Final Round XVII - 2014 Fighting Game Tournament - March 14th - 16th

enzo_gt

tagged by Blackace
What are the odds we finally find out what that Capcom Cabs shit was all about?

I'm still thinking it's a Capcom Arcade Cabinet update with all the Street Fighters included: I, II and all its variations, III and all its variations, and the Alphas.
Hadouken Cabs? I think that's way too much to expect, especially considering how much stuff they'd have to port properly and maybe even get licensing together.

I think if you want to align it with other stuff, it'd be a USF4 PS4 announcement, but I think people have been reading way too much into purported hints for SF4 coming to PS4.
 
I talked to MarkMan on the phone and he said that Larry and Eric both said that it won't be allowed for use tomorrow.
Huh.

That's not going to look great.

Hadouken Cabs? I think that's way too much to expect, especially considering how much stuff they'd have to port properly and maybe even get licensing together.
What would they have to license for straight up Street Fighter games? Are there characters in the Alpha series that I'm forgetting about that would necessitate Capcom having to secure rights?

Porting would take awhile, yeah - but it's been quite awhile since that weird-ass ad hit the internet anyway, and I'd imagine they wouldn't have made the ad if they hadn't had something in the pipeline for awhile.

Although I do recognize that Hadouken Cabs referencing USF4 makes a ton of sense. Kinda. However much sense anything related to that ad can make :)
 
Whenever changes like this happen, it does seem to matter who wants it to happen. Like SF4 isn't going back to standard arcade controls because top players have moved on from that. Reminds me of going back and forth on macros in SC4. Hilde was a lot tamer without the macros, and at the time I thought there was no point in banning her as long as people used standard controls. But it seemed like a lot of people wanted macros + Hilde banned. Makes you wonder if games should be balanced around non-standard control schemes as well...
 
I am pretty sure FChamp is super salty that Full Schedule a near full screen Plasma Beam with the Viper ball tech. He has probably never been hit by that before and certainly no one has done that stuff before in a real match. I made a mention of it as soon as it happened.

Full Schedule was definitely doing stuff that most Vipers weren't doing before, like with his Seismo cancels and Viper ball stuff + mix ups.

If they allow Daigo and company to rewire their sticks for the Select Plink button then I see no problem with this to be honest.

In the grand scheme of things, this is less game influencing than using macros for plink dashing in MVC3. I guess the difference is that the game itself does not allow you to map up/forward in one button like they can with L+M+H.

That said I still have to give credit to a guy who plays Marvel 3 with 10 buttons.
I think the opportunity should be taken then to re-examine how these input devices are considered, because the way it is being enforced in this case - in my opinion - is just a receipt of how it has not been given enough thought.

Take the case of analog sticks on game pads being used. An analog stick certainly does not require input blending to create diagonal inputs (or any directional inputs) the way a microswitch device does, yet we allow players to use these freely.

Really what I think it comes down to is that the rule being applied this way is sort of a mandate that arcade stick gates use only 4 microswitches to create directional inputs, because the argument against the button seems to be that up-right is technically two inputs, even though on a stick it is one motion. This currently is not true for other allowed forms of directional input - there are certainly defined diagonal inputs on directional pads and analog sticks have an enormous amount of possible input values and just uses ranged to determine what individual inputs to send.

I would probably just move to eliminate directional inputs from individual buttons altogether, and require directional inputs to come from a dedicated part of the hardware which could be further defined within the rules (joystick, analog stick, directional pad). This way you can separate the question of whether it is acceptable to allow directional inputs as single binary button actions, separating the abstract question from the mechanical issues.
 
Whenever changes like this happen, it does seem to matter who wants it to happen. Like SF4 isn't going back to standard arcade controls because top players have moved on from that. Reminds me of going back and forth on macros in SC4. Hilde was a lot tamer without the macros, and at the time I thought there was no point in banning her as long as people used standard controls. But it seemed like a lot of people wanted macros + Hilde banned. Makes you wonder if games should be balanced around non-standard control schemes as well...
SC4 had no arcade version, so there was no standard control scheme.

Folks have used keyboard controls at Evo before. (very rare) Are those going to be banned now?
 
I always felt majors should be like the old arcades- no BYOC- you use what they have, like unmodded Qanbas or TEs.

(Tekken players would be upset)

Back in the old days- you had to do weam up casuals so you could understand the quirks of the stick in an arcade tourney, because sometimes they were unreliable.

Some of the issue is also the game itself- in the case of folks having auto-select plink on their sticks, always felt Capcom should have put auto-plink in by default in AE, let alone Ultra.
I think this is a bad idea. Didn't everybody have to use those shitty official MK sticks at the MK9 national?

People have different preferences, depending on what you learned on.

I'm sure japan players didn't want to play on our happ stuff and vice versa back in the arcade heyday. Didn't we give daigo a japan set up during A3 nationals?

Unless its an arcade only tournament. I guess then we all gotta roll with it.
 
I think this is a bad idea. Didn't everybody have to use those shitty official MK sticks at the MK9 national?

People have different preferences, depending on what you learned on.

I'm sure japan players didn't want to play on our happ stuff and vice versa back in the arcade heyday. Didn't we give daigo a japan set up during A3 nationals?

Unless its an arcade only tournament. I guess then we all gotta roll with it.
Galloping Ghost Arcade in Chicago had a UMvC3 cabinet. I was pumped to get a legit arcade experience with the game until I touched the stick. It was so goddamn stiff; I could hardly trijump. I only played a match against the AI before leaving it.

The drama was fun because the decision was up in the air but now that Larry, MarkMan and Mr. Wizard are all in agreement, it's going to be banned tomorrow.
They aren't the drama, though. Champ and Neo vs. Fullschedule is.
 

enzo_gt

tagged by Blackace
I would imagine it's a Sony deal, so some stipulations might come up and all that.
I don't think whatever they're using currently at a tournament bears any weight on some paid PR space for an announcement. I can't see any reason that could matter for Sony, Capcom, or people watching. Sony isn't stingy about exclusives either. Hell, even Microsoft isn't that particular.

This is also working under the assumption it won't come to X1 either.
 
Does anyone know how good FullSchedule is with an OG stick though? I doubt he'll perform anywhere as good as he was today.

They aren't the drama, though. Champ and Neo vs. Fullschedule is.
But the drama is caused by the stick. Now that FullSchedule doesn't have his stick, I doubt he'll play as good with an OG stick.
 
The drama was fun because the decision was up in the air but now that Larry, MarkMan and Mr. Wizard are all in agreement, it's going to be banned tomorrow and the drama is over.
Nah, people going to complain favoritism. I mean, auto-select plink sticks have been known about and used for year.

If you ban this, that should be banned as well (though the hard part is you can't see/prove who has those)
 
I honestly can't believe that he is not being allowed to play on that stick tomorrow on it. The TOs and MrWizard should've copped to their mistake and let it slide for that tournament. To think this wouldn't be an issue if a few top players hadn't lost some games. No one would've given a crap if FChamp had won that game.

Almost as bad as when EVO switched to 3/5 pools in the middle of the day.
 
I honestly can't believe that he is not being allowed to play on that stick tomorrow on it. The TOs and MrWizard should've copped to their mistake and let it slide for that tournament. To think this wouldn't be an issue if a few top players hadn't lost some games. No one would've given a crap if FChamp had won that game.

Almost as bad as when EVO switched to 3/5 pools in the middle of the day.
I have zero say in this one. This is Larry's call, not mine.
 
I honestly can't believe that he is not being allowed to play on that stick tomorrow on it. The TOs and MrWizard should've copped to their mistake and let it slide for that tournament. To think this wouldn't be an issue if a few top players hadn't lost some games. No one would've given a crap if FChamp had won that game.

Almost as bad as when EVO switched to 3/5 pools in the middle of the day.
Did the TO make a mistake though? I could understand if it is EVO, but if the FR TO just learned about it, they should be free to make the call.

I do however agree he should be able to play with it, because that would be much, much funnier.
 
I honestly can't believe that he is not being allowed to play on that stick tomorrow on it. The TOs and MrWizard should've copped to their mistake and let it slide for that tournament. To think this wouldn't be an issue if a few top players hadn't lost some games. No one would've given a crap if FChamp had won that game.

Almost as bad as when EVO switched to 3/5 pools in the middle of the day.
Also, folks are going to say if it was a top player, they would have let it slide. TO's can't win either way on this.
 

enzo_gt

tagged by Blackace
I'm not feeling letting someone play through most of a tournament with a stick, and then making them play without it for the rest of the tournament, especially after being under the assumption from authorities that it was acceptable; where the error in judgment admittedly rested on their hands instead of Full Schedule's.

IMO they should let it rock tmmro and then ban it from there afterwards. Seems kind of scummy to change up on a player once they've made it this far through being told it was okay.

EDIT: Dahbomb basically said what I said but started typing earlier.
 
I honestly can't believe that he is not being allowed to play on that stick tomorrow on it. The TOs and MrWizard should've copped to their mistake and let it slide for that tournament. To think this wouldn't be an issue if a few top players hadn't lost some games. No one would've given a crap if FChamp had won that game.

Almost as bad as when EVO switched to 3/5 pools in the middle of the day.
+1 @everything but mostly at the bolded part.

EDIT: Plus this:
IMO they should let it rock tmmro and then ban it from there afterwards. Seems kind of scummy to change up on a player once they've made it this far through being told it was okay.
 
I honestly can't believe that he is not being allowed to play on that stick tomorrow on it. The TOs and MrWizard should've copped to their mistake and let it slide for that tournament. To think this wouldn't be an issue if a few top players hadn't lost some games. No one would've given a crap if FChamp had won that game.

Almost as bad as when EVO switched to 3/5 pools in the middle of the day.
Like Wizard says, he doesn't have any say in it overall. He just spoke with Shinblanka about it because his name was brought up.

I do agree that he should be allowed to rock the rest of the tournament with it and then no dice for future ones.
 
I honestly can't believe that he is not being allowed to play on that stick tomorrow on it. The TOs and MrWizard should've copped to their mistake and let it slide for that tournament. To think this wouldn't be an issue if a few top players hadn't lost some games. No one would've given a crap if FChamp had won that game.

Almost as bad as when EVO switched to 3/5 pools in the middle of the day.
For real. If the top players complain, they get their way.

Shouldn't ban the stick halfway through the tourney. Deal with it then move on from there.
 
I honestly can't believe that he is not being allowed to play on that stick tomorrow on it. The TOs and MrWizard should've copped to their mistake and let it slide for that tournament. To think this wouldn't be an issue if a few top players hadn't lost some games. No one would've given a crap if FChamp had won that game.

Almost as bad as when EVO switched to 3/5 pools in the middle of the day.
Really? They said he can't use it tomorrow...?
 
I honestly can't believe that he is not being allowed to play on that stick tomorrow on it. The TOs and MrWizard should've copped to their mistake and let it slide for that tournament. To think this wouldn't be an issue if a few top players hadn't lost some games. No one would've given a crap if FChamp had won that game.

Almost as bad as when EVO switched to 3/5 pools in the middle of the day.
I forgot about that 3/5 switch during EVO in the middle of the day.That was such a huge screw up.

Really? They said he can't use it tomorrow...?
Yup, MarkMan, Larry (ShinBlanka) and Mr. Wizard decided it should be banned. According to Mr. Wizard, it was Larry who decided that he should be banned starting tomorrow.
 
I honestly can't believe that he is not being allowed to play on that stick tomorrow on it. The TOs and MrWizard should've copped to their mistake and let it slide for that tournament. To think this wouldn't be an issue if a few top players hadn't lost some games. No one would've given a crap if FChamp had won that game.

Almost as bad as when EVO switched to 3/5 pools in the middle of the day.
But everything about this went exactly according to the FGC drama generator script, so why wouldn't it end that way?

Marvel is dumb, Fchamp is salty, Neo is fchamp's echo chamber, Wizard acts out, TOs favor top players, someone tries to get a money match, and twitter makes the whole community look stupid. Only things that are missing are fanatiq and marn, and I'm sure OBS will do their part.
 

SDBurton

World's #1 Cosmonaut Enthusiast
I'm not feeling letting someone play through most of a tournament with a stick, and then making them play without it for the rest of the tournament, especially after being under the assumption from authorities that it was acceptable; where the error in judgment admittedly rested on their hands instead of Full Schedule's.

IMO they should let it rock tmmro and then ban it from there afterwards. Seems kind of scummy to change up on a player once they've made it this far through being told it was okay.

EDIT: Dahbomb basically said what I said but started typing earlier.
Kind of? It is scummy. Like Dahbomb said if it wasn't for top players losing to it this would've flown under the radar.