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DF: All Developers Extremely Happy With PS5 Development But Not All Are Happy With XSX Development

Redlight

Member
One thing Sony did with PS1 was make a great development environment including tools, documentation and support. This was in stark contrast to the poor job Sega and Nintendo has historically provided. The Saturn was an absolute mess. From my understanding Sony knocked it out of the park with PS4 as well. So to me it's not a surprise. Microsoft may not be as streamlined due to trying to cover PC development and several generations of hardware, or they didn't give it the attention it deserved. But this is one thing that has always been important to Sony.
Odd that you would leave PS3 out of this revisionist history.
 

Ozzie666

Member
Odd that you would leave PS3 out of this revisionist history.

Revisionist? Never claimed they were perfect mate. PS3 launch was a disaster and developers struggled. I don't honestly know how Sony's tools were for PS3. I know developers struggled with the concepts of the cpu more than anything as it was a head of its time; pretty common place now though.

So maybe Microsoft has had their own PS3 or Saturn moment here with the Series X and development support has struggled.
 
Isn’t this the same person people here were calling a MS shill for getting early access to the Series S?
In my book anyone who speaks ill of the guys at DF is an idiot, they're one of the most wholesome informative channels on Youtube and i always check their videos even if i don't have any interest in the game they're discussing, DF retro is reason alone to support them, I'm still mad some schizo drove off John Linneman off neogaf.

Anyway I've already seen the video, i won't miss a chance of seeing Wichard's signature hand motions.
 

onQ123

Member
Devs might not get the best out of the Xbox Series X but Microsoft isn't dumb & what is really happening is that they are trying to create a platform that has so much software running on it that people will buy devices that run the Xbox games like how people buy different tablets & phones .

Even the name gives this away because Series S / Series X means that it will be more consoles made in the Series S & Series X line.

In short they want to be like Apple & have people hooked into the ecosystem & the small payment plan is a good way to get people because if they are already paying the money then see the new models of Xbox Series S / Series X that will come out in a few years they will just upgrade like people do with the phones & someone else will end up with the older model that someone else paid for but never really owned & the userbase will just grow.
 

Hawking Radiation

Gold Member
Yep, just gonna set up camp here. Can already hear the footsgeps getting louder

 

Iced Arcade

Member
Edit: Jumped the gun on thinking it was another usual Agnostic2020 thread without reading the OP. Just reacted to the bait title.
 
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Lysandros

Member
One thing Sony did with PS1 was make a great development environment including tools, documentation and support. This was in stark contrast to the poor job Sega and Nintendo has historically provided. The Saturn was an absolute mess. From my understanding Sony knocked it out of the park with PS4 as well. So to me it's not a surprise. Microsoft may not be as streamlined due to trying to cover PC development and several generations of hardware, or they didn't give it the attention it deserved. But this is one thing that has always been important to Sony.
Yes, PS2 seems to be the exception from Sony with developers reporting poor/insufficient documentation for the development kits.
 

TLZ

Member
Well that's a typical Agnostic2020 Dissects all the positive out of what's said to mold into a nice little spin.

Anyone interested in what is actually said, click the video to 38.35 Xbox is more powerful but developers are finding the PS5 easy because it's the same as the PS4... Microsoft's is harder because they started brand new game development kit that not only includes the Series X/S but PC and X1.
That's exactly what he said in his post, that's if you bothered reading it instead of quickly accusing him :messenger_neutral:
 

ExKing

says GAF is a racist board but still wants to be a part of it...
That's quite surprising, I thought devs always wanted the most capable and powerful hardware. That sounds a bit too good to be true "extremely" happy ? Ok, we'll see when the games come out, if that happiness translates into quality.
 

Aladin

Member
Death loop is not an exclusive after all. It is coming to xbox.
Xcloud is make or break for xbox ecosystem. When your game ends up on the best streaming service, it makes sense to develop for xbox at any cost.
 

dvdvideo

Member
Wait, the title says "all developers". Please provide evidence of every single developer for both ps5 and xbox. I hope we have a lot of room for your reply, it should be hundreds of direct quotes.
 
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reinking

Member
Actually it's only the perfect price because microsoft made the xbsx /series S cheap. The ps5 was more expensive than the xbx
Prove it. People keep saying this. It is doubtful that Sony was ever going to release a $600 console again.
 

Iced Arcade

Member
That's exactly what he said in his post, that's if you bothered reading it instead of quickly accusing him :messenger_neutral:
You are correct, I did react to the bait title and history alone. Good looking out, we all deserve besties like you.
 
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ZywyPL

Gold Member
I don't trust DF, they are MS shills, and one of their staff members is even an XB Discord channel member, all they do is spread lies and FUD, so obviously this article is yet again nothing but a big fat lie just to get clicks.
 

Fitzchiv

Member
All he's saying is some developers are having to move to something new and different in GDK. They'll get used to it.

Probably for Sony too in the future once they eventually break it to the world they'll be going that direction too...
 

Panajev2001a

GAF's Pleasant Genius
So they are going to scale up from ps4!? So all this time, these mf's been lying out their asses!? And their fans been trolling everyone under the sun. What a shit show.








😂, trolling every thread you can very diligently. The gang is at least aligned... now, figure out a dev environment is not the same as a development SDK target nor tHe final specs. But sure your novel was surely not a success because you were using a dated Word processor ;).
 

cireza

Member
Developers should stop complaining and get to work.

Don't embarrass yourselves like this.

Oh my god there are some new features in my development environment, MS sucks ! Sony rules, nothing as changed at all, so I don't have to use my brain !
 
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DonJuanSchlong

Spice Spice Baby
😂, trolling every thread you can very diligently. The gang is at least aligned... now, figure out a dev environment is not the same as a development SDK target nor tHe final specs. But sure your novel was surely not a success because you were using a dated Word processor ;).
If they scale up from ps4 for the new horizon, wouldn't that kinda mess with fast traveling? Or would they gimp the ps4 version and give benefits to the ps5 version? This stuff is interesting, now that games have been confirmed as crossgen. Not trolling, I'm interested to see how they are going to do it in Halo as well, if that makes you feel any better 🤷‍♀️ 🤷‍♂️.
 
This is why I think multiplatform games will have a slight edge on PS5 at launch (well aside from RE8 :p )

We've heard for several months now the dev tools/dev software environment on Xbox are not as good. This won't change either; PS5's SDK is super streamlined for PS5 only. XSX SDK has to have commonality with PC and has to be scalable for Series S. This is like a thin layer on top of games stopping devs getting 100% out of the system.
 
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Garani

Member
Isn’t this the same person people here were calling a MS shill for getting early access to the Series S?

He is, but he can't affor to loose a potential audience of 100 million PS4 owners. He gotta give some good news once in a while, don't you think?

In my book anyone who speaks ill of the guys at DF is an idiot, they're one of the most wholesome informative channels on Youtube

Then you get the "Halo Infinite doesn't look impressive because of lighting". That was the biggest BS of the whole history of BS.
Lockheart should have been all digital SeX. MS f'd that up.
They couldn't. They wanted to undercut Sony's pricing, and to do that they had to engineer a whole new machine, and thus loose industrial savings (2 different APUs, different memories, etc)
 

mcjmetroid

Member
This isn't going to make any difference.

It isn't like developers are going to 'choose" ps5 because it's slightly easier to develop for.

Most non first party games are going to be appear on both. It's foolish not to. Were not living in the Saturn Ps1 days anymore.
 

12Dannu123

Member
Sony platforms: PS5
Microsoft platforms: Xbox, Windows 10|X and Game Streaming.

More platforms to target, the more complicated it is. But Sony doesn't have any relevant platform beyond consoles, so developers only target 1 platform.



This is why I think multiplatform games will have a slight edge on PS5 at launch (well aside from RE8 :p )

We've heard for several months now the dev tools/dev software environment on Xbox are not as good. This won't change either; PS5's SDK is super streamlined for PS5 only. XSX SDK has to have commonality with PC and has to be scalable for Series S. This is like a thin layer on top of games stopping devs getting 100% out of the system.

If you watch the yotube video. The Xbox GDK targets Xbox and PC (Both are MS's Oses) so for multiplatform development, the Xbox will likely be the main development kit for developers and publishers.
 
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Romulus

Member
Still, being more difficult to develop on doesn’t mean much.
PS3 was hell for most devs yet there’s things on the platform which perfectly hold up a decade later. We’ll see insane shit on Series X.

SNES holds up, as does many gamecube, ps2, and og Xbox games. Many do, but I think 98% of ps3 games aged awfully. One of the worst examples imo.
 
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Panajev2001a

GAF's Pleasant Genius
If they scale up from ps4 for the new horizon, wouldn't that kinda mess with fast traveling? Or would they gimp the ps4 version and give benefits to the ps5 version? This stuff is interesting, now that games have been confirmed as crossgen. Not trolling, I'm interested to see how they are going to do it in Halo as well, if that makes you feel any better 🤷‍♀️ 🤷‍♂️.

You know how much you come off as reading off a script/astroturfing when you continue to misread what other people are saying (people that are criticising seeing the biggest launch blockbusters on PS4 as well) just as an excuse to whip out what reads like a canned reply? Seriously, not trying to dunk on you. Sorry if that seems harsh, not meant to be.

If you create your game on both and do not have two full sized teams working in parallel and ignoring each other then yes, the high end console version is held back.
Does it mean the game will look like shit on the high end console? No, but that does not mean it is using the high end console’s full potential.

This article is taking about the development environment being familiar and an extension of what PS4 devs used, this has no bearing with cross generation games or not.

Much like you writing a book on the same version of Word you wrote the previous one on has no bearing on what the new book will be about.
 

geordiemp

Member

He mentions at the end of the day its the software that shows the capabilities of a hardware and that is as much dependent on development environment as specs.

Hopefully all the fake fud about ps5 will die soon.

DF geting their excuses ready when ps games look same or god forbid better.

Its more than about apis and TF, you need to keep those large XSX shader arrays fed.

And Ray tracing is memory intensive, not just RAM< but also caches and cache bus speed.

Lets wait for a comparison, Richard getting his story ready.....
 
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cormack12

Gold Member
If developers got used to the Cell then I don't think this generation is going to be a problem, lol. Games will get better looking as the gen goes on. We don't need this mean girls shit everytime a console gets a negative quote.
 
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DonJuanSchlong

Spice Spice Baby
You know how much you come off as reading off a script/astroturfing when you continue to misread what other people are saying (people that are criticising seeing the biggest launch blockbusters on PS4 as well) just as an excuse to whip out what reads like a canned reply? Seriously, not trying to dunk on you. Sorry if that seems harsh, not meant to be.

If you create your game on both and do not have two full sized teams working in parallel and ignoring each other then yes, the high end console version is held back.
Does it mean the game will look like shit on the high end console? No, but that does not mean it is using the high end console’s full potential.

This article is taking about the development environment being familiar and an extension of what PS4 devs used, this has no bearing with cross generation games or not.

Much like you writing a book on the same version of Word you wrote the previous one on has no bearing on what the new book will be about.
No offense taken, everyone's entitled to their opinion.

Was just curious since it wouldn't be any different from the other camps games that are also cross gen.

It's good that Sony have provided devs with a familiar environment to work in. It might be a little more work to get their with Xbox dev kits, but it seems they have the upper hand in being the lead console for multiplatforms, because of it.

All I know, is that this upcoming years is going to be great for everyone. Many major games are going to be available for the first time ever on different hardware, new IP's, remakes/remasters, etc.
 

Kumomeme

Member
they change xbox sdk to gdk so its take time for devs to get used to. while ps5 not much different than ps4. thats what i understand. things will be better later.

the new gdk is not just for xbox but for pc too so lets see how it goes.
 
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What was actually said: Some devs I've spoken to are happy with the new Xbox development environment, others aren't as happy because it's different from current gen environment.

What Sony fans think was said: PS5 is universally easier to develop for, will be the primary console with Xbox getting ports and Microsoft are going to exit the video game market and sell off their IPs to Sony at which point I'll pretend I always liked them.
 
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