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For those who don't own a Wii U - These are the load times people complain about

dallow_bg

nods at old men
May 8, 2007
28,696
4
0
Texas
www.dolefulorange.com
Excuse my ignorance, but the entire process took a bit more than a minute to complete. I mean, this justifies outrage and shock? Have we gotten so fucking entitled and impatient? Are people installing that many games that this is actually an issue? It's like 1:20 total time. How do you get through other aspects of life that require infinitely more patience?
Because it was a 36mb nes game.
Now imagine a retail download. Or don't imagine, there are stories here and video of that I'm sure.
 

GulAtiCa

Member
Jan 19, 2013
14,760
0
0
www.zenfaproductions.com
I could deal with the slowness fine, if it wasn't for the damn hard locks! It's not a game bug, but a system bug dealing with communications (as far as I can tell). I hope they fix that above all...
 

teh_pwn

"Saturated fat causes heart disease as much as Brawndo is what plants crave."
Jun 14, 2004
14,602
36
1,585
Austin
That's pretty horrible. Windows 95 with a pentium 2 could install 40 MB msis faster than that.

They should have used modified Linux rather than trying to reinvent the OS.
 

adamsappel

Member
Aug 22, 2005
14,199
0
1,315
54
www.tehbias.com
Excuse my ignorance, but the entire process took a bit more than a minute to complete. I mean, this justifies outrage and shock? Have we gotten so fucking entitled and impatient? Are people installing that many games that this is actually an issue? It's like 1:20 total time. How do you get through other aspects of life that require infinitely more patience?
It's a 36 megabyte game. It should install in a blink. I don't know if a WiiU game takes extrapolationally longer, but then again I can't understand how LEGO City Undercover is a 19GB download.
 

Slayven

Member
Dec 10, 2004
121,808
7
0
USA
Does Microsoft have a patent on downloading the installed game for consoles? I don't know why Nintendo would look at how Microsoft does it and how Sony does it, and copy the inferior way.
Microsoft must have, cause that is the only reason this would make sense. I rather be knocked out of multiplayer while it is downloading/installing then have to wait while it downloads then install.
 

wsippel

Banned
May 25, 2006
14,534
0
0
Erfurt, Germany
That's pretty horrible. Windows 95 with a pentium 2 could install 40 MB msis faster than that.

They should have used modified Linux rather than trying to reinvent the OS.
What is "installing"? If it's just copying? Sure. If it's deflating an uncompressed archive? Yes. If it's anything more than that? Maybe. Maybe not. Installing a 3MB security update on my Macbook Air, with SSD and all, can take up to five minutes. There is no "installing X MB on system Y takes Z seconds" rule. What archive format is used? What kind and level of compression? Encryption? How many files does the archive contain, and does the installer verify checksums of each file? Are there any pre or post install scripts, and what do they do?

Don't get me wrong, installing shit on Wii U certainly is slow. Too slow, from the perspective of a user. But there might be technical reasons, and "but it takes so and so long on some other system" isn't helping the discussion, because we have no idea what either system actually does.
 

TedNindo

Member
Nov 7, 2010
2,091
1
750
I don't think it matters what it is more than the fact that it is not a $350 gaming experience in 2013.

Hell, 360 was more optimized at launch and was around the same price range.
Add to that that the 360 had an OS built by microsoft. A company that has zero experience making operating systems.
 

kirby_fox

Member
May 23, 2007
5,096
0
0
[REDACTED]
It's only annoying when I want to switch from Netflix to a game back to Netflix. Trine 2 install took forever.

But it's a great way to stay in shape if you do jumping jacks or pushups during your wait time!
 

Subaru

Member
Jun 16, 2009
1,681
0
0
WHen I download anything at Wii U I always choose the option "Turn off the console after downloading", that downloads AND install the game that I've bought it. So, I never saw these big installation times.

But yes, it's sux. PS3 have atrocious installing times too.
 

Morokh

Member
Jan 17, 2010
3,207
0
0
France
Download times just seem inconsistent.

I downloaded the ZombiU demo which is pretty much 1,5 gig in around 15 min, while the Zen Pinball Demo took more than 20 minutes.

Otherwise the day 1 update was done in roughly 5 minutes and so was the MH3U one.
 

AzaK

Member
Jun 11, 2011
8,363
1
0
I noticed in a thread last week that had some pictures of Sim City and people were shocked at how small the cities were. Obviously everyone in the official threads knew, but if you weren't actually looking for Sim City info you may not have actually stumbled upon a picture.

With that in mind I made a video last night of how long it takes to install Punch Out!, a 36mb game. If you haven't seen how slow the Wii U OS is you're in for a shocking treat.


http://youtu.be/RqlHIslONT4


I really dig my wii u but nintendo needs to fix this crap. And with reports of how slow the processor is I'm not sure how much they actually can :/


Edit: This is even better:
I just stared at the screen, open jawed when I installed and had to wait for punchout to install. At 36 MB I'd expect no more than 2-3 seconds really. The Wii U install process is terrible and I have no idea if they can fix it. If its hardware related, as in something like slow flash RAM then we're buggered.If its a software issue then it's just terrible engineering. Either way it's not acceptable.
 
Apr 21, 2010
6,977
0
0
Um, why make this thread now when Nintendo already announced a fix for this is coming in the Spring?

And what does this have to do with Sim City?
 

Epcott

Member
Oct 13, 2006
7,877
0
1,290
www.instagram.com
That's also a video from November.


It took me 1 minute and 30 seconds (stopwatch'd) to do all of the following:
1) Confirm my system's date and time change.
2) Exit to the main screen.
3) Boot up Monster Hunter 3U.
4) Download an update to Monster Hunter 3U.
5) Install an update for Monster Hunter 3U.
6) Reboot Monster Hunter 3U.
7) Hit "New Game".

The slow OS is really exaggerated, and people should stop posting videos from around the system's launch to make it look like there's still a problem. The OS isn't lightning speed, but if someone can't handle all of the stuff I listed above taking a minute and a half, I think the problem is more with that person's patience than the system.
*sigh of relief*

Also, by Wii game I actually mean not a Wii U game. I know it switches to Wii OS for original Wii software and the shop. I'm wondering if the load time to transition to Wii OS takes a long time.
 

pixlexic

Banned
Nov 10, 2012
7,468
1
0
Why do you have to install at all if you downloaded it?
same reason you have to on the ps3. Which I explained earlier.

but to better visualize it.

A = program one data
B = program two data
C= program three data

this is a windows formated disk.

data on disk:
AAABBBB CCBB AAAACCCCCBBBAABBB CCBBBCCCC

Which can become fragmented and slow if getting full but is faster others wise.


PS3 and Wiiu do not use a windows file system. They use a strict system of headers and tight data alignment.

ps3 /wii data on disk

headers: | data:
AABBCC | AAAAAAAABBBBBBBBCCCCCC


if not properly set up correctly then a lot of stuff has to be moved around to install an application. Its even worse if you are only using one storage device. Think of it as having to run defrag before each install.

But in this case you usually try to pre set enough space for a lot of files where you think you think you would need them.

headers: | data:
AABBCC <- extra space for future installs-> | AAAAAAAABBBBBBBBCCCCCC


But if you only have so much space to begin with then you can not do this preemptive space caching very much.
 

KingSnake

The Birthday Skeleton
Jan 9, 2013
26,118
2
0
Installing the NFSMWU took me 15 minutes. And it has 6 GB, which is way more than 7 times 36MB, so it depends on what is behind the "installing".
Hopefully the April update will help the people without patience.
 

Skyzard

Banned
Jun 3, 2012
20,772
0
0
If any console really needed the standby feature that Sony is implementing with the PS4, it's the Wii U, especially with the off-tv play. Damn I definitely don't have this much patience for games. It's half the reason I stopped playing my home consoles and went Vita only.
 
Jun 26, 2012
3,190
0
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same reason you have to on the ps3. Which I explained earlier.

but to better visualize it.

A = program one data
B = program two data
C= program three data

this is a windows formated disk.

data on disk:
AAABBBB CCBB AAAACCCCCBBBAABBB CCBBBCCCC

Which can become fragmented and slow if getting full but is faster others wise.


PS3 and Wiiu do not use a windows file system. They use a strict system of headers and tight data alignment.

ps3 /wii data on disk

headers: | data:
AABBCC | AAAAAAAABBBBBBBBCCCCCC


if not properly set up correctly then a lot of stuff has to be moved around to install an application. Its even worse if you are only using one storage device. Think of it as having to run defrag before each install.

But in this case you usually try to pre set enough space for a lot of files where you think you think you would need them.

headers: | data:
AABBCC <- extra space for future installs-> | AAAAAAAABBBBBBBBCCCCCC


But if you only have so much space to begin with then you can not do this preemptive space caching very much.
But that doesn't explain why Sony and now Nintendo decided to go with such an archaic file system. Hell, 'archaic' isn't even the word - the FAT file system, which solved this problem, was invented back in 1977.
 

pixlexic

Banned
Nov 10, 2012
7,468
1
0
I can't believe you guys are buying digitally on Nintendo's systems. Getting them back if your system dies is a needless pain.
We are hoping that what they said about changing to an account based service happens sooner than later.

Edit: also wanted ot add i just download ballon fight and it installed in about 2 secs. but I also have a external drive.
 
Oct 30, 2006
596
2
840
I don't mind the slowness much, but why the hell do I have to tell it to install? Why would I dl something I didn't want to install. It should just do it automatically, or at least have the option.
 

Hoo-doo

Member
Sep 29, 2011
27,245
30
655
Um, why make this thread now when Nintendo already announced a fix for this is coming in the Spring?

And what does this have to do with Sim City?
It's going to be a blast when people realize that's is impossible to simply "fix" this issue without rewriting the entire OS.
 

RedSwirl

Junior Member
Mar 29, 2009
28,093
0
0
noplatform.wordpress.com
Does Microsoft have a patent on downloading the installed game for consoles? I don't know why Nintendo would look at how Microsoft does it and how Sony does it, and copy the inferior way.
I don't think so, iOS does it as well. Actually, on Xbox and iOS the apps still have to install, it's just that the OS does it for you and includes that step along with downloading as part of the same progress bar.

Shit, the 3DS does this. You don't have to tap "install" when you download a 3DS game, I think it just automatically installs once it's done downloading and then appears on the front menu.
 

solarus

Member
Oct 24, 2009
4,359
1
780
How can any one say this OS is better than PS3/360 with a straight face?

Those videos are horrifying.
Many of those people have never used those systems and have only experienced the wii this generation, they are talking out of their asses.
 
Jun 11, 2004
2,788
0
0
Many of those people have never used those systems and have only experienced the wii this generation, they are talking out of their asses.
As on owner of all three, I've always hated Microsoft's cluttered Xbominations, though it's definitely the quickest of the three at this point. Downloads & installs in particular are just miles faster than the slow PS3 and slower Wii U equivalents.

I'm fond of Sony's XMB, though loading up anything browser based is torturous and the revamped store defeats Wii U in terms of painfully slow irritation.

I like the Wii U OS in terms of functionality and, for the most part, design, but I cannot argue that it's FAR too slow overall. There's just no doubt about it. I do like the e-Shop, although I've heard that the US version is inferior to the European equivalent in terms of layout. Was that ever fixed?
 

andthebeatgoeson

Junior Member
Jun 7, 2004
23,035
0
0
42
Ok, im off to work. I just wanted to raise 3 flame shields for while i'm gone.



1. I am a nintendo fan. I have a Wii U, for chrisssssssake!


2. I know that installs aren't the only thing people complain about. I just figured that 2 minutes for 36MB was absurd so it's what i filmed.


3. I talk slow at the beginning for comedic effect (someone on youtube, of all places, got that) but the quivering is just my natural bullshit voice.



Ok, have at me. But seriously, Nintendo, fix this.


Edit: Updated the OP with the better video as well.
I agree. Fix it. Make it easier to turn off the gamepad or background downloads (either or). I wish someone came up with a snappy way to buy a disc and install it w/o needing to keep the disc in. Would solve a lot of problems with DD. Get a cheap disc because gamespot really wants you to come buy, then sell later, get rid of the need to swap a disc/lose a disc/scratch a disc.
 

Panajev2001a

GAF's Pleasant Genius
Jun 7, 2004
17,042
8,082
2,055
What if this isn't an OS in the traditional sense that you and I consider an OS? What if, for security reasons, the *entire* thing reloads from a hypervisor of sorts for every non-social persistent function (i.e. MiiVerse and the web browser would count as an always-running function - the "OS" would not) function as a piracy prevention method? What if installing software creates a virtual machine of sorts for every piece of software to continue along those lines?
Then I would say that their paranoid approach to security is biting them in the ass causing a systems that, taking an use POV, feels sluggish to use.

It could be that the system was rushed, it could be a novel, untested, technically incredible new approach which takes a long time to get it right and fast, etc... etc... but it hardly matters to end users. What they experience in 2013 is a sluggish experience.

It feels like it takes ages to do just about anything including "quickly" accessing Miiverse from the main menu or from a game and then returning to what you were doing before. Result? I tend not to use those features as much as I would want to.
 

Persona86

Banned
Jun 14, 2012
6,085
0
0
It could be a lot better, hopefully Nintendo updates it or something. But it honestly wouldn't bother me that much. I'm in it for the actual games more than UI.
 

H_Prestige

Banned
Aug 2, 2008
15,476
0
0
What if this isn't an OS in the traditional sense that you and I consider an OS? What if, for security reasons, the *entire* thing reloads from a hypervisor of sorts for every non-social persistent function (i.e. MiiVerse and the web browser would count as an always-running function - the "OS" would not) function as a piracy prevention method? What if installing software creates a virtual machine of sorts for every piece of software to continue along those lines?
What if none of that matters to the end user and Nintendo screwed up another thing about this joke of a system?