Blackbird|
Banned
RPG?
RPG?
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Factor 5 / White Harvest: Wii Project Cancelled
- Thread starter Shiggy
- Start date
RPG?
RPG?
ThatObviousUser
ὠαἴÏÏιÏÏÎ¿Ï Ïαá¿Ï εἶ
Second said:
Super-man. When Brash pulled out it was the beginning of the end for F5.
Blackbird|
Banned
Linkup said:
No,probably Rogue squadrom trilogy with online,improved graphics and motion controls
Blackbird|
Banned
laserbeam said:
The starman in the first image almost confirms that this is pilotwings
AceBandage
Banned
Blackbird| said:
The starman in the first image almost confirms that this is pilotwings
They were working on a Pilotwings game on the Gamecube.
Could be a port of the assets.
Either way, Pilotwings on Wii is a perfect fit. Not having it would be a huge waste (of course, I'm still waiting on a new 1080 and Wave Race).
Interesting...
As many know, Blue Harvest was the fake film name used during the production of Return of the Jedi. That makes White Harvest an interesting name choice. Harvesting dollars from all those Hoth levels, amirite?
That said, I would love to see more Wii content (like a new Rogue Squadron) as they always get the most of the system. Hell, RS2 would be in the top 10 best looking Wii games, to me.
As many know, Blue Harvest was the fake film name used during the production of Return of the Jedi. That makes White Harvest an interesting name choice. Harvesting dollars from all those Hoth levels, amirite?
That said, I would love to see more Wii content (like a new Rogue Squadron) as they always get the most of the system. Hell, RS2 would be in the top 10 best looking Wii games, to me.
spidye said:
Brash had the rights for Superman because of their working relationship with Warner Bros. If I remember correctly, EA had the rights to a game based on the movie Superman Returns, and Brash was making a game based on the comic book. I may be wrong about the relationships involved, but Brash was working on Superman, Clash of the Titans, SAW and Where the Wild Things Are when they imploded. And as much of a joke as it seems, Factor 5 was working on a Kid Icarus game and it looked stupid.
I should note that the DDM does not represent Factor 5 anymore (as Factor 5 doesn't really exist anymore), and the slide is from nearly a year ago.laserbeam said:
If it was comic book only, how do you explain this Julian Eggebrecht quote from the Superman press release? I think it is plausible that it was for the off-on Superman Unleashed that Bryan Singer was attached to, no? Also, I believe all of EA's options for WB properties expired at the end of last year.Syckx said:
AceBandage said:
Those assets were made for Wii, no porting was involved
With regard to Superman, here you can find some images and a video:
http://www.joystiq.com/2009/03/10/alleged-screens-and-video-from-factor-5s-canned-superman-game/
The battle against Doomsday was shaping up very nicely imo.
Do you mind giving some details?
Blackbird|
Banned
[Nintex] said:
WayForward too,they have 2 announced wii games for this fall
Here some more information I dug up with a quick Google search:
Link:http://www.reillygames.com/games.htm
Link:http://drewlanglois.com/resume.html
Title #1: The same one that Kevin Reilly was working on and likely published by Nintendo.
Title #2: Clearly a Rogue Squadron title published by LucasArts.
Link: http://ryanbond.net/resume/
Kevin Reilly Resume said:
Link:http://www.reillygames.com/games.htm
Drew Langlois Resume said:
Link:http://drewlanglois.com/resume.html
Title #1: The same one that Kevin Reilly was working on and likely published by Nintendo.
Title #2: Clearly a Rogue Squadron title published by LucasArts.
Ryan Bond Resume said:
Link: http://ryanbond.net/resume/
Blackbird|
Banned
So this is the shiggy secret source
Blackbird|
Banned
NR1 said:
A compilation of 3 old games taking more time to be made than a brand new game ? looks strange for me
cuyahoga said:
Rogue Squadron as a casual game with a wide variety of activities to choose from lasting 5 to 15 minutes? That sounds more like PilotWings to me. Skydiving, parachuting, hang gliding, jet pack, and gyrocopter missions all run about that length of time plus those are all fairly "casual" activities in a video game (think Wii Sports). Combat missions set in the Star Wars universe seem more "hardcore" to me.
If there is a Kid Icarus game being developed, then its by Retro Studios, in my opinion. Factor 5 may have had an early hand in it at some point, but it was taken away by Nintendo early in development.
No, it wouldn't be Rogue Squadron, but a pick-up-and-play Star Wars Wii game makes sense to me. Factor 5 was definitely working on Kid Icarus at one point (entirely possibly it could have been an unsolicited pitch, though), but the consensus seems that its pretty dead.NR1 said:
Blackbird|
Banned
The leaked assets,casual,mission based,5 to 10 minutes,various ativities,everything confirms pilotwings.
Factor 5 started making a kid icarus pitch for nintendo,nintendo recused,factor 5 proposed pilotwings nintendo accept,this is my guess.
The only estrange thing is that they dont have a publisher for one of the games,lucas arts are the only publisher that have the star wars franchise,maybe nintendo cacncelled pilotwings and they working to remove the references and turn the game into a new franchise to a new publisher
Factor 5 started making a kid icarus pitch for nintendo,nintendo recused,factor 5 proposed pilotwings nintendo accept,this is my guess.
The only estrange thing is that they dont have a publisher for one of the games,lucas arts are the only publisher that have the star wars franchise,maybe nintendo cacncelled pilotwings and they working to remove the references and turn the game into a new franchise to a new publisher
ephemeral garbage
Member
Shiggy said:
Brutal Legend is an EA-published large open world game where a Wii conversion might have been recently cancelled.
Just sayin'...
[Nintex] said:
I really don't know. Achim Moller still lists both Wii Games for a release in 2009 - that's probably when they are finished.
@NR1
--> Rogue Squadron
--> Pilotwings (or a flight game, in case Nintendo is no longer publishing it)
And "UNANNOUNCED LICENSED TECHNOLOGY PACKAGE (WINPC).", that's Xaitment AI.
@Blackbird|
After the Project HAMMER "debacle" I do not want to link to people resumes as they are probably not allowed to post such things. In addition, I always hope that there will be more news coming from those spots
Otherweise I would post so much more which shouldn't be found on the internet (but in most cases superannuation links to them and then I am not the "bad guy"
)@Not A Fur
That's what I was thinking about. But actually, the Factor 5 port was cancelled in July - news about the Brutal Legend Wii cancellation hit the web in June.
@Animator
After the EA port was cancelled, huge layoffs happened at WhiteHarvest. You know, the team wasn't as large as during in last December, but still. Now they are desperately seeking new projects as there current two games will be finished this year (if they aren't already!). It would be great if you could provide more information on the LucasArts and Nintendo projects or tell us why you believe both will not be released. Achim Moller seemed pretty confident that they will hit the shelves.
It really depends on how they structured the company. It's possible/ likely that Factor5 LLC is done for (and maybe even White Harvest LLC), but it's also possible that Factor5 GmbH is completely unaffected by this and doesn't have to pay anyone - if it actually officially is a completely separate entity. And that seems to be the case. You can do really funky stuff in that regard with GmbHs/ LLCs, at least according to German law. I know several guys who ran GmbHs in the ground, just to reopen another GmbH pretty much instantly and continue exactly where they left, without any obligations whatsoever.Animator said:
Blackbird|
Banned
Shiggy said:I really don't know. Achim Moller still lists both Wii Games for a release in 2009 - that's probably when they are finished.
@NR1
--> Rogue Squadron
--> Pilotwings (or a flight game, in case Nintendo is no longer publishing it)
And "UNANNOUNCED LICENSED TECHNOLOGY PACKAGE (WINPC).", that's Xaitment AI.
@Blackbird|
After the Project HAMMER "debacle" I do not want to link to people resumes as they are probably not allowed to post such things. In addition, I always hope that there will be more news coming from those spots
Otherweise I would post so much more which shouldn't be found on the internet (but in most cases superannuation links to them and then I am not the "bad guy"
@Not A Fur
That's what I was thinking about. But actually, the Factor 5 port was cancelled in July - news about the Brutal Legend Wii cancellation hit the web in June.
@Animator
After the EA port was cancelled, huge layoffs happened at WhiteHarvest. You know, the team wasn't as large as during in last December, but still. Now they are desperately seeking new projects as there current two games will be finished this year (if they aren't already!). It would be great if you could provide more information on the LucasArts and Nintendo projects or tell us why you believe both will not be released. Achim Moller seemed pretty confident that they will hit the shelves.
If they have a game that have a publisher,will be released this year and wasn't been announced i think that nintendo is confirmed,i dont know any other company that announce games 2-3 months prior the release.
That's what I think. Like I said, I don't exactly know how LLCs work in the US, but a GmbH works pretty much like this: In a best case scenario, the GmbH owns nothing. Everything that's bought, acquired or invented gets assigned to another entity, be it a person or an independent company. If the GmbH goes down, the owners only lose the initial deposit required to found a GmbH, usually 25,000. And that's it. Regardless of what the company owes anyone. The owners could be millionaires, they wouldn't have to pay jack, and they'd keep all the IP. They would be free to cough up another 25,000 to found a new GmbH and continue, without any obligations whatsoever.laserbeam said:
EatChildren
Currently polling second in Australia's federal election (first in the Gold Coast), this feral may one day be your Bogan King.
Shiggy said:
I thought their last, and ultimately cancelled, Rogue Squadron game was that Xbox multiplayer title and port of the three Rogue Squardon games.
Honestly, I'm just really skeptical anything will come out of anybody resembling Factor 5. If Factor 5 / White Harvest have two Wii titles expected to hit by the end of the year, why have they not been announced? It's mid September. There's still time, but you'd think they'd want to drum up some public interest, especially considering company difficulties and the guarentied attention from a new Rogue Squadron.
Ninja Moomin
Banned
Dreamwriter said:
or imagine if they didn't have to wrestle with quaint technology and the engine made it easy to design the game.
being too tech focused has a downside.
EatChildren said:
It's not Factor 5 that decides when to present a game. When Factor 5 USA closed, Achim Moller said that projects will be revealed in the coming months. At least Nintendo is known for announcing games only a few days before release. Their two latest projects were Rogue Squadron for LucasArts (see lawsuit) and Pilotwings for Nintendo (see leaked assets and DMA list), in addition to a port for EA which was only started when WhiteHarvest was already founded.
Still, I assume that Rogue Squadron will be published by LucasArts while Nintendo will no longer publish the flight project. Achim Moller says that one game has a publisher and the other one does not. Changing a Star Wars game into a "neutral" franchise is much more difficult than trying that with a Pilotwings title.
White Harvest LLC seems to employ only a handful of people nowadays, it might be that they are more or less done with their projects. Until finding a new project, they may keep only a few employees. Closing White Harvest would probably also mean a closure of Factor 5 GmbH.
EatChildren
Currently polling second in Australia's federal election (first in the Gold Coast), this feral may one day be your Bogan King.
Shiggy said:
So, what, the Pilot Wings-esque game is the one with the publisher, or Rogue Squadron? I'm figuring the former, with them reworking content for the new publisher, as it seems the most likely reason to not have it announced yet.
I just don't see why a hypothetical Rogue Squadron Wii game, practically complete and published by LucasArts, would still be under wraps if launching this year. They were definitely working on it, but I'm under the impression it's dead.
EatChildren said:
I'd say Rogue Squadron is the one with the publisher. Both Wii projects are not dead, Achim Moller just reconfirmed that both are to be finished this year. I cannot answer the other question though as I don't know it; I also don't think that either of the games will be released this year.
Blackbird|
Banned
Blackbird|
Banned
Done
Blackbird|
Banned
Things have changed since our last Factor 5 feature.
In May 2009, Achim Moller, CEO of the German Factor 5 GmbH, officially announced the closure of the San Rafael branch of Factor 5. "The continuation of operations" proved to be impossible, citing "the sudden bankruptcy of Brash Entertainment" as a reason. Debts of the San Rafael based studio had increased due to outstanding payments by Brash. Still Factor 5 did have other investors; they did not only work on Superman, which was internally known as "Blue Steel".
Nintendo and LucasArts were their other two major partners. Both publishers were afraid that Factor 5 could use their money for paying off debts instead of using it for game development. There was the danger of Factor 5 shutting down without delivering any of titles.
The heads of Factor 5 had to find a solution, they did not want to lay off their remaining employees and lose their contracts with Nintendo and LucasArts or any of their own assets.
That is where the German branch came to help. Assets of Factor 5 Inc. (US branch) including Turrican, Katakis and Denaris were all transferred to Factor 5 GmbH in Germany. Factor 5 GmbH was founded by Achim Moller, who was part of the original Factor 5 but did not relocate when the team moved from Germany to the US in 1995. In 2002, however, decreasing costs of fast internet connections and a high data volume allowed him to work for his former studio again. His first project was a port of the DivX player for the Nintendo GameCube, after that the studio in Cologne worked on the VFX in Star Wars Rogue Squadron III.
"Although we are saddened by Factor 5 Inc.'s situation, our corporation will remain unaffected by these developments." One could get the impression that Factor 5 GmbH was entirely independent and that they had always owned Turrican and other Factor 5 properties. Anyhow, this is not the case. Factor 5 GmbH had never developed a game on their own as they consisted of only a handful of employees until now.
Pilotwings
Having resolved issues related to Factor 5 Inc.-owned assets, there still was the problem of losing support of Nintendo or LucasArts. Factor 5 GmbH did not have the capacities to develop their titles unless some US employees would have relocated back to Germany (which they certainly did not want to). But they also found a solution for this issue. The remaining US employees moved to a new studio: BlueHarvest LLC, soon to be renamed as WhiteHarvest LLC. Nintendo and LucasArts gave the permission to work on Factor 5 Inc. titles to Factor 5 GmbH which licensed development of both of their Wii titles to WhiteHarvest LLC, which was founded immediately after Factor 5 Inc.'s closure in December 2008. One of their games was a new entry in the Rogue Squadron series, internally codenamed as Blue Harvest, the other one was a new Pilotwings title for Nintendo. In February 2009, WhiteHarvest LLC and Factor 5 GmbH pulled another coup: Electronic Arts contracted them for a third Wii title. Despite other reports, this was not a conversion of their cancelled PS3/Xbox 360 title Superman. It was a Wii conversion of Double Fine Productions' Brütal Legend. WhiteHarvest LLC rehired several former Factor 5 employees to manage work on all three projects.
Double Fine's Brütal Legend
Bad news did not arrive until a lawsuit hit the company. Laid off Factor 5 staff and debtors noticed that the studio transferred assets to their German branch before filing bankruptcy to avoid paying any debts.
James Smith, a San Francisco lawyer representing the employees, put it in a nutshell:
"We believe and have alleged in the complaint that Factor 5 and White Harvest are essentially the same company, being run by the same people, being represented by the same sets of lawyers, with all the same management and ownership and control, performing all the same work that they were doing at Factor 5, just now with a new name and a new address."
Smith also stated that work on the new Rogue Squadron title and Pilotwings, which was done at Factor 5 Inc., was transferred to WhiteHarvest LLC. It must be noted that this was not unlawful. Work done on both projects had been property of LucasArts and Nintendo. Both companies could have transferred the work done at Factor 5 to any studio they may have wanted to. In this case it was WhiteHarvest LLC as their employees already knew the games.
At the end of June, Brütal Legend for Wii was cancelled. Technical and quality concerns were part of the decision, as Destructoid reported. These resulted from EA's desire to release Brütal Legend for Wii around the same time as the Double Fine version hit the shelves. Meeting these requirements was all but possible for WhiteHarvest LLC.
As a result of the failure of their EA project, WhiteHarvest LLC had to lay off most - if not all - of their employees in July. However, Achim Moller of Factor 5 GmbH recently assured that both of their other Wii titles could have been released in 2009, indicating that Rogue Squadron and Pilotwings have been finished. Moller admits, nonetheless, that Factor 5 is unsure whether both of these titles will see a release, suggesting that either Nintendo or LucasArts are not confident on publishing their Factor 5-developed game.
The future of Factor 5 may not look bright. But Moller is actively trying to find new projects for his studio. He wants to establish the recently founded Factor 5 Media Productions GmbH as a new German development studio which is no longer dependent on an US branch. Best of luck!
http://goneisgone.blogspot.com/
In May 2009, Achim Moller, CEO of the German Factor 5 GmbH, officially announced the closure of the San Rafael branch of Factor 5. "The continuation of operations" proved to be impossible, citing "the sudden bankruptcy of Brash Entertainment" as a reason. Debts of the San Rafael based studio had increased due to outstanding payments by Brash. Still Factor 5 did have other investors; they did not only work on Superman, which was internally known as "Blue Steel".
Nintendo and LucasArts were their other two major partners. Both publishers were afraid that Factor 5 could use their money for paying off debts instead of using it for game development. There was the danger of Factor 5 shutting down without delivering any of titles.
The heads of Factor 5 had to find a solution, they did not want to lay off their remaining employees and lose their contracts with Nintendo and LucasArts or any of their own assets.
That is where the German branch came to help. Assets of Factor 5 Inc. (US branch) including Turrican, Katakis and Denaris were all transferred to Factor 5 GmbH in Germany. Factor 5 GmbH was founded by Achim Moller, who was part of the original Factor 5 but did not relocate when the team moved from Germany to the US in 1995. In 2002, however, decreasing costs of fast internet connections and a high data volume allowed him to work for his former studio again. His first project was a port of the DivX player for the Nintendo GameCube, after that the studio in Cologne worked on the VFX in Star Wars Rogue Squadron III.
"Although we are saddened by Factor 5 Inc.'s situation, our corporation will remain unaffected by these developments." One could get the impression that Factor 5 GmbH was entirely independent and that they had always owned Turrican and other Factor 5 properties. Anyhow, this is not the case. Factor 5 GmbH had never developed a game on their own as they consisted of only a handful of employees until now.
Pilotwings
Having resolved issues related to Factor 5 Inc.-owned assets, there still was the problem of losing support of Nintendo or LucasArts. Factor 5 GmbH did not have the capacities to develop their titles unless some US employees would have relocated back to Germany (which they certainly did not want to). But they also found a solution for this issue. The remaining US employees moved to a new studio: BlueHarvest LLC, soon to be renamed as WhiteHarvest LLC. Nintendo and LucasArts gave the permission to work on Factor 5 Inc. titles to Factor 5 GmbH which licensed development of both of their Wii titles to WhiteHarvest LLC, which was founded immediately after Factor 5 Inc.'s closure in December 2008. One of their games was a new entry in the Rogue Squadron series, internally codenamed as Blue Harvest, the other one was a new Pilotwings title for Nintendo. In February 2009, WhiteHarvest LLC and Factor 5 GmbH pulled another coup: Electronic Arts contracted them for a third Wii title. Despite other reports, this was not a conversion of their cancelled PS3/Xbox 360 title Superman. It was a Wii conversion of Double Fine Productions' Brütal Legend. WhiteHarvest LLC rehired several former Factor 5 employees to manage work on all three projects.
Double Fine's Brütal Legend
Bad news did not arrive until a lawsuit hit the company. Laid off Factor 5 staff and debtors noticed that the studio transferred assets to their German branch before filing bankruptcy to avoid paying any debts.
James Smith, a San Francisco lawyer representing the employees, put it in a nutshell:
"We believe and have alleged in the complaint that Factor 5 and White Harvest are essentially the same company, being run by the same people, being represented by the same sets of lawyers, with all the same management and ownership and control, performing all the same work that they were doing at Factor 5, just now with a new name and a new address."
Smith also stated that work on the new Rogue Squadron title and Pilotwings, which was done at Factor 5 Inc., was transferred to WhiteHarvest LLC. It must be noted that this was not unlawful. Work done on both projects had been property of LucasArts and Nintendo. Both companies could have transferred the work done at Factor 5 to any studio they may have wanted to. In this case it was WhiteHarvest LLC as their employees already knew the games.
At the end of June, Brütal Legend for Wii was cancelled. Technical and quality concerns were part of the decision, as Destructoid reported. These resulted from EA's desire to release Brütal Legend for Wii around the same time as the Double Fine version hit the shelves. Meeting these requirements was all but possible for WhiteHarvest LLC.
As a result of the failure of their EA project, WhiteHarvest LLC had to lay off most - if not all - of their employees in July. However, Achim Moller of Factor 5 GmbH recently assured that both of their other Wii titles could have been released in 2009, indicating that Rogue Squadron and Pilotwings have been finished. Moller admits, nonetheless, that Factor 5 is unsure whether both of these titles will see a release, suggesting that either Nintendo or LucasArts are not confident on publishing their Factor 5-developed game.
The future of Factor 5 may not look bright. But Moller is actively trying to find new projects for his studio. He wants to establish the recently founded Factor 5 Media Productions GmbH as a new German development studio which is no longer dependent on an US branch. Best of luck!
http://goneisgone.blogspot.com/
Cosmonaut X
Member
Wow - so they were involved with Brutal Legend as well?
Still not entirely clear on what they were doing with PilotWings - did they initiate the project themselves and try to sell it to Nintendo, or was it given to them by Nintendo?
Still not entirely clear on what they were doing with PilotWings - did they initiate the project themselves and try to sell it to Nintendo, or was it given to them by Nintendo?
A new Rogue Squadron and Pilotwings would make Nintendo's holiday a whole lot better. Release them already!
I also don't understand why Nintendo hasn't bought Factor 5 yet. They must be a bargain at the moment and despite the failure of LAIR, the studio has a good track record.
I also don't understand why Nintendo hasn't bought Factor 5 yet. They must be a bargain at the moment and despite the failure of LAIR, the studio has a good track record.