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Final Fantasy XIV: Heavensward |OT3| Keniki Gauge Cost: 20,000

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Frumix

Suffering From Success
Oct 19, 2012
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I don't think this game exists just for the story, but I do feel that there's another factor that people aren't considering. Yes, it's a revolving door for a lot of people, but even so... is that entirely a bad thing? Obviously the ideal is to be able to retain subscribers and grow the population from expansion to expansion, sure. But with how competitive the space is and how much of a time investment MMOs are, that's a big ask. What if you also look at it from this perspective: If FFXIV did not offer the FF experience it does, how many of those people who buy in for the story would buy in at all? We're talking buying the game and expansions, maybe a 3 month or 6 month sub, and possible bringing a few friends with them for the ride. So after that maybe they leave until the next build up of content. Or maybe they never come back. But is that investment they made insignificant to contributing to FFXIV's success?

I don't have the receipts so I don't base my opinions around the bottom line.
 

Killthee

helped a brotha out on multiple separate occasions!
Jun 6, 2004
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So like... what is there to do at 60 besides raid?

Once I got my bard to 60 I geared up a bit to 240 ilevel through PVP/tomes and started leveling a few other jobs I was interested in.

Obviously things are about to change a bit, but I want to make sure that I want to make the commitment of buying SB.
PvP, story mode raids, savage mode raids, alliance raids, extreme primal, dungeons, diadem (no one does this), and side quest like Hildebrand.

Can also switch it up and lv crafting/gathering classes if you enjoy that or just take a break and come back for the next big story patch/expansion.
 

scy

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...and definitely makes me think about the long term nature of the content I've played and enjoyed.

I enjoy getting to actually discuss it since i find myself largely in a variety of minorities within the context of the game community / GAF. It's a big part of why I don't like the angle they took of "We cut a dungeon for other, possibly harder!, content!" rather than finding ways to honestly skimp on how they give me new niche content. It's why my focus on outlining new content is finding ways to reuse their existing content, say via the Minstrel!*, rather than creating something entirely brand-new and standalone from the ground-up. At no point do I want the addition of new content in the game to be approached as groups within the game competing against each other for a bigger slice of the pie; what I want, what you want, what the next guy wants, and so-on can all differ and it really should never become a case of us-vs-them.

*I am bothered so much that they have an in-game means to embellish content for the sake of it and they do not use it nearly enough.

I mean HW also had the really bad issue of 5 months between 3.0 and 3.1 and nearly 8 months until the next wing of the raid released, and they already said they don't want to repeat that at least. That alone was a huge blow to player retention.

This is a large part of why it frustrates me when the shiny "NEW" thing in an expansion is tucked away behind the next patch? Or cases like the content promised in early Heavensward (the squad stuff has been on the list since ARR!) and we're actually still waiting to see it get added come next expansion? It's not that common but it doesn't exactly bode well when things get shoved around release wise. I mean, look at poor Egi-glamours!

I don't think this game exists just for the story, but I do feel that there's another factor that people aren't considering. Yes, it's a revolving door for a lot of people, but even so... is that entirely a bad thing?

I mean, yes, it is kind of a bad thing as a symptom of sorts but it's not an end-of-the-world thing on it's own without that number dwindling over time; it's what leads to the question of how to keep more and more of them month-to-month while also not burning out people or causing people to feel too behind to ever resub or whatever else here. I do think a great strength of XIV in this is how easy it is to catch-up (sort of; you and a few others can sort of attest to it not being the smoothest ride through and through) and it's a part of the game they should keep building on. People should feel okay with coming and going as they please, just a greater incentive to stay subbed because they'd rather stay for the game and not out of feeling pressured to stay sub for the sake of keeping current.

So less a case of ignoring it but rather more about aiming for a bigger success; keep the people who do merely come around for the story or on a patch-by-patch basis but start working towards the next step of keeping them without hurting the bottom line. It's why I think the basically-gacha model to the limited flying mount campaign is a potentially sketchy area? Like, it starts to tuck away more limited content behind a paywall (a 3 month buy-in, too!). It's just a mount so maybe people won't care but we'll see, I guess.
 

Haly

One day I realized that sadness is just another word for not enough coffee.
Oct 10, 2006
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FFXIV is not WoW. Stop trying to make every mmo like wow, thanks.

As much as I agree with this sentiment in the general sense, 1.0 was not WoW, and it bombed. 2.0 only took off (and this is one of the greatest recoveries of a failing game in the history of the industry) because it ripped off WoW wholesale. So, maybe copying WoW is not the worst thing FFXIV can do to keep itself fresh for its own playerbase.

And what iammeiam is also saying that FFXIV is not doing enough to "go its own way" as it were. That it's in kind of a rut. That after evolving into 2.0, everything since then has been more or less 2.0+ rather than a genuine 3.0. What they did in SB with regards to revamping the combat can be seen as a small step towards a substantially different game, but it's just that, a small step. Other steps like, say, POTD, or Aquapolis, or WT, or whatever are similar in that while they present a new potential direction for the game, they exist only on the periphery of the core experience, and aren't really being iterated upon as far as we can see.
 

duckroll

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Jun 7, 2004
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It's why I think the basically-gacha model to the limited flying mount campaign is a potentially sketchy area? Like, it starts to tuck away more limited content behind a paywall (a 3 month buy-in, too!). It's just a mount so maybe people won't care but we'll see, I guess.

Wait wtf is this? Is it just a reference to how the Easter event gave away a free flying egg mount or was there some SB announcement I missed (I missed a lot because I was catching up on the game before reading in depth reports on the SB stuff.)?
 

Frumix

Suffering From Success
Oct 19, 2012
8,813
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Wait wtf is this? Is it just a reference to how the Easter event gave away a free flying egg mount or was there some SB announcement I missed (I missed a lot because I was catching up on the game before reading in depth reports on the SB stuff.)?

Being touted as the new alternative for Veteran Rewards, if you stay subbed for 90 days total during a certain TBD period you get a mount.
 

scy

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Jul 20, 2007
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Wait wtf is this? Is it just a reference to how the Easter event gave away a free flying egg mount or was there some SB announcement I missed (I missed a lot because I was catching up on the game before reading in depth reports on the SB stuff.)?

Granted, the more confusion at this makes me wonder if I'm wrong on it BUT they announced limited campaigns for rewards based on sub time (during the campaign period!) are replacing the Veteran Rewards system going forward. The first is a unique Falcon (airship) mount for subbing for 90+ days during the promotional period.

Edit: Just went back to the VOD for this:
 

duckroll

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Wait, replacing? Does this mean that my dream of subbing for years even if I don't play regularly, just to get a Wind-up Nanamo, is totally dead?
 

scy

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"Replacing" might be the wrong word; they're no longer adding to the Veteran Rewards from cumulative playtime. So those on that page I linked should be all the rewards you'll be able to get and the new limited-time campaigns are the new version of the rewards program. A lot will depend on how long of a time period these campaigns run (weeks? months? entire patch cycle? etc.). The cynic in me has them placed roughly 60 or 120 days apart so people are basically constantly subbing 3 months at a time for each campaign :|
 

Frumix

Suffering From Success
Oct 19, 2012
8,813
1
495
How is everyone (who is rolling Sam or red mage) going to level from 50-60?

35 Palace of the Dead runs is the only realistic option if you don't have a tank to get you instant dungeon queues, then that method may be slightly faster.

Fastest you can run PotD 51-60 with a competent group that goes for speed rather than exploration is 10-12 minutes which results in about 6 hours of grinding. If you get instant queues for dungeons and every dungeon run is within 20-22 minutes then that'll also result in approximately 6 hours (rested exp and buffed armory bonus taken into account). FATEs is not gonna be as efficient and PVP leveling efficiency remains to be seen but on first day nobody's gonna be queuing for PVP.
 

duckroll

Member
Jun 7, 2004
114,734
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"Replacing" might be the wrong word; they're no longer adding to the Veteran Rewards from cumulative playtime. So those on that page I linked should be all the rewards you'll be able to get and the new limited-time campaigns are the new version of the rewards program. A lot will depend on how long of a time period these campaigns run (weeks? months? entire patch cycle? etc.). The cynic in me has them placed roughly 60 or 120 days apart so people are basically constantly subbing 3 months at a time for each campaign :|

YAY MY NANAMO IS SAFE!
 

Haly

One day I realized that sadness is just another word for not enough coffee.
Oct 10, 2006
58,446
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People who are doing POTD, do you do 1-10 1-30 or 51-50?
51-60 can be fastest but it can go wrong at times.

51-60 is most time efficient. It's very rare that I wipe at that level (can happen more in the 80s), and I'll be doing it hopefully with Vanilla and who else we can get instead of randos.
 

duckroll

Member
Jun 7, 2004
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Wow, I mean, I understand the hatred for the status quo of the City States. But... Nanamo did nothing wrong... T_T
 

Slater

Banned
Oct 1, 2014
1,011
0
0
Wow, I mean, I understand the hatred for the status quo of the City States. But... Nanamo did nothing wrong... T_T
Because her fate in HW is the worst bit of writing in the game and a complete backdown asspull. That glaring mark of HW narrative is a very big wrong
 

Guess Who

Banned
Oct 21, 2012
10,408
1
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at least nanamo is trying to affect positive change in her shitty oligarchy

gridania's just crazy religious people who are scared of trees
 

duckroll

Member
Jun 7, 2004
114,734
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Because her fate in HW is the worst bit of writing in the game and a complete backdown asspull. That glaring mark of HW narrative is a very big wrong

Damn you people are awful. It wasn't even her fault!

at least nanamo is trying to affect positive change in her shitty oligarchy

gridania's just crazy religious people who are scared of trees

At least they have religious reasons. Limsa is literally a pirate's den. Run by pirates, for pirate. Pirates who oppress the beastmen and break their oaths. And their solution? KILL MORE BEASTMEN. Fuck em.
 

Slater

Banned
Oct 1, 2014
1,011
0
0
at least nanamo is trying to affect positive change in her shitty oligarchy

gridania's just crazy religious people who are scared of trees
Best boy Aymeric had to deal with a crazy religious theocracy and pulled it off like a champ, without using us as his errand boy for everything he needed to do either.

The lalafell failure can't say that
 

Foxxsoxx

Member
Dec 6, 2015
2,652
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PvP, story mode raids, savage mode raids, alliance raids, extreme primal, dungeons, diadem (no one does this), and side quest like Hildebrand.

Can also switch it up and lv crafting/gathering classes if you enjoy that or just take a break and come back for the next big story patch/expansion.


Mmm so not too much after the raids...

I'm guessing SB will be something I put in a month of play on and off per patch playing then.

That'll work for me. Thanks :)
 

encephalon

Member
Feb 19, 2010
6,089
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Can i get away with getting rid of my ps4 copy of heavensward before the expansion (i have prorderdered) comes out? It's not going to require my heavensward disc before i can install it, right?
 

duckroll

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Jun 7, 2004
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She will be the second to last boss in the games final raid content before it shuts down.

With Rowena as the true final battle

Is this the raid content where the merchants of Eorzea are conspiring to sell the planet out to interested aliens?
 

Sorian

Banned
Nov 18, 2012
22,401
0
0
I would absolutely love a Rowena heel turn storyline. They have to do some payoff after she's been collecting all this allagan tech for years.
 

QisTopTier

XisBannedTier
Jul 12, 2009
35,665
0
1,035
I would absolutely love a Rowena heel turn storyline. They have to do some payoff after she's been collecting all this allagan tech for years.

Khloe is just rowena's way of keeping track of how the warrior of light does combat and settles things

"Oh yes please tell me more INTERESTING stories, oh here are some grade 5 materia I found laying on the ground"
 
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