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Eurogamer: Tabata on Final Fantasy XV - "core-centric", "casual", "best FF ever"

M_Night

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Nov 9, 2010
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There are other ways to make the combat easier for casual/new fans. Its called difficulty options.

Dont water down the combat aesthetics or it will come to bite you back in the ass.
 

MrMatt555

Member
Mar 25, 2014
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Holy shit how many people are gonna freak out about this and completely ignore the fact that Tabata claims this is an alternative method of play?
 

donutzsick

Member
Feb 5, 2013
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agreeing a lot with duckroll. i get the frustration for people who were hyped for versus, i was too. Even if this game is no longer versus, it could still be a great game. it might not be the game we wanted, but RE fans WANTED more re1-3 style RE. Let the guy make the game he wants to make and lets see if it is good on its own merits. Type 0 and crisis core were good, third birthday by most accounts is not that good, so lets see where this game falls on tabata's history.

Imo its best to wait for actual details, control lay out, and the demo itself to make a judgement. It is healthy to be cautious after what happened after 13, but boy some of the hyperbole i see in this thread..
 

Eusis

Member
Apr 15, 2011
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I wonder if this game's going to stand as an example of why a traditional system is not inherently a bad fucking idea. In a sense the philosophy actually makes a lot of sense, from the start it was a turn based game series that then introduced some real time elements, so even though "he's not getting younger" isn't really a good enough excuse for someone in charge of an action series it IS a good reason to stick with a turn based or similar set up for a series meant to be for people who don't want intense action and instead something more methodical but not overtly complex. This ends up seeming like some bizarre compromise between people who think turn/command based is inherently abhorrent and those who are too bad at action games to handle a sudden gameplay shift, and likely isn't going to please much of anyone baring some surprise twists.

Well, outside of people who really do just want their games to be flashy and on auto pilot, but I question how big such a market really is. People want to do Awesome, but if you don't feel like you did anything meaningful there a dumb blockbuster can scratch that itch better.
 

duckroll

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Jun 7, 2004
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Not disagreeing with Versus, but looking at it now there were only two 3d KH games released...there have since been 4 more and a whole resurgence of western and japanese ARPGs to draw from. This isnt a crazy experiment anymore, there are well established games in the genre now that can be looked at.
I think the comparison to KH was more valid in 2006 than it is today because it is clear that when the project first started they could have just made a realistic KH reskin as Versus and shipped that game out and people would have been pretty satisfied. The problem is as the game continued development it got more and more ambitious.

You can see from the 2011 trailer for example, the game really wanted to be everything. You have interactive environments, you have third person shooting, you have pure action gameplay, and open world to explore, you can hijack enemy vehicles during combat and use their turrets or drive them around, Noctis can use multiple weapons, he can teleport, etc. All of that is really cool, but in the end it has to make a cohesive and fun game experience. They probably tried and failed. Hence with the project reboot they're looking at how to present as much of those things visually as possible in game they can actually make which is (hopefully) fun.
 

Betty

Banned
May 31, 2013
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I also want to say how much I hate Stella's new design, now she has one of those same sickly sweet anime faces that XIII used.

Her old design at least had character and felt somewhat individual, this new one just fades into the background.

 

Hedge

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May 29, 2013
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I play games to watch them play itself, don't you know?

God, this sounds so far from the dark KH-esque FF of ages past. I was really looking forward to ot, too.
I mean it could still be alright, but it just won't be Versus.
 

Dark_castle

Junior Member
Jun 25, 2013
9,921
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Thank you whichever mod for closing down the opportunity for more people to sign the goddamn useless-but-what-fucking-else-can-we-do petition.

So rather than focusing on the supposingly 'depths' of the combat, you focus on talking SHIT that none of your customers ever want to hear. Good fucking job, Tabata.

When I first hear the news of Nomura leaving and Tabata stepping up, I view it as overall a good news. Now? An absolute motherfucking nightmare. Jesus fucking Christ. Tabata, you are suffocating me here.
 

Valnen

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Aug 4, 2009
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I got some bad news for you...
You can have all the bad news you want. I'll reserve my judgment for the playable demo. There are people that say KH 2 is a button masher too and they're wrong.

I admit to being worried at this point. It seems they're just throwing Nomura's vision away entirely.
 

TuXx

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May 7, 2013
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Press X and Noctis will play the entire game for you while you can sit back and enjoy the story. Is that casual enough for you, Square?
 

oti

Banned
Aug 5, 2012
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We'll see how it turns out. I'm ok if it plays like KH. I don't like the term "instant gratification" though, that's mobile games philosophy of video game design. I'm not going to play FF XV while waiting for the bus.
 

M_Night

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Nov 9, 2010
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Square: if we state its simple to play the casuals will eat it up. Good idea.

Reality: displeasing the people who have already committed to purchase and will spread positive information over the net and word of mouth.
 

MormaPope

Banned
Mar 31, 2012
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It's not a one button game. It's a two button game at least. There's both Defend and Attack. Get that right. :p

Also, no one said that there will be zero strategy or skill. You are saying that there will "obviously" be a manual control scheme which is more technical. I don't think that it is obvious, or even probable. He is describing the game as it is. That doesn't mean it takes no skill at all to play, but the skill will be related to other things rather than input - like deciding how to approach a fight, where to attack, who to attack first, how to set your party AI up, and what weapons and abilities to equip in a fight.
All the combat shown thus far seems to be Noctis and bros duking it out in a small mob of enemies, teleporting, duking it out further, combined action with party member, duking it out. I have no idea what changing equipment and AI will actually do when it comes to controlling the battle.
 

Betty

Banned
May 31, 2013
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You can have all the bad news you want. I'll reserve my judgment for the playable demo. There are people that say KH 2 is a button masher too and they're wrong.
This is nothing like KH anymore though.
 

sn00zer

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Mar 31, 2009
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I think the comparison to KH was more valid in 2006 than it is today because it is clear that when the project first started they could have just made a realistic KH reskin as Versus and shipped that game out and people would have been pretty satisfied. The problem is as the game continued development it got more and more ambitious.

You can see from the 2011 trailer for example, the game really wanted to be everything. You have interactive environments, you have third person shooting, you have pure action gameplay, and open world to explore, you can hijack enemy vehicles during combat and use their turrets or drive them around, Noctis can use multiple weapons, he can teleport, etc. All of that is really cool, but in the end it has to make a cohesive and fun game experience. They probably tried and failed. Hence with the project reboot they're looking at how to present as much of those things visually as possible in game they can actually make which is (hopefully) fun.
True, but gutting the one thing that got people hooked in the first place (action combat in Final Fantasy) is not how I imagined it being rebooted. All the other things you listed could have gone and I would still be happy, hell take out character swapping, but the one thing that was established from day 1 and I would say reiterated at e3 2013 has now been cut down. and it fucking sucks.
 

Dark_castle

Junior Member
Jun 25, 2013
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And NO previous Final Fantasy were NOT overwhelming. The Witcher 2 was overwhelming. Xenoblade Chronicles was overwhelming. Dragon's Dogma was overwhelming. Hell, Kingdom Hearts 2: Final Mix was overwhelming. Final Fantasy XIII was NOT.

GOD.
 

SOLDIER

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Dec 4, 2006
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You're phrasing your post like people are going to be negatively critical no matter what FFXV actually is. If Tabata says things that agitate fans, well, the game either something people are hesitant about or he's saying really weird things that don't reflect what the game is.

I'm going with the former because he's the director for the game, if anyone knows how the game will actually play and function, its him.
Not like that's so hard to believe.

It's sparse information right now, and Tabata's track record has shown that he knows how to not make hand-holdy games. Wasn't Type-0 critcized for being too hard in parts?

I have plenty of concerns for FFXV, but this is too little info to get up in arms over. But on the bright side, if people complain enough, we may get some clarification from Tabata sooner rather than later, so by all means everyone yell really loud.
 

Augemitbutter

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Feb 3, 2008
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I also want to say how much I hate Stella's new design, now she has one of those same sickly sweet anime faces that XIII used.

Her old design at least had character and felt somewhat individual, this new one just fades into the background.

they're both hideous robot dolls.
 
Sep 2, 2011
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To be honest, clearly this just another way of saying, "we need to ship as soon as possible and recoup as much investment as possible so rather than fine tuning the combat, we need to make it straight forward as possible"

Anytime a developer says the words "accessible" its always about the same thing. Money.

Cant say I have a horse in this race. FFXV looked mildly interestimg, but as an RPG I wluld eventually lost interest. Now I dont need to worry about it at all. So whatever *shrugs*
 

Nerokis

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Feb 28, 2013
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As long as there is equipment, weapon, stat building/customization, and dungeon crawling, it's still ff. Execution has never been that important beyond limit breaks.
Yeah, still missing crucial context here. Are dungeons actually interesting to maneuver through, or incredibly basic along the lines of Bravely Default? How demanding/complex does enemy design get? How deep can you go with customization, and how big of an impact can it have on the battlefield? Surrounding all that, are there grand cities, is the exploration actually satisfying, is the world populated with diverse and interesting NPCs and side-quests?

There is way, way too much we don't know to suddenly conclude that FFXV is somehow going to be a huge disappointment. I mean, although Tabata's words in this interview hurt to read, I can still imagine the battle system rivaling past FFs in terms of fun and execution. We just have to wait and see. I'm pretty happy that we're finally being given concrete info, at least.
 

Mortemis

Banned
Oct 23, 2013
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Not like that's so hard to believe.

It's sparse information right now, and Tabata's track record has shown that he knows how to not make hand-holdy games. Wasn't Type-0 critcized for being too hard in parts?

I have plenty of concerns for FFXV, but this is too little info to get up in arms over. But on the bright side, if people complain enough, we may get some clarification from Tabata sooner rather than later, so by all means everyone yell really loud.
I've heard that too. Tabata's response for that was more difficulty options though, not simplifying everything. Granted he was working on an HD project and not a new game.
 

Benzychenz

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Aug 2, 2013
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We still have a big world to explore, an awesome road trip story, and a Shimomura soundtrack. Don't panic just yet.

The combat may take a backseat gameplay wise to the world and exploration ala Xenoblade (though Xenoblade's combat was still pretty fun to be fair).
 

duckroll

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All the combat shown thus far seems to be Noctis and bros duking it out in a small mob of enemies, teleporting, duking it out further, combined action with party member, duking it out. I have no idea what changing equipment and AI will actually do when it comes to controlling the battle.
Yes well we can say that about trailers in pretty much every single RPG, especially early trailers. I'm not arguing that the game will have amazing depth here. I don't know if it will. But I think it's important to have a rational opinion about stuff based on what we do know. Is it disappointing that this doesn't have high level action combat? If we were expecting it to be that, sure. Does that automatically mean that anything with automation or contextual action is total shit? No, definitely not. You can design gameplay which focuses on other things. Obviously it will be less obvious on generic mobs than in more carefully scripted boss encounters, so I guess we'll see?

The demo will be really interesting, because Tabata repeats in almost every interview that people who are doubtful about the new direction of the game should check out the demo to see for themselves, so he's definitely approaching the demo as something he would be proud of and representative of how good the game could be. If the demo turns out to be shit, then it's pretty bad news for the full game too imo.
 

M_Night

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Nov 9, 2010
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The worst thing I have ever read regarding this game.

"I myself am not getting any younger. I don't want to be frantically pushing buttons. I also want to utilise the intelligence of the hardware spec, and not have to go through too much hassle or trouble in order to execute moves."

Did your focus testing reveal all old gamers have arthritis or something?
 

Philippo

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Mar 25, 2014
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Quoting myself from the other thread:
Shiiiiiitttt.
I'm still gonna try and be positive about it but this precise article makes it very hard to do it.
If the demo plays like he says, this thing will backfire in their faces so hard.
I hope he realizes it in time and adds some sort of "hardcore" command scheme.
Now i'm 100% hopeful that our complaints reach SE either now or after playing the demo, so they can go to fix it (or at leat give a fucking hardcore option) ASAP.
Because their gameplay decisions are already backfiring, and if the demo ends being like this, it'll only get worse.
 

sn00zer

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Mar 31, 2009
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Its amazing how incredible literally everything else about the game sounds...and the on thing...THE ONE THING FFVersus was known/developed for is now cut

Also what the hell at the e3 showing, looked like an action game to me back then
 

silva1991

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Apr 9, 2014
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You can have all the bad news you want. I'll reserve my judgment for the playable demo. There are people that say KH 2 is a button masher too and they're wrong.

I admit to being worried at this point. It seems they're just throwing Nomura's vision away entirely.
I hope this is the case but it's probably not : (
 

raven777

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Jan 30, 2012
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The game is over a year away. I am sure there are a lot of battle mechanics that has not been revealed and we will hear about them more in coming events like Jump Festa, E3, and TGS next year.