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Does Sony need more variety in their first party games? Can we do less skill trees.

Whitecrow

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Sony used to have a little more variety but it's been closing studios if they were not profitable.

And yes, fuck skill trees I'm so tired of them in every AAA. Devs dont know how to make a game without it anymore?
 

Terenty

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It's true Sony's first party games feel like they came from the same assembly line approved by suits with zero creativity.

But what's the point of changing anything if fans gobble it up in droves?
 

anthony2690

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I think you're missing tens of games exclusive to PlayStation that don't follow that pattern. But sure, cherry pick on (some) of the biggest ones to try to make conversation.
I think he is picking first party only.
As obviously they have filled some gaps in genres with third party deals.
 

Gameplaylover

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I don't have a problem with skill trees, but Sony's high budget AAAs with monster marketing are (nearly) all cinematic 3rd person actioners. Some more variety would be nice.
 
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GymWolf

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I absolutely don't understand the problem with skill trees...if you don't want rpg element and a constant sense of progression, don't buy fucking action RPGs...
 
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Zannegan

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Every game company could probably use more variety. PS fans would welcome more games in more diverse genres, as the reception of games like Returnal and Death Stranding show, just not at the cost of the games and IP that they already love. That leaves Sony limited wiggle room for experimentation unless they're willing to expand. Plus, to a certain degree, if it ain't broke... *shrug*

As for skill trees, they're a bit overused, but what are you going to replace them with? I think the real problem is that the games that use them are too light on RPG mechanics. Rather than having to choose a playstyle and invest into that, you just upgrade everything because you know that eventually everything will be available. They're more like skill checklists than skill trees.
 

Topher

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I don't get the gripes about games that are "cinematic". All that means is that the production values of the stories being told are extremely high. Great animation, great voice acting, etc. The game play is still great in these games so why the fuss over doing a great job in the cutscenes?

Come On What GIF by MOODMAN
 

Cyborg

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Focus on what works :) PlayStation is on fire and they are producing amazing games. Look at the last couple of years. Also kudos for introducing new IPs.
When the development costs are so high it's unreasonable to expect PS to invest in all the niche games. You need to focus on what sells/works
 
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sncvsrtoip

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this year destruction all star - multiplayer kinda twisted metal style, returnal - rouglike, deathloop - also kinda rouglike, ratchet - platformer/shooter, kena - another pixar style game , so its seems Sony is lacking of mature 3rd person narrative driven story games ;d
 
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Topher

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It's true Sony's first party games feel like they came from the same assembly line approved by suits with zero creativity.

But what's the point of changing anything if fans gobble it up in droves?


jeff bridges opinion GIF


And why do they gobble them up? Because they love the games and simply do not share your negative opinion of them. Really is that simple.
 
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Kokoloko85

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Some new variety would be great but also dont stop what they are doing.

Playstation developers are making game of the year winning and runner up games but also smaller titles lile Astrobot, Dreams, Everybody Golf, Ratchet and Clank.

Plus games like Astrobot, Bloodbone, Shadow of the Colossus, Returnal, Demon Souls, Until Dawn and The Last Guardian are very different. Way more variety than what most publishers are doing.

They have a more winning variety than most publishers
.
Nintendo releases mostly the same IP ( which is great, they innovate on them and have plenty smaller titles with new gameplay mechanics)
and MS…. Well they had to buy a publisher and bunch of already successful IP’s to stay relevant lol. Its not like they are releasing awesome games every 3 months…And we’ll see how much successful variety they will have in the future.

Can see the haters trying to make a big deal out of it but its been great to be a Playstation owner.

What I would like to see from Playstation is some 1st person shooters, JRPG’s and a fighter. Bring back some classic platformers like Sly Racoon and Jak.
Also a WRPG too. Also produce more smaller titles too. But most importantly carry on what they are doing
 
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i would for sure love a bethesda style open world RPG from sony. imagine a game like that with some of the best graphics with a good story and memorable characters that feel real. maybe sony will do something like that since they are now locked out of future fallout and elder scrolls games.

at the same time keep making those amazing 3rd person games and improving on that formula to make them even better.
 
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Zannegan

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I don't get the gripes about games that are "cinematic". All that means is that the production values of the stories being told are extremely high. Great animation, great voice acting, etc. The game play is still great in these games so why the fuss over doing a great job in the cutscenes?

Come On What GIF by MOODMAN
I can't speak to anyone else's opinion. For all I know, there are a lot of people out there who dislike a focus on cinematics in any way, shape, or form. For me though, the major downside of games that are billed as "cinematic" is that gameplay tends to take a back seat to the director's vision, and what's there is often highly contextual and restricted.

Big "gameplay" moments are often delivered through setpieces and A-to-Awesome button prompts rather than natural, always available moves and inputs. There's rarely room in the gameplay for player choice, experimentation, or expression. You either do exactly as the designers intended or it's back to the last checkpoint you naughty monkey. It's not quite as restrictive as QTEs, but it gets there.

Don't get me wrong, I enjoy a roller coaster game every now and then, but I prefer a little more freedom in how I solve the problems a game throws at me. Of course, it's a spectrum. I don't usually want a totally unfocused game experience either. *shrug*

Anyway, for me the worst offenders are things CoD campaigns though, not Sony first party games, though I never could get into Uncharted outside of the puzzles.
 
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Markio128

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i would for sure love a bethesda style open world RPG from sony. imagine a game like that with some of the best graphics with a good story and memorable characters that feel real. maybe sony will do something like that since they are now locked out of future fallout and elder scrolls games.

at the same time keep making those amazing 3rd person games and improving on that formula to make them even better.
I think the biggest issue with that is the length of time it would take to develop the game you suggest. I mean it could be 10+ years between TES games. That’s too long in my humble opinion to tie a developer to a single game, unless we are talking about Insomniac who could probably knock one out a year haha
 
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azertydu91

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X to doubt.

Where are thier shooters? (1st person and 3rd)
2D platformers?
Fighting games?
RPG? (J or W)
RTS?
Sandbox?
Survival?

There are a whole lot of genres they don't address that other companies do.
Shooters 3rd or fps?
You mean like Uncharted, ratchet and Returnal for example ?You could also add Killzone and that predator game.
Sandbox like Dreams where you can play and create literally every kind of game.
Rpg like Demon's soule or God of war.
For fighting games they do have a lot of exclusives that would be counter productive because Street and guilty gear are taking care of it.
But yeah they do lack RTS and survival games.
For platformer do they ahve to be in 2D because there's little big planet or sackboy adventures.
You just need to count all those games that you forgot.
 

Withnail

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I think he is picking first party only.
As obviously they have filled some gaps in genres with third party deals.

Published by Sony = first party production. Third party deals are deals with another publisher (e.g. FFVIIR is a third party deal, Demon Souls is a first party game).

No idea why people get so hung up on the ownership of the studio.
 

Three

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X to doubt.

Where are thier shooters? (1st person and 3rd)
Where are their third person shooters. Um try some of their most popular franchises, Uncharted and TLOU.

Also OP this is the dumbest shit I've read today:

"As someone who games on all consoles (XsX, PS5 and switch) I’m not too bothered by it since my PS5 is my exclusive box"

So you think all sony exclusives are samey but you're not too bothered by it because all you play on your PS5 are sony exclusives. How does that make sense? Just admit you're trolling here.
 
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Godot25

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I miss huge FPS from Sony's first-party. I loved Killzone 2 (outside of horrendous input lag), Killzone 3 and Resistance series and while I admire Guerrilla to venture into different genre, that FPS gap is just sad at this point.

Heck, it does't need to be "military FPS" game. Initiative for example is making Perfect Dark which will be an FPS game. Want some of that from PlayStation Studios.
 

ParaSeoul

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Surprisingly the PS5 has had more variety than the PS4 did in its final years just because all the walky talky games are out already
 

Hobbygaming

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I find it funny how people are acting like MS 1st party was creating masterpieces in many different genres

And Spider-man couldn't be anymore different than Horizon, the same goes for the rest. Third person games can be totally different in how they play
 
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Withnail

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I miss huge FPS from Sony's first-party. I loved Killzone 2 (outside of horrendous input lag), Killzone 3 and Resistance series and while I admire Guerrilla to venture into different genre, that FPS gap is just sad at this point.

Heck, it does't need to be "military FPS" game. Initiative for example is making Perfect Dark which will be an FPS game. Want some of that from PlayStation Studios.

I enjoyed Resistance and Killzone to some extent but I think modern Sony sees no need to compete in that space with COD and Battlefield etc. Sony's success in large part comes from providing a platform for third parties.
 

Godot25

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I find it funny how people are acting like MS 1st party was creating masterpieces in many different genres

And Spider-man couldn't be anymore different than Horizon, the same goes for the rest. Third person games can be totally different in how they play
Well. Microsoft first-party is making
Psychonauts 2 - action platformer
Microsoft Flight Simulator - flight sim
Age of Empires IV - Real-time strategy
Halo Infinite - FPS game
Forza Horizon 5 - arcade racer
Forza Motorsport - sim racer
RedFall - open world FPS immersive sim with loot aspects
Starfield - FPS/TPS open world RPG in space
Perfect Dark - FPS game
Minecraft Dungeons - Diablo style action RPG
Minecraft - just Minecraft
Fable - action third-person RPG with social interactions
Avowed - first person RPG game in open world
Ori - 2D metroidvania
Oxide - 4X Civilization style strategy game
Contraband - Heist vehicular style game

and I could go on and on...

I mean, nobody will argue, that Sony's first-party is better in terms of quality. But in terms of variety it is clear, that Microsoft is aiming for more diverse lineup. If it is good or bad thing, that's subjective to every player. Somebody likes constant that "third-person action adventure games" that Sony's shooting towards.
 

DarthPutin

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I feel like 3d parties do a sufficient job of providing all these top-down, isometric, etc etc games I (don't) need. And it won't help with the narrative either - public at large will ignore these games because they don't give a shit, while CoWs will ignore it like they ignore Sackboy, Concrete Genie, Astrobot, Returnal, VR games, etc.... because it won't be big super popular cinematic mainstream game no one will care.

I think they should let their top notch studios do what they want and do best. You can't have studio for every genre under the sun, and most of this obscure stuff doesn't need Sony's budget anyway. Why and how would you force Sucker Punch to make topdown shooter few people will buy? I really don't understand why it is first party that need to cover everything under the sun. Don't think that's how it works.

Trying to make decent MP makes sense and they are trying it seems. Maybe an FPS or RPG (though with AAA JRPG's they are already de facto console to go). But again need studio that wants to make it.
 
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Hobbygaming

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They might not all be from 1st party but PS5 has a lot of variety already and as far as shooters go

Firewalk
Deviation Games
Guerrilla Games new IP
Insomniac MP project

They'll most likely have 2-4 new shooters this generation
 
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Godot25

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I enjoyed Resistance and Killzone to some extent but I think modern Sony sees no need to compete in that space with COD and Battlefield etc. Sony's success in large part comes from providing a platform for third parties.
Who is talking about COD and Battlefield competition? I enjoyed Resistance and Killzone because of their campaigns and lore, not because of multiplayer. And if we are being honest, COD campaigns are a joke and BF2042 doesn't have campaign at all...
 
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GymWolf

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I can't speak to anyone else's opinion. For all I know, there are a lot of people out there who dislike a focus on cinematics in any way, shape, or form. For me though, the major downside of games that are billed as "cinematic" is that gameplay tends to take a back seat to the director's vision, and what's there is often highly contextual and restricted.

Big "gameplay" moments are often delivered through setpieces and A-to-Awesome button prompts rather than natural, always available moves and inputs. There's rarely room in the gameplay for player choice, experimentation, or expression. You either do exactly as the designers intended or it's back to the last checkpoint you naughty monkey. It's not quite as restrictive as QTEs, but it gets there.

Don't get me wrong, I enjoy a roller coaster game every now and then, but I prefer a little more freedom in how I solve the problems a game throws at me. Of course, it's a spectrum. I don't usually want a totally unfocused game experience either. *shrug*

Anyway, for me the worst offenders are things CoD campaigns though, not Sony first party games, though I never could get into Uncharted outside of the puzzles.
Sorry for my french, but this is fucking bullshit, most sony games have better combat, controls and pure gameplay than your gamey ass game like zelda or kena.
There is NOTHING inside these games that can be comparable to fighting and horde in dg, a thunderjaw in horizon or a valkyrie in gow, people love to elevate gameey looking games but those games most of the times have shitty\simple combat or puzzles, being colorful, having no story, no voice acting, shit graphic is not equal to be a game with incredible mechanics\combat.


And you don't need to get into a setpiece to enjoy the combat in any of those games since they are mostly open world or open ended like tlou2 or gow.

What we are even talking about here?!

This cinematic narrative is just bullshit for console warriors exactly like xbox only does shooters\has no gamez and nintendo only does child games.
 
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Markio128

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They might not all be from 1st party but PS5 has a lot of variety already and as far as shooters go

Firewalk
Deviation Games
Guerrilla Games new IP
Insomniac MP project

They'll most likely have 2-4 new shooters this generation
Yeah, I feel like this would be a more worthwhile conversation nearer the end of this current gen. Who knows what Sony will release in the coming years?
 

Hobbygaming

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Well. Microsoft first-party is making
Psychonauts 2 - action platformer
Microsoft Flight Simulator - flight sim
Age of Empires IV - Real-time strategy
Halo Infinite - FPS game
Forza Horizon 5 - arcade racer
Forza Motorsport - sim racer
RedFall - open world FPS immersive sim with loot aspects
Starfield - FPS/TPS open world RPG in space
Perfect Dark - FPS game
Minecraft Dungeons - Diablo style action RPG
Minecraft - just Minecraft
Fable - action third-person RPG with social interactions
Avowed - first person RPG game in open world
Ori - 2D metroidvania
Oxide - 4X Civilization style strategy game
Contraband - Heist vehicular style game

and I could go on and on...

I mean, nobody will argue, that Sony's first-party is better in terms of quality. But in terms of variety it is clear, that Microsoft is aiming for more diverse lineup. If it is good or bad thing, that's subjective to every player. Somebody likes constant that "third-person action adventure games" that Sony's shooting towards.
And when did this change take place? This generation, because of an acquisition right? That's my point

Now suddenly, a console needs 7, 1st party RPGs and FPS. PS gets a ton of variety from their partners and their action adventure games all distinguish themselves from one another
 

RoboFu

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Seeing as I just realized after many many years that kratos was a complete rip off of the Diablo 2 barbarian. IDK what think anymore… 😨
 

Gameplaylover

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Who is talking about COD and Battlefield competition? I enjoyed Resistance and Killzone because of their campaigns and lore, not because of multiplayer. And if we are being honest, COD campaigns are a joke and BF2042 doesn't have campaign at all...
The problem is, Killzone and Resistance are not mainstream enough. Sony spends insane amounts of money for their big AAAs + marketing and they want to be danm sure that they sell tons of it. So they need some "popcorn cinema Transformers/Fast&Furious" stuff for the masses. Right now people and especially critics seem to love the cinematic 3rd person action formula and so it's a safe bet for Sony.
 
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And when did this change take place? This generation, because of an acquisition right? That's my point

Now suddenly, a console needs 7, 1st party RPGs and FPS. PS gets a ton of variety from their partners and their action adventure games all distinguish themselves from one another

Ironically that list just makes Xbox look like the FPS machine if we're going by the same logic people use with Sony
 

anthony2690

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Published by Sony = first party production. Third party deals are deals with another publisher (e.g. FFVIIR is a third party deal, Demon Souls is a first party game).

No idea why people get so hung up on the ownership of the studio.
I really don't care either way, as long as games that interest me come out.
I was just stating what I think OP was trying to put across.
 

slade

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Sony don't need to do anything other than give me more 3rd person cinematic action adventure games. Other publishers can cover other genres. If it were up to me, I'd shelve that baseball and racing game and all those VR titles and have those guys make more 3rd person cinematic action adventure titles.
 
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tommib

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I’m with you op. I’m done with skill trees. 90% of the time I’m unlocking them and not even paying attention to what they do. Some button combo will unleash something. It’s superficial and superfluous in equal measures. Sony’s AAA cinematic adventures are particularly guilty of these.
 
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I know people will see this as FUD but I was listening to a podcast on Sony’s up coming games that we know of and as people stated before they all seem to have a similar back bone.

Spider-Man = Third person action adventure with light RPG elements (Skill tree)

GOW = Third person action adventure with light RPG elements

Horizion = TPAAwLRPGE

Wolverine = not much info but we can assume unless it’ll be a full rpg in the isometric view

Naughty Dog also has a similar DNA to their games. As my favorite studio I feel they mastered the formula the best tho.

As someone who games on all consoles (XsX, PS5 and switch) I’m not too bothered by it since my PS5 is my exclusive box but do you think Sony should add a bit of diversity to their game line up from a genre perspective? Would you like to see them fund a large budget Crpg or an isometric strategy game? Maybe dive into more untraditional genres. I know from a business perspective if it ain’t broke…but what about from a non mainstream fan perspective. What would y’all like to see, or just stick to what they’ve been doing?
At the least I’d like to see them do less skill trees and maybe do a game that is either a full RPG. The quality of their studios doing a full on RPG sounds like a good ass time to me.








Well animals with a backbone can evolve into all different shapes and sizes!

Honestly for there tent pole release's I think they can only really use 3rd person or 1st person (Maybe Fixed camera) what other genres require that kinda of budget?

I've got zero issue with them defaulting to the 3rd person perspective. It's the most adaptable perspective that can fit into almost any genres. Saying that I would love for them to get behind a similar size first person single player game. This seems like a far less competitive field with only far cry and I guess elder scrolls/Fallout doing the big bucks at the moment.

I agree I'am kinda sick of skill trees and collecting skill points. There just so bland and clinical they take the magic out of the game somehow. I think there are far more interesting ways to build up your character.

Would be completely happy for them to a full on rpg Japense or western. No doubt it would set the standard for production values and polish. It would likely work properly as well (looking at you Bethesda and CD project red).

For CRPG and isometric they could fund a smaller game but I think it would be a bit crazy to put some real big bucks behind it at this point.
 

Godot25

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The problem is, Killzone and Resistance are not mainstream enough. Sony spends insane amounts of money for their big AAAs + marketing and they want to be danm sure that they sell tons of it. So they need some "popcorn cinema Transformers/Fast&Furious" stuff for the masses. Right now people and especially critics seem to love the cinematic 3rd person action formula and so it's a safe bet for Sony.
Yup. I know.

I mean, I'm in the minority, because I couldn't give a damn about new Wolverine and Spider-Man games because they are superhero characters and seeing how Sony is chasing this multimedia approach does not give me good vibes at all. But it clearly works so what do I know right?
 
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Guilty_AI

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Eh, as much as i dislike their big 1st part games, its their bread and butter.

Or rather, i feel they aren't all too interest in however their games play and always put more focus on spectacle.
 
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Aldric

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Sure, Jan. If lucky you'll get tomorrow some N64 (or older) roms announced. And what is even more sad, you will be happy with them.
Nintendo factually have far more variety in their first party offerings than Sony. You people eat up the same generic resi4 style camera "cinematic" experience with laughably shallow automated gameplay and pretend one roguelite bombing horribly is the sign of a balanced first party offering. But hey we should all be thankful to Sony for elevating the medium with licensed capeshit titles and third rate AssCreed clones (Ubisoft towers are ok when Sony does it).
 

Markio128

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Nintendo factually have far more variety in their first party offerings than Sony. You people eat up the same generic resi4 style camera "cinematic" experience with laughably shallow automated gameplay and pretend one roguelite bombing horribly is the sign of a balanced first party offering. But hey we should all be thankful to Sony for elevating the medium with licensed capeshit titles and third rate AssCreed clones (Ubisoft towers are ok when Sony does it).
taylor swift haters gonna hate GIF
 

Papacheeks

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Sony needs a Forza Horizon game. They've got Polyphony with the car models and attention to detail. They just need a studio to expand the Gran Turismo IP to something beyond the track.

I've imagined an open world racer with GT cars for so long and you have these special Vision GT cars.
Why have they not looked at these special cars and tried to make a Speed Racer meets Wipe-Out type mode or even standalone arcade game. An arcade game based on real life models but with Polyphony attention to detail and heavy customization.

Like seriously. Expand the fucking Gran Turismo IP. It already has a loyal following in the tens of millions. There won't be any sales issue with new games with the GT name. You can slap GT on a steaming pile of shit and people would line up for it.

FUCK

Imagine if they dusted off MOtorstorm and used licensed cars? Get some small developer to make it.

Some new variety would be great but also dont stop what there doing.

There developers are making game of the year winning and runner up games but also smaller titles lile Astrobot, Dreams, Everybody Golf, Ratchet and Clank.

Plus games like Astrobot, Bloodbone, Shadow of the Colossus, Returnal, Demon Souls, Until Dawn and The Last Guardian are very different.

They have a more winning variety than most publishers.
Nintendo releases mostly the same IP ( which is great, they innovate on them ) and MS…. Well they had to buy a publisher and bunch of already successful IP’s to stay relevant lol. Its not like they are releasing awesome games every 3 months…

Can see the haters trying to make a big deal out of it but its been great to be a Playstation owner.

What I would like to see from Playstation is some 1st person shooters, JRPG’s and a fighter. Bring back some classic platformers like Sly Racoon and Jak.
Also a WRPG too. But most importantly carry on what they are doing

Wasn't everybody's golf Japan studio?
 
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GymWolf

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Most games these days are an amalgamation of several different genres. If you're calling out PS for not having all these other genres you pretty much have to call out every single major publisher... really, you could.

What would you have in place of a "skill-tree"... aren't all forms of skill progression a skill-tree?!? Like for real... you kill/beat an enemy you get exp, that exp is used to get new abilities.

I'm trying to wonder what it is about skill-trees... is the UX/UI of the PS skill-trees? Are they too similar in UI design? Or is it the name that's an issue? how about we call it a skill-rocket or maybe a skill-pole?
Pretty sure they can't even describe what is so bad about skill trees.

I mean, i get it, no one likes skill trees that are just +1 strenght or +1 agility but skill trees in sony games most of the times are full of new abilities that change the gameplay...and how is this different than collecting red orbs in dmc to unlock new moves?!
 
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Nintendo factually have far more variety in their first party offerings than Sony. You people eat up the same generic resi4 style camera "cinematic" experience with laughably shallow automated gameplay and pretend one roguelite bombing horribly is the sign of a balanced first party offering. But hey we should all be thankful to Sony for elevating the medium with licensed capeshit titles and third rate AssCreed clones (Ubisoft towers are ok when Sony does it).

Sony manages to put out cinematic experiences that still shit all over Nintendo games in the gameplay department

I'll give them credit that they've managed to get the jump button down at least
 
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Hunnybun

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We can do less skill trees industry-wide. It’s mostly artificial fluff.

I went through a period of my life from about 2012 to 2015 when I was just extremely busy and had very little time for games. I basically just stopped playing them for a few years.

Until then I don't think I'd ever so much as levelled up a character. When I came back to games, these pointless RPG mechanics were fucking EVERYWHERE. We now have a UK government that talks blithely about "levelling up" the north of the country!

Wtf happened?! Was it all just down to Dark Souls or something?

Personally I can tolerate it in something like Spider-Man because they make the process simple and crystal clear. But God of War, with its interminable options and opaque terminology - or God forbid, fucking Demon's Souls itself, with its ultra nerdy delight in making something DELIBERATELY obscure - that can just fuck off forever as far as I'm concerned. It's tedious in the extreme.
 
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