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Final Fantasy XIV: Heavensward |OT3| Keniki Gauge Cost: 20,000

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MechaX

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Jul 25, 2007
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I don't think it is?
If we are a Primal, none of the Hydaelyn stuff would make sense. Also, crystals don't vanish en masse as we walk around. :p

Well...
I think the distinction is that Eikons and Elder Primals like the Warring Triad, Odin, and Bahamut don't need crystals to sustain themselves, and may not need crystals to summon them either. Phoenix definitely didn't need crystals, but only a lot of prayer.

But yeah, it's still headcanon at this point though.
 

Anoregon

The flight plan I just filed with the agency list me, my men, Dr. Pavel here. But only one of you!
Jun 9, 2011
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Also I gotta say, even though he's a total mary sue I still like Aymeric. He's a bro.
 

duckroll

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Well...
I think the distinction is that Eikons and Elder Primals like the Warring Triad, Odin, and Bahamut don't need crystals to sustain themselves, and may not need crystals to summon them either. Phoenix definitely didn't need crystals, but only a lot of prayer.

But yeah, it's still headcanon at this point though.

Hmmm.
I haven't done the Warring Triad questline yet. I don't fully understand the distinction between Eikons, Primals, Elder Primals, whatever. I remember that Odin wasn't actually a Primal but rather the sword itself was some Primal-like immortal cursed thing that lures people in and turns them into Odin? Bahamut and Phoenix were kept alive entirely by prayer, yes. Which is interesting, but never fully explained. It is because the amount of faith generated made crystals redundant? Or is there some other factor?
 

Aeana

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Jul 10, 2006
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When's the SB OT going up? Thursday? Friday? I won't be able to make it for the FC's Goodbye Heavensward, but we're doing a Hello Stormblood this weekend too right?

Once early access is on, people will forget they even know you as they race for the cap.
 

Squishy3

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Sep 1, 2013
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And for the record I don't remember there being a rash of people out to ruin people's MSQ fun at HW launch, and more to the point the people who want to run around blasting spoilers everywhere are going to be the people who don't listen to Yoshida. All the request accomplished was getting the non-story stuff yanked from everywhere and a lot of hilarious misplaced indignation on both sides.
Judging by what they've been doing regarding those leaked notes (Reddit's been taking them down, but also now any imgur posts of them have been disappearing) that anything datamined appearing on anything remotely popular (imgur, reddit, tumblr, etc.) will just disappear.

Well...
I think the distinction is that Eikons and Elder Primals like the Warring Triad, Odin, and Bahamut don't need crystals to sustain themselves, and may not need crystals to summon them either. Phoenix definitely didn't need crystals, but only a lot of prayer.

But yeah, it's still headcanon at this point though.
Coil spoilers:
Phoenix was summoned by using all the aether they gathered to try to stop Dalamud (this was a ritual designed to summon the power of the Twelve but not the Twelve themselves) and the binding failed and Louisoix took the aether used into himself to become Phoenix. He then relinquished the aether at the end so he wouldn't continue to exist and drain aether from the world, but was made into a thrall by Bahamut as he was relinquishing the power, causing him to continue to exist. The Warring Triad etc. still need to consume aether to exist, they're purely spiritual beings, and everything needs aether to exist. A primal/Eikon's don't generate aether so they can't sustain themselves as I understand it, so they need to drain it from their surroundings. And the Warring Triad were so powerful (We didn't fight them at their full strength, either, as they'd been imprisoned for centuries) they could drain the planet dry very quickly.
 

scy

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Judging by what they've been doing regarding those leaked notes (Reddit's been taking them down, but also now any imgur posts of them have been disappearing) that anything datamined appearing on anything remotely popular (imgur, reddit, tumblr, etc.) will just disappear.

This is kind of disgusting :|
 
Mar 3, 2011
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Hmmm.
I haven't done the Warring Triad questline yet. I don't fully understand the distinction between Eikons, Primals, Elder Primals, whatever. I remember that Odin wasn't actually a Primal but rather the sword itself was some Primal-like immortal cursed thing that lures people in and turns them into Odin? Bahamut and Phoenix were kept alive entirely by prayer, yes. Which is interesting, but never fully explained. It is because the amount of faith generated made crystals redundant? Or is there some other factor?

HW spoilers

I'm pretty sure Primals constantly drain aether from the surrounding area once active to sustain themselves after the initial summoning which is why letting them go about on their own is dangerous. I think dudes like Thordan pope were a bit different since in his case he had the sword as the source of aether.
 

Ken

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May 27, 2010
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When's the SB OT going up? Thursday? Friday? I won't be able to make it for the FC's Goodbye Heavensward, but we're doing a Hello Stormblood this weekend too right?

Probably sometime after the game goes down for maintenance/when I remember.
 
Sep 11, 2007
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I don't think it is?
If we are a Primal, none of the Hydaelyn stuff would make sense. Also, crystals don't vanish en masse as we walk around. :p

I don't know your case, but I have a lot of crystal clusters with me!

Also Shinryu, wasn't summoned with crystals but rather the energy (aether)
of Nidhogg's eyes? I don't know, it seems that as long you have an energy source Primals can maintain their presence, my guess is the Haedylyn itself that provides our source of energy to maintain our pressence?
 

iammeiam

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Judging by what they've been doing regarding those leaked notes (Reddit's been taking them down, but also now any imgur posts of them have been disappearing) that anything datamined appearing on anything remotely popular (imgur, reddit, tumblr, etc.) will just disappear.

Yeah, the subreddit turning into a fansite over area for discussion has been a thing lately, so it's disappointing but not a shock. It'll be further disappointing if the big data sites like Garlond Tools also keep the lights out, especially if the patch notes are as detail-light as the final 3.0 notes were.

Like, they've been hyping up the combat changes forever. They had a media preview info dump that we're not allowed to judge anything by. They had a live letter we're not allowed to judge anything by. They were asked giant job-direction changes and said they couldn't answer because then other people would have questions. At this point we have to wait for live, and it would be awesome to be able to decide which job I level first based on actual information about the job with some reliability behind it. But it'll be sparse information out of respect for their request, which won't even stop 4Chan from blasting "Snape Kills Thancred" all over the place if it's what they feel like.
 

Guess Who

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Oct 21, 2012
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Yeah, the subreddit turning into a fansite over area for discussion has been a thing lately, so it's disappointing but not a shock. It'll be further disappointing if the big data sites like Garlond Tools also keep the lights out, especially if the patch notes are as detail-light as the final 3.0 notes were.

Like, they've been hyping up the combat changes forever. They had a media preview info dump that we're not allowed to judge anything by. They had a live letter we're not allowed to judge anything by. They were asked giant job-direction changes and said they couldn't answer because then other people would have questions. At this point we have to wait for live, and it would be awesome to be able to decide which job I level first based on actual information about the job with some reliability behind it. But it'll be sparse information out of respect for their request, which won't even stop 4Chan from blasting "Snape Kills Thancred" all over the place if it's what they feel like.

to be fair, thancred probably deserved it
 

Toth

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Jan 27, 2010
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I don't know your case, but I have a lot of crystal clusters with me!

Also Shinryu, wasn't summoned with crystals but rather the energy (aether)
of Nidhogg's eyes? I don't know, it seems that as long you have an energy source Primals can't maintain their presence, my guess is the Haedylyn itself that provides our source of energy to maintain our pressence?

This is what I am alluding to. We
are clearly not 'normal' humans and the story has stressed several times that Primal are sustained by the prayers of their faithful. There is a complete lack of background info on us (we just sorta appear) and the strange everyone-forgetting what we looked like during our absence
 

dramatis

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May 28, 2008
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I am feeling those Vietnamese glamours though.

One of the things I hoped SE would do was pull from the whole Asian board of fashions. Not only are there contemporary traditional outfits, there's a lot of funky historical fashion to grab from.
 

Squishy3

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Sep 1, 2013
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Yeah, the subreddit turning into a fansite over area for discussion has been a thing lately, so it's disappointing but not a shock. It'll be further disappointing if the big data sites like Garlond Tools also keep the lights out, especially if the patch notes are as detail-light as the final 3.0 notes were.

Like, they've been hyping up the combat changes forever. They had a media preview info dump that we're not allowed to judge anything by. They had a live letter we're not allowed to judge anything by. They were asked giant job-direction changes and said they couldn't answer because then other people would have questions. At this point we have to wait for live, and it would be awesome to be able to decide which job I level first based on actual information about the job with some reliability behind it. But it'll be sparse information out of respect for their request, which won't even stop 4Chan from blasting "Snape Kills Thancred" all over the place if it's what they feel like.
Hezkezl posted about what he's gonna datamine out, and separate it into two separate threads (so people don't need to see things they don't want to see.)

https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/comments/6gstjs/a_reminder_to_dataminers/disuhgz/?context=3

This is what I am alluding to. We
are clearly not 'normal' humans and the story has stressed several times that Primal are sustained by the prayers of their faithful. There is a complete lack of background info on us (we just sorta appear) and the strange everyone-forgetting what we looked like during our absence
That has nothing to do with anything regarding the nature of the WoL, everyone's memories about what happened during the Calamity are hazy.
 

Anoregon

The flight plan I just filed with the agency list me, my men, Dr. Pavel here. But only one of you!
Jun 9, 2011
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I wonder if I'll have a last minute change of heart on Friday and go samurai instead of redmage. I'll have to watch some videos to decide.
 

Valonquar

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Jun 27, 2013
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This is what I am alluding to. We
are clearly not 'normal' humans and the story has stressed several times that Primal are sustained by the prayers of their faithful. There is a complete lack of background info on us (we just sorta appear) and the strange everyone-forgetting what we looked like during our absence

Lore team:
 

MechaX

Member
Jul 25, 2007
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Judging by what they've been doing regarding those leaked notes (Reddit's been taking them down, but also now any imgur posts of them have been disappearing) that anything datamined appearing on anything remotely popular (imgur, reddit, tumblr, etc.) will just disappear.

Coil spoilers:
Phoenix was summoned by using all the aether they gathered to try to stop Dalamud (this was a ritual designed to summon the power of the Twelve but not the Twelve themselves) and the binding failed and Louisoix took the aether used into himself to become Phoenix. He then relinquished the aether at the end so he wouldn't continue to exist and drain aether from the world, but was made into a thrall by Bahamut as he was relinquishing the power, causing him to continue to exist. The Warring Triad etc. still need to consume aether to exist, they're purely spiritual beings, and everything needs aether to exist. A primal/Eikon's don't generate aether so they can't sustain themselves as I understand it, so they need to drain it from their surroundings. And the Warring Triad were so powerful (We didn't fight them at their full strength, either, as they'd been imprisoned for centuries) they could drain the planet dry very quickly.

2.3/HW Spoilers:
True, I believe that Leviathan absorbing the aether of his priest and Ramuh were the first hint that all types of Primals may need something to sustain themselves even if it's not in the form of crystals. In Bahamut's case, siphoning aether would have been completely detrimental to what Xande was trying to do with the Crystal Tower, so why not just have dragons in stasis fueling him for eternity through prayer? Although, we know that summoning and maintaining an Eikon is a bit different than what the Ascians were doing with the beast tribes in telling them "get a shit load of crystals and then you're good." Ysale learned this the hard way when she not only transformed with a deficit of crystals, but could not maintain her form against Ravana for too long and lamented that she needed more crystals.

Although, have introduced some alternate methods such as using Nidhogg's eyes as batteries for Shinryu, etc.

But it's all going to come back to using too much of the planet's aether. Alexander himself noted that in all attempts to do great things like beating Bahamut on his own, he always fucks up the planet eventually.
 

dramatis

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May 28, 2008
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Maybe they shouldn't have slowly creeped in so many Eastern gear designs before the Eastern expansion!
Stop watching just slice of life modern dramas and watch some costume drama crap, you'll see there's plenty of room to design
 

HelloNewman

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May 25, 2016
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So for people switching to Red Mage have you got your glamours picked out? I'm having a hard time finding anything the red dyes are terrible.
 

Mr Croft

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Has anyone else pre-ordered on ps4 i don't see the file installed. (I barely know how to work this console) I also didn't get an early access code is it not available for ps4 or did I just not receive it?
 

Guess Who

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Oct 21, 2012
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So for people switching to Red Mage have you got your glamours picked out? I'm having a hard time finding anything the red dyes are terrible.

Dalamud Red can look good on the right gear, but on some things it's just too saturated. Wine Red is a good "deeper" red, I think.
 
Nov 29, 2011
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Has anyone else pre-ordered on ps4 i don't see the file installed. (I barely know how to work this console) I also didn't get an early access code is it not available for ps4 or did I just not receive it?

It is definitely available for PS4 cause when i registered my access code it gives you an option if you want to play on pc or PS4 for early access on the se website
 

Bowlie

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Dec 29, 2014
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Pre-ordered Stormblood, bought 60 days and transferred my character to Ultros o7

Next time I'm in I'll submit an application for the FC, my name's Sazh Katzroy.
 

Mr Croft

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It is definitely available for PS4 cause when i registered my access code it gives you an option if you want to play on pc or PS4 for early access on the se website

I did purchase it from the Sony store. Was I not supposed to do that? I have not received anything and I will be a little upset if I miss early access. But I guess it would have been my own fault.
 
Mar 3, 2011
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An interesting post I found on reddit.

its not a garbage system, but it's still far from perfect.
Despite the variety of content that awards tomes, the largest reward has always been tied to Expert roulette, but if you did one expert roulette a day it still takes 5/6 days of the roulette to cap. That very quickly begins to feel like a chore, because an ex roulette has never featured more than 3 dungeons in its rotation; which you have to repeat ad nauseum for 3 months+ to finish even one set of tome gear with the capped currency. And this has realistically been the goal/target for non-raiding players for every even numbered patch since 2.x.
I also think it doesn't help that, similarly, massive amounts of tome farming was required for the Anima weapon; the most efficient way to farm in most of those instances being to run ARF X number of times, since it had the best reward of time -> tomes.
Is there an argument that people do this to themselves? Absolutely. But where I'd argue the current system is flawed is that, for all the variety of things rewarding tomes, there is hardly ever anything competitive with dungeons for their time spent:tomes rewarded ratio, and it's been that way for 4 years.
 

rubius01

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May 26, 2012
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I am feeling those Vietnamese glamours though.

One of the things I hoped SE would do was pull from the whole Asian board of fashions. Not only are there contemporary traditional outfits, there's a lot of funky historical fashion to grab from.



I was kinda hoping they would take more from the Middle East or Central Asia for their fashon designs then from the Far East.
 

Caim

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Feb 10, 2015
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I did purchase it from the Sony store. Was I not supposed to do that? I have not received anything and I will be a little upset if I miss early access. But I guess it would have been my own fault.

On PSN (assuming thats what you meant by Sony store) it should be automatic I went full digital on HW and SB and haven't put any codes in. According to the PSN store it won't start downloading until sometime today/tonight.

Nothing gets registered to your SE account until SB downloads to your system and you log in during EA which then it will register on the mog station.
 

SaintGalgo

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Jul 31, 2013
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The noct AST shield nerf is a solid indicator that sensible potency rebalancing has continued, but I'm curious how widespread it is. And, of course, WHM in general.

The funny thing is that Noct AST being overpowered was the last sliver of hope I had for the competitiveness of WHM.
Mostly because it would be hilarious.
 

dramatis

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I was kinda hoping they would take more from the Middle East or Central Asia for their fashon designs then from the Far East.
They have, I think.

In one of the areas showcased in the Tour of the East, there's a Mongolian-ish (maybe?) vibe to the architecture and clothing, though the clothing was harder to see since it was at a distance.
 

Wagram

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Jul 11, 2013
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I think it's heavily implied that
we, the players, are a Primal summoned by the planet and substained by the prayers and thoughts of the people we save

Hydaelyn and Zodiark both summon champions (player character and Ascian respectively) in times of need. Hyadelyn in particular summons Warriors of Light on the cusp of every calamity in an effort to stop the calamity itself and in turn the rejoining of the reflections.
 

iammeiam

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The funny thing is that Noct AST being overpowered was the last sliver of hope I had for the competitiveness of WHM.
Mostly because it would be hilarious.

At some point they have to give WHM something, and on that day Scholars will finally know what it means to be the also-ran healer. Believe.

I'm still waiting on Earthly Star and Balance pics from E3, because those two making it in unscathed are still going to put AST at insanely good levels.
 

Mr Croft

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On PSN (assuming thats what you meant by Sony store) it should be automatic I went full digital on HW and SB and haven't put any codes in. According to the PSN store it won't start downloading until sometime today/tonight.

Nothing gets registered to your SE account until SB downloads to your system and you log in during EA which then it will register on the mog station.

Thanks for the help and clarification. I was about to have a nervous breakdown I already took Friday and Monday off of work
 

HelloNewman

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May 25, 2016
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So is there a reason SE doesn't post patch notes until the day before? And is there an embargo for E3 gameplay or is there just nothing to show?
 

Ken

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So is there a reason SE doesn't post patch notes until the day before? And is there an embargo for E3 gameplay or is there just nothing to show?

So people don't scramble to take advantage of knowing the specifics of what's coming while the game is up!
 

Allard

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Feb 2, 2010
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So is there a reason SE doesn't post patch notes until the day before? And is there an embargo for E3 gameplay or is there just nothing to show?

According to Yoshida they aren't finished writing it, its not much of a historical precedant since we have only ever had one other expansion release before but HW did have a preliminary patch notes 3-4 days before, for whatever reason they didn't manage to release it on time this time. There is no embargo for E3 gameplay as far as I can tell.
 

Haly

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Oct 10, 2006
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So people don't scramble to take advantage of knowing the specifics of what's coming while the game is up!

God forbid people have an idea of what they want to do.
 

Ken

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May 27, 2010
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God forbid people have an idea of what they want to do.

I mean, people usually do but the super specifics like x y z item being used in a new recipe or relic step are held back till full notes, afaik.
 

iammeiam

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I linked them earlier, but friendly reminder that the 3.0 patch notes told us nothing specific. And actually looking at them I no longer care that we don't get prelim notes because eh. Datamining or bust.


Here's the item section:
[2.0][3.0] New items have been added.




* Due to the volume of items added with the release of patch 3.0, they will not be listed in the patch notes.

[2.0][3.0] New recipes have been added.




* Due to the volume of recipes added with the release of patch 3.0, they will not be listed in the patch notes.

[3.0] New master recipe books have been added.
[2.0] New recipes have been added to the previously existing master recipe books.
If a player has already used these master recipe books, the recipes will be automatically added to the crafting log upon the release of patch 3.0.

such spoilers, much market volatility.

(also 'protecting the market' is a weird defense given that it just means the people who exploit the information are 'whoever can log in the second servers go up', instead of 'whoever is logged in when notes go up'; but whatever, I don't care as much about that part as that I don't think the market factors into the 4.0 notes much)
 
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