• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

Drama Digital Foundry: “PS5 teardown is uninteresting, until we get our own hands on"

Status
Not open for further replies.

phil_t98

Member
Oct 10, 2014
2,970
2,288
595
How do you know they don’t have an NDA or an agreement with Sony not to say much at the moment?
 
  • Like
Reactions: EDMIX
Mar 27, 2020
7,318
22,005
690
You said loan, implying that DF will
Have to go and get another system
Well they are preproduction units correct?

And even if they are not they still are a result of an agreement between Microsoft and the people who received them.
 
Last edited:
Mar 27, 2020
7,318
22,005
690
And what is this agreement?
Are you saying there isn't one and they can post whatever they want of it?

Where are the streams, the thermal studies, the sound measurements and the next gen games? Where's the footage of the complete operating system and other items?

Don't you think that there's a lack of information even though many of these people have XSXs in their homes?

You know Tom Warren? He supposedly had a video of him playing Destiny 2 on the XSX but he strangely deleted it.

How can you say their isn't an agreement after all that?

An NDA is a contract to protect intellectual property - it has to be signed for the YouTube “influencer” to get early access to the console. Therefore it is a marketing contract - no signature, no content.

Secondly I’m not taking about BC vs next generation games.

Add up the minutes of YouTuber produced gameplay content from PS5 vs Xsex and you’ll find there are more minutes of youtuber footage at higher quality, from the PS5.

Neither company has produced anything approaching the content I want - proper unedited gameplay and console usage.

What do we have to look at from those Xsex consoles that are out in the wild then? - well let’s look at one of the biggest Xbox marketers around Tom Warren and the content he produced ...




Sounded just like what I wanted to see. Someone sitting down with the console for a few hours of gaming. Ok it’s Destiny 2 but nevermind that - a chance to see what the Xsex experience would offer.

What did we get?






Yep - 272p source captures from a camera so far from the TV it’s a blur ....

I’d suggest you go take a look at it but




To be honest I’m not surprised he took that video down either.


So yeah - take the rhetoric about MS letting everyone see their console somewhere else until you’ve got some footage to back it up.

I’m not interested in hearing yet more “insiders” under marketing contracts tell me how great this stuff is when they can’t show it, regardless of the reason why. And that applies to both Sony and MS.
Whatever is being shown with these consoles has already been approved by Microsoft. Once the system is finally out people who get them outside an agreement can do whatever they want with them.

Edit: Did a little bit of research and watched some videos while some of my questions were answered theres still some footage missing.

Edit 2: Ok so basically Yongyea confirmed an NDA for these systems.


Basically they are attached with terms and conditions that they have to follow. Such as limiting what they can talk about for example.
 
Last edited:

TGO

Member
Sep 5, 2007
10,307
9,427
1,530
UK
but Sony did the tear down video, there isn't much to add really is there?
Well yeah, DF is supposed to experts on hardware.
They did a complete analysis on a image of the silicon die for Xbox Series X.
The information in the teardown just show's you what the components are, there's no talk about what it actually does and how effective it will be.
This is something they can use their knowledge to inform users.
So them saying it's uninteresting is shocking
Did they do their own teardown of previous consoles before talking about whats inside?
I'm just assuming they are making the video as we speak, but the comments from Alex has blown this up more then it should be because its idiotic to suggest that it's uninteresting to them, unless...
 

xan stylo

Member
Jan 7, 2018
909
1,200
530
I think PS5 is a well-designed console, except for it's size/form factor. That thing is a big heckin' chonker and the optics of this Noah's Ark of game consoles next to the XSX and XSS probably wouldn't be great.
So the ps5 Is a "big heckin chonker" but the xbox series x isn't? I can't even fit that fat bastard in my TV unit, gotta put it behind the TV. The ps5 will fit. My girlfriend calls it the x block as its hideous and looks like a building block.
 
Last edited:

sainraja

Member
Aug 15, 2007
567
308
1,255
Alex, does have a name and is quite clearly more a fan of PC gaming than any console. Overlooking that, there was nothing 'that' wrong with Halo Infinite showcase, in actual fact. The combat looked fab, the guns looked brilliant the Art, Music and sound effects pure Halo. Its biggest problem, was it didn't look much above a One X game, But I would find to it hard to think of an open-world FPS on the One X that runs at native 4k at 60 fps with a map size bigger than the last 2 Halo games combined.
You are clearly forgetting the months of conversation that ensued once it was shown. You can't alone define the issues many people were having with what Microsoft showed of Infinite.
It was nice to see the cooling system of the PS5, but it was dull Teardown and was like having Grandad take your console apart. Contrast that with how MS allowed the likes of Digital Foundry, Austin Evans Ect to hold the various components and also try putting the internals of the console back together themself's. Much more interesting and far better to be open to the gaming press

It's funny how you look to call people out, yet act like one of the SONY Faithfull, right down to talking numbers of views *rolleyes*
What makes one more interesting than the other? The person you are responding to found Sony's interesting enough. Why you are pushing your opinion to be higher or more valid than his? If you are saying DF's was more interesting, why did you find it so? Why is it better because they get to hold the components vs Sony/MS themselves doing it? You can't be serious with that statement. I mean, do the components change or something?

If you ask me, both were pretty boring to sit through (you have to actually be interested in the components to actually sit through it all). If you go with stats alone, many more people found the PS5 teardown a lot more interesting just based on likes and views alone. So by that you are simply wrong in your statement.

Regardless of it all, I can't think of why Sony wouldn't do it or should do it. Did they with the PS4? If so, I wonder what stopped them from doing so this time around. Budget? Marketing spend? different priorities?

And please, stop with labeling people as a fan of this or that (e.g. Sony faithlful). Just makes your point have less weight if you have to resort to that.
 
Last edited:

PaintTinJr

Member
Jan 30, 2020
571
1,447
435
Oxfordshire, England
Given that people are saying that DF had access from Microsoft with series X(and S) and not PS5, can anyone that's watched all the DF videos tell me if the PSU specs for the Series S were revealed by DF. I've checked the web (and my google fu might be off) but all I get is the master chief logo on the unit coming up (wiki only lists series X power draw, Xbox don't list it, amazon uk/com don't list it, and in the DF comparison text they don't list it).

If they've had full access and this number is still not in the public domain, that seems a bit weird to me. Does anyone know the amount - so we can maybe extrapolate the real power use of X by it being 3x times the compute of the S?
 
  • Like
Reactions: phil_t98

RokkanStoned

Member
Jan 14, 2018
2,529
2,996
605
Norway
I mean, there is a point there, but seems way too salty in how it's written. "Uninteresting" I'd definitely disagree on, though it might be different for people with technical expertise, especially since they got a rather good look at the Xbox SeX from my impression of the video. However, both consoles should at this point be available to various third parties (like DF) to check them out without restrictions in order to give the consumers a better idea of the hardware. It certainly spells a bit lack of confidence from Sony's side that they've been rather restrictive, at least by my own impression.
 
Mar 27, 2020
7,318
22,005
690
Just doing a 5 min video like this one would be enough. Is the case of balance vontent that takez time with fast videos.

Interesting how he says that he thinks it will be quieter than the Series X. Also interesting how he talks about the difficulty of using liquid metal to cool something down.
 
  • Like
Reactions: mckmas8808

FrankWza

Member
Feb 14, 2013
1,882
529
575
So the ps5 Is a "big heckin chonker" but the xbox series x isn't? I can't even fit that fat bastard in my TV unit, gotta put it behind the TV. The ps5 will fit. My girlfriend calls it the x block as its hideous and looks like a building block.
I don’t think the series x is terrible looking and I like the all black. I do think and have many times asked this question here and have never had a reply. Where is this system fitting so easily? The depth being equal on all sides limits your options if you need to place it vertically because it takes up the same amount of space in all directions. Like behind or beside a tv on your stand. You’d have to have a stand that is substantially bigger than your tv. Horizontally, it’s so high that, even if it fits inside a tv stand, it will limit the airflow. If you place it horizontally on your stand you’ll have to raise your tv. Anyone you has a big center channel speaker will understand that. I know the ps5 is bigger in volume, but you can place it vertically behind your tv top front to bottom back and horizontally you’re going to have much more room to play with height wise versus width.
 
  • Like
Reactions: EDMIX
Aug 5, 2009
1,086
550
965
UK
You are clearly forgetting the months of conversation that ensued once it was shown. You can't alone define the issues many people were having with what Microsoft showed of Infinite
.

What by rabbit Twitter and gaming forums PS Fanboys ? . It wasn't the best , but nowhere near as bad as was made out . For me the biggest disappointment was a total of Raytacing. It wasn't the showcase it needed to.be, but hardly terrible IMO.


What makes one more interesting than the other? The person you are responding to found Sony's interesting enough. Why you are pushing your opinion to be higher or more valid than his? If you are saying DF's was more interesting, why did you find it so? Why is it better because they get to hold the components vs Sony/MS themselves doing it? You can't be serious with that statement. I mean, do the components change or something?

If you ask me, both were pretty boring to sit through (you have to actually be interested in the components to actually sit through it all). If you go with stats alone, many more people found the PS5 teardown a lot more interesting just based on likes and views alone. So by that you are simpl
One was more interesting because the press where not only given full access to the actual hardware but also allowed to actual play with the actual hardware and all that some 6 months ago and not just for DF either , but other members of the press were allowed to do the same .
 
  • Like
Reactions: CatLady
Dec 29, 2018
2,318
6,352
635
Well yeah, DF is supposed to experts on hardware.
They did a complete analysis on a image of the silicon die for Xbox Series X.
The information in the teardown just show's you what the components are, there's no talk about what it actually does and how effective it will be.
This is something they can use their knowledge to inform users.
So them saying it's uninteresting is shocking
Did they do their own teardown of previous consoles before talking about whats inside?
I'm just assuming they are making the video as we speak, but the comments from Alex has blown this up more then it should be because its idiotic to suggest that it's uninteresting to them, unless...
Uh huh. THIS . I doubt anyone in this thread is even going to try to counter that point because its spot on.

I said this before in a post of mine. DF does analysis on videos, images, hardware, anything. Very interesting to see a certain crowd claim DF NEEDS to have hardware IN STUDIO (IN-PERSON) to be able to add their take on it.
 
Last edited:

kruis

Exposing the sinister cartel of retailers who allow companies to pay for advertising space.
Dec 11, 2008
2,841
1,001
1,185
Uh huh. THIS . I doubt anyone in this thread is even going to try to counter that point because its spot on.

I said this before in a post of mine. DF does analysis on videos, images, hardware, anything. Very interesting to see a certain crowd claim DF NEEDS to have hardware IN STUDIO (IN-PERSON) to be able to add their take on it.
DF even goes so far as to analyze videos of trailers and alpha versions so they can extrapolate about what the final release might hold in store. They don't need much hard evidence to fill a ten minute video. It doesn't take much to capture their attention judging by the three videos (combined almost 60 minutes) they did about that Avengers game back in August.
 
Dec 29, 2018
2,318
6,352
635
It's a 7 minute video of a Japanese guy removing the screws from a plastic box. So little was going on in the video, the engineer was silent for long stretches.

Yes, that is uninteresting to many people. If you have a problem with that subjective comment, please make note of it in your Rain Man Serious Injury Notebook. Ow, ow, ow.
Really?

We all got a first look at the innards of the PS5. Something that tech nerds have been waiting for for months, especially Digital Foundry and them claiming it to be uninteresting is suspect when they do full video analysis of the Series X chip from an image floating around online.

You telling me them getting their first glimpse of the PS5 innards, including the expensive liquid metal cooling system is genuinely uninteresting? So they have NO opinion on how this all works or how Sony would have chosen their hardware route on the cooling the system, exhaust and intake vents, size of the heatsink, SSD sizes and potentially what is compatible with the machine etc. etc ?

Give me a fucking break.

DF even goes so far as to analyze videos of trailers and alpha versions so they can extrapolate about what the final release might hold in store. They don't need much hard evidence to fill a ten minute video. It doesn't take much to capture their attention judging by the three videos (combined almost 60 minutes) they did about that Avengers game back in August.
They had their own Unreal Engine 5 analysis video up within minutes of the engine demo being available on Epic's youtube channel.
 
Last edited:

sainraja

Member
Aug 15, 2007
567
308
1,255
What by rabbit Twitter and gaming forums PS Fanboys ? . It wasn't the best , but nowhere near as bad as was made out . For me the biggest disappointment was a total of Raytacing. It wasn't the showcase it needed to.be, but hardly terrible IMO.
Labeling people to dismiss their opinions is sooo easy. And you keep choosing to do it. Disappointing.
One was more interesting because the press where not only given full access to the actual hardware but also allowed to actual play with the actual hardware and all that some 6 months ago and not just for DF either , but other members of the press were allowed to do the same .
We're talking about a teardown video here, are we not? What about the teardown video that DF did for the Series X you found interesting?
 
Dec 29, 2018
2,318
6,352
635
What is the volume of the PS5 compared to the XSX and XSS?
I think PS5 is bigger in total volume, but not that much that I would classify it has HUGE compared to Series X.

Going by how my PS4 Pro operates during games, I couldn't care less if PS5 is a full on PC tower as long as its not loud while i'm gaming.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Lysandros

geordiemp

Member
Sep 5, 2013
10,514
15,818
960
UK
How do you know they don’t have an NDA or an agreement with Sony not to say much at the moment?
Microsoft said at Hotchips they could only talk a little about RDNA2 due to AMD NDA.

Sony will ahve same agreement.

If sony have more customisations, then there is less they can say.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Lysandros

geordiemp

Member
Sep 5, 2013
10,514
15,818
960
UK
Nothing will change until AMD present RDNA2 and reveal all.

They have patented Infinity Cache L2, shared data cache L1, Cache data compression technique, there is allot they have to reveal.

MS and Sony have not said much because they cant, at least the shared CCX CPU memory is now out in the open.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: Lysandros

geordiemp

Member
Sep 5, 2013
10,514
15,818
960
UK
fair enough. do you know when this is?
AMD stated something like Oct 28 th it is set for, funny how consoles are a few weeks later.... :messenger_beaming:

This will all have been agreed and legally binding many months ago and set in stone for both, MS probably were allowed hotchips but they were clearly very limited in scope..

MS even said we cant talk about L1 or procees etc in questions.

Its a shame, as AMD having so much new stuff has stopped MS and Sony talking openly about the tech.

XSX Hot chips mentioned none of this new sruff, but that does not mean XSX or Ps5 does not have them, it means they cant say either way.
 
Last edited:

phil_t98

Member
Oct 10, 2014
2,970
2,288
595
AMD stated something like Oct 28 th it is set for, funny how consoles are a few weeks later.... :messenger_beaming:

This will all have been agreed and legally binding many months ago and set in stone for both, MS probably were allowed hotchips nut tghey were very limited in scope..

Its a shame, as AMD having so much new stuff has stopped MS and Sony talking openly about the tech.

XSX Hot chips mentioned none of this, but that does not mean XSX or Ps5 does not have them, it means they cant say either way.
this maybe another reason not to do the tear down video yet then
 
Jul 29, 2013
2,536
4,712
950
US
I think PS5 is bigger in total volume, but not that much that I would classify it has HUGE compared to Series X.

Going by how my PS4 Pro operates during games, I couldn't care less if PS5 is a full on PC tower as long as its not loud while i'm gaming.
I thought I saw an article the other day that the PS5 was the biggest game console ever and like 50% huger in volume than the XSX? That's substantial enough for my statement to be Mythbusters 'Plausible'.
 
  • Like
Reactions: CatLady
Aug 5, 2009
1,086
550
965
UK
Labeling people to dismiss their opinions is sooo easy. And you keep choosing to do it. Disappointing.
When it's objective criticism it's fine , but it was clear a lot of it was basically just PS Fans going OTT; Ones who' had a bee in their bonnet, even since MS came out with a GPU advantage

talking about a teardown video here, are we not? What about the teardown video that DF did for the Series X you found interesting?
It was more interesting due to nothing more than you had discussion and talk of what the various parts did and we also saw them playing actual Hardware months ago , along with the likes of Austin. SONY not only came late , but it's teradown was as basic as it gets .

I enjoyed it enough to watch it all mind[/QUOTE][/QUOTE]
 
Last edited:
Mar 27, 2020
7,318
22,005
690
this maybe another reason not to do the tear down video yet then
Maybe but it's not like a teardown is going to reveal RDNA2 features. Microsoft already had Hotchips and there are still some unanswered questions. And this was after a teardown was down and the die was revealed.
 

DynamiteCop!

Member Series S
Mar 3, 2018
4,809
11,631
825
The teardown was incredibly uninteresting, and there's no reason for them to cover it because there is no actual information from it. Sony is also being weird af, controlling the flow of information so we know basically nothing, staging events for people to "review" the console in a controlled environment and completely ignoring community concerns or what people actually want to know.

They're ass backwards about everything.
 

SegaSnatcher

Member
Jan 31, 2020
126
234
240
Scottsdale, Arizona
Really?

We all got a first look at the innards of the PS5. Something that tech nerds have been waiting for for months, especially Digital Foundry and them claiming it to be uninteresting is suspect when they do full video analysis of the Series X chip from an image floating around online.

You telling me them getting their first glimpse of the PS5 innards, including the expensive liquid metal cooling system is genuinely uninteresting? So they have NO opinion on how this all works or how Sony would have chosen their hardware route on the cooling the system, exhaust and intake vents, size of the heatsink, SSD sizes and potentially what is compatible with the machine etc. etc ?

Give me a fucking break.


They had their own Unreal Engine 5 analysis video up within minutes of the engine demo being available on Epic's youtube channel.
Couldn’t have said it any better. It is quite suspect when someone from DF calls a tear down video of a brand new console that shows us things we didn’t know about previously “uninteresting”. The use of liquid metal is uninteresting? That huge heat sink is uninteresting? It’s complete and utter BS that DF doesn’t have enough to go on to create a 10 - 15 minute video to give their opinions. They have made long videos about things with much less information.
 

devilNprada

Member
May 2, 2019
641
756
330
I don't see why Digital Foundry has to upload content you decide, otherwise it's "videos nobody cares about" and they are paid Microsoft shills.

I'm sure if Sony had sent a PS5 to DF, or even invited them to test one, you'd have just as many videos as about the Xbox Series X - which they actually have. Instead Sony prioritized the opinion of this guy;


Lol that was pretty funny...
 
Mar 27, 2020
7,318
22,005
690
right, an NDA isn’t a pact with satan. It’s standard. Yet, As soon as you mention NDA it becomes a conspiracy one way or the other. That’s why commenting on the PS5 teardown was a great opportunity to show their expertise. Even if it was just for clicks and they added 10% new insight. They would have had 0 restrictions to speculate or interpret without NDA
Very good point that you made. An NDA would allow the manufacturer to control the messaging. Hence why Microsoft gave the systems to those people to take apart. Also why Microsoft gave those systems to those youtubers. It's all part of marketing.

Now if someone were to go out and buy a console themselves there would be no NDA behind that. So they could do almost whatever they want with it without the consent of the manufacturer.

If Sony were to send consoles out to people to tear it down or to play games on I'm pretty sure they would control the messaging. Again it's just another marketing tactic.
 
Dec 29, 2018
2,318
6,352
635
Couldn’t have said it any better. It is quite suspect when someone from DF calls a tear down video of a brand new console that shows us things we didn’t know about previously “uninteresting”. The use of liquid metal is uninteresting? That huge heat sink is uninteresting? It’s complete and utter BS that DF doesn’t have enough to go on to create a 10 - 15 minute video to give their opinions. They have made long videos about things with much less information.
I don't expect a full on in-depth hardware breakdown now but a quick video analysis of what they think of the hardware and potentially what is new (that we have not yet picked up on) would be interesting.

NX Gamer and other youtube channels already have their videos up on their opinions of the hardware and these guys don't have the hardware in their possession either but they have offered their opinions on it. I mean that's enough until they actually physically have a PS5 machine in the studio to do a deeper dive in the tech.

I thought I saw an article the other day that the PS5 was the biggest game console ever and like 50% huger in volume than the XSX? That's substantial enough for my statement to be Mythbusters 'Plausible'.
I have not seen any article mention PS5 being 50% larger in volume compared to Series X. Where did you read that comparison?
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: Lysandros

FrankWza

Member
Feb 14, 2013
1,882
529
575
I don't expect a full on in-depth hardware breakdown now but a quick video analysis of what they think of the hardware and potentially what is new (that we have not yet picked up on) would be interesting.

NX Gamer and other youtube channels already have their videos up on their opinions of the hardware and these guys don't have the hardware in their possession either but they have offered their opinions on it. I mean that's enough until they actually physically have a PS5 machine in the studio to do a deeper dive in the tech.


I have not seen any article mention PS5 being 50% larger in volume compared to Series X. Where did you read that comparison?
I remember seeing something like 21%
.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Hawking Radiation

FrankWza

Member
Feb 14, 2013
1,882
529
575
That sounds a bit more believable than 50%. Both are big. PS5 is taller and wider. Xbox Series X is thicker.
It’s too hard to do volume because of the curves on PS5. Footprint is easier. They’re both 10 lbs. both will provide a challenge to fit anywhere. Based on people’s pics in setup threads, I never see empty giant shelves that may fit either systems horizontally. I know mine are taken already. Gonna be a lot of vertical next gen systems on people setups next month. Or new stands or shelves put up ;)
 
  • Like
Reactions: Hawking Radiation

Redlight

Member
Feb 5, 2014
957
2,013
540
I used the words I used because they applied to you, interesting you see it as a fight where people try to score points/win arguments.

It is also quite hilarious how you sprinkle evidence lacking very direct statements (“you want them to wax lyrics on PS5” and “you claim Digital Foundry is anti-Sony”) to then close with a “present compelling evidence (in a thread showing Battaglia being unprofessional, not commenting is an acceptable answer...) or do not bother replying”.

Doing something you accuse someone else of doing... that is projecting mate and you know it.
Once more for the road...

Given that you're make a claim, it's up to you to prove that claim.
When you reply I hope to see the actual evidence of this clear bias. Otherwise, don't bother.
 
Last edited:

Redlight

Member
Feb 5, 2014
957
2,013
540
you’re right. But calling it uninteresting raises some eyebrows. They’re the biggest site of that type,no? There was more than enough for these experts to comment on. There are still questions that can be answered. All from that video. They have series x and know it is dram-less. It appears the PS5s SSD has dram.(I know nothing is 100% unless it’s officially confirmed) That’s one example where their input would be valued. This is interesting stuff for enthusiasts, it has to be interesting for a site like theirs. They don’t have to comment, but calling it uninteresting...
Sure, but that's only an issue if the reader decides that they're referring to the PS5 as uninteresting, as opposed to the video itself. They make video content for a living, so they're unlikely to be wowed by that presentation. To be fair, if you judge it as a video, it's pretty dry and a little on the dull side.

Without their own hands on experience they'd only be commenting on what we can all see with our own eyes. They should wait for the chance to do their own teardown.
 
  • Like
Reactions: phil_t98

TGO

Member
Sep 5, 2007
10,307
9,427
1,530
UK
What I find interesting is the majority of the system is cooling.
most of the size comes from the fan and heat sink.
If they can reduce that, you're looking at a very small PS5 Slim
 
Last edited:
Dec 29, 2018
2,318
6,352
635
Well, what are you getting for volume(bounding box) of the PS5 compared to the XSX?
I don't see anyone compare volume between the two consoles. There are tons of articles directly comparing the height, width and length of both consoles which is why I'm curious to know where you got the 50% bigger volume from.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.