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Elden Ring might be one of the most overrated games ever!

Just got the platinum trophy for the game today, Took me 150 hours to get it.

I think the experience would have been better if the game had a easy mode because the world, art, music and bosses are just amazing. But in order to see everything you NEED a guide and fighting some bosses over and over again because of the difficulty is just a waste of time and not fun.

The lack of direction and hard difficulty kills the joy of experiencing everything, like I would not recommend this game to any of the my causal gamer friends and that's the issue Fromsoftware has to address in the next game to get more sells and go more mainstream if they decide to go that route.
 
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Claus Grimhildyr

Vincit qui se vincit
Too bad then that in regards to this thread, that was just one of the points, besides your take being a clear strawman. Even if it weren't, it's just one of the points in this thread, yet you act as if that's all OP is "crying about".
Never stated it was the OP who said that. Just that those were two common claims people have used in this thread. *You* are the one creating strawman arguments here.

So, as per usual, it's just the garbage souls fanboys standard reply. I'm inclined to believe that there's some programing in these fanboys mind that generate similar forms of the "git gut" statement whenever some negative statement about a From software game is identified, and you are doing a pretty job as evidence for this belief.
If I am the “garbage souls fanboy”, then you are the “pathetic souls hater”. I have literally stated numerous times problems with the game in this and other threads. I also call out ignorant comments that are wholly untrue and often times it can be boiled down to “Get better at the game”.

Now why is it that *you* are so damn salty that someone dares suggest that it may be a player skill issue? Maybe you project a little too much, kiddo.
 

Rea

Member
Just platinumed the game. Oh boy, what a game. Personally, this is 10/10 in terms of exploration and Arts direction. The underworld areas are dreamlike.


But this game is garbage open world game when you talking about side quests, NPCs, and interactions in the world. There's no town like other open world games where you can purchase things, chill, interact with others NPC, there's no place which make you feels safe and relaxed except for Round table hold but that place is boring. Anywhere in the world feel dangerous and constantly feeling pressure and stressful. Everything is aggressive and want to kill you.

I know because it is souls game, it's the nature of souls game. I love souls game. But this game sucks in these situations when other open world games done so well.

The last thing, this game is the worst Souls game ever, i have played BB, DS3, Demon's souls, sekiro. Those games are balanced that you can "git gud" to beat the game. But this game forces me to do things when I don't want to do.

Late game bosses attacks are so shitty that i am forced to use ash, but when i use it, makes the game So easy as fuck. I literally watched a boss die by his own when his hp is around 20%.
The bosses can read your inputs and do some random bullshit moves, everytime my roll is mis-timed and gets attacked, the roll animation will delay and automatically roll after. Many bosses has attacks that skip frames, its inhuman to dodge.
Despite my complaints, i still love this game, its sad to see that fromSoftware broke their already perfect formula, just because they wants to make the open world souls game. I hope they fixes those issues in the next game. Input reading of the bosses are so cheap and artificial and broken.
 
Yeah pretty positive it's not me. I work for myself, people work for me and I make a lot of money and have power. Keep shitting the thread though you lousy basement dweller.

You are just here to get a rise out of people. Want me to hire you as a social media poster? You can post controversial game opinions on our YouTube and Instagram to get people riled up and boost the algorithm. You'd be good at it. I'll pay your 3K a month. <3
Never seen anyone with a more self-inflated ego, based on the fact that they run a small youtube channel. "I have power"? Um, no you don't. You get like 1K+ views on most of your reviews. How delusional are you?
 
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. . .by looking at the map.



You didn't use the map in ER? Impressive.



. . .that and following the huge LITERAL breadcrumbs that you can't turn off. Hmm. I wonder why they put those in their game?



One of my favorite encounters in RDR2 was just fishing on a lake and enjoying watching people go about their day. After I had enough fishing (I know, crazy thought, I got tired of fishing and decided to do something else) I decided to see if I could row around the rivers edge, just because. I came up on a shack in the middle of nowhere with some folks arguing, man and son. Father pulls on me and I hogtie him and get the story from the son. Not a good situation, made worse when you find out what happened with the mum. Decided to shoot the dad and loot the place because I'm a degenerate and this was my WESTWORLD. Later found out this was a part of the collection quests. This is never communicated by the game nor does the game stop you from doing what you're doing.

. . .but you're right. The above pales in comparison to "discovering" a catacomb, beating an endboss that you've almost surely fought already and then being rewarded with an enemy you've already fought as your new sidekick.



I'm glad your level of excitement at getting another summons you won't use or looting an arcstone after exploring off the beaten never waned. It did for me. And if you are exploring because you know you are going to be rewarded for something, then you aren't exploring - you are making your way through "checklist content."



I'm not your friend, guy. . .



None of the superfluous content in TW3 or RDR2 exist in opposition to the main game. It is all content that is internally cohesive to the world and is there to be engaged with or ignored. That they exist creates a "lived in" feeling to the open world that the static and largely unchanging world in ER can't compete with. ER's world exist for the player; the world in TW3 and RDR2 exist largely in spite of them.
I liked rdr 2 and the Witcher 3 - but I guess the “simulation” aspect of it just doesn’t wow me. I like ER more because it embraces being a videogame - to me the simulations are just not advanced enough yet. I never fished in rdr2 that seems completely boring to me - like why do I care about what clear video game characters do with their day? Maybe if the illusion was better I would I dunno
 
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Majukun

Member
I have been playing the game for quite some time now, but I expected so much better specially given how well received it was. It has so many flaws that would never have a pass for pretty much any other 3rd party franchise, that I can't even comprehend how it has been so highly regarded.

First, the main issue: The open world exploration SUCKS TREMENDOUSLY! I haven't been that much bored by exploration for so long. Not even Far Cry and Assassin's Creed have been this boring to explore, and I do consider them quite boring nowadays. There's no reward to wander around the map, other than that sense of finally finding a cave with some sort of decent level design to go through and fight a boss. The open world is basically a huge useless HUB which you need to traverse to find the actual content of the game.
so there's no reward to exploration other than..rewards to exploration?
the artistic value of the game might be subjective, but the game offers a decent variety of location and some breath-taking vistas if you are into the decadent genre.
if anything one issue i have with the ER world is that there is not much interacting with it...most thinks want you dead on first sight, and the rest just exchange a few lines while standing in place or opening a shop..we are far away from a "living breathing world"..but i don't think it was their intention to begin with


And talking about caves, good Lord, they were definitely not ashamed at all to recycle content. I have been in pretty much the same catacomb numerous times. Dungeons with extremely similar looks and patterns: you get into a cave, rest at the state of grace, go down stairs and find a locked door, then make your way through this little dungeon, pull a lever, come back to the start, the door is open, fight the boss. Also, the boss might be one you have already fought like 3 or 4 times already before, with slightly variation of attacks and carrying a different weapon. Still, it's already MUCH better than wandering that barren open world.
not sure what people were expecting..when filing an huge overworld recycling assets is smart design. It's how you re-arrange said assets that matters, and in this case elden ring's catacombs are all different enough to offer a different experience

I'm also under the impression that From Software can't figure out anymore how to make the game more challenging to it's players other than making bosses faster, with extremely high poise, and with big combos that will lock you until they manage to break your defense and fuck you up. This is the "easiest" Soul game because you basically need to kill dozens of optional bosses in order to overpower the main ones.
this is true. since they had to entice souls veterans they cranked up with speed, feints and damage.
to balance this they offered you a group of battle option so vast that makes the game somewhat balanced in its being unbalanced...the cpu cheats, you cheat, you can fight on equal ground unless you force yourself into an only melee, reflex based build..and even in those you can buff yourself and pick some great weapon and go to town old style.

Also fighting with big and slow weapons is a chore now, because the window you have now to damage the bosses is minimal before they restart their combo cycle. The balance that the previous games used to provide is pretty much gone.
can't comment on that, never went slow and heavy in any souls game.

And I won't even talk about the graphics and performance, this game runs worse in my computer than a lot of others that looks way better. But this is no surprise, and it's something that I can ignore as long as I'm having fun with the game.
oh really aree on this one.
still have heavy frame pacing issues that sometime make the game unplayable..als for some reason in the icy giant region the game is prone to crash a lot.

But anyway, Elden Ring is like two steps backwards compared to all their previous games. Up until now, I always praised the level design of any Souls games, Bloodborne and Sekiro; but it is almost nonexistent in ER. After what they've done to Sekiro, I believed From Software was gonna be able to deliver their best next Souls game, but instead they gave me an unbalanced Boss Rush game with a useless and boring open world hub.

much like with botw..the old design is still there..just more sparsearound instead of condensed into structured levels
 

Thief1987

Member
much like with botw..the old design is still there..just more sparsearound instead of condensed into structured levels
That's the main problem at least for me. There are plenty to find and discover in previous "souls" games and interconnected metroidvania-esque world design is objectively better, because it's more tight and focused, and you don't need to traverse huge boring wasteland to find some interesting content.
 

tassletine

Member
Just got the platinum trophy for the game today, Took me 150 hours to get it.

I think the experience would have been better if the game had a easy mode because the world, art, music and bosses are just amazing. But in order to see everything you NEED a guide and fighting some bosses over and over again because of the difficulty is just a waste of time and not fun.

The lack of direction and hard difficulty kills the joy of experiencing everything, like I would not recommend this game to any of the my causal gamer friends and that's the issue Fromsoftware has to address in the next game to get more sells and go more mainstream if they decide to go that route.
I agree. A friend of mine asked me if I should play it, and because they're going through a messy situation (in life) right now, I spent a good deal of time warding them off it. It's really not the game to use for an escape.

I too felt an extreme lack of direction at the end of the game, but I think that was deliberate, as the game is really trying to tell you the story of Wretch ascending to God.

Once you've gained your power in a regular game you are rewarded with an ending. Here you're kind of left wandering, alone, with choices still to make -- And that happens well before the end game.
For me that's a realistic take on what happens when you win an award or have any kind of success. You kind of feel hollow. Nothing has really changed and the problems are still there.

Miyazaki has always left his games unfinished, he likes that style. Personally I think he leans into that too much, compromising the flow, but it's part of what makes his games unique.
 

TheSHEEEP

Gold Member
The lack of direction and hard difficulty kills the joy of experiencing everything, like I would not recommend this game to any of the my causal gamer friends and that's the issue Fromsoftware has to address in the next game to get more sells and go more mainstream if they decide to go that route.
The game is not meant for casual gamers.
Games have a target audience, Souls games (at least the ones From Software does) do not include casual gamers in their target audience. You are correct to not recommend them to casual gamers that just want to chill and relax.
It's as simple as that.

If that kills the joy for you, play a different game.
There are more than enough games (too many, I'd argue) that won't challenge anyone in any way except the spending of time.
Why try and force this wonderfully unique approach to gameplay to become part of that swamp?

It just speaks to a mindset of weakness and a participation trophy attitude to demand something catered at someone else to also/instead be catered to you.

The lack of direction I get, though, it's also my least favourite part of the game and I do use guides a lot (to know where to go next/proceed with quests/find nighttime bosses, etc.).
I just don't have the time to figure out every last detail myself. Too many games. Too little time...
However, here's the kicker, I'd rather drill a hole in my knee than demand From Software change how their games are just to cater to my personal preferences.
 

ZywyPL

Gold Member
Just got the platinum trophy for the game today, Took me 150 hours to get it.

I think the experience would have been better if the game had a easy mode because the world, art, music and bosses are just amazing. But in order to see everything you NEED a guide and fighting some bosses over and over again because of the difficulty is just a waste of time and not fun.

The lack of direction and hard difficulty kills the joy of experiencing everything, like I would not recommend this game to any of the my causal gamer friends and that's the issue Fromsoftware has to address in the next game to get more sells and go more mainstream if they decide to go that route.

It's like you just described Tunic just perfectly. If it wasn't for the god mode most people would just drop the game, either right away or after some time due to how tiresome the combat is, but because of the easy peasy mode people were able to put all the time and effort into exploring the world, gathering the manual pieces, and solving all the puzzles the game is filled with instead, which the game and its world basically is all about.

So that being said, I don't see a single reason why soulslike titles can't have something like that or the regular easy/normal/hard modes to chose from, the only side effect is that more people would buy those games.
 

Clear

Gold Member
So that being said, I don't see a single reason why soulslike titles can't have something like that or the regular easy/normal/hard modes to chose from, the only side effect is that more people would buy those games.

The downside is that it'd be a distraction during development, costing them time to focus on a singular, maximally tuned, user experience.

Also presenting multiple difficulties from the start opens up a scenario where its more likely than not that the player is going to pick a sub-optimal choice in terms of initial impact due to disposition. Its a Goldilocks type of deal where if you assume normal difficulty is "just right" then you are also offering them "too easy" and "too hard". The reality is players both underestimate and overestimate their ability, because there's no standard to measure against until they've experienced what the game offers, and that's oftentimes a moving target.

The real problem is consequential to that however: How is the player supposed to react to finding themselves mismatched in terms of challenge? If you offer an easy way out -like being able to lower the difficulty dynamically- then obviously some people are going to take that route. This not only circumvents the whole point of the design philosophy that satisfaction comes from rising to, and overcoming a seemingly impossible situation, but it also makes it likely that the player will not restore difficulty to its original setting once the "blocker" encounter has been cleared.

The bottom line is that unless overall game difficulty is calibrated in a really tight range, then the ability to alter that baseline is always going to have limited utility. At best in a scenario where difficulty continuously ramps to match the player-character's power growth, being able to lower the difficulty is likely a semi-permanent solution to a transitory problem. Unless you have infinite down-steps in difficulty, isn't it likely that lowering difficulty merely delays the point at which they "cry uncle" ? And for this you have actively disincentivized figuring out how to overcome the initial blocker, the satisfaction that comes from rising to the challenge, and created a scenario where the rest of the game may end up feeling trivial because the player is on a beginner setting.

Single difficulty is the best and most ludological choice for FROM's style of game. Anyone arguing the reverse on grounds of "accessibility" simply hasn't thought the ramifications through in my considered opinion.
 

Methos#1975

Member
Just got the platinum trophy for the game today, Took me 150 hours to get it.

I think the experience would have been better if the game had a easy mode because the world, art, music and bosses are just amazing. But in order to see everything you NEED a guide and fighting some bosses over and over again because of the difficulty is just a waste of time and not fun.

The lack of direction and hard difficulty kills the joy of experiencing everything, like I would not recommend this game to any of the my causal gamer friends and that's the issue Fromsoftware has to address in the next game to get more sells and go more mainstream if they decide to go that route.
The game has sold more than 13.4 million copies, it has already gone mainstream and a large part of why it did is because of the things you fault it for. Even mainstream casuals are getting tired of the hand holding and barrage of pointless map markers found in most open world games today and the complete lack of challenge inherent to them. The casual mainstream market has spoken and it completely disagrees with your opinion.
 

G-DannY

Member
The game has sold more than 13.4 million copies, it has already gone mainstream and a large part of why it did is because of the things you fault it for. Even mainstream casuals are getting tired of the hand holding and barrage of pointless map markers found in most open world games today and the complete lack of challenge inherent to them. The casual mainstream market has spoken and it completely disagrees with your opinion.

at this moment, for what I can check on my Steam achievements, only 35% of player killed Hoarah Loux, so only 35% of Steam users reached the end boss.

As a rule of thumb, we can then maybe relate that just a bit more than a third of that 13.4 million copies (considering same achievement attach rate also on consoles) completed the game as for now.

That to me seems to mean that more than half of that 13 million players got bored or burned out of the game


(by the same measure, only 31% killed Malenia, so we can safely assume that probably only the true hard invested in the game completed it)
 
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Kssio_Aug

Member
The game has sold more than 13.4 million copies, it has already gone mainstream and a large part of why it did is because of the things you fault it for. Even mainstream casuals are getting tired of the hand holding and barrage of pointless map markers found in most open world games today and the complete lack of challenge inherent to them. The casual mainstream market has spoken and it completely disagrees with your opinion.
Season 9 Idk GIF by The Office


Not sure if I agree. Admittedly I don't follow sales numbers, so I have no idea how these numbers compare to most of the mainstream games on the market. There's also the fact that Elden Ring hype before release was huge over all internet, way before the game released, so it had a very effective marketing which also contributed to that; and also the fact that every video game website was praising it to heavens.

I honestly don't care too much about the lack of difficulty options (although I don't oppose them either). I actually think in the Souls games the one difficulty kinda works; and the co-op ends up making up for that in most scenarios although it can be a bit annoying to find a random partner eventually in certain sections (which I believe will be a problem specially for ER given both how huge it is and how so many people are NOT interested in playing NG+ compared to the other titles).

But I don't agree at all with the argument of "hand holding and barrage of pointless map markers". First, you can see in this very thread, and over the internet in any discussion board about the game, that a lot of people do not actually appreciate to be wandering around an large area blindly looking for conten; it can get tiring pretty fast. And also, many other open world games are not that much ridiculous in terms of UI either... RDR2 as default has just about the right amount of UI in the screen someone should want, and you can disable pretty much anything. If I'm not mistaken you can also disable most of the UI in The Witcher 3, which ALSO, as default, is not bad either (I have seen people criticizing many things in TW3, but I don't remember the UI being one of them, except on PC because as default it didn't work very well for kbm users iirc). Same with BotW.

Having a mini map at the corner of the screen instead of being required to press a button is, imo, not a bad design choice AT ALL.

And actually, the total lack of direction you have in their quest system is one of the main problems of the Souls franchise since ever, but in Elden Ring, exactly for being so wide, is made just much worse. Other than hardcore Souls fans, I don't think nearly anyone else would oppose an actual quest log with SOME direction of what the hell you actually should do. Some people already mentioned it here, but some quests can be ridiculously obscure, and not many people has either the time or patience to be trying figure them out without looking for a guide, and you might know very well that most people that play From Software games totally resort to guides to complete the quests, which 100% kills the idea of the complete lack of hand holding as a good design choice to begin with.
 
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recursive

Member
Never seen anyone with a more self-inflated ego, based on the fact that they run a small youtube channel. "I have power"? Um, no you don't. You get like 1K+ views on most of your reviews. How delusional are you?
Is that what he does? Really weird flex on someone giving their opinion of elden ring.
 

linkroi

Member

Elden Ring is kind of... hard to "review", i do find the game to be overrated in a lot of ways, i mean Elden Ring is now (or seems to be ?) the most popular "souls game" in the franchise and it makes me wonder, why? sure, the game has a lot to offer and it's a great and fun adventure, but the game struggles to keep the pace, the late game (especially the MOUNTAINTOPS OF THE GIANTS) is a mix of recycled bosses, recycled enemies, recycled catacombs, i mean that was boring for me, i wanted at some point to finish the story, to be over with the game. I never felt that in any other souls game, count Bloodborne and Sekiro in it. Does it make Elden Ring bad? of course not, the game deserves to be praised because it is genuinely a good game, but far from the rest of the series. Plus, i think the game is not very well calibrated, if you explore the world you will be WAY MORE powerful than the main bosses without even grinding, there's no real "wall" to tell you, *oh, there it is, you have to beat him if you want to continue the game, git gud bro*, if you don't manage to beat the boss, you can now really grind to be more powerful, i never did that in Elden Ring and i was still much stronger than pretty much "every boss". Still, the late-game bosses will be hard as fuck, maybe the hardest boss fights in the souls series if you want to do it "legitimately" and without help.

 
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The game is not meant for casual gamers.
I don’t get this ….

Adding a easy mode would not negatively impact YOUR experience. They could just boost damage done in a easy mode and make the easy mode optional.

Why lock out more people from experiencing the game? I could see a lot of people not getting the sequel because they don’t want to go through another game with constant challenging bosses, no sense of direction and grinding.

This is just my opinion after finishing the game, to each his own.
 
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engstra

Member
at this moment, for what I can check on my Steam achievements, only 35% of player killed Hoarah Loux, so only 35% of Steam users reached the end boss.

As a rule of thumb, we can then maybe relate that just a bit more than a third of that 13.4 million copies (considering same achievement attach rate also on consoles) completed the game as for now.

That to me seems to mean that more than half of that 13 million players got bored or burned out of the game


(by the same measure, only 31% killed Malenia, so we can safely assume that probably only the true hard invested in the game completed it)
The game's fucking massive so that's not saying much. I've almost put in a 100 hours and not reached those bosses yet.
 

NoobleBear

Member
I don’t get this ….

Adding a easy mode would not negatively impact YOUR experience. They could just boost damage done in a easy mode and make the easy mode optional.

Why lock out more people from experiencing the game? I could see a lot of people not getting the sequel because they don’t want to go through another game with constant challenging bosses, no sense of direction and grinding.

This is just my opinion after finishing the game, to each his own.
From is doing the world a favor by not letting everyone have a participation award. This mentality of everyone should get to do it will be the downfall of society. Also part of the reason these games are so well received and rewarding is because they are hard a.f. I'm sure they're not doing the difficulty thing for some grand altruistic purpose, however, they are acutely aware that the difficulty is what sells their brand.
 

Flutta

My tears. Exclusive to gamepass. Forever.
I don’t get this ….

Adding a easy mode would not negatively impact YOUR experience. They could just boost damage done in a easy mode and make the easy mode optional.

Why lock out more people from experiencing the game? I could see a lot of people not getting the sequel because they don’t want to go through another game with constant challenging bosses, no sense of direction and grinding.

This is just my opinion after finishing the game, to each his own.
Not every game is for everyone. As it should be. The entitlement is strong with this one.

Also Elding is the easiest game released by FROM which it one of the reasons why so many people bought it. I bet you never played any other souls game and thats understandable.

There are enough hand holding games flooding the market already go play those if you find souls game to be ”too hard”.

Smh
 

WolfusFh

Member
Never stated it was the OP who said that. Just that those were two common claims people have used in this thread. *You* are the one creating strawman arguments here.
The comment I replied to, which started this, had the comment *But to me so many of these complaints are less “It just isn’t for me” and more “I suck and I want to blame the game for it instead of myself" ". I apologize if that was a misunderstanding, but considering the thread, it's a possible interpretation that your comments are also directed at OP.

Regardless, your comment that most of the game's criticisms just boil down to that isn't supported by any evidence, it's just what you're claiming based on your evidence. And considering that you constantly approach this angle, as well as considering the standard behaviour of this fanbase, it's unlikely to be true, but more likely to be influenced by your bias.
If I am the “garbage souls fanboy”, then you are the “pathetic souls hater”. I have literally stated numerous times problems with the game in this and other threads.
The fact that you point out problems doesn't mean you are tolerant when other people do it. It's also possible that it's just a defense for being criticized for the "git gut approach".
I also call out ignorant comments that are wholly untrue and often times it can be boiled down to “Get better at the game”.
Same argument as the first point.
Now why is it that *you* are so damn salty that someone dares suggest that it may be a player skill issue? Maybe you project a little too much, kiddo.
Again, garbage souls fanboy behavior. And to clarify, this doesn't mean you ARE a fanboy, just that you are showing the behaviour right now. Whatever skill I have at the game is irrelevant to the point, as well as any of your assumptions towards my "intentions" or "emotions".

If I were to follow this type of argument, I would say "Now why is it that *you* are so damn devoted to point out supposed "lack of player skill" whenever someone dares criticize the game? Maybe you are just a souls fanboy after all, kiddo".

Also, your point falls apart when you see that I just replied to the "git gut" comments that are I actually thought were the standard crap. Not all of them. In fact, there is a comment here that complained about "enemies attacking you", that got shit on a lot. Notice that I didn't reply to any of these. Because in this case, I agree. That actually seems to be a complaint that exists due to lack of skill.

So this very thread is evidence that your assumption about me being "salty" when someone points out lack of skill is just an invalid assumption. I'm yet to see evidence that your criticisms regarding "lack of skill" are actually valid and not fanboy behaviour though.
 

YoungEmperor96

Neo Member
at this moment, for what I can check on my Steam achievements, only 35% of player killed Hoarah Loux, so only 35% of Steam users reached the end boss.

As a rule of thumb, we can then maybe relate that just a bit more than a third of that 13.4 million copies (considering same achievement attach rate also on consoles) completed the game as for now.

That to me seems to mean that more than half of that 13 million players got bored or burned out of the game


(by the same measure, only 31% killed Malenia, so we can safely assume that probably only the true hard invested in the game completed it)
you know, only 21% of Steam players complete Red dead redemption 2 (a very mainstream game). Here are the percentages completed for some popular games on Steam:
-God of war: 45%
-Hollow knight: 19%
-Dark souls 3: 24%
-Sekiro: 24%
-DMC5: 26%
And don't forget ER is a very long game and it's only been out for a few months. A lot of people haven't even finished the game yet
 

Guilty_AI

Member
. . .by looking at the map.
Exactly

You didn't use the map in ER? Impressive.
Rarely. Definitely nowhere near as much as i had to in RDR2 or TW3.

. . .that and following the huge LITERAL breadcrumbs that you can't turn off. Hmm. I wonder why they put those in their game?
Wonder what you're even talking about. Is that an online thing? You can 100% turn it off, i know i did from the get go.

One of my favorite encounters in RDR2 was just fishing on a lake and enjoying watching people go about their day. After I had enough fishing (I know, crazy thought, I got tired of fishing and decided to do something else) I decided to see if I could row around the rivers edge, just because. I came up on a shack in the middle of nowhere with some folks arguing, man and son. Father pulls on me and I hogtie him and get the story from the son. Not a good situation, made worse when you find out what happened with the mum. Decided to shoot the dad and loot the place because I'm a degenerate and this was my WESTWORLD. Later found out this was a part of the collection quests. This is never communicated by the game nor does the game stop you from doing what you're doing.
And one of my favorite moments in Elden Ring was beating a boss by giving him rabbies. Felt really proud of that, really like when games let you actually play the game.

Also, fishing? Is fishing in that game even fun? I tried once or twice and never touched again, it was just clunky and unrewarding. Talking about fishing, i found hilarious how the game lets you go on a killing spree then get back all your honor by catching fish and releasing them. Guess releasing some fish surely makes up for burning those innocent NPCs alive for the kicks.

. . .but you're right. The above pales in comparison to "discovering" a catacomb, beating an endboss that you've almost surely fought already and then being rewarded with an enemy you've already fought as your new sidekick.
You mean a random encounter that rarely happens pales in comparison to unadultered fun combat where i get to test my skills and my character build? Yes.

Listen, i get it. These random encounters can be fun, but the way RDR2 is designed makes them much worse than they could actually be. For this to work effectively you need SMALL HUB WORLDS, not a gigantic open maps, otherwise you risk walking miles with nothing of worth happening. Not to mention RDR2 has so many poorly thought out mechanics and controls on top of another that these situations can get nonsensical and immersion breaking really easily.
A game that understand those things and generally execute them better is Yakuza for example.

I'm glad your level of excitement at getting another summons you won't use or looting an arcstone after exploring off the beaten never waned. It did for me.
Summons? Those were some of the ones that got me the most excited. Not to mention all that xp you gained killing those enemies and bosses even if the item does turn out to be useless to you, since, unlike other """"RPGS"""" (cough the witcher 3 cough), the game actually felt challenging and leveling up meant something.

And if you are exploring because you know you are going to be rewarded for something, then you aren't exploring - you are making your way through "checklist content."
Pirates explore the seas for tresures, treasures i know exist but don't know the full details of since there is no checklist giving me dets or anything, thus its exciting. Same thing.

On the other hand, absolutely no one explore cities and wilderness because there's a 1% chance that something "interesting" may happen.

I'm not your friend, guy. . .
Everyone is my friend, friend.

None of the superfluous content in TW3 or RDR2 exist in opposition to the main game. It is all content that is internally cohesive to the world and is there to be engaged with or ignored. That they exist creates a "lived in" feeling to the open world that the static and largely unchanging world in ER can't compete with. ER's world exist for the player; the world in TW3 and RDR2 exist largely in spite of them.
A lived in feeling that disappears the moment you try the slightest out-of-box interaction with said world.
Robbing peoples house in TW3 with absolutely no consequence? YES YOU CAN.
Going to greet someone to them PULL A GUN ON THEM because the control mapping sucks? HAPPENS ALL THE TIME IRL.
Passing through some spot in TW3 only to find THE EXACT SAME PEOPLE, DOING THE EXACT SAME THINGS, SINGING THE EXACT SAME ANNOYING SONG, AND GETTING THE EXACT SAME SCOLDING, AT "ANY" TIME OF THE DAY? Yes, we all know kids play hopscotch in the middle of the night, very immersive.
Or maybe i should murder everyone in this town, ONLY TO HAVE HUNDREDS OF COPS SHOWING UP THAT NEVER STOP COMING. Where the hell are they even coming from? Oh right, the cop factory, we have those in real life too.
 

Kssio_Aug

Member
you know, only 21% of Steam players complete Red dead redemption 2 (a very mainstream game). Here are the percentages completed for some popular games on Steam:
-God of war: 45%
-Hollow knight: 19%
-Dark souls 3: 24%
-Sekiro: 24%
-DMC5: 26%
And don't forget ER is a very long game and it's only been out for a few months. A lot of people haven't even finished the game yet
Other than Red Dead Redemption 2 and God of War, I wouldn't call any of these other games mainstream though. But I agree that being such a long game naturally brings down the amount of people who actually finishes it. But the statistic that pretty much everyone who beat the game also killed Malenia is interesting, and might indicate that pretty much only the most hardcore players are actually reaching the end of it. It also doesn't invalidate his point though... the game might have sold a ton, but since just about 1/3 gets to the end, you can't really tell if most players actually enjoyed the formula that much (maybe they did, maybe they didn't).
 

WolfusFh

Member
and you might know very well that most people that play From Software games totally resort to guides to complete the quests, which 100% kills the idea of the complete lack of hand holding as a good design choice to begin with.
Souls fans are very contradictory regarding this point. There's a thread that complained about this, in which OP did not want to use a guide, but many of the comments were suggesting and insisting that a guide is good, because the game is "designed with the player base in mind, designed for the community interaction". The translation is that the game is designed knowing that people in the internet will talk, find things and build guides.

However, apparently, the game is also designed so that "no hand holding like every modern game does", which is contradictory to the first point. A guide is the ultimate handholding. Now, the usual counter argument is that a guide isn't necessary, but the player base interaction can enhance the experience", which is again contradictory. If one of the positive points is that the game doesn't have hand holding, then this "community interaction" couldn't possibly enhance the experience, since it negates one of the positive aspects.

The game doesn't need any guide, true, but to experience all the content, without a guide, it takes a massive amount of trial and error and time that most players will never have.

People also suggested that you don't need quest logs since you can just write it on a piece of paper. This is archaic. If one needs to write information, a "notepad" in the game would be the best design choice. The player would create their log in the game, no handholding.
 
From is doing the world a favor by not letting everyone have a participation award. This mentality of everyone should get to do it will be the downfall of society.

Dude we are talking about a video game… stop it 😆

Some of you need to get your head out of your ass. Go out into the real world and do something that will make you proud instead of seeking that from beating hard Fromsoftware games.

The commentary that these games shouldn’t have a optional easy mode is just selfish because it would not take away anything from the hardcore fans but the pride of more people beating “YOUR” game.

Am done, not going to speak on this anymore because it’s a silly conversation.
 

Kssio_Aug

Member
Dude we are talking about a video game… stop it 😆

Some of you need to get your head out of your ass. Go out into the real world and do something that will make you proud instead of seeking that from beating hard Fromsoftware games.

The commentary that these games shouldn’t have a optional easy mode is just selfish because it would not take away anything from the hardcore fans but the pride of more people beating “YOUR” game.

Am done, not going to speak on this anymore because it’s a silly conversation.
Even though I do not think the lack of difficulty options is a big issue, I don't think you're wrong either. There are some things that, if added as options, should not affect the experience of others. And I'm sure many Souls hardcore fans would oppose to some stuff until it's actually implemented (then they would probably call it smart anyway). I remember some people were hard against respec, for example, and giving a hundred reasons why From shouldn't add them, and when it finally became a thing no one gave a flying fuck.
 
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YoungEmperor96

Neo Member
Other than Red Dead Redemption 2 and God of War, I wouldn't call any of these other games mainstream though. But I agree that being such a long game naturally brings down the amount of people who actually finishes it. But the statistic that pretty much everyone who beat the game also killed Malenia is interesting, and might indicate that pretty much only the most hardcore players are actually reaching the end of it. It also doesn't invalidate his point though... the game might have sold a ton, but since just about 1/3 gets to the end, you can't really tell if most players actually enjoyed the formula that much (maybe they did, maybe they didn't).
What I mean is that 36% of people who buy a game complete it, especially a long game like ER.... is very normal, has absolutely nothing to do with being burned out or not liking the game. Skyrim (original version) only had 31.4 percent of the final quest completed, and it was the most popular game on Steam at the time. Some of my friends (fans and non-fans) bought ER in March and still haven't finished the game. Someone got to 170h and was still in first playthrough, mostly he just went to invade and pvp.
-Or try to compare with a recent mainstream game is Horizon. On Psn, Horizon has a completion rate is 35%, and platinum rate is 9%. ER has many endings so it's hard to judge, but the number of people who beat Godfrey is 35.6%, with platinum rate is 10.4%.
 

DryvBy

Member
I didn't pay attention to much of the media on this one. I just had a general idea of what I was getting myself into.

It's the easiest Souls game and most of that's due to the check points but this game also had me summon in co-op people for the first time in my Souls history. That could be because I'm older and lazier now too. But I absolutely loved this game and I'm not a fan boy. I've only finished Demon's Souls and Bloodborne before this, dabbling in the others. But I even loved the open world, outside of the snow area which was completely worthless with little to no enemies to kill.

Could it be better? Of course. Everything can be. But for what it is, I loved it.

I've platinumed this game and I'm working on the 100% on Xbox just because I want something to do.
 

NoobleBear

Member
Dude we are talking about a video game… stop it 😆

Some of you need to get your head out of your ass. Go out into the real world and do something that will make you proud instead of seeking that from beating hard Fromsoftware games.

The commentary that these games shouldn’t have a optional easy mode is just selfish because it would not take away anything from the hardcore fans but the pride of more people beating “YOUR” game.

Am done, not going to speak on this anymore because it’s a silly conversation.
My point stands brotha, not everyone should get to experience everything. Sometimes you gotta put in the work... or as the children say "get gud" ...
 

Kssio_Aug

Member
I didn't pay attention to much of the media on this one. I just had a general idea of what I was getting myself into.

It's the easiest Souls game and most of that's due to the check points but this game also had me summon in co-op people for the first time in my Souls history. That could be because I'm older and lazier now too. But I absolutely loved this game and I'm not a fan boy. I've only finished Demon's Souls and Bloodborne before this, dabbling in the others. But I even loved the open world, outside of the snow area which was completely worthless with little to no enemies to kill.

Could it be better? Of course. Everything can be. But for what it is, I loved it.

I've platinumed this game and I'm working on the 100% on Xbox just because I want something to do.
Maybe you're becoming older and lazier (I sure am, lmao). But I think some of the bosses in this game are among the hardest in the franchise, but what makes it overall easier is that you can turn your back on them for a while, kill some optional easier bosses first, and come back stronger to beat them. In the previous games, when you reached a fog you pretty much reached a wall, for better or worse. The problem, for me at least, is that they're not actually the fun type of harder sometimes. And, as you mentioned, the checkpoints are way more generous now - one of the aspects I actually really appreciate in ER.
 
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TheSHEEEP

Gold Member
The commentary that these games shouldn’t have a optional easy mode is just selfish because it would not take away anything from the hardcore fans but the pride of more people beating “YOUR” game.
Wrong.

You have to see the Souls games as an exclusive club.
Only people who manage to beat those games on the one difficulty that they have are allowed in.
By that, every person in that club is assured of their exclusivity and that of everyone else in the club and may rightfully feel elevated over those unwilling* to put in what it takes to get there.

If that club was opened to all the riff-raff, the exclusivity would be gone.
That's what would be taken away.

Is this elitist?
Yes. And I'm 100% convinced that elitism is a good thing, an excellent motivator to improve yourself in regards to... anything in life, really... and I'm proud to be part of any elite that I am part of, within and outside of gaming.
Albeit with different amounts of pride (obv. something like this is less important than other aspects of life).
Cry me a river.

----
*Yes, unwilling.
Especially Elden Ring has so many easier methods to get through the game (aka magic), nobody can claim that they are not good enough.
A boss too hard? Go somewhere else first. By the time you come back, you'll be a better player with a better character and better weapons. That's not even grinding.
The only reason is that they haven't spent the time to figure out how to do it, not any inherent lack of ability.
 

-MD-

Member
I agree with most of what OP wrote but then again, I don't really enjoy open world games anymore and everyone else seems to love them. In my playthrough I've probably spent 15 hours just riding around on a horse which to me isn't fun, I'm here to fight and down bosses, not sprint through a giant empty landscape.
 

anothertech

Member
This is the kind of game that you just wander, no shiny dots to follow, no quest list crowding the screen, no spoon-feeding a linear storyline.

It's true sandbox style, and around every corner is a possible legendary experience. It's pretty incredible they pulled something like this off. The map design is so well structured how almost no place is perfectly flat or horizontal. Most surfaces are at some angle that gives more weight to the eerie environment.

With over 200 bosses to find and a massive amount of weapons and spells it really makes it so you can play this game a thousand different ways.

My take is we are lucky a game like this exists. It's obviously not for everyone, but for those that like the aesthetic and combat style this is a dream come true.

It's been a while since I had such controller throwing moments, and jumping for joy boss kills. Also, praise the fucking bird lol
 
Wrong.

You have to see the Souls games as an exclusive club.
Only people who manage to beat those games on the one difficulty that they have are allowed in.
By that, every person in that club is assured of their exclusivity and that of everyone else in the club and may rightfully feel elevated over those unwilling* to put in what it takes to get there.

If that club was opened to all the riff-raff, the exclusivity would be gone.
That's what would be taken away.

Is this elitist?
Yes. And I'm 100% convinced that elitism is a good thing, an excellent motivator to improve yourself in regards to... anything in life, really... and I'm proud to be part of any elite that I am part of, within and outside of gaming.
Albeit with different amounts of pride (obv. something like this is less important than other aspects of life).
Cry me a river.

----
*Yes, unwilling.
Especially Elden Ring has so many easier methods to get through the game (aka magic), nobody can claim that they are not good enough.
A boss too hard? Go somewhere else first. By the time you come back, you'll be a better player with a better character and better weapons. That's not even grinding.
The only reason is that they haven't spent the time to figure out how to do it, not any inherent lack of ability.
Yeah I mean I’m not great at souls type games but you can make this one as easy as any other game - you just have to put more effort into it. It’s an intrinsic part of the gameplay, I would’ve totally done an easy or normal option if there was one but I’m glad there wasn’t. The consequences of dying etc are all part of it - really there is an “easy” mode if you’re not great at it and it’s just utilizing everything and overleveling - exploring to get better stuff etc - it’s part of what made it so enthralling to me as I had a real goal when going places cus I needed shit for me to be able to kill anybody. Whereas someone actually good I’m sure they didn’t need that. Which is awesome
 
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I actually agree with the op on a few things no idea why people are comparing RDR2, BOTW and Horizon to elden ring BOTW has better traversal, combat and exploration then elden ring, RDR2/horizon has better NPC interactions, graphics, story, animations then every fromsoft game combined. You would be better off comparing elden ring to other AA Japanese games, character action games or jrpgs. Fromsoft still reuses the same clunky character movement of DS1 even though they made better games with better movement sekiro,bloodborne. To many reused weapon animations nothing like seeing the same katana moveset from DS1 or the short sword moveset Demon souls along with tons of other weapons. Side quest still suck compared to any jrpg in the last 10+ years the rewards you get from side quest in fromsoft games are pathetic ranni quest line is like standard mid tier questline that in every jrpg in the last 10 years all the people to hype that quest line either dont play jrpgs or are simps for ranni. Going back and doing caves at a higher level net you nothing except for a few of them that have rare items in other jrpgs even if you go back and fight lower level enemies atleast you get dropped items, cash, rare encounters, xp ect. In elden ring you get souls and crafting items both suck you dont get enough souls from fighting the enimes in the caves to make it worth it and the crafting items aren't that great to go out of your way to get there are many max 5-6 caves in the game that are worth your time. NIoh 1 and 2 does this 1000 times better because the drop rates for elden ring are terrible you can max out arcane and still have to farm certain enemies a million times. Most of the over world monsters arent worth fighting since there rune drops are way to low unless you want there "weapon if it even drops" then thats the only reason to fight them. People talk about how elden ring improves on other open world games but you do the same stuff in this game as most other games find this tower to reveal the rest of this section of the map, Fight these monster in these camps to get xp, Talk to this NPC to start this quest line same stuff. In the over world section most of the time your traving on flat plane fields 80% of the time going to your next destination and most of the time in a straight line the only interesting locations in the game are the legendary dungeons. At best I would give the game a 7.5 if you played every souls games + dlc or remaster from demon souls onward outside of the Legendary weapons which have some of the interesting and best move sets in the game and a few of the ash of wars that werent present in dark souls 3 or its dlc and a few enemies type you have seen everything this game has to offer by the 20 hour mark.

 

22•22

Doesnt need recognition
It's almost aa if a FIRT TRY deviation regarding a more or less stale and predictable formula didnt came out perfect. But still better than most crap we get (mentioning fucking farcry regarding exploration......)


But no. Let's ignore logic and moan and get gold because someone that couldn't get past it's first hour and agreed with your post


Let's be less negative and look at the possibilities an ER 2could have.


Nah bro this game sucks like this hypothetical car model which has massive potential with some user feedback and experience FFS
 
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Yeah pretty positive it's not me. I work for myself, people work for me and I make a lot of money and have power. Keep shitting the thread though you lousy basement dweller.

You are just here to get a rise out of people. Want me to hire you as a social media poster? You can post controversial game opinions on our YouTube and Instagram to get people riled up and boost the algorithm. You'd be good at it. I'll pay your 3K a month. <3
Oh my god how old are you? 12?
It's almost aa if a FIRT TRY deviation regarding a more or less stale and predictable formula didnt came out perfect. But still better than most crap we get (mentioning fucking farcry regardin exploration,)


But no. Let's ignore logic and moan and get gold because someone that couldn't get past it's first hour and agreed with your post


Let's be less negative and look at the possibilities an ER 2could have.


Nah bro this game sucks like this hypothetical car model whicg has assive potential with some user feedback and experience

No, that's not how it works. If you don't criticize a product then the follow-ups will hardly get better.

I promise you guys that Miyazaki will not undergo cardiac arrest if people criticize his games.
 
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Fake

Member
I don’t get this ….

Adding a easy mode would not negatively impact YOUR experience. They could just boost damage done in a easy mode and make the easy mode optional.

Why lock out more people from experiencing the game? I could see a lot of people not getting the sequel because they don’t want to go through another game with constant challenging bosses, no sense of direction and grinding.

This is just my opinion after finishing the game, to each his own.

How do you know that? Are you a dev or something?

You're contradicting many times at this page of the thread. Making scalable difficult requires time and resources. No game need to be the same.

And your logic don't even make sense dude. Nobody lock people from experiencing the game. This is totally nonsense. This is his game, his vision.
BTW, "I could see a lot of people not getting the sequel because they don’t want to go through another game with constant challenging bosses, no sense of direction and grinding" is totally ilogical. This have being said since the first game of the series and here we are... calling the game overrated.

A director should do whatever he want without anyone interference. He doesn't have to please everyone. That's the magic of his game. Time to time people ask for an easy mode, he denny, people whining over Twitter/Facebook, next game get praise and the and the cycle continues.
 
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