Fire Emblem Echoes: Shadows of Valentia |OT|

With minimal spoilers, which villagers should I focus into which classes?
Faye- Cleric
Kliff - This is your best villager. I made him a Mage but he works pretty much as anything
Tobin - Bench lol. You can make him an Archer but he has bad stats
Gray - He does fine as a mercenary

YMMV (Some people make Kliff an Archer and Tobin a mage) but they are solid choices.
 
Amazon delivered it to my door a few minutes ago. Fortunately not crushed, and actually in great condition. I ordered the Limited Edition.

I opened the package and took it out, but haven't opened the box yet. This is a lot bigger than I thought it would be. It's very nice, definitely one of those cases where I want to put the box on display. Eager to crack it open later.

Game reminds me of SMTIV
I'm curious in which manner you mean. Just the dungeon crawling?
 
Is it possible to play around with different classes for the characters to try out different things or are things more restricted and you'd want to pick one and stick with it?
 
Forgot to mention, I called many stores including gamestops, walmarts, best buy, and the second Target I called apparently had 7 or 8 of the amiibos in stock. They held one for me and I got it.
 
Clair is annoying. I think its the Voice

Faye- Cleric
Kliff - This is your best villager. I made him a Mage but he works pretty much as anything
Tobin - Bench lol. You can make him an Archer but he has bad stats
Gray - He does fine as a mercenary

YMMV (Some people make Kliff an Archer and Tobin a mage) but they are solid choices.
Funny, I picked the exact classes you recommended for those characters. Even Tobin
 
Clair is annoying. I think its the Voice



Funny, I picked the exact classes you recommended for those characters. Even Tobin
tbh, if you look around in the Ram village, you get some hints on what classes you should upgrade your characters (except maybe for Faye)

I would've jumped on the special edition if NA got the Amiibos as well. Didn't seem worth it for just the pins and a CD, IMO.
tbh, the special edition is only 60 dollars and with the amiibo it's like 90 ? It's 90 in Europe with the amiibos, so it's pretty much the same right ?
 
tbh, if you look around in the Ram village, you get some hints on what classes you should upgrade your characters (except maybe for Faye)



tbh, the special edition is only 60 dollars and with the amiibo it's like 90 ? It's 90 in Europe with the amiibos, so it's pretty much the same right ?
Exactly the reason I picked these classes.
I choosed cleric for Faye just so she can heal Alm. dedicated healer for my Protagonist
 
So my experience with Fire Emblem is pretty recent. I bought this basically on the back of enjoying Awakening and Fates. But from the sound of it, the mechanics here are a bit different. What should I know before getting into it?
 
Nope, because of how promotion gains work in this game.

Once, somebody posts a more detailed reason I'll add it to the OT.
Fine, fine. I'll get on it~

So, how do promotions work in Shadows of Valentia?:

Let's say you have a Lv. 7 Cavalier w/ the following stats:
27 HP | 13 Atk | 4 Tec | 9 Spd | 0 Lck | 6 Def | 2 Res

And that this is the base statline for a Lv. 1 Paladin (courtesy of SF):
28 HP | 12 Atk | 5 Tec | 8 Spd | 0 Lck | 8 Def | 5 Res

If you promote immediately, your newly-minted Paladin would have the following stats:
28 HP | 13 Atk | 5 Tec | 9 Spd | 0 Lck | 8 Def | 5 Res
(+1 HP | +0 Atk | +1 Tec | +0 Spd | +0 Lck | +2 Def | +3 Res)

All of a unit's stats will be brought up to the base of the class they're promoting to. If any particular stat already meets or exceeds the base of that class, it will be unaffected upon promotion. As you can see, our Paladin's Atk and Spd were completely unaffected due to exceeding the Paladin class' base while their HP, Tec, Def, and Res improved.

I see, but if I level to the max, I'll still have a stronger unit in the end, right?

Yes, that's true. If you promote early, you lose the potential stat gains from levelling beyond the earliest point possible. However, due to the low growth rates compared to other games in the series (Expect a lot of +1s and +2s) and the XP formula favoring units that promote early (A Lv. 19 Villager gains less Xp than a Lv. 10/12 Mercenary), it's just much saner to not promote as late as possible. The low growths can create a gap where you could promote a few levels later and -still- end up with the same stats you would've had had you promoted earlier. You also start seeing promoted enemies sooner than other games in the series, leading to rapid increases in enemy strength. Personally, I'm -still- stuck with Villagers while I'm up against Gold Knights. Yeah, not the fairest of fights.

tl;dr: Promote ASAP

As a special note, the Mercenary -> Myrmidon -> Dread Fighter promotion line can loop back into the Villager class. Other promotion lines will require the Villager's Fork, which at this time is a -very- limited item.

-----

Do tell if there's any details missing.
 
Amazon delivered it to my door a few minutes ago. Fortunately not crushed, and actually in great condition. I ordered the Limited Edition.

I opened the package and took it out, but haven't opened the box yet. This is a lot bigger than I thought it would be. It's very nice, definitely one of those cases where I want to put the box on display. Eager to crack it open later.



I'm curious in which manner you mean. Just the dungeon crawling?
The way you navigate around the village and talk to villagers remind me of the start of SMT IV. Especially the way you see minimized versions of the character illustrations placed over the landscape before you interact with them.

The dungeon crawling as well reminds me of SMTIV.
 
Nope, because of how promotion gains work in this game.

Once, somebody posts a more detailed reason I'll add it to the OT.
Here's my (bad) explanation for how promotions work.

Unlike in most Fire Emblem games, in SoV units that promote have their stats raised to the base stats of the class they're promoting into, while keeping any stats that are higher. So the only reason you would wait on promoting is if you think that you're going to be able to raise a unit's stats above their promotion's base stats.

It's pretty unlikely that you're going to be able to do that, however. SoV growth rates are very low, especially compared to the other two 3DS games. So in almost all cases (read: for casual play, all cases) it's better to take the immediate power surge you gain by promoting instead of waiting to roll the dice to see if you could *possibly* get a slightly better unit.

Also, grinding to level 20 takes a LOT of time.

Basically, pros of promoting ASAP:
Get a powerful unit when you need it
Don't have to grind
Frees up experience for other units/feed more experience to the same unit

Cons:
You may have missed out on your chance to grind for four hours and to get a very slightly better unit for the end of the game.

Edit: damn ninjas and their 1-2 range
 
So my experience with Fire Emblem is pretty recent. I bought this basically on the back of enjoying Awakening and Fates. But from the sound of it, the mechanics here are a bit different. What should I know before getting into it?
No more pairing units together on the battlefield for stat buffs.
Archers have longer range, AND can counter attack melee units.
Casting spells costs HP.
When a healer casts an offensive spell, they leach health.
Play with perma death on, a new item lets you rewind turns in an emergency.
 
Currently at the end of Alm's route of chapter 1 (?)
I assume you can't beat Desaix in this map but I can't help but tempted to get his dracoshield. >_<
In Gaiden I seem to recall
you needed to do hideous amounts of grinding and then have Silque warp someone next to him and one round KO him...at which point you're so strong you don't need the dracoshield of course. But seeing as warp no longer has unlimited range that probably won't work out.

Is it possible to play around with different classes for the characters to try out different things or are things more restricted and you'd want to pick one and stick with it?
Restricted though Mercenary eventually loops back to Villager for some reason. I'd love to know why only mercenary line gets to do this.
 
Tobin - Bench lol. You can make him an Archer but he has bad stats
Three words: Base 6 Speed. Make him a mage and give him +2 speed from the fountain and he'll quickly snowball into Excalibur, at which point he's set. Kliff has a base AS of 1 as a mage with Fire, all the spell variety in the world can't save that.
 
Fine, fine. I'll get on it~

So, how do promotions work in Shadows of Valentia?:

Let's say you have a Lv. 7 Cavalier w/ the following stats:
27 HP | 13 Atk | 4 Tec | 9 Spd | 0 Lck | 6 Def | 2 Res

And that this is the base statline for a Lv. 1 Paladin (courtesy of SF):
28 HP | 12 Atk | 5 Tec | 8 Spd | 0 Lck | 8 Def | 5 Res

If you promote immediately, your newly-minted Paladin would have the following stats:
28 HP | 13 Atk | 5 Tec | 9 Spd | 0 Lck | 8 Def | 5 Res
(+1 HP | +0 Atk | +1 Tec | +0 Spd | +0 Lck | +2 Def | +3 Res)

All of a unit's stats will be brought up to the base of the class they're promoting to. If any particular stat already meets or exceeds the base of that class, it will be unaffected upon promotion. As you can see, our Paladin's Atk and Spd were completely unaffected due to exceeding the Paladin class' base while their HP, Tec, Def, and Res improved.

I see, but if I level to the max, I'll still have a stronger unit in the end, right?

Yes, that's true. If you promote early, you lose the potential stat gains from levelling beyond the earliest point possible. However, due to the low growth rates compared to other games in the series (Expect a lot of +1s and +2s) and the XP formula favoring units that promote early (A Lv. 19 Villager gains less Xp than a Lv. 10/12 Mercenary), it's just much saner to not promote as late as possible. The low growths can create a gap where you could promote a few levels later and -still- end up with the same stats you would've had had you promoted earlier. You also start seeing promoted enemies sooner than other games in the series, leading to rapid increases in enemy strength. Personally, I'm -still- stuck with Villagers while I'm up against Gold Knights. Yeah, not the fairest of fights.

tl;dr: Promote ASAP

As a special note, the Mercenary -> Myrmidon -> Dread Fighter promotion line can loop back into the Villager class. Other promotion lines will require the Villager's Fork, which at this time is a -very- limited item.

-----

Do tell if there's any details missing.
After more than a decade of promoting at level 20 for best stats, this is gonna be tough as fuck to get used to :\
 
anyone got a rough idea of how long this is by the way? want to know how much of this I can play over the next week and still have enough to keep me busy during my flight and layover
 
Currently at the end of Alm's route of chapter 1 (?)
I assume you can't beat Desaix in this map but I can't help but tempted to get his dracoshield. >_<
Short version: Yes, but it requires the following:

-Two units with a minimum of 30 HP/8 DEF (Normal, I haven't tried hard). You should have a leather shield by this point so have it equipped to whichever unit has the highest defense.
-The Levin Sword (Best to equip Alm with it since he should have a high HP stat by this point)
-At least two units who can hit enemies from a distance. I recommend making Faye and Kliff mages and turning Tobin into an archer for this task if you haven't promoted either already.
-At least one cleric. Two is recommended but I was able to succeed with just Silque.

The strategy is to warp Alm to the gap between the two walls. This should trigger Desaix
's doppelganger
to move in and attack Alm. Make sure all the ranged enemies are taken out before you proceed (it's advised you use Python to take out the archers). From there, move Alm one space backward, then four spaces backwards. From here, you can do one of the two strategies:
1. Move Alm down four and then have your allies pin him. Slowly wear him down by attacking him from a distance with your archers, Alm's Lightning Sword and mages while locking him like this :
O
ODesaixO
O

If you choose this method, make sure each unit surrounding them can take a hit and that your healer(s) can recover the damage that unit was dealt.

2. Have your highest defensive unit within Desaix's range and move Alm out of it. Desaix should go after them. From there, slowly move your unit to the right into the castle wall to the right and corner him (Clair is the best unit for this since she can stay right on the wall and move once he's in the corner). If done correctly, it should look like this:
|
|DesaixO
O

This is the strategy I used, it gives you some breathing room if you only have one healer since he'll likely just keep plucking away at the same unit while you heal back any damage deal short of a critical hit. Give it enough time and the dracoshield should be yours!*

*If you try to wall Desaix on the right sight of the map via the castle without pinning him, Desaix will run away when his HP runs low. DO NOT DO THIS! You want to pin him so he can't run away and you can safely heal your units. If he escapes, simply rewind a few turns and try to pin him.
 
I just realized that I forgot to recruit Python. Damn. I'm on already on Celica's route, so I'm leaving him for another play through unless Alm can backtrack.
 
I really like how you explore villages in this game. This should become the standard way you do it in future games.

Edit: Also like the concept of shields. Though it kinda would only work if you only have 1 inventory slot like in this game.
 

Metroidvania

People called Romanes they go the house?
So should I be delaying the free promotion from villager into an actual class until the early crew hits max villager level, or does that have negative consequences this time around?

edit: Read above, apparently it's promote early and often? How odd.
 
Oh bother I made a really dumb mistake (end of act 2)
I picked up the ridersbane as Celica (I missed that room going through that area as Alm)...I'm struggling to remember if her party ever fights mounted units. Well I read there is a single use merchant I can use to send it back to Alm.
 
Haha I'm glad people are enjoying their collector's editions.
It looked huge to me and I don't have the space to store those types of things any more - good thing I passed!
 
UPS finally showed up! The Limited Edition box sure is bigger than you'd think. It's pretty nice. The amiibo are awesome as well!

Starting to play now, hyped!
 
so what are the best classes to change the villagers into?

Based on the stuff you see in the beginning at the village, the game is pushing for Gray to merc, kliff to mage and tobin as archer.

WHat about faye? Im feeling cleric but i just got one and this party seems really small right now to have 2 healers...
 
so what are the best classes to change the villagers into?

Based on the stuff you see in the beginning at the village, the game is pushing for Gray to merc, kliff to mage and tobin as archer.

WHat about faye? Im feeling cleric but i just got one and this party seems really small right now to have 2 healers...
You won't regret having another cleric.
 
so what are the best classes to change the villagers into?

Based on the stuff you see in the beginning at the village, the game is pushing for Gray to merc, kliff to mage and tobin as archer.

WHat about faye? Im feeling cleric but i just got one and this party seems really small right now to have 2 healers...
Make Faye into a Cleric. She gets some pretty rad abilities
 
so what are the best classes to change the villagers into?

Based on the stuff you see in the beginning at the village, the game is pushing for Gray to merc, kliff to mage and tobin as archer.

WHat about faye? Im feeling cleric but i just got one and this party seems really small right now to have 2 healers...
You don't get another dedicated healer aside from Silque in Alm's party until fairly lategame.