and in terms of worlddesign but the story / Chars were so cringy. Never finished it though so I'm not judging. But it was just another open world game thingy with zombies and a mediocore (cringy) story. Just my opinion though.
 
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mr.dilya

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The first scale is used by people on social media and forums. You know?. because things only can be Shit or a Masterpiece.

The thing is...games aren't cheap. They are $60 (now $70) regardless of how good or bad they are. So yeah...if I'm about to pay full price for a game day 1, you better believe anything below an 8 is trash.
 
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