Mr Moose
Member
I am saying it is still happening before it reaches the TV. Shouldn't even need VRR to eliminate tearing, the devs should do it.
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Dusk Golem reiterates that the Xbox will be more powerful than the PS5 (Admitted to starting console wars, demodded)
sircaw
Banned
didn't digital foundry say that cyberpunk was pretty awful with vrr?
Riky
$MSFT
No, why would it be?
sircaw
Banned
i just remember that saying it was very poor,
Krisprolls
Banned
That’s nobody’s definition of ‘more powerful’...(fanboys aside)
Of course it is the definition.
Otherwise you'd have more powerful hardware running games worse, it would be very confusing
It's just the overall power is more than gpu and cpu power, something many here have trouble to grasp.
PS5 has a lot of hardware customizations : custom geometry engine, unified L3 cache, cache scrubbers, ultra fast ssd, faster clock due to a smart variable frequency system...
That's what makes it more powerful overall and that's why it runs games better.
sircaw
Banned
From 15:40 talking about vvr, what does John say about it?
Hendrick's
since you like lol at my other post, this is for you too. enjoyBut it DIPS PRETTY HARD.
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Hendrick's
If only my penis was as big as my GamerScore!
Don't worry, the PS5 may get VRR Soony too. Then you will all be circle jerking over it as much asSo there is if you don't have a VRR TV? Got it.
Riky
. Until then...
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Heisenberg007
Gold Journalism
And there is on the PS5 even if you have a VRR TV. I guess there wasn't enough Cerny sauce left over to fix an actual problem after it was all spent on cache scrubbers
At least them cache scrubbers made the PS5 more powerful than XSX so it tears 5x less than XSX and renders at a higher resolution with better frame-rates
Plus, VRR is coming in an update on PS5.
Heisenberg007
Gold Journalism
Don't worry, the PS5 may get VRR Soony too. Then you will all be circle jerking over it as much as
Haha, no way. It's still a niche feature that likely supports only 1% of console players. Plus, it does not affect or determine how powerful a console is.
Bernd Lauert
Banned
At least them cache scrubbers made the PS5 more powerful than XSX so it tears 5x less than XSX and renders at a higher resolution with better frame-rates
Waiting for tools, I see
Riky
$MSFT
From 15:40 talking about vvr, what does John say about it?
But it DIPS PRETTY HARD.
I think you're misunderstanding what he says, he says the game dips hard and VRR will help that. He then says but it does dip pretty hard, he doesn't mean during VRR. I'd listen to that again.
Klayzer
Member
Its the new Xforce rally cry, VRR and VRR TVs. It somehows magically fixed all the 3rd party comparisons. Can't wait for the next savior to arrive.
ne1butu
Member
VRR VRR VRR
sircaw
Banned
No
The game still dips with vvr, what is there to know?
It's not great. he says it, if vvr was some silver bullet it would not dip.persiod.
The game still fucking sucks even with that.
BAD RIKY BAD
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Heisenberg007
Gold Journalism
Waiting for tools, I see
No, that's the Xbox fanboys. Sony fans are perfectly happy knowing that PS5 already outperforms XSX consistently despite being $100 less
Heisenberg007
Gold Journalism
They just don't realize that the importance of VRR for them only highlights the fact that XSX drops more frames than PS5.
Krisprolls
Banned
Yes, it's hilarious how Xbox fanboys cling to VRR as the solution to Series X having lower framerate.
VRR doesn't replace the missing frames, you're still running bad. You still have increased lag between frames resulting in less responsive controls.
It's better to have more frames like on PS5.
VRR will be available on both consoles anyway for the 1 % of gamers who have a VRR TV, because it's part of the HDMI 2.1 official specs. It's written on the box on both consoles, they support HDMI 2.1. Both console makers could be sued if HDMI 2.1 wasn't supported.
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Yeah, the replies from some on Team Xbox is the problem.
The denial is strong. Instead of trying to understand and accept, the double down continues.....
Just remember, alot of y'all conditioned some to expect way better Series X performance. While some of us expected things to be close.
This might be a repeat of the PS360 gen, and only amazing Series X exclusives can even things out.
Remember, if/when the PS5 starts coming up short in these face offs, this was expected. Not BC face offs...ppl please....stop
Y'all created a no win situation, and some of us said this months ago, because of all the dumb ass FUD. Basically handed Sony, the PS5 amazing pr for forum folks, ppl like us that hang out on forums like this. All yall had to to was just be normal, humble...
Continuing reaping what you sowed.
The denial is strong. Instead of trying to understand and accept, the double down continues.....
Just remember, alot of y'all conditioned some to expect way better Series X performance. While some of us expected things to be close.
This might be a repeat of the PS360 gen, and only amazing Series X exclusives can even things out.
Remember, if/when the PS5 starts coming up short in these face offs, this was expected. Not BC face offs...ppl please....stop
Y'all created a no win situation, and some of us said this months ago, because of all the dumb ass FUD. Basically handed Sony, the PS5 amazing pr for forum folks, ppl like us that hang out on forums like this. All yall had to to was just be normal, humble...
Continuing reaping what you sowed.
thelastword
Banned
The funny thing about these guys is they are the first to call someone a fanboy, when they knowingly spread FUD and disingenuous takes.....Chris Grannel, Dusk Golem, TimDog, The Dolphin guy and the Discord Brigade, all knew they were lying and making stuff up......One was even on here as an insider spreading fake heightened PS5 specs, but in the end even though the PS5 is not 13TF, it's still faster than Series X, that must hurt them real bad with the current faceoffs, seeing the results after all this effort they put in to deceive and undermine PS5's realtime performance.....
Aguero9320
Member
The race to declare a winner here is bordering on desperate from some of you.
It’s like throwing one punch in a boxing match that barely grazes the opponent then dancing around with your arms in the air like it’s over.
The specs say Series X is more powerful - you can spin and argue all you like, and talk of ‘Cenry juice’ (cringe) but it’s true, yet as on the other hand Sony fans like to point out, Microsoft hasn’t even released a game on its own hardware yet.
Gears Hivebusters looks stunning, and it’s funny how so many conveniently ignore that the biggest and most important release to date on the new consoles has been ‘called’ for the Series X (waits for spin) But there still are not anywhere near enough games to make a definitive judgment on performance (not power, that one was over long ago)
You all need to calm down a bit, because right now all we have that’s worthwhile are the raw specs.
My prediction, for what it’s worth (which is nothing) is that Series X will, in time, be proven to be the better performer, Microsoft’s gaming output will drastically improve and none of it will matter - they will get trounced in sales (but still do well) and Sony fanboys will continue to relentlessly defend their chosen brand as better. In the meantime I’ll keep playing on both, plus PC.
KingT731
Member
Look. You said you were going to leave the thread and not reveal any more information but you just keep responding. Are you in or out?
Heisenberg007
Gold Journalism
Yeah, besides Sony has explicitly confirmed that VRR is coming on the PS5. And it isn't just the PS5 thing. Their Sony X900H TV will also be updated with VRR, likely at the same time.
But the future that both consoles will have, is used by only 1% of the console population, and in no way changes the actual rendering power of the console has become the biggest, most important thing in a console war because of a certain group of fanboys who can't take an L.
phil_t98
#SonyToo
nobody hurt at cross gen game face off. only people like you who jump in to point out a few FPS difference here and there and when somebody says its a bug or something you try your hardest to dissprove that
Heisenberg007
Gold Journalism
I think that's the point everyone is arguinng. The "specs" do not say Series X is more powerful. Only one spec (TF) in one component (GPU) says that XSX is more powerful than PS5.
If we are just going to by just one metric of one component, why can't we say "2.23 > 1.83, so PS5 is more powerful"?
(it sounds stupid, doesn't it? that's how we feel when someone says 12 > 10 so XSX > PS5)
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SSfox
Member
Riky
$MSFT
No
The game still dips with vvr, what is there to know?
It's not great. he says it, if vvr was some silver bullet it would not dip.persiod.
The game still fucking sucks even with that.
BAD RIKY BAD
You don't understand what VRR does do you
It doesn't stop the game losing frames, nobody claims it does. What it does is force the TV refresh to match the GPU output, this eliminates any screen tearing and smooths out all the judder.
You may still feel some controller latency but since the vast majority of dips are brief you probably won't notice that and you won't see any judder on screen.
As I've said before an easy way to see this is the Italian track on Dirt 5, without VRR you come around one corner to a long straight and you can see the framerate stutter, turn on VRR and it's totally smooth. It makes a massive difference to the like of Valhalla too.
Md Ray
Member
PS5 GPU is more powerful than XSX GPU in some ways.
sircaw
Banned
You don't understand what VRR does do you
It doesn't stop the game losing frames, nobody claims it does. What it does is force the TV refresh to match the GPU output, this eliminates any screen tearing and smooths out all the judder.
You may still feel some controller latency but since the vast majority of dips are brief you probably won't notice that and you won't see any judder on screen.
As I've said before an easy way to see this is the Italian track on Dirt 5, without VRR you come around one corner to a long straight and you can see the framerate stutter, turn on VRR and it's totally smooth. It makes a massive difference to the like of Valhalla too.
All i know Riky old chap is that John says it still dips a lot. its there plain and simple to see in the video, like i said if vvr was some wonder cure they would just state it at the front of the video and say, VVR solves all issues, they don't.
sony is not even using it atm, and they are smashing xbox in games, so when Vrr comes out for sony its even more of a game over for xbox? are you really saying that.
Shmunter
Member
VRR is like a wheelchair for underperforming consoles.
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Riky
$MSFT
It's not just one spec, it's the three most important specs for graphics. A bigger GPU that has more compute units and a higher teraflop count that doesn't downclock.
Higher peak memory bandwidth with 10gb being substantially faster, Valhalla for example only uses 6.5gb.
A faster CPU as well.
All the RDNA2 features that once baked into next gen engines will increase performance above and beyond those three advantages mentioned.
Md Ray
Member
"My little VRR pleasure pearl goes vrrrooommm"You don't understand what VRR does do you
It doesn't stop the game losing frames, nobody claims it does. What it does is force the TV refresh to match the GPU output, this eliminates any screen tearing and smooths out all the judder.
You may still feel some controller latency but since the vast majority of dips are brief you probably won't notice that and you won't see any judder on screen.
As I've said before an easy way to see this is the Italian track on Dirt 5, without VRR you come around one corner to a long straight and you can see the framerate stutter, turn on VRR and it's totally smooth. It makes a massive difference to the like of Valhalla too.
Perfect.
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Riky
$MSFT
I would stop if I were you, you don't know what you're talking about. Listen to what John actually says, VRR helps when the framerate drops. If you want further confirmation go to the Valhalla and Black Ops comparisons or better still the HDMI 2.1 video they did recently where they explain it perfectly.
Who created the situation?
Oh yes, the people who have been spitting since the X360 and the entire life of the Xbox One and wishing for a Sony monopoly.
Y'all were saying that anybody who believed that the PS5 had less than 12-14TF was stupid, then the XSX came in with 12 and PS5 with then and changed narratives.
Y'all managed to join ResetEra to cancel one dude who is a reliable insider on Capcom stuff because he said that he heard/saw RE8 running not well on PS5.
Aguero9320
Member
I mean... no? This is the kind of deluded nonsense that rubs people the wrong way. As a multi console owner it’s so frustrating - it’s way too early to judge and performance has been - without the use of a fucking microscope - almost entirely indistinguishable.
Save up and buy both.
Panajev2001a
GAF's Pleasant Genius
MasterCornholio
Member
"My little VRR pleasure pearl goes vrrrooommm"
Perfect.
Is pleasure pearl another name for clitoris?
Serious question because I never seen it before.
Unknown?
Member
It's interesting that some are claiming early, unoptimized ports are not a good way to judge between them now but at the launch of consoles unoptimized ports will always favor the more powerful system.
Now when the console is mature things look better due to software efficiency and trickery to exploit a better image.
Now when the console is mature things look better due to software efficiency and trickery to exploit a better image.
ethomaz
Banned
Dust Golem reliable?
But let's say he is reliable lol
He admitted on twitter that he was only saying that because the found the console wars was too much one sided.
A console war that become one sided because all the marketing FUD MS and Xbox fans created.
RDNA1, overclocked, 8-9TFs, world most powerful console, fake RT, fake 4k, not sustained clocks, etc etc etc.
Lysandros
Member
It can easily depend on the GPU since every single part of PS5's GPU is more powerful than XSX's. This is a fact by the way not a comment. The same applies for the CPU 'if' PS5 has unified L3 cache.
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Heisenberg007
Gold Journalism
1. It is definitely NOT the most important spec. Multiple developers have confirmed that they have never even used TFlop as a metric when developing games.
2. The memory setup is clearly better on the PS5. Ask any developer, and they will confirm that the dual memory setup is a pain in the arse. You have to manually redirect where each data should go. The average total memory speed is pretty much the same on both consoles, but the unified setup gives PS5 the edge.
3. PS5's CPU has been performing than XSX's consistently. That's why PS5 performs better in 120 Hz mode than XSX. One of the big reasons is that on-paper it is only 100 MHz faster. However, the CPU in the PS5 does not have to do any decompression because of a separate decompression unit that is 400% more powerful than XSX. It doesn't appear in the spec sheet often, but it does show up in performance. Then there is the rumored Unified Cache that might also be doing its job.
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Tripolygon
Banned
As we all know, PS4 pro having identical number of CU and bigger overall GPU in terms of die space in the SoC is more powerful than PS5.
Someone just finished explaining to you how one spec does not make XSX more powerful and you double down with same nonsense. If it is more powerful why is it not showing in the games? Please don't say tools.
There's nothing I hate more than a dumbass who relishes is his ignorance.
Heisenberg007
Gold Journalism
Riky's likely reply: "umm ... tools."
Heisenberg007
Gold Journalism
You need to check the first post in this thread again. Is that RE8 thing really the only fake thing he said?
Riky
$MSFT
Name calling, grow up.
I'll tell you why and I've had this told me. All the games so far are last gen games, some just released later than the next gen consoles. They all work on last gen engines, Valhalla, Watch Dogs, Call Of Duty etc.
I was told that moving from PS4 Pro to PS5 was very easy, the tools have barely changed and you even have the same number of compute units for your load. You get a big clock boost, you get a big increase in Ram at a higher bandwidth and a huge increase on the CPU side. That is why it was so easy for Cyberpunk to just run the PS4 Pro version at 60fps.
For Xbox it's a bit more complicated , not sure about the tools late scenario but the GDK isn't as familiar and has more changes than Sony, you do get the benefits of Ram and CPU increase but there is substantially more work to be done for the wider GPU that isn't just a big clock speed increase. So you need more optimization to get the same results and time has been short with working from home and getting games ready for launch date.
When we get to next gen engines the picture will be different.
Dust Golem reliable?
But let's say he is reliable lol
He admitted on twitter that he was only saying that because the found the console wars was too much one sided.
A console war that become one sided because all the marketing FUD MS and Xbox fans created.
RDNA1, overclocked, 8-9TFs, world most powerful console, fake RT, fake 4k, not sustained clocks, etc etc etc.
Then why its not FUD when the other side says 14TF, RDNA 3, "anyone who believes otherwise is dumb".
It was one of the main reasons, if not, the main reason to make people screech around, if it was the XSX version y'all would be consdering him as the ultimate source.
ethomaz
Banned
Because we had the specs? I mean before that it was speculation.
RDNA1, overclocked, not sustained clocks, take RT, 9TFs, world most powerful console, etc were all narratives pushed after Sony revealed the specs.
Xbox fans had made a discord server just to push fake narratives thinking lies can translate in sales lol
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Heisenberg007
Gold Journalism
Dude, really? He literally spread false information. For RE8, he even said that he did because the console war was getting too one sided. Matt wiped the floor with him on Twitter when he asked for more information.
None of DG's information was proved to be correct: Silent Hills, PS5 being more expensive, PS5 being worse performing, RE8 gameplay showcase on PC, etc.
And we're still supposed to give credence to his claims?
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