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Forza Motorsport 2 Screenshots... yes, they're REAL

alterego

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Jun 22, 2006
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chespace said:
Again, keep in mind that the game is far from finished and many of the graphical effects missing in these screenshots have yet to be stabilized in the build (HDR and various other car shaders). If you're going to nitpick the visual minutae of a game, wouldn't it make more sense to do so with something that's not a work-in-progress?

Anyway, it's GAF so I'm not expecting much more. Hate away, haters!

I think a lot of the groundwork is in place (car models are very good).

I think the main criticisms were the lighting and environment textures which are the things you've mentioned will be improved so I'm sure it'll look fine in the end (especially whizzing by at 60fps).

I wouldn't read to much into the forum drama but the PR could have been handled better.

When do you think this will ship Che?
 

DMczaf

Member
Jun 6, 2004
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After this thread, I understand the need for bullshots. The internet isn't ready for work-in-progress screens!
 

Tieno

Member
May 6, 2006
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DMczaf said:
After this thread, I understand the need for bullshots. The internet isn't ready for work-in-progress screens!
After this thread? Too Human convinced me on that already. Threads like this are a convincing argument for bullshots and behind-the-scenes showings of games at E3. Though to be fair, the releasing of Forza 2 CGI footage isn't a smart thing either if the first showing of the game can't back it up. Either way, there's still a lot of time.
 

chespace

It's not actually trolling if you don't admit it
Jun 8, 2004
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sangreal said:
I don't know why you felt the need to reiterate this since your last post (wtf do you mean by stabilized anyway?) but to be fair it is not only GAF that has hated on the screens. They seem to be universally hated

wtf do you mean by wtf do i mean. :) what i mean is that all of these graphical effects are coded individually in the engine, and that all the code is inter-dependent in the build -- so when you drop in a new feature and flip the switch, you might end up inadvertently borking other pieces of the build. that's what i mean by instability. it's just a standard ongoing process that eventually gets ironed out.

as for the hate... well, people have a right to hate if they want. all we at turn 10 can hope for is that as the floodgates open and you get more and more looks at the game, not to mention the press getting their hands on it soon, that everyone will realize that not only do the graphics not suck, but that the game feels like the next-gen driving sim everybody has been waiting for on 360.
 

Agent Icebeezy

Welcome beautful toddler, Madison Elizabeth, to the horde!
Aug 28, 2004
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chespace said:
wtf do you mean by wtf do i mean. :) what i mean is that all of these graphical effects are coded individually in the engine, and that all the code is inter-dependent in the build -- so when you drop in a new feature and flip the switch, you might end up inadvertently borking other pieces of the build. that's what i mean by instability. it's just a standard ongoing process that eventually gets ironed out.

as for the hate... well, people have a right to hate if they want. all we at turn 10 can hope for is that as the floodgates open and you get more and more looks at the game, not to mention the press getting their hands on it soon, that everyone will realize that not only do the graphics not suck, but that the game feels like the next-gen driving sim everybody has been waiting for on 360.

Holiday 2006 still on?
 
Dec 27, 2005
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It's hard to believe you're still taking thinly veiled pot-shots PGR3 considering these screens, even if early. Racing sims are one of the few genres where I'm actually a graphics whore. It nees to feel and look like the next-gen racer everyone is waiting for...
 

sangreal

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May 19, 2005
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chespace said:
wtf do you mean by wtf do i mean. :) what i mean is that all of these graphical effects are coded individually in the engine, and that all the code is inter-dependent in the build -- so when you drop in a new feature and flip the switch, you might end up inadvertently borking other pieces of the build. that's what i mean by instability. it's just a standard ongoing process that eventually gets ironed out.

I knew what you meant actually, I just think its weird to use a word like stabilized when talking about screenshots since they are released in a controlled manner (these were leaked, but I'm assuming they were officially given out?)

as for the hate... well, people have a right to hate if they want. all we at turn 10 can hope for is that as the floodgates open and you get more and more looks at the game, not to mention the press getting their hands on it soon, that everyone will realize that not only do the graphics not suck, but that the game feels like the next-gen driving sim everybody has been waiting for on 360.

Well my post history reflects that I think the game looks ok already, I was just pointing out that it isn't just GAF thats nay-saying
 
Jan 19, 2005
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Wollan said:
There are games out there that do and show alot more that's getting much more heat but that's another discussion.

Is it...a racing game where fundamental gameplay conceits can not in any way be gleaned from screenshots? There are tons of ways screenshots for other types of games can legitimately tell you something about the fundamentals of the game. This is, in my opinion, not one of those instances.

It's why I've enjoyed the videos they've released for the game, because they describe the features and enhancements to the game. I'll see what it looks like in-game at some point, but until it's closer to a finished product, I'm much more interested in how it plays.

A screenshot for, say, Resistance, regardless of the graphical state its in, can still tell you Fun Facts like: "Oh, there's like a zillion little crawly things on this level."

Apples and Oranges, Mr. W.
 
Jan 19, 2005
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My Arms Your Hearse said:
It's hard to believe you're still taking thinly veiled pot-shots PGR3 considering these screens, even if early. Racing sims are one of the few genres where I'm actually a graphics whore. It nees to feel and look like the next-gen racer everyone is waiting for...

PGR3 is not a racing sim. Potshot exposure has failed.
 

sangreal

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May 19, 2005
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chespace said:
Forza 2 will no longer ship in Holiday 2006 -- a new date will be given at X06. :)

winter 07 confirmed :(

I guess it pays to over-analyze lines like 'this winter' afterall
 

pilonv1

Member
Jun 7, 2004
22,668
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chespace said:
Forza 2 will no longer ship in Holiday 2006 -- a new date will be given at X06. :)



So Viva Pinata, Crackdown and Gears carry the first party Christmas?
 

TTP

Have a fun! Enjoy!
Jun 10, 2004
24,539
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WTF with the green environment?!? Needs more background.


LOL @ the camera (WTF with the background again?!?!)


Another background. Blue this time. LOL this movie sucks!

This post is about complaining over work in progress shots
 

sangreal

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May 19, 2005
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TTP said:

WTF with the green environment?!? Needs more background.


LOL @ the camera (WTF with the background again?!?!)


Another background. Blue this time. LOL this movie sucks!

This post is about complaining over work in progress shots
:lol :lol
 

Tieno

Member
May 6, 2006
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TTP said:
[IG]http://www.matrix-explained.com/photopost/data/507/113Matrix_Set.jpg[/IMG]
WTF with the green environment?!? Needs more background.

[IG]http://www.matrix-explained.com/photopost/data/507/113Hugo_Matrix_set2-med.jpg[/IMG]
LOL @ the camera (WTF with the background again?!?!)

[IG]http://www.matrix-explained.com/photopost/data/507/113Making_Revs666-med.jpg[/IMG]
Another background. Blue this time. LOL this movie sucks!

This post is about complaining over work in progress shots
But look at the detail on agent smith!!! wa wa wii wa! Don't like the bloom in the last shot though.
 

mashoutposse

Ante Up
Jun 22, 2004
5,089
892
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Scranton, PA
Forza 2 isn't looking bad at all, but it reminds me of checking out Metropolis Street Racer before GT3. I'm sure GT5 will rewrite the books on driving game graphics, then we'll see a much better looking Forza 3.
 

Wollan

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Feb 10, 2005
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From now on, people don't have the right to be disappointed when viewing pre-release photos? Why are we making up special rules? Developers or publishers need to take responsibility for promo material. Especially when it's relative close to release. I think you guys(or whoever makes the decision) should have waited a bit more(since you have already waited so long) and shown a build with the recently added grass and HDR as in this case it would make 2x the difference. I am now personally aware that this stuff is coming so I will hold my judgment but people who don't know do have the right to hammer it based on how it looks.

hadareud said:
well, be disappointed then - who is telling you that you are not allowed to be?

Just the general word here. 'Yeah these are first pics but don't judge them because more is coming'. It's our right to judge them, they obviously put them out for us to see.
 

hadareud

The Translator
Oct 18, 2004
22,702
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Wollan said:
From now on, people don't have the right to be disappointed when viewing pre-release photos? Why are we making up special rules? Developers or publishers need to take responsibility for promo material. Especially when it's relative close to release. I think you guys(or whoever makes the decision) should have waited a bit more(since you have already waited so long) and shown a build with the recently added grass and HDR as in this case it would make 2x the difference. I am now personally aware that this stuff is coming so I will hold my judgment but people who don't know do have the right to hammer it based on how it looks.
well, be disappointed then - who is telling you that you are not allowed to be?
 

Rhindle

Member
Jun 8, 2004
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Wollan said:
Just the general word here. 'Yeah these are first pics but don't judge them because more is coming'. It's our right to judge them, they obviously put them out for us to see.
Except that in this case, they were leaked, which forced their hand.
 

Skilotonn

xbot xbot xbot xbot xbot
Feb 28, 2006
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There you go... they were real... just like most of us thought...

And I'm glad to hear that it was true after all that many effects were missing from these pics - my only complaints were stuff like the grass and environmental lighting and so on... awesome...

Keeping into account that this baby will be running at 60 fps, 720p, total customisability, 12 cars, and create just any design you can think of to cover the car, you'd be crazy to think that this game won't look and move amazing in the final version...

And I had to laugh at that GT4 shot though - the cars in that game are basically one giant photo texture - absolutely nothing is modeled, the cars are poly-starved, not even the door handles, grills or headlights are modeled... if you go ga-ga over that, then good for you then... I won't hate on that... :)
 

bud

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Nov 22, 2004
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chespace said:
Again, keep in mind that the game is far from finished and many of the graphical effects missing in these screenshots have yet to be stabilized in the build (HDR and various other car shaders). If you're going to nitpick the visual minutae of a game, wouldn't it make more sense to do so with something that's not a work-in-progress?

Anyway, it's GAF so I'm not expecting much more. Hate away, haters!

serious question: why does this game not blow away gt:hd?

isn't that the least we can expect?
 

buckfutter

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Aug 29, 2005
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Skilotonn said:
And I had to laugh at that GT4 shot though - the cars in that game are basically one giant photo texture - absolutely nothing is modeled, the cars are poly-starved, not even the door handles, grills or headlights are modeled... if you go ga-ga over that, then good for you then... I won't hate on that... :)

You kind of just did. And what's the point of modelling all that detail if it barely looks better than a last-gen "photo texture" version? Compare the tailights and tell me something is not wrong with this picture. No-one was going "ga-ga" over a last-gen title, they were pointing out that these screenshots are lacklustre.
 

Kabuki Waq

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Jun 6, 2004
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on the plust side atleast it will have damage modeling and actual racing AI.


On the crap side WTF was up with all those CG video's that were shown? I mean really the game does not look to be even close to those. NOT EVEN CLOSE. Unless something happens and it looks insane in motion.
 

thorns

Banned
Jun 6, 2004
3,106
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buckfutter said:
You kind of just did. And what's the point of modelling all that detail if it barely looks better than a last-gen "photo texture" version? Compare the tailights and tell me something is not wrong with this picture. No-one was going "ga-ga" over a last-gen title, they were pointing out that these screenshots are lacklustre.

because photo textures look good in, umm , photos, and not actually as good in motion?
 

Ghost

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Jun 6, 2004
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Bud said:
serious question: why does this game not blow away gt:hd?

isn't that the least we can expect?

Just a guess but id figure because:

the game is far from finished and many of the graphical effects missing in these screenshots
 

mrklaw

MrArseFace
Jun 10, 2004
59,891
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I agree with Wollan (not the first time)

If lighting and other bits aren't in, then we can't judge until we see more final shots. But it is dumb to release these. Leaked or not leaked, they had to be created by the developer.
 

Blimblim

The Inside Track
Jun 8, 2004
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mrklaw said:
I agree with Wollan (not the first time)

If lighting and other bits aren't in, then we can't judge until we see more final shots. But it is dumb to release these. Leaked or not leaked, they had to be created by the developer.
The first 3 screens were leaked, the new batch from yesterday are official images. At least they were sent to us by MS.
 

Kabuki Waq

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m0dus said:
I think the groundwork demonstrated in those shots is excellent, especially the car models. People act retarded when they don't see over-the-top shader and lighting effects at first glance. The term "Work in Progress" has no meaning here, which has been demonstrated numerous times.


do you think in motion the game will come close to the CG that was shown?

those screens could be released on xbox and they would look bleh ....i mean cmon.
 

Kabuki Waq

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Jun 6, 2004
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Amir0x said:
no of course the game won't reach the CG

but come on guys that should no longer be anyone's base for next-gen titles :p



there is not reaching CG and there is not even coming close to the CG.

Graw did not reach CG but atleast it sort of came close. This looks like an XBOX game in the screens.
 

bud

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Nov 22, 2004
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Deezel said:
Are you judging the screenshots or the game as a whole?

pics

Ghost said:
Just a guess but id figure because:

they did gt:hd in 3 weeks and it's basically an updated version of gt4. forza is an entirely different game and built up from the ground for the 360.

shouldn't this already blow gt:hd away then?
 

Amir0x

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Oct 27, 2004
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Kabuki Waq said:
there is not reaching CG and there is not even coming close to the CG.

Graw did not reach CG but atleast it sort of came close. This looks like an XBOX game in the screens.

i just don't see it. I mean, admittedly, it's not the most amazing shit we've seen next-gen. It's a racing game with huge customization, damage models, 300 vehicles, and the shit like '3d grass' and 'HDR' is being added/fixed says che... and what this game DOES acheive is 60fps @ 720p. Which, for me, is what a racing game needs to do in next-gen to even start to be acceptable.

But I agree this isn't a great looking game... but it still doesn't look OMG GTHD as people are making it to be here
 

Kabuki Waq

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Bud said:
pics



they did gt:hd in 3 weeks and it's basically an updated version of gt4. forza is an entirely different game and built up from the ground for the 360.

shouldn't this already blow gt:hd away then?


well in Flopza's defence. GT games look like crap while playing. Quite a bit worse than forza 1 IMO.
 

bud

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Nov 22, 2004
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it looks better than gt:hd but it doesn't blow it away though, that's what i said.