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[Ferrio]

I love the industrial design aspect of Thinkpads. All business and they look the part.

I just had work buy me a new laptop. I own a thinkpad personally (that's too outdated) so wanted another one. I would of had to pull some serious teeth for them to get one... damn dell too entrenched here.. Ended up getting a latitude... hoping it's decent. I can't live without a nipple mouse, I *hate* touchpads.

 

[Lonely1]

Well...at least the computer is pretty good for the price. Not sure if the price is low enough to keep potential buyers from feeling a bit like poseurs, but who knows. Those speaker grilles are hilarious, though. They remind me of the air conditioning vents in my great grandmothers' home.

If the build quality is good, I would consider them If i was in the market for a Laptop.

 

[jim-jam bongs]

Different OSes, different native software, aluminum unibody, better screen, better keyboard, better trackpad, etc.

Whether it's worth 1k more it's up to the consumer honestly.

All true, which makes the price comparison more relevant rather than less, don't you think?

 

[Al-ibn Kermit]

Different OSes, different native software, aluminum unibody, better screen, better keyboard, better trackpad, etc.

Whether it's worth 1k more it's up to the consumer honestly.

OS/software is subjective and the article says that the keyboards are very similar between the two. The Dell also has the higher resolution screen (1080P) in the price comparison solstice made.

If the Dell had an aluminium unibody, that would be good obviously and the article mentions that the Dell trackpad is iffy with multi-touch gestures but realistically, nobody would think that is worth $1000. Well at least I don't know anybody that would.

 

[Dreams-Visions]

My vote for sharpest PC laptop brand. I had an 18.4" VAIO and loved it until its poor build quality and materials revealed themselves over about 6 months.

It ultimately resulted in Sony offering me a full purchase price refund 10 months after the purchase date. I did love that laptop. :-(

If the build quality is good, I would consider them If i was in the market for a Laptop.

concur. Read the review. It discusses the build quality. Seems acceptable for the price. No deal-breaking issues in the $1000 laptop space. If spending $1500, I'd probably look elsewhere, though.

The new Elitebooks just came out, btw. I'd direct people towards those, assuming they got their firmware issues resolved (it was a pretty rough year for new Elitebook owners last year).

 

[Dude Abides]

case and point: why sometimes it's good to care about looks if you're a business professional. Imagine strolling into a meeting with your attorney or accountant with that. Of course, if it is to never leave the house, it's all good. And if you're a card-carrying member of ForeverAlone-GAF, it doesn't matter anyway.

Case in point, I think if your attorney or accountant gives a shit about what his client's laptop looks like, you should be looking for a new attorney or accountant.

 

[Nerevar]

I just had work buy me a new laptop. I own a thinkpad personally (that's too outdated) so wanted another one. I would of had to pull some serious teeth for them to get one... damn dell too entrenched here.. Ended up getting a latitude... hoping it's decent. I can't live without a nipple mouse, I *hate* touchpads.

typing from a Dell right now and I gotta say ... I would probably kill someone to get a Thinkpad. Been using Dell for the past 5 years or so and they've been nothing but trouble. We replace comps every 2 years and every single one has had to have a motherboard replaced. My most recent one occasionally doesn't boot and has to be hard-reset by pulling the battery out to get it to start up again. Just counting down the days to the Dell service call where I have to wait for a tech to show up and swap out the motherboard. Nothing but trouble.

 

[Dreams-Visions]

How powerful is it by comparison though which really is what would matter to me.

Should have clicked the link, bro.

As we all know, no laptop brand in the world offers the combination of speed, power, battery life, size and weight that Apple offers. Even when they try (this Dell, HP Envy), they fall short. But in all things, it's about how much the areas where a MacBook Pro excels (power and features WITH long battery life) matter to you in your daily life. For example, if you never leave home with your laptop, you spend the same amount of money on a little more power at the sacrifice of some battery life which you're not taking advantage of by never leaving home with it.

For the mobile user, you won't find a lighter, more powerful and longer lasting laptop with construction and materials quality as high as the MBP. Or, I haven't found one yet...and I've shopped the best Latitudes, Thinkpad's and Elitebooks.

Case in point, I think if your attorney or accountant gives a shit about what his client's laptop looks like, you should be looking for a new attorney or accountant.

don't miss the forest for the trees. The POINT is that in the business world, you make impressions with the things you're wearing and using. Impression can be everything sometimes. There is nothing new here, so I'm not sure why people are acting like these are new concepts. Don't be thick just for the sake of being thick.

Next we'll have people suggesting they don't understand business suit culture.

 

[Dude Abides]

don't miss the forest for the trees. The POINT is that in the business world, you make impressions with the things you're wearing and using. Impression can be everything sometimes. There is nothing new here, so I'm not sure why people are acting like these are new concepts. Don't be thick just for the sake of being thick.

Maybe in frivolous fields like entertainment or sports or some such, but people who deal with serious matters don't care about kiddy tech stuff like laptop appearance. They might care about your suit or your shoes, but anybody who starts passing judgment on a laptop, of all things, would get laughed out of the room.

 

[Deku]

Maybe in frivolous fields like entertainment or sports or some such, but people who deal with serious matters don't care about kiddy tech stuff like laptop appearance. They might care about your suit or your shoes, but anybody who starts passing judgment on a laptop, of all things, would get laughed out of the room.

But what if you have a hipster executive you have to work for?

oh wait, maybe that's an oxymoron.

In the business world FYI, Apple was seen as niche and is now seen as too mainstream. They we never seen as business machines.

 

[Dreams-Visions]

But what if you have a hipster executive you have to work for?

oh wait, maybe that's an oxymoron.

ha.

Yea, I know at a few very unique companies, you can come to work wearing whatever the fuck you want. I'm sure in a Google meeting, you'll have all manner of colorful wear and gear...but probably not at an executive officer meeting. I think we all know that there is a rare exception out there, not really worth discussing as if it were a normal, standard experience. We all know what boardrooms look like by and large. Shirt & tie. Polo and slacks at minimum.

But anyway, I didn't mean for this digression to occur.

 

[XiaNaphryz]

It was a surprise to learn you can't post on a year old thread.

Not without a really good reason anyway.

 

[AbsoluteZero]

Should have clicked the link, bro.

Holy fuck the battery life on the MBP...and a better score to boot.

 

[Technosteve]

If you want a good looking laptop you get an envy, if you want something that is a giant piece of shit you get a Dell.

 

[Dreams-Visions]

Holy fuck the battery life on the MBP...and a better score to boot.

Indeed. As I said, I've yet to find a laptop that bests (or even matches) the MBP in the following combination:

1.) CPU power

2.) GPU power

3.) Battery life

4.) Size and weight.


I'm pretty sure such a laptop doesn't exist.

If you want a good looking laptop you get an envy, if you want something that is a giant piece of shit you get a Dell.

If you want something that looks pretty good while still being solid, you get an Elitebook or Precision.

I think if you want something good looking AND solid, you get a VAIO Z. Unfortunately, you're limited to 13"...but they're so damn pretty.

In fact, I think the VAIO line looks better than the Envy line. But that's my opinion only.

In the business world FYI, Apple was seen as niche and is now seen as too mainstream. They we never seen as business machines.

Dual-boot Windows and profit.

 

[numble]

But what if you have a hipster executive you have to work for?

oh wait, maybe that's an oxymoron.

In the business world FYI, Apple was seen as niche and is now seen as too mainstream. They we never seen as business machines.

Everyone at Google uses either Mac OS X or Linux:
http://www.businessinsider.com/henr...lames-windows-for-china-hacking-attack-2010-5

So at least one major company sees them as viable business machines.

Remember what the word "never" means.

 

[kamspy]

If you want a giant piece of shit you get an envy, or you get a Dell.

Fixed.

Seriously, can't believe all the HP love in this thread. I haven't touched a HP computer in a about a year (sister's laptop) but everything HP I've ever owned or tried to fix for a friend has ended in hilarity.

Have they significantly increased their build quality and preinstalled software?

 

[ukas]

damn thing is sexy as hell in red

I have one and love it. Much better build quality than the m15x first gen.

 

[entremet]

OS/software is subjective and the article says that the keyboards are very similar between the two. The Dell also has the higher resolution screen (1080P) in the price comparison solstice made.

If the Dell had an aluminium unibody, that would be good obviously and the article mentions that the Dell trackpad is iffy with multi-touch gestures but realistically, nobody would think that is worth $1000. Well at least I don't know anybody that would.

But consumer habits are highly personal and subjective. Spec comparison don't mean that much to general consumers.

 

[Dreams-Visions]

Fixed.

Seriously, can't believe all the HP love in this thread. I haven't touched a HP computer in a about a year (sister's laptop) but everything HP I've ever owned or tried to fix for a friend has ended in hilarity.

Have they significantly increased their build quality and preinstalled software?

HP Elitebook.

http://www.engadget.com/2011/05/24/hp-elitebook-8460w-8560w-and-8760w-mobile-workstations-all-go/

Don't buy from their consumer line. They are pieces of shit.

Assuming the Elitebook firmware issues from last year have been worked out, you can grab one of these. Paired with a DreamColor 2 display, you'll be hard-pressed to want to use anything else. Just prepare for 1.5-3 hour battery life. If I were to replace my MBP with any PC laptop, it would be one of these or a Precision. I just wish they offered better battery life. But the target audience for them isn't really looking for battery life, so I doubt it'll ever come.

 

[ukas]

Everyone at Google uses either Mac OS X or Linux:
http://www.businessinsider.com/henr...lames-windows-for-china-hacking-attack-2010-5

So at least one major company sees them as viable business machines.

Remember what the word "never" means.

We have had people from Google in our office a few times this year so far. Trust me not everyone is running OSX or Linux.

 

[Garcia]

God damn, the grates for the speakers are ugly as sin.

My sentiments exactly. Ew...

 

[Lebron]

I would rock that new Dell.

 

[TxdoHawk]

Those keys are ugly as sin. Whoever designed those should probably be fired.

That aside...I wish more people would try aping top laptop designers, not less. The industry needs it, because when left to their own devices most makers put out ugly-ass laptops.

 

[jim-jam bongs]

don't miss the forest for the trees. The POINT is that in the business world, you make impressions with the things you're wearing and using. Impression can be everything sometimes. There is nothing new here, so I'm not sure why people are acting like these are new concepts. Don't be thick just for the sake of being thick.

Next we'll have people suggesting they don't understand business suit culture.

I love how the "business world" is this utterly homogenous thing in your mind. Hint: it's not. I'm an enterprise architect, my look is neat geek. I actually get points for showing up to a client meeting with a weird little netbook like the m11x, or using an Android phone.

Sucks for you if you have to look like "a Mac" to get ahead though, must get pretty expensive.

 

[Dreams-Visions]

I love how the "business world" is this utterly homogenous thing in your mind. Hint: it's not. I'm an enterprise architect, my look is neat geek. I actually get points for showing up to a client meeting with a weird little netbook like the m11x, or using an Android phone.

Sucks for you if you have to look like "a Mac" to get ahead though, must get pretty expensive.

Yes, your experience is the standard. Let's use it to discuss the typical business world experience. lol. It's not homogenous. But some things are more common than others. We're discussing the typical scenario here. You can pretend the exception is the standard if you wish. Just don't be offended if I ignore you.

 

[CartridgeBlower]

This, right here encapsulates exactly why "PC people" don't understand "Mac people".
I mean literally, that quote is it. The exact thing. The idea that "specs and performance are the only aspects of a computer that matter"

Oh, also, I do see the clear MacBook inspirations, but it really isn't so stupidly blatent that I actually care.

I own both a Mac and a PC, so, yeah...

Nice try though!

 

[Deku]

Everyone at Google uses either Mac OS X or Linux:
http://www.businessinsider.com/henr...lames-windows-for-china-hacking-attack-2010-5

So at least one major company sees them as viable business machines.

Remember what the word "never" means.

oh I was speaking generally. Note I didn't say Google never uses Apple computers. Apple desktops are used in many business.

But PCs dominate the business world and in that world it is true Apple desktops have never been seen as business machines (ie: in the PC v Apple horserace, Apple has never recovered ground it lost to PC in the business world). I'm sure your superior human flesh searching for random factiods will find that piece of statistic too.

 

[BosSin]

Don't get me wrong I'm no expert with laptops but isn't the main reason for macs having longer battery life than any other laptop due to the fact that windows is a power hog?

In this case wouldn't it be wise to install some flavour of Linux if someone was worried about battery life

 

[jim-jam bongs]

Yes, your experience is the standard. Let's use it to discuss the typical business world experience. lol. It's not homogenous. But some things are more common than others. We're discussing the typical scenario here. You can pretend the exception is the standard if you wish. Just don't be offended if I ignore you.

Feel free to ignore away, you're actually just wrong. I go out to the offices of a wide range of corporates every week, from banks to TV networks, and what you're describing is actually the exception in this day and age. Like I said, sucks if you've convinced yourself of what you're saying but that doesn't make it true.

 

[Dreams-Visions]

^ k. ignored. anyway,

oh I was speaking generally. Note I didn't say Google never uses Apple computers. Apple desktops are used in many business.

But PCs dominate the business world and in that world it is true Apple desktops have never been seen as business machines (ie: in the PC v Apple horserace, Apple has never recovered ground it lost to PC in the business world). I'm sure your superior human flesh searching for random factiods will find that piece of statistic too.

Indeed. Principally because of cost and OS. If it wasn't running Windows, you weren't speaking a business language. Now even though they do run Windows, they're not typically going to be purchased to install Windows 7 on them.

 

[Rich!]

Don't get me wrong I'm no expert with laptops but isn't the main reason for macs having longer battery life than any other laptop due to the fact that windows is a power hog?

Remember - Mac's can run windows with boot camp. Same battery life.

The reason the battery life is good is because the battery is FUCKING MASSIVE.

 

[BosSin]

Remember - Mac's can run windows with boot camp. Same battery life.

The reason the battery life is good is because the battery is FUCKING MASSIVE.

Oh, I heard the battery life takes a nose dive when running windows with dualboot, must've heard wrong

 

[jim-jam bongs]

lol

Pathetic.

 

[numble]

oh I was speaking generally. Note I didn't say Google never uses Apple computers. Apple desktops are used in many business.

But PCs dominate the business world and in that world it is true Apple desktops have never been seen as business machines (ie: in the PC v Apple horserace, Apple has never recovered ground it lost to PC in the business world). I'm sure your superior human flesh searching for random factiods will find that piece of statistic too.

Come on, why do you need to always resort to ad hominem attacks? What does this even mean?

 

[Rich!]

Oh, I heard the battery life takes a nose dive when running windows with dualboot, must've heard wrong

Not on my one it didn't. Took a hit when absolutely raping it with intensive programs and games, yeah - but for browsing and general use (even editing on Adobe Premiere) it lasted the same on a charge as Mac OS.

 

[mrklaw]

Maybe in frivolous fields like entertainment or sports or some such, but people who deal with serious matters don't care about kiddy tech stuff like laptop appearance. They might care about your suit or your shoes, but anybody who starts passing judgment on a laptop, of all things, would get laughed out of the room.

also, from experience, people walking into meetings with MBAs or MBPs get dirty looks whenever they inevitably forget their VGA dongle, or network dongle, or livemeeting fails to work yet again because they don't have a standard IT imaged thinkpad

 

[Dreams-Visions]

Oh, I heard the battery life takes a nose dive when running windows with dualboot, must've heard wrong

No, it does drop by approximately half.

Partially because Windows doesn't have the same kind of optimizations that OS X has to maximize battery life. Partially because the discrete GPU is always engaged (no gpu switching, despite having an integrated GPU).

This is why I never recommend anyone buy a Mac if they plan to use it primarily as a WinBox. You lose most of the benefits of owning the Mac (better trackpad functionality, better battery life, cooler, quieter operation). If you are going to run Windows most of the time and want to spend big, get an Elitebook or a Precision. Don't buy a Mac.

 

[BosSin]

Not on my one it didn't. Took a hit when absolutely raping it with intensive programs and games, yeah - but for browsing and general use (even editing on Adobe Premiere) it lasted the same on a charge as Mac OS.

Fair enough, how is dualboot? Do most programs and games run smoothly with it?
Oh, nvm

 

[NGAMER9]

They both look like laptops. Wow.

Exactly my point, what's the problem here?

 

[foodtaster]

Uhm, OSX gives you nearly a 30% increase in battery life . Just sayin'. And don't say it's just their laptop, either.

Fact of the matter is, if PC's ran an optimized OSX, even a Macbook Pro would be spanked in battery life.

 

[Dreams-Visions]

Exactly my point, what's the problem here?

No problem at all. Imitation is the best form of flattery.

I'm sure you can, at minimum, acknowledge that lengths Dell went to try try to create a machine as similar as possible to the MBP. It's staring you in the face. I don't believe Dell has done so this blatantly before.

Uhm, OSX gives you nearly a 30% increase in battery life . Just sayin'.

yea, it's much more efficient. Thanks, UNIX.

 

[NGAMER9]

No problem at all. Imitation is the best form of flattery.

I'm sure you can, at minimum, acknowledge that lengths Dell went to try try to create a machine as similar as possible to the MBP. It's staring you in the face. I don't believe Dell has done so this blatantly before.

I can admit there's a few similarities, but with a different color scheme, speaker gate, headphone placement, buttons, charger placement, etc. it's not like they're close enough to confuse anyone. I guess it's a little derivative, but not enough to cause a stir.

 

[Jasoco]

Bigger than the device it's trying to copy.
Ugly as sin speaker grills.
Keys are interestingly rounded.
PC laptops still have mouse buttons? Why hasn't every PC maker totally copied Apple's Magic Trackpad yet? (Even Google did on a laptop they gave away for FREE. Though it's not perfect. In fact the driver is downright atrocious in comparison.)
Ugly advertising stickers make me glad Apple doesn't put up with that shit.
I know it's not plastic, but for some reason it totally looks plasticy.
The hinge is sooo 2000. (I am so used to Apple's hinge design which they've had since the iBook 2. And even Google copied it in the aforementioned FREE laptop.) Let me guess, the power plug is in the back? Along with the Ethernet? That's silly.
The hinge placement forces the design to be bigger than it should be, and the screen looks to be 16:9 instead of 16:10 (Not that that's bad. I don't care which format it is as long as the resolution is good.)
Where's the power LED? On the front like the MB's have? Or in your face like most other PC laptops? I can't see one on it.

Once again any attempt to mimic Apple purposely fails due to lack of industrial design and vision. Does the Unibody method really add so much to the price that other PC makers are unable to copy it?

And I still can't believe those Windows and Intel stickers need to be placed on the laptop in such a distracting location. Why can't that shit be put on the bottom where no one ever looks? Is there some kind of deal PC manufacturers make with MS and Intel/AMD and ATI/Nvidia/Etc that requires it be where people passing by your computer can see it? Do passers by really walk past your computer and think to themselves "Oh, hey. You have Nvidia on Windows 7. I never would have figured that out and I cared about it so much I'm so glad I didn't have to ask you personally"?

When Apple went Intel, my biggest concern was literally "I really hope we won't need to have stickers on our Macs now." Apple must have made a great deal with Intel. Now I know Intel is really the only choice you have on Macs anyway so it's not like you can accidentally mistake it for something running AMD, but what about the OS? Surprised MS doesn't require Mac users who install Windows on their Macs to put little stickers on them. In fact, the only time I can remember Apple needing to brand their machine with someone elses logo was the short lived HP iPod.

Too bad they didn't copy the backlit keyboard. All laptops should have that.

I wish the MacBook Air still did. :-( I forget how much I find it useful. It may be the deciding factor in whether I go Air next time or stay Pro.

Spoiler

I so want to go Air.

 

[Dreams-Visions]

^ yea, pretty much.

I can admit there's a few similarities, but with a different color scheme, speaker gate, headphone placement, buttons, charger placement, etc. it's not like they're close enough to confuse anyone. I guess it's a little derivative, but not enough to cause a stir.

No, it won't cause a stir. It's just interesting. To be honest...when looking at it, I'm not sure what *else* they could have done to look more like an MBP than it already does. The only thing that's distinctive is the finish on the inside and the shape of the keys. damn near everything else appears to be derived from the basic design of the MBP.

Again, I'm just surprised that Dell would feel the need to do this. Their laptops have looked fine as it was.

 

[SUPREME1]

Bigger than the device it's trying to copy.
Ugly as sin speaker grills.
Keys are interestingly rounded.
PC laptops still have mouse buttons? Why hasn't every PC maker totally copied Apple's Magic Trackpad yet? (Even Google did on a laptop they gave away for FREE. Though it's not perfect. In fact the driver is downright atrocious in comparison.)
Ugly advertising stickers make me glad Apple doesn't put up with that shit.
I know it's not plastic, but for some reason it totally looks plasticy.
The hinge is sooo 2000. (I am so used to Apple's hinge design which they've had since the iBook 2. And even Google copied it in the aforementioned FREE laptop.) Let me guess, the power plug is in the back? Along with the Ethernet? That's silly.
The hinge placement forces the design to be bigger than it should be, and the screen looks to be 16:9 instead of 16:10 (Not that that's bad. I don't care which format it is as long as the resolution is good.)
Where's the power LED? On the front like the MB's have? Or in your face like most other PC laptops? I can't see one on it.

Once again any attempt to mimic Apple purposely fails due to lack of industrial design and vision. Does the Unibody method really add so much to the price that other PC makers are unable to copy it?

And I still can't believe those Windows and Intel stickers need to be placed on the laptop in such a distracting location. Why can't that shit be put on the bottom where no one ever looks? Is there some kind of deal PC manufacturers make with MS and Intel/AMD and ATI/Nvidia/Etc that requires it be where people passing by your computer can see it? Do passers by really walk past your computer and think to themselves "Oh, hey. You have Nvidia on Windows 7. I never would have figured that out and I cared about it so much I'm so glad I didn't have to ask you personally"?

When Apple went Intel, my biggest concern was literally "I really hope we won't need to have stickers on our Macs now." Apple must have made a great deal with Intel. Now I know Intel is really the only choice you have on Macs anyway so it's not like you can accidentally mistake it for something running AMD, but what about the OS? Surprised MS doesn't require Mac users who install Windows on their Macs to put little stickers on them. In fact, the only time I can remember Apple needing to brand their machine with someone elses logo was the short lived HP iPod.


I wish the MacBook Air still did. :-( I forget how much I find it useful. It may be the deciding factor in whether I go Air next time or stay Pro.

Spoiler

I so want to go Air.

BIGGEST APPLE HOMER EVER.

 

[Chinese Electric Batman]

Dell runs a Windows OS, wins automatically.

 

[Dreams-Visions]

Dell runs a Windows OS, wins automatically.

In some ways yes, in some ways no.

Also, a Mac can run a Windows OS while looking better, weighing less and scoring higher in testing. So I guess it wins too.

 

[Angelus Errare]

I really don't understand why it's so hard to make a good looking laptop, and why I have yet to be hired by these companies to make a good looking laptop despite it all.

Like really the designer for some of these laptops shouldn't be working.

 

[buhdeh]

Does no decent designer want to work for Dell or something? How does such a huge PC manufacturer make such ugly, clone laptops? The specs and pricing look great but I don't want to be carrying around some MacBook clone. Christ, even a budget company like Acer can make their own designs like the Acer Timeline 3820 and 3830 laptops that look a billion times better.