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Formula 1 2018 Season |OT| Better Late Than Never

Makariel

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Bad luck for Stoffel but he has been consistently out performed and never managed to live up to the hype. Yes the car didn't help, but what would have helped would have been to stay just a little closer to Alonso in terms of qualifying. Not surprised that they signed Norris. I still don't expect mclaren driving for the 2019 championship. I still wonder where Ocon will end up at? Would be a shame to lose him from the grid.

Kimi is still fast and is driving better than he did for years, not sure why they axe him now. Maybe he ends up in indy as team mate for Alonso? :)
 

Fox Mulder

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McLaren fucking sucks though. Vandoorne just isn't as good as Alonso at dragging that car around.

This team chews up young talent. Perez, Magnussen, and now Vandoorne. Norris is next.
 

xrnzaaas

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Vandoorne's pace is a clear representation of what the car can do, Fernando is simply going beyond its limits. ;) Unless their car improves next year I expect Sainz and Norris to be the constant backmarkers.
 

Makariel

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McLaren is already the slowest Renault powered car on the grid. Once they are consistently beaten by the Honda powered Red Bull team the McL management will hopefully collectively eat their hats. Teams with lower budget consistently outperform the papaya squad, I'm not sure this will change any time soon. I was quite surprised by the documentary series on amazon prime about the team when they started into the last season. The hubris at display makes citizen kane appear humble.
 

Yagami_Sama

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McLaren gave up this season several races ago. When it was clear that they were struggling and their development was going backwards, they decide to invest on next year car which I hope that this gamble pays off. On the few Friday practices in which Norris was driving, he was on par with Vandoorne. I am really curious to see how McLaren will handle Sainz and Norris, it is clear, at least for me, that Norris is their favorite and if Sainz beats him, like Alonso is doing with Vandoorne will be,at least interesting to see. Will be similar to the Hamilton X Alonso situation.
 

xrnzaaas

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So it's confirmed:
- Charles for Kimi in 2019
- Kimi in Sauber for the next 2 years WTF!
 

Redneckerz

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Stuck in 1Q84.
Leclerc to Ferrari was one thing you could see, but the Kimi part had me shook. Why go to Sauber for 2 more years?

I reckon they want The Iceman serve as some kind of mentor? There is also a rumor that he would be co-owner of Sauber in 1-2 years - Which would explain the move.
 

DasPenguin

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Leclerc to Ferrari was one thing you could see, but the Kimi part had me shook. Why go to Sauber for 2 more years?

I reckon they want The Iceman serve as some kind of mentor? There is also a rumor that he would be co-owner of Sauber in 1-2 years - Which would explain the move.

This was already rumoured a week ago in Finnish newspapers. Kimi wanted to drive for two more years and Leclerc only has a one year deal. One rumour is that if he drives like a chump, they just bring Kimi back for the second season. The other big rumour is the co-owner stuff.

Dude loves to drive so good for him.
 

Redneckerz

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Stuck in 1Q84.
This was already rumoured a week ago in Finnish newspapers. Kimi wanted to drive for two more years and Leclerc only has a one year deal. One rumour is that if he drives like a chump, they just bring Kimi back for the second season. The other big rumour is the co-owner stuff.

Dude loves to drive so good for him.
Could be plausible aswell. I just hope Ocon finds a seat, dude is way too good to not be in the F1. And Stroll is only in it because of pappa.
 

Yagami_Sama

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What weird move. I was not expecting Raikkonem to go back to Sauber, I thought that he would got a spot on Haas or retire, but Sauber never consider that option. But maybe, Ferrari asked him to go there and stay to see if Leclerc will "deliver" or else they drop him and bring Raikkonem back. It will be interesting to see how Vettel will handle the situation, if Leclerc got better results than him if he will accept to be P2 or the same for Leclerc.

Next season the drama will reach new heights.
 

Makariel

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We're back to Mercedes on top. I guess that was it in terms of the championship. Ferrari blew it while they had the advantage :-/
 

Breakage

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Yeah it was. I reckon there will be contact at the start tomorrow what with Verstappen splitting Hamilton and Vettel.
 

xrnzaaas

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I still don't think Mercedes is back to top form, Lewis simply posted an insanely good lap. Seb underperformed or made mistakes many times under pressure, a DNF from Lewis would be helpful to him but I don't see hm closing that points gap if Lewis has flawless races until the end of the season.
 

Airbus Jr

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Ferrari must've very high hopes for Leclerc

Their only hope is that Leclerc is the prodigal kid Harry Potter of Formula One and can pull magic lap to defeat Hamilton and set to become their new number one driver next season with Vettel as the new with wingman

Vettel still struggles to beat Hamilton even with better car

Raikkonen? Well...just enjoy your race buddy...
 
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Yagami_Sama

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Vettal as a "Bottas", I mean wingman, would be interesting to watch, because I doubt that Vettel would do something like that. And it would hilarious to see Ferrari's saying, "Seb, Charles is faster than you".
But talking about the race, Verstappen near Hamilton could be risky. But I believe that Hamilton will be careful with him, Verstappen sometimes overdid things and complain later. Also what happened to Ricciardo ? Redbull is giving the colder shoulder ?
 

Makariel

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I'm not sure what Ferraris strategy was today? They must have realised that Vettel would be behind Perez after the change? Hamilton has the championship in the bag.
 

PedroPanache

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They just didn't have the pace and Lewis was supreme today. It's worrying in terms of an entertaining championship, because Lewis has now won a bunch of races that he really had no right to win, much like last year, in fact. He'll probably just run away with it now. Part of me is insanely curious as to how these last two years would have played out with Rosberg still at Mercedes.
 

Lionel Richie

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I'm not sure what Ferraris strategy was today? They must have realised that Vettel would be behind Perez after the change? Hamilton has the championship in the bag.

It was ridiculously stupid. Between their constantly idiotic strategies, Seb's snafus in the rain, Kimi being perpetually locked into IDGAF mode and Hamilton going God mode and making 0 mistakes for a long stretch, the dream is sadly dead.

Seriously, I dislike Lewis and I'm a huge Ferrari fan and I actually like Seb, but Hamilton/Mercedes absolutely deserve this. Ferrari needs to get their heads out of their asses and compete better.

They just didn't have the pace and Lewis was supreme today. It's worrying in terms of an entertaining championship, because Lewis has now won a bunch of races that he really had no right to win, much like last year, in fact. He'll probably just run away with it now. Part of me is insanely curious as to how these last two years would have played out with Rosberg still at Mercedes.

My man Nico would never allow this bullshit and would save us. I remember the season when he won it all and a select few were so goddamn salty in the OT that they said his title DIDN'T COUNT because Hamilton had some bad luck. Yeah those were the days to be a F1 fan...
 

PedroPanache

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It was ridiculously stupid. Between their constantly idiotic strategies, Seb's snafus in the rain, Kimi being perpetually locked into IDGAF mode and Hamilton going God mode and making 0 mistakes for a long stretch, the dream is sadly dead.

Seriously, I dislike Lewis and I'm a huge Ferrari fan and I actually like Seb, but Hamilton/Mercedes absolutely deserve this. Ferrari needs to get their heads out of their asses and compete better.



My man Nico would never allow this bullshit and would save us. I remember the season when he won it all and a select few were so goddamn salty in the OT that they said his title DIDN'T COUNT because Hamilton had some bad luck. Yeah those were the days to be a F1 fan...

Yeah, some fans can be a bit much. I love watching Lewis race, and I'm a big fan, but Rosberg deserved that championship and built the foundation of his charge on the back of four superb wins at the start of the season, catching Hamilton napping and underestimating Nico. You always need a bit of luck in F1, even in the modern era of bulletproof cars. But, really, after watching this race, I can't help but miss the guy. It makes you wonder how the combination of the Hamilton/Rosberg rivalry would have played out with Vettel and Ferrari challenging more and more in the last two years.
 

Mohonky

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I'm not sure what Ferraris strategy was today? They must have realised that Vettel would be behind Perez after the change? Hamilton has the championship in the bag.
As soon as I saw Ultras going on I was questioning this, also knowing that any of the top 3 pulling in to the pits meant putting them in traffic, just didn't see the logic in it and I think Vettel was right to question that. But it's a catch 22 at this point, Arrivabene and co have made a few statements to the press lately about how they are the ones who make the decisions, Vettel is there to drive. I think their patience is running out with Vettel as it did with Alonso. Ferrari expect two things from their drivers; results and obedience. Ferrari have never been a team to tolerate their drivers speaking out of line and Vettel is now becoming that combination of disillusioned and frustrated while Ferrari signing on Leclerc is in my mind them getting ready for a reboot.

There's no real reason Ferrari shouldn't be leading the WDC at least (taking out the Hamilton factor). They've had an almighty engine this year, arguably the best car on the grid and Merc have made more than a few of their own poor strategy calls. Last year was a tight battle but this year is a year Ferrari should have considered theirs to lose.

Mercs form hasn't been stellar this season either, Ferrari have regularly had the better race car and it looks like the Ferrari PU has leap frogged their own, but Hamilton just keeps on doing what he does; he stays out of trouble, keeps it clean and finds a way. Hamilton always seems to be his own worst enemy, he has periods where he just seems to go off, but when he believes he can do it, he just seems to find something and that's making all the difference right now.

I'm curious how Honda are going to go next year. RB are having all kinds of reliability issues but they've even been warned by Renault of them but they don't care. They didn't take the new MGU-H (or was it K?) because it didn't fit their aero package despite Renault saying the new component was a reliability upgrade, and now Renault have the Spec C engine but aren't using it because of they don't believe that for reliability it's there yet, but RB are using it anyway. Considering how little RB seem to care for working with engine manufacturers recommendations (Renault said years ago making a powerful and reliable PU that would fit the demands of RB's tight chasis package was one of their biggest issues) I wonder how much wriggle room Honda will get.
 

xrnzaaas

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Wtf was Perez doing, took out his teammate and wanted to do the same to Sirotkin, it's almost like he was racing without mirrors.
 

GrizzleBoy

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Yeah, some fans can be a bit much. I love watching Lewis race, and I'm a big fan, but Rosberg deserved that championship and built the foundation of his charge on the back of four superb wins at the start of the season, catching Hamilton napping and underestimating Nico. You always need a bit of luck in F1, even in the modern era of bulletproof cars. But, really, after watching this race, I can't help but miss the guy. It makes you wonder how the combination of the Hamilton/Rosberg rivalry would have played out with Vettel and Ferrari challenging more and more in the last two years.

Wut?

Built the foundation of his charge on the back of four superb wins at the start?

Ham was crashed into in turn one of the second race.

Hams engine relegated him from qualifying sessions of the third and fourth race.

With very few working engine components left, he had to race without pushing too hard.

Those engine issues meant that by Spa came around, Ham had to start plumb last after taking penalties to replace the blown engine parts.


Despite Rosberg being gifted 75 points due to all this in a car that nobody else could challenge him in, by Malaysia he only had an 8 point lead over Hamilton.

In that Malaysian race, Lewis who was leading comfortably and on pace to take the lead of the championship by a good margin had his engine turn into a ball of flames and instead dropped 23 points behind Nico.

The next race, Hamilton had an issue with his car at the start which meant he was in P8 by the time he got to turn 1.

By the end of the season, despite all this, Nico only won with a 5 point advantage.

Securing 98 points purely from mechanical issues of your nearest rival, ruining your own races multiple times by being unable to race wheel to wheel properly and getting penalties, and yet only winning by 5 points at the end of the season is an interesting way of describing a "deserved" champion imo.

He won because the only other car on the grid (that mattered) was hampered from the very beginning. He drove better than he did in other seasons (and even thats debatable since he ended up getting penalties almost every time he had to actually race against someone and not just lead from P1), but you take that driving and apply it to any situation where Hamiltons car wasn't exploding every other race for the first half of the season and beyond and its quite obvious that his driving wasn't what gave him the advantage.

You can call people who say his championship doesn't count ridiculous, but you're not exactly looking any better if you're sitting there saying that the deciding factor in the 2016 championship was "a bit of luck", "superb wins" where the only person who could challenge was knocked physically or mechanically out of the running and Lewis "underestimating Nico".

There were clearly other much more damaging factors, that had nothing to do with whether Nico was driving well or not.
 
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Lionel Richie

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He won because the only other car on the grid (that mattered) was hampered from the very beginning. He drove better than he did in other seasons (and even thats debatable since he ended up getting penalties almost every time he had to actually race against someone and not just lead from P1), but you take that driving and apply it to any situation where Hamiltons car wasn't exploding every other race for the first half of the season and beyond and its quite obvious that his driving wasn't what gave him the advantage.

I'm so sorry guys, this is clearly my fault.
 

PedroPanache

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Wut?

Built the foundation of his charge on the back of four superb wins at the start?

Ham was crashed into in turn one of the second race.

Hams engine relegated him from qualifying sessions of the third and fourth race.

With very few working engine components left, he had to race without pushing too hard.

Those engine issues meant that by Spa came around, Ham had to start plumb last after taking penalties to replace the blown engine parts.


Despite Rosberg being gifted 75 points due to all this in a car that nobody else could challenge him in, by Malaysia he only had an 8 point lead over Hamilton.

In that Malaysian race, Lewis who was leading comfortably and on pace to take the lead of the championship by a good margin had his engine turn into a ball of flames and instead dropped 23 points behind Nico.

The next race, Hamilton had an issue with his car at the start which meant he was in P8 by the time he got to turn 1.

By the end of the season, despite all this, Nico only won with a 5 point advantage.

Securing 98 points purely from mechanical issues of your nearest rival, ruining your own races multiple times by being unable to race wheel to wheel properly and getting penalties, and yet only winning by 5 points at the end of the season is an interesting way of describing a "deserved" champion imo.

He won because the only other car on the grid (that mattered) was hampered from the very beginning. He drove better than he did in other seasons (and even thats debatable since he ended up getting penalties almost every time he had to actually race against someone and not just lead from P1), but you take that driving and apply it to any situation where Hamiltons car wasn't exploding every other race for the first half of the season and beyond and its quite obvious that his driving wasn't what gave him the advantage.

You can call people who say his championship doesn't count ridiculous, but you're not exactly looking any better if you're sitting there saying that the deciding factor in the 2016 championship was "a bit of luck", "superb wins" where the only person who could challenge was knocked physically or mechanically out of the running and Lewis "underestimating Nico".

There were clearly other much more damaging factors, that had nothing to do with whether Nico was driving well or not.

Well, when you put it like that. Seriously, though, point well taken. My memory of the 2016 championship is obviously a little fuzzy. I don't remember Lewis' woes at the start of the season, but even if Rosberg had a lot of luck, he still deserved his championship. Because that's the nature of F1. I don't think he's as good as Lewis, clearly, but he held firm and even though it was only 5 points, those last four races were pragmatic ones. Whether the gap was 50 points or 5, the ending result would be the same. I should watch a season review of the championship, because I've forgotten so much, and just to see if I can poke any holes in your defence as well.
 

Makariel

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Since I spent a few hours today on the motorway, seeing various reckless behaviour and insane driving, let's talk about Perez. What's up with him? Rule number one is don't crash into your team mate. Well, he has some experience there and since yesterday he already changed his story.

And then the episode with Sirotkin. Asking for the stewards to let him drive by because he can't make a move? Something that didn't take the Hulk not even a lap once he was behind the Williams and most other drivers seem to manage as well. Without crying on the radio how evil the Williams is for driving the racing line. And then the ramming into the Williams once he was on its side. WTF?

How is he still driving next year while Ocon is out?
 

Mohonky

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And he costs money by putting the second car into the wall, losing them points. At some point he causes more trouble than he is worth.

Well yes, but while X is still greater than Y, he'll remain.

Unfortunately that's always the case for many teams outside of the biggest manufacturers.
 

Fox Mulder

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And he costs money by putting the second car into the wall, losing them points. At some point he causes more trouble than he is worth.

I don't even know why Perez would want to stay. His sponsors are valuable and he'll certainly be put in his place when Lance arrives. He'll never be allowed to punt off or rough up daddy's boy.
 

Yagami_Sama

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I just had time to watch the race today.And it was a good race. Hamilton was on beast mode and that incident while was trying to lap a few cars was tense. Ferrari's desperate pit stop strategy for Vettel was sad and cost him the second place. And I see this kind of thing as just more pressure on Vettel for next season.If Le Clerc over perform him will be something else.

And all the crying from Perez was hilarious.He just missed hitting the wall. And poor Ocon, once more was hit by his teammate.

And I am very happy for Alonso performance he was the best of the rest,7th, in a race in which I thought that they would not complete.
 

Makariel

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Sochi so far, Verstappen on fire and Mercedes with team orders to victory. Bottas will be the number two as long as Hamilton is in the team. Not too long ago Mercedes was mocking Ferrari because of team orders, times have changed.

Edit : Bottas should have won, was ordered to step down and let Hamilton through. I know team orders are legal now but I still don't like them, the fastest driver should win.
 
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Nok Su Kow

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I've had to give up watching F1 it's so boring, now I just read the result and it reconfirms I made the right decision

I ended up picking up most of the DVDs and a video game instead because I love the sport but not what it is now
 

Mohonky

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Sochi so far, Verstappen on fire and Mercedes with team orders to victory. Bottas will be the number two as long as Hamilton is in the team. Not too long ago Mercedes was mocking Ferrari because of team orders, times have changed.

Edit : Bottas should have won, was ordered to step down and let Hamilton through. I know team orders are legal now but I still don't like them, the fastest driver should win.

Was Bottas the fastest driver?

I hate seeing team orders myself but you will never know if there might have been an overtake without some team orders at some point in the race. That's why they do it, so team mates don't get hot under the collar and try something risky later on that will harm the team over all. It sucks but at this end of the season with the title fight have swung so many times, it's just the logical choice.

If Hamilton wraps up the season before the last race I would think they will probably swing one Bottas if they can.
 

Makariel

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Was Bottas the fastest driver?
Was Lewis the faster driver? We won't know thanks to the radio control by Mercedes. A team that in the recent past always stated they are "racers" and let their drivers race. Yeah sure.

It wasn't even necessary, Mercedes were more than half a second faster than anyone else. Hamilton cruised past the Ferrari as if the red car had a GP2 engine. The precedent was set earlier in the year already, Bottas is nothing more than a roadblock for anyone who might be coming close to Hamilton.

So, to reiterate: team orders suck. I didn't like them when Ferrari was using them (remember Schumacher and Barrichello?) and time has not made me look at them in a more positive way.
 

Breakage

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I waited all day and planned to watch the highlights this evening.
I got up to the bit where Hamilton overtook Vettel and switched off.
I looked up the results and they were unsurprising.
I think Lewis is on his way to his fifth WDC.
 
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Fox Mulder

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Was Lewis the faster driver? We won't know thanks to the radio control by Mercedes. A team that in the recent past always stated they are "racers" and let their drivers race. Yeah sure.

It wasn't even necessary, Mercedes were more than half a second faster than anyone else. Hamilton cruised past the Ferrari as if the red car had a GP2 engine. The precedent was set earlier in the year already, Bottas is nothing more than a roadblock for anyone who might be coming close to Hamilton.

So, to reiterate: team orders suck. I didn't like them when Ferrari was using them (remember Schumacher and Barrichello?) and time has not made me look at them in a more positive way.

There's nothing wrong with what Mercedes did, it's legal and now Hamilton has a 50 point gap or two DNF's up on Vettel with 5 races left. Bottas isn't in the title picture at all after Mercedes let drivers race plenty this year, and Bottas only got put on support duty around Germany or Hungary. He lost out on a few wins early in the season due to bad safety car timing or luck, like a puncture while leading in Baku and a gearbox failure while leading in Austria.
 
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Yagami_Sama

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That was a boring race. For me this race was awful. When Ferrari do this, is expected because Ferrari works like that , but Hamilton does not need that to be champion and he does not need that to win, it was a shame and one of his best season, is just ruined for me. Just awful to see that. BUT if in the end Hamilton become champion because of this points it will be okay, but I doubt it.

Apart from this, the race was boring, the start was great and the rest not so much. Verstappen was been Verstappen and ended in 5th, Ricciardo in a more cautious way ended in 06th. And McLaren was terrible, horrible race for the team, they need to improve a lot for be able to try to have a podium next season.
 

Makariel

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There's nothing wrong with what Mercedes did, it's legal [...]
Have I ever claimed otherwise? Just because it's legal doesn't mean I have to like it. And if everything is so wonderful, why were the Mercedes drivers so down and almost depressed looking at the press conference? Shouldn't they be celebrating the 1-2 win and all smiling?
 

Grieves

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Well that about wraps it up for the championship this year. Can't see Ferrari pulling this one back now (sorry Lionel Richie Lionel Richie )

Surprised Bottas got a sulk on, he must of know in that position he would be asked to let Lewis by.

Good racing from Max.

LOL at Bernie sat next to Putin. C'mon snipers, you had the ideal shot!
 

Lionel Richie

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Well that about wraps it up for the championship this year. Can't see Ferrari pulling this one back now (sorry Lionel Richie Lionel Richie )

Yeah this thing is done unless Lewis crashes or breaks in the next 2 races and Seb wins out. With how reliable Mercedes cars are and how Lewis is driving out of his mind right now, I somehow think the first is even more unlikely than the second. It was a good ride for a while though, shame Ferrari got batshit stupid since Marchionne passed. It could have been beautiful, instead it's over early.

You're right on Max, holy shit was he ever the bright spot on the race. Should be pretty fun next year with Leclerc driving a good car. Max is probably the future of F1 in my eyes, but we'll see.
 

Yagami_Sama

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Maybe Ferrari was too concerned with next season. the hurry to sign Leclerc was weird. Because they will have, let's say 2 number 1 drivers and I don't think that Vettel will not accept or now how to handle this situation of be surpassed by his teammate. Remember the situation with Webber and Ricciardo. I think that this will be thing to watch next season, because it may be the last season Vettel drives for Ferrari, and the same for Bottas on Mercedes.

And I think that I am the only one which, does not sympathize with Verstappen.
 

AlphaMale

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Was Lewis the faster driver? We won't know thanks to the radio control by Mercedes. A team that in the recent past always stated they are "racers" and let their drivers race. Yeah sure.
It wasn't even necessary, Mercedes were more than half a second faster than anyone else. Hamilton cruised past the Ferrari as if the red car had a GP2 engine. The precedent was set earlier in the year already, Bottas is nothing more than a roadblock for anyone who might be coming close to Hamilton.
So, to reiterate: team orders suck. I didn't like them when Ferrari was using them (remember Schumacher and Barrichello?) and time has not made me look at them in a more positive way.

I totally agree. I think team orders do more damage than just the immediate race. I mean, racer's stats are on the line and that's set in stone! How many wins should Schumacher and Hamilton really have in total? How many should Barachello, Massa, and Bottas really have?
These stats are what's officially recorded for all of history. There's not gonna be fine print where they state, "*wins by team orders". It's final and permanent. So it makes me sad for those "support drivers" who had to give up wins to help their team mate.