GreatnessRD
Member
Hopefully they don't fuck this up.
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Solarstrike
Member
You mean Tencent has acquired.. Bandcamp
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Stooky
Member
how is it corporate when any artist can upload their music and sell it for what ever price they choose?
TGO
Hype Train conductor. Works harder than it steams.
This was my thing that pop in my head.
God bless the late 90's/2000's
Oddvintagechap
Member
Epic good though, smart business.
Isa
Member
Yeah I don't like this. I use Bandcamp frequently, and I hope they don't mess it up. But I bet things will creep in even if slowly be it shares and percentages or censorship. Its been too free there for a good while. Where its album art or lyrics, I can see things getting censored in some way, especially with heavy Tencent/China stake in Epic. I don't hate Epic Games but I'd never use their PC storefront and the moment any sign of a bad changes occur I'm out. But maybe that's the plan in the long term, just another generic streaming service that guts the underground and fringe elements?
It'll be interesting to see where this goes in the future. I hope they leave well enough alone.
It'll be interesting to see where this goes in the future. I hope they leave well enough alone.
We don't have a place for artists to sell their stuff that isn't part of some massive corporate platform anymore.
Bandcamp used to be that, now it's just another corporate platform.
The changes might not come quick but they will.
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saintjules
Member
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nush
Member
Funny thing is Bandcamp is actually blocked in China. If it gets unblocked now we'll know the knee has been bent before we see it another way.
TransTrender
Gold Member
Good to know!
My new hot single, "Taiwan is a County and XiXiPooPoo Man Sucks" will be hitting the Bandcamp charts shortly!
DaGwaphics
Member
You bastard, I came to post "and this one time..." just from the title alone.
Stooky
Member
all this doom and gloom while nothing has changed. the original directors are still in charge. I'm curious to see what they do with the extra funding.
MrFunSocks
Banned
The real question is how will this integrate into fortnite?
TheInfamousKira
Reseterror Resettler
Indie spotlight. Live @TencentStudios concerts with your favorite unknown dark ambient artist playing on a big screen in the middle of a match. Hurray.
(I don't get how Epic Games work, don't listen to me. Chinese takeover of Western industry, I don't get that, either. And I especially don't know how Fortnite works. That's the one where people wear paid skins to throw tomatoes at BLM virtue signaling videos while some guy whose Rick/Spiderman/Chris Redfield snipes them, right?)
Hayabusabruh
Member
It's a one time deal
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March Climber
Member
Solarstrike
Member
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Black_Stride
do not tempt fate do not contrain Wonder Woman's thighs do not do not
You joke but MetaSounds is on its way to people not really needing expert software to make music/sfx for their games.
By that logic shouldnt you be saying Nespers has acquired Bandcamp?.....Nespers own like 45% of Tencent.....which is more than the 40% Tencent has in Epic.
Tencent doesnt own enough of Epic for you to say Tencent has acquired Bandcamp.
Tencent is a minority shareholder....not even enough to influence what Epic does, Tencent could cash out their shares and Epic wouldnt bat an eyelid cuz someone will take their place.
People are acting like Epics recent purchases have not all gotten better from having Epic as owners.
Quixel is "free" now thanks to Epic and while Mixer isnt quite as good as Substance Painter.....Adobes acquisition of Allegorithmic made the Substance suite worse for it.
Negotiator101
Member
Bandcamp?
Herr Edgy
Member
I would but I'm not sure how far NDAs will let me.
What I probably can say is that we just do what we think is right. We are a pretty big company by now and we put a lot of effort into making new and exciting things.
Also, all acquisitions so far have only helped creators. Be it reducing the Unreal marketplace cut to 12% many years ago, even retroactively so sellers suddenly got paid quite a lot out of nowhere for past sales, making Quixel free for all Unreal users and reducing cost for other users, taking a very small cut for games sold on EGS allowing devs to get more from a sale, paying out of pocket for sales on EGS so this wouldn't hurt devs' pockets, making artstation learning free, the list goes on.
Creators have only profited from Epic's plans, which, if I dare remind the gamers here, are the ones often putting their personal or limited assets on the line (in case of smaller Devs) to make the games you enjoy.
Disliking EGS or some of the practices is absolutely fine, but creating a boogeyman is just weird.
Maiden Voyage
Gold™ Member
Seems Bandcamp is now a vehicle for Epic to continue their lawsuits against App Store owners:
arstechnica.com
Epic and Google are gearing up for another legal battle. You might recall that Google has an in-app billing crackdown coming to the Play Store soon. The new rules require all apps selling digital goods to use Google Play Billing by March 31, so Google gets a cut of the sales. Any app in non-compliance has been unable to ship updates since March 31, but the real deadline is June 1, when these apps will be removed from the Play Store. Epic Games bought the popular independent music site Bandcamp in March, and it's already taking Google to court over its newest acquisition. Bandcamp isn't in compliance with the billing rules, so it's due for a ban in June. As part of its antitrust case against Google, Epic is filing a motion for a preliminary injunction to block Bandcamp's de-listing from the Play Store.
Epic has attacked Google and Apple over their app store rules and what Epic says are excessive fees. In March, there were a lot of questions surrounding why the creator of Fortnite and the Unreal Engine would buy an independent music site. One line of commentary from Music Business Worldwide founder Tim Ingham seems to have nailed Epic's strategy. Ingham notes that Epic failed to get Apple to reduce its 30 percent app store cut, in part because the alternative model Epic could demonstrate to the court, the Epic Games Store and its 12 percent fee, wasn't profitable. Apple's lawyers argued the unprofitability of Epic's Games Store justified Apple's 30 percent fees.
Bandcamp is a profitable digital content business, though. Bandcamp has a searchable content store, and it hosts and delivers the content by charging artists a 10 to 15 percent commission. Ingham predicted Epic would hold up Bandcamp's business model as a viable alternative to Apple and Google's app store fees, and that Epic would use its new acquisition to attack app store owners. It looks like we're seeing the first actions of that plan.
Epic raises several issues with Google's billing system. First, that Bandcamp's payment system is "custom-built to maximize efficiency and minimize costs, allowing artists to be paid within 24 to 48 hours of a sale." Google Play takes 15 to 45 days to pay out, and Bandcamp's speedy system is meant to help independent artists pay monthly bills on time.
Second, Epic says Bandcamp's ability to give artists 82 percent of revenue would be harmed if Google takes a 30 percent cut. Epic also notes that Google offered the company a sweetheart deal of 10 percent commission after Epic complained. Google keeps offering huge companies special discounts on its Play Store fees. Spotify has another special arrangement that allows it to run its own payments system alongside Google Play. Epic turned down the 10 percent deal, too, saying Bandcamp currently has a 7 percent profit margin on its 13 percent cut, so it can't afford it.
One of the more interesting complaints is that Google Play Billing just isn't compatible with the type of store Bandcamp runs. The first is that Bandcamp is a mix of digital and physical content. That makes sense for a music company—you can buy a digital download, a physical CD or vinyl record, and some band merch like a T-shirt, all in one store. Google Play Billing, which was meant for in-app purchases, isn't built for this and doesn't support physical sales. Bandcamp would have to support two different payment systems, and it would have to run two checkout systems. Bandcamp's second compatibility issue is that it's an open marketplace, with thousands of artists selling goods. Google Play supports paying a single developer entity, not playing middle-man to thousands of sellers.
On Bandcamp's blog, CEO Ethan Diamond said, "If Google’s policy changes stand, beginning on June 1st, we would have to either pass Google’s fees on to consumers (making Android a less attractive platform for music fans), pass fees on to artists (which we would never do), permanently run our Android business at a loss, or turn off digital sales in the Android app." Removing purchases due to Google's new billing rules is the option Amazon and Barnes & Noble took earlier this month. Poor Barnes & Noble is also an Android manufacturer, and now it can't sell digital books on its own hardware!
Epic's antitrust case against Google is set for April 2023, while non-compliant apps will get booted off the Play Store in a month. We'll be on the lookout for more developments.
4:18 pm ET update: Google sent a statement:
Bandcamp says it can’t afford Google Play billing, Epic files injunction [Updated]
Epic bought Bandcamp last month. Now Bandcamp is a weapon against app store owners.
arstechnica.com
Epic and Google are gearing up for another legal battle. You might recall that Google has an in-app billing crackdown coming to the Play Store soon. The new rules require all apps selling digital goods to use Google Play Billing by March 31, so Google gets a cut of the sales. Any app in non-compliance has been unable to ship updates since March 31, but the real deadline is June 1, when these apps will be removed from the Play Store. Epic Games bought the popular independent music site Bandcamp in March, and it's already taking Google to court over its newest acquisition. Bandcamp isn't in compliance with the billing rules, so it's due for a ban in June. As part of its antitrust case against Google, Epic is filing a motion for a preliminary injunction to block Bandcamp's de-listing from the Play Store.
Epic has attacked Google and Apple over their app store rules and what Epic says are excessive fees. In March, there were a lot of questions surrounding why the creator of Fortnite and the Unreal Engine would buy an independent music site. One line of commentary from Music Business Worldwide founder Tim Ingham seems to have nailed Epic's strategy. Ingham notes that Epic failed to get Apple to reduce its 30 percent app store cut, in part because the alternative model Epic could demonstrate to the court, the Epic Games Store and its 12 percent fee, wasn't profitable. Apple's lawyers argued the unprofitability of Epic's Games Store justified Apple's 30 percent fees.
Bandcamp is a profitable digital content business, though. Bandcamp has a searchable content store, and it hosts and delivers the content by charging artists a 10 to 15 percent commission. Ingham predicted Epic would hold up Bandcamp's business model as a viable alternative to Apple and Google's app store fees, and that Epic would use its new acquisition to attack app store owners. It looks like we're seeing the first actions of that plan.
Bandcamp says its business is incompatible with Google Play Billing
Epic's court filing argues that "Google has a monopoly over Android app distribution, and uses its monopoly power to illegally tie its payment product—Google Play Billing—to its app distribution product—Google Play." Bandcamp is used as an example of what harm this billing system will cause, arguing that Bandcamp's business model is mostly incompatible with Google Play Billing.Epic raises several issues with Google's billing system. First, that Bandcamp's payment system is "custom-built to maximize efficiency and minimize costs, allowing artists to be paid within 24 to 48 hours of a sale." Google Play takes 15 to 45 days to pay out, and Bandcamp's speedy system is meant to help independent artists pay monthly bills on time.
Second, Epic says Bandcamp's ability to give artists 82 percent of revenue would be harmed if Google takes a 30 percent cut. Epic also notes that Google offered the company a sweetheart deal of 10 percent commission after Epic complained. Google keeps offering huge companies special discounts on its Play Store fees. Spotify has another special arrangement that allows it to run its own payments system alongside Google Play. Epic turned down the 10 percent deal, too, saying Bandcamp currently has a 7 percent profit margin on its 13 percent cut, so it can't afford it.
One of the more interesting complaints is that Google Play Billing just isn't compatible with the type of store Bandcamp runs. The first is that Bandcamp is a mix of digital and physical content. That makes sense for a music company—you can buy a digital download, a physical CD or vinyl record, and some band merch like a T-shirt, all in one store. Google Play Billing, which was meant for in-app purchases, isn't built for this and doesn't support physical sales. Bandcamp would have to support two different payment systems, and it would have to run two checkout systems. Bandcamp's second compatibility issue is that it's an open marketplace, with thousands of artists selling goods. Google Play supports paying a single developer entity, not playing middle-man to thousands of sellers.
On Bandcamp's blog, CEO Ethan Diamond said, "If Google’s policy changes stand, beginning on June 1st, we would have to either pass Google’s fees on to consumers (making Android a less attractive platform for music fans), pass fees on to artists (which we would never do), permanently run our Android business at a loss, or turn off digital sales in the Android app." Removing purchases due to Google's new billing rules is the option Amazon and Barnes & Noble took earlier this month. Poor Barnes & Noble is also an Android manufacturer, and now it can't sell digital books on its own hardware!
Epic's antitrust case against Google is set for April 2023, while non-compliant apps will get booted off the Play Store in a month. We'll be on the lookout for more developments.
4:18 pm ET update: Google sent a statement:
ChorizoPicozo
Member
Freedom.
ChorizoPicozo
Member
Mmm...Jaffe?
