Kickstarter is for... kickstarting things. There is zero guarantee or expectation that the end result will continue to be a purely grassroots endeavor, which is a completely unsustainable approach for a major hardware R&D project anyway.
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Facebook has acquired Oculus VR for 2 Billion US Dollars
- Thread starter ShogunDarius
- Start date
Kickstarter is for... kickstarting things. There is zero guarantee or expectation that the end result will continue to be a purely grassroots endeavor, which is a completely unsustainable approach for a major hardware R&D project anyway.
stufte
Member
I honestly don't get why ANYONE thinks that people who contribute money to a kickstarter deserve anything beyond what is offered. My mind boggles. It's like lending your friend gas money to go to an interview and expecting a cut of his salary.
More_Badass
Member
Best analogy yet
Seriously, this whole Facebook acquisition has nothing to do with Kickstarter. It was merely for the original dev kits, which happened, which was a success. That's it.
Actually if there is a link to KS, it's that a Kickstarted project became a huge marketable product, big enough to be bought by Facebook for 2 billion. This proves without a doubt that Kickstarter is valid and effective
jediyoshi
Member
No? The KS money is a drop in the bucket of their funding at hand before Facebook got involved and after the KS was over.
Rentahamster
Rodent Whores
As long as all the backers receive the rewards they were promised for their level of support, the contract is fulfilled. It's hardly "shitting" on them. As far as I know, all the dev kit 1s shipped out (albeit not as fast as some would have liked).
You clearly don't understand what Kickstarter actually is.
Fried Food
Banned
Because you don't make(or not make) 2bn dollar desicisions that have the chance to change life as we know based on what "FANS" think. If your in that situation, Fuck the fans.
notoccupanther
Member
Methinks I do ..
I understand that I don't like Facebook...
There .. I said it ..
Facebook in 3 years|
What you've said here, and what you're complain about, would indicate otherwise.
notoccupanther
Member
Perhaps the ideologue in me had pipe dreams for what Kickstarter could become. Alas it's slowly becoming just another pick and choose, startup-by-proxy pool for Facebook, Google and their lik ...
Betta Lines
Member
This is heavy
Pretty much. Any worthwhile idea will be sold to the highest bidder.
CadetMahoney
Member
This.
More_Badass
Member
Has Google and their like actually bought any other Kickstarted hardware tech/products? Or is this opinion of yours based on this single incident?
They have approximately 2 billion reasons not to care.
I like this analogy
I totally understand where some people are coming from, but they were being naive. All things considered, it's a pretty cheap life lesson.
KoopaTheCasual
Junior Member
Love this analogy. So apt.
BishopLamont
Banned
Valve is the best candidate to make something like Oculus successful.
Why are you ignoring the thousands of kickstarters from small to big, that have no involvement from the likes of google or fb?
People expect too much from doing good things like they're doing something special when its just a normal thing to do, its not as genuine as someone who truly gives and anything they receive is just a bonus.
call_kotaku
Member
I'd argue they have less interest than Facebook does in hypothetically making VR ubiquitous, since their interest is in making Steam the primary platform for VR games instead of pushing VR far enough into the mainstream to build their "metaverse" or whatever.
There's also the distinction between Oculus's success and the success of VR in general.
Wiktor
Member
Not really. If somebody else makes the device, then Valve would help to make it big like nobody else. But actually making in the first place? Valve lacks the money to pump into R&D that this thing requires and they lack the money to build it in mass quanities and advertise properly. They could license it out to other companies, but then the device itself would be a lot more expensive.
Simply put Valve is pretty small company, while for something like this you need a tech giant.
BishopLamont
Banned
Its true they don't need to make Oculus or VR mainstream in general, but if they did have an interest in reaping the benefits of success, I have no doubt they have the resources and capability to do so. People really underestimate how strong the Steam platform is and how it can be used to push whatever Valve wants to.
How much money would the continual R&D actually need? Valve isn't exactly short on cash flow.
notoccupanther
Member
There doesn't have to be precedence ... the levee breaks with an initial single drop
More_Badass
Member
Oh, so you're just sharing ridiculous unsubstantiated opinions, ignoring the fact that there are literally thousands of successful Kickstarters that don't "sell out", and that Kickstarter had absolutely nothing to do with Oculus being bought by Facebook
If anything, this shows that a Kickstarted project can become a massive success
Wiktor
Member
They were burning through dozens of millions as a bassicaly garage company. Valve isn't short on cash, but they don't have billions to throw around on wacky projects. Especially since it would need to be updated over and over again pretty much every year.
This is a big project. Lots of money and huge team needed, as well as mass orders of parts. This is pretty much the antithesis everything Valve is about. Facebook is desperate to not miss on the "next big thing". At least initially they will give Rift pretty much whatever they want.
Plus Valve is ridiculously slow. Steam Machines are taking forever to ship and those are bassicaly just regular PCs built with fancy controller.
call_kotaku
Member
Valve already did substantial R&D on both VR and AR, and probably spent a substantial amount of money on it, but launching hardware is way more expensive and I think their priority would be to maintain the viability/dominance of Steam (hence Steam machines) than to spend their resources trying to produce consumer VR.
And if everyone in the know understood that Oculus was probably going to be acquired (which was inevitable once they got venture funding, apparently), then there's no reason for Valve to spend their money pushing VR when someone with more money will do it for them. Steam will benefit no matter who produces the hardware, and however rich you think Valve is, they're in no position to compete with google/samsung/apple on hardware if VR does take off.
If anything, the only reason Valve would buy Oculus is some sort of exclusivity for Steam.
iceatcs
Junior Member
I think I could see it by from Steam controller pad. They seem failing on it. Need bigger R&D and resource to bring it upper and quicker.
This is the gaming community at its worst. Irrational, pathetic and secluded.
1) This deal in no way violates the rights or the reasonable expectations of Kickstarter backers. Quite the opposite - they helped kickstart a wildly successful company and product. If they wanted a return or control they should have invested money when the company was recruiting.
2) There is zero evidence to show that Oculus will now stop developing its technology for gaming applications, and there is little business sense in doing that.
3) Anyone who looks down on Oculus for "selling out" is a liar, a hypocrite or an idiot. When you are offered 2 billion dollars for your unproven product by one of the most prominent tech companies in the world, you take it.
4) The vehement hatred towards Facebook is entirely irrational and honestly perplexing.
HP_Wuvcraft
Banned
I hate to break it to you, but things require money to be successful.
Kickstarter was never, ever going to lead to some utopia where corporations crumble and everything is free.
What the hell? People, please chill the fuck out. The acquisition in no way negatively affects kickerstarter backers and the next line of Rift's. Gamers at their ugliest.
And it you would be fair to your supporters you would haven handed out shares which would now be some factor 1000 in value. Or at least only keep the 400M for further develpment and hand out Facebook shares with some factor 560 worth of the kickstarter pledges.
More_Badass
Member
You're not serious? Right? Right?
You're serious...
Sure I am serious . If you get venture capital you have to share your profits. If you go to Kickstarter you get the money, the people who pay take the risk and if you are successful you keep all the profit and those who took the risk get the shaft.
More_Badass
Member
How are they getting the shaft? The Kickstarter was for the original dev kits. Nothing else. They was completed, it was succeeded, they shipped. The backers received their rewards. Pledging wasn't an investment in the company, it was a donation to help the developers. Everything else since has nothing to do with the backers or Kickstarter, except for the fact that it proves that a Kickstarted project can become a major success
Seriously this quote from yesterday is so relevant
I stilll am shocked that people can't understand how Kickstarters work. Have you backed a project? Or maybe even backed the Oculus?
I am not angry at them. I just can understand why people are. And funding a startup is completely different from giving someone the money for the bus, really one bad comparison.
And sure I know how kickstarter works, that doesn't mean it is fair.
More_Badass
Member
But it wasn't a start-up. It was to help develop the dev kit, not to create a company
flyinpiranha
Member
LMAO, what? Nobody was 'funding a startup' on a kickstarer, you can pretend you're a broker and 'investing' but you get what you paid for. It's like funding Redbox by renting a movie. "Sorry, I'm cutting my funding this weekend" ... by not renting a movie.
There was absolutely no promise or financial return or gain. You paid, you got DK1, the end.
It's the most fair thing I've ever seen, how is it not fair? Explain to me how agreeing to pay for a product, receiving that product, and getting exactly what you paid for ... is not fair?
HolyBaikal
Banned
Well, I'm not a big fan of Facebook. And I wouldn't want them to hurt this in any way, and it sounds like just being a part of Oculus has made many people turn away from it.
But I want to be optimistic and hope for the best. Palmer Luckey and many other people are really big fans of virtual reality, so I think it would be strange if any of them did anything that could hurt it. If things went badly, couldn't they use a lot of the money they have to start a new company and create a new Virtual Reality product? Or could contracts prevent them from doing so?
I'm sure that a lot of money invested in this market will be a good thing. And that if someone makes a bad product that isn't good for PC gaming, other companies will be interested in making another product that does.
Sony and Facebook don't have to be the only two companies involved in Virtual Reality. And I'm sure that if it is worth Facebook investing 2 billion dollars into it, there is a healthy market for it. I'm sure that, whatever happens, there will be great both augmented reality and virtual reality in the future.
But I want to be optimistic and hope for the best. Palmer Luckey and many other people are really big fans of virtual reality, so I think it would be strange if any of them did anything that could hurt it. If things went badly, couldn't they use a lot of the money they have to start a new company and create a new Virtual Reality product? Or could contracts prevent them from doing so?
I'm sure that a lot of money invested in this market will be a good thing. And that if someone makes a bad product that isn't good for PC gaming, other companies will be interested in making another product that does.
Sony and Facebook don't have to be the only two companies involved in Virtual Reality. And I'm sure that if it is worth Facebook investing 2 billion dollars into it, there is a healthy market for it. I'm sure that, whatever happens, there will be great both augmented reality and virtual reality in the future.
I'd totally invest 50$ for .000000002% of the shares man!
Donations are not investments.
Kickstarter money is donated.
They don't have to really give you anything they promise, and no one pledged for owning a part of the company. They got their promised rewards and helped get Oculus going. Not even Notch and his 10k have a right to any part of the company's value.
Kickstarter money is donated.
They don't have to really give you anything they promise, and no one pledged for owning a part of the company. They got their promised rewards and helped get Oculus going. Not even Notch and his 10k have a right to any part of the company's value.