How about any game that has 3D movement? (Meaning >90% of new games.) You're generally not even allowed to use the d-pad for movement outside of fighters and platformers.
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Destructoid: PS4 controller prototype & devkit photo, [Up: New Photo/Info In OP]
- Thread starter gofreak
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How about any game that has 3D movement? (Meaning >90% of new games.) You're generally not even allowed to use the d-pad for movement outside of fighters and platformers.
Refreshment.01
Member
BTW, Low chance it will be a touch screen.
My reasoning comes from reports that you can click the area as an input mechanism. That doesn't make a lot of sense for a touch screen, it makes more sense for a touch pad.
My reasoning comes from reports that you can click the area as an input mechanism. That doesn't make a lot of sense for a touch screen, it makes more sense for a touch pad.
My friends i have a console to sale you, it's called the Wii U, it's familiar yet new. Incredible, the console get's sh!t from earth to heaven but when my favorite company does it, it's familiar yet new XD
I pretty much never use the dpad for movement, not even in fighting games.
Unspeakable Evil
Member
Was thinking the same, but we'll wait and see.
For the new page:
http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-orbis-dual-shock-4-leak-analysis
EDIT: This pretty much confirms pad over screen. Interestingly the controller does appear to have speakers and not a microphone as well. Wednesday can't come soon enough.
http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-orbis-dual-shock-4-leak-analysis
EDIT: This pretty much confirms pad over screen. Interestingly the controller does appear to have speakers and not a microphone as well. Wednesday can't come soon enough.
Graphics Horse
Member
Most 2D games i prefer the dpad, those tend to be the only ones that offer it.
It does look really similar, which I think is its problem. I guess I was hoping for something a bit more unique. I know no one liked the ps3 boomerang controller but at least it had style.
Schobeleth
Member
Yeah, it's really annoying. I never say that the 360 pad layout is wrong, just because I don't like it.
Coming from my previous statement, I just prefer the analog sticks to be symmetrical. It feels perfect and natural to me when it comes to shooters, action games, etc. Also it is a well known fact that the dualshock d-pad is one of the best d-pads out there, so naturally people who haven't become accustomed to it would omit it from their analysis of the dualshock.
You only play schmups don't you?
What is the issue with symmetrical sticks anyway? Neither are actually the natural position, which actually lies somewhere directly in between a symmetrical and symmetrical, but that cannot exist due to having a d pad.
Also, there are game play segments in games that would be order of magnitude harder on a symmetrical sticks, such as the trials in Ni No Kuni, where you have to control two characters simultaneously using the analogues, often mirroring their moves exactly. Much easier to do with symmetrical sticks, which in all honesty I prefer.
Only real unnatural facet of both controllers to me are the placement of all the shoulder buttons, which imo should be further back, with L1/R1 or LB/RB being where L2/R2 currently preside, and L2/R2 being more towards the back of the controller where the middle fingers naturally rest when using the current L2/R2 or LT/RT.
Also, there are game play segments in games that would be order of magnitude harder on a symmetrical sticks, such as the trials in Ni No Kuni, where you have to control two characters simultaneously using the analogues, often mirroring their moves exactly. Much easier to do with symmetrical sticks, which in all honesty I prefer.
Only real unnatural facet of both controllers to me are the placement of all the shoulder buttons, which imo should be further back, with L1/R1 or LB/RB being where L2/R2 currently preside, and L2/R2 being more towards the back of the controller where the middle fingers naturally rest when using the current L2/R2 or LT/RT.
Callibretto
Member
What? Maybe if you're playing 2d games, but in 3d games, analog stick for movement is much more ideal
Graphics Horse
Member
Hm, I'm not keen of pinch zoom as it means taking a hand off the controller. I even do 'the claw' on my phone for pinch zoom because I'm too lazy to use my other hand. Useful in browsing I guess.
A lot of skilled PC players would argue with that, but that's for another time.
Refreshment.01
Member
I'm glad Sony copied "the speaker in the controller" idea, it was great on Wii when used properly and a higher fidelity implementation of this can only mean better things for games.
MrCookiepants
Member
ALBOFIGHTER
Member
Haha I do play fighting games and racing so that affects my views more. I also play some fps and platformers but I only use analog when there's no choice.
I'm not sure why some of you are mentioning 3d movement. Up is up just the same on dpad as it is on analog. Keep in mind I still use the right analog stick to look around in 3d games as you kinda have to which I have no problem with. It's the left analog movement stick I'm talking about.
I'm not sure why some of you are mentioning 3d movement. Up is up just the same on dpad as it is on analog. Keep in mind I still use the right analog stick to look around in 3d games as you kinda have to which I have no problem with. It's the left analog movement stick I'm talking about.
AppleSmack
Banned
I really hope they change up the controller for final release. That dumb blue light at the front and those analog thumb sticks are awful.
It would be ok so long as it's for down the sight aiming only. when you're down the sights any tilting motion detected would adjust the aiming accordingly. Would be super awesome to get your precise headshots without having to mess with the stick.
I can't think of a 3rd/1st person shooter that wouldn't benefit from this.
weekend_warrior
Banned
Paracelsus
Member
Does PES still allow d-pad movement? I used to demolish analog players back in the day.
Same. I get the point about you moving the actual screen on the vita, but if the amount of adjust is fixed I think you'd adjust to it really quickly. I'm crap at headshots generally, and even more so on a console with twin sticks, but in uncharted GA I found it really natural.
Wasn't really doable on DS3 due to lack of gyros - the accelerometers wouldn't have given the finesse needed.
Yes it still does.
Oppo
Member
4 cardinal directions with binary range (on/off)
Vs
360° of motion with highly variable range (sneakingwalking/running for example)
Is it worth it though? I thought the whole point of including move is to lure in the casuals so not sure how this controller is going to help them. It seems to be designed more for the core than the casuals . Something has got to give... There must be something more to the move integration in the controller than meets the eye.
LowEndTorque
Member
Having messed around a bit with the Wii U pro-controller, I reached the conclusion that placement of sticks doesn't really matter at all. What matters is the overall comfort, ergonomics and feel of of the controller. It's just that the most comfortable controller on the market happens to use offset sticks, so maybe that's why people make a big deal out of it. What makes the 360 controller great is the shape, buttons and ergonomics not the offset sticks.
weekend_warrior
Banned
^ This guy gets it. Though I still prefer symmetrical because my hands are symmetrical.
Nah, for movement an analog stick can be ideal, but not for aiming. Using WASD is perfectly adequate, but there are real limitations to only digital, on/off movement in only 8 directions. Having a dedicated key to toggle walk/run is one of them. The problem though is how do you use something like an analog stick for movement but still have the freedom of a full keyboard for other actions? That's the tradeoff.
There are also situations where having a digital on/off movement can be ideal, but I think that's more the exception than the rule and comes about because the design of the game is built around keyboard controls. See something like Trackmania and how users design tracks.
Use both thumbs?
Wow. Is this a post from 1999?
ALBOFIGHTER
Member
I see your point. I guess you would need pressure sensitive dpad to have the same potential. For the 360 degrees you can use the right analog. Games don't usually require you to go full circle unless its a quick time event.
Graphics Horse
Member
Hmm?
In those ancient Richard Marks vids people like to post they're tracking cylinders as well as spheres on the PS2.
Well that's still at the end of a stick vs on one side of a controller, so there's less liberty of movement without obstructing the camera's view. That's what I mean. Not really the shape of it.
You mean the company that made this:
and these:
Cuz if that's the case, we'd be pretty goddamn lucky.
Graphics Horse
Member
That's true but the design of it is not something you'd swing behind your head, you'll always be vaguely facing the screen and if it's used in a Tumble-like way, it has potential to work well, not that I expect many games to use it. I am curious if fingers could block it or if it'll be perfectly out of the way but besides that it looks like it'll be visible through the best part of 180 degrees.
True that helps as well, you don't actually need a perfect unobscured shape then, just a cross reference with another camera.
SeriousApes
Member
The form looks nice overall. It looks a bit larger, closer to the 360 controller, with slightly longer and wider grips than the DS3. I like the sticks, they look like they're still convex, but with an added lip for better grip, and they look further apart than the DS3. D pad looks nice. I'm not sure about the new additions like the touch pad, move light, and speaker/mic. I look forward to seeing the finished design. Hope it's more sleek in the final version.
I had like a bunch of weird mini-dreams last night and one of them I was playing the PS4 (or at least the controller) with a friend, and while it was all really fuzzy I swear to whatever you believe that I remember thinking "oh this d-pad is really nice."
Sony's marketing in my dreams!
Sony's marketing in my dreams!
If you read the digital foundry analyst, they seemed to believe the stereo cameras played a role in offsetting that. Technically it's over my head, but it sounded reasonable enough to work.
They don't care if you buy a PS4, they want you to buy games.
If they can sell you a subscription to a cloud PS4, it equates to the same thing.
TimeEffect
Member
OK, so, now I change my mind and am hoping it's indeed a touch screen. Surely a very basic screen is not worth $100.
I like the inclusion of the little speaker. I played through zombiu recently and the gamepad has a little speaker too. One character in the game would speak on a walkie talkie and sound would come through the gamepad. It was a subtle but welcome touch that added to the atmosphere of the game.
Alx
Member
but in those demos, the degrees of freedom were limited, it mostly worked in a vertical 2D plane : height and lateral position of the cylinders, and rotation in that plane. That part is rather easy to do, you only have to extract a 2D blob in the image, and compute its center and main direction.
Tracking depth motion is another story. According to their Eyepad patent, they intend to estimate those motions by analyzing the projected shape of a rectangle, but that method isn't robust to errors in the image. Tracking a sphere is a better solution because there is less ambiguity : the projection of a sphere is always a disk (it's useless for orientation though)
It's all good until you play with a proper set of cans.
Then what does that speaker do for you when you have headphones on? That's an issue. Playing horror games with good sound design on a set of cans is miles ahead of my 5.1 setup. All those little audio details just pop. Hopefully, if it is a speaker and not a mic, you can choose to not use it as a speaker.
indeed.....lol...
3rdamention
Member
Now this is 4D.. Unfortunately all my gaming dreams involve old systems...like NES and the Genesis...where power goes out or my sister trips over them and I lose all my progress cause you cannot save..
3rdamention
Member
So would this mean we move around ourliving room and the sound reflects that? I'm confused about the gaming implications but its awesome on paper..
With the game having your exact position in the real world & controlling the sound it could make you feel like a Zombie is creeping up on you from behind.