Franchises destroyed/fatigued by countless sequels

#53
That actually has more do with the platforms (Wii saw a huge decline after 2010 and Wii U....well....yeah) than the series itself. This is like saying Mario Kart has been destroyed because Mario Kart 7's sales aren't even half of Mario Kart Wii's numbers.

Case in point. Bookmark this post and bump this thread when Mario Party 11 comes to Switch.
3DS version barely became a million seller on a 67+ million userbase, sorry but your userbase excuse don't hold any water, neither your MK comparison, as 3DS version sold 15.57 million, an attach rate of 1/4 of it's installed userbase. MP is nowhere near this.
 
#54
This happened to me with the Mega Man Battle Network Franchise. I loved the first 3, but they started releasing at a pace that I just couldn't keep up with. Like Pokemon, Monster Hunter and Harvest Moon, I only have to play one of these games every other year. Not yearly.
 

nekkid

It doesn't matter who we are, what matters is our plan.
#55
#56
I'd say Halo. I don't know if that's due to the existence of sequels or because Bungie weren't the ones making them though.

Either way, it's not 'destroyed' but it certainly isn't anywhere near to its former popularity.
 
#57
Mario Party 10 still sold over 2 million copies.

It's still successful it's just now no longer yearly.

Also the developer, ND Cube, also released two 3DS Mario Parties, Wii Party U and worked on Animal Crossing Amiibo Festival in addition to Mario Party 10.
 
#58
Call of Duty would seem like an easy pick, but then you look at the radical shift in design from Ghosts, to Advanced Warfare, to Black Ops 3, to Infinite Warfare (lesser multiplayer, superior campaign to BO3), to WWII. It makes you realize, "oh, that's a bad take."

Rhythm games are by far the worst offender, in this case. We didn't need a Guitar Hero every year, much less every six months, but somehow we wound up with around 17 of them in the span of just five years. Not to mention DJ Hero, which was a really unique and weird rhythm game, was immediately followed by DJ Hero 2 within a year.

Same goes for Dance Dance Revolution, and worse yet, Karaoke Revolution. Oh, and don't forget Singstar, Dance Central, and most of all, Just Dance. Just Dance is the franchise that keeps the original Wii alive; that poor machine doesn't even support online multiplayer anymore, and yet Ubisoft is still making a significant profit off of those machines that justifies them porting it to an eleven year old console.

I'd say Halo. I don't know if that's due to the existence of sequels or because Bungie weren't the ones making them though.

Either way, it's not 'destroyed' but it certainly isn't anywhere near to its former popularity.
Its fall in popularity is almost certainly because Halo isn't the defining multiplayer FPS anymore. Heck, it wasn't in 2010, either; social media just wasn't prevalent enough to really communicate how much more popular MW2 and Black Ops were than Halo Reach. If people want to shoot stuff with their friends these days, they don't need to have Halo to do it anymore. They can play Call of Duty, Battlefield, Overwatch, Rainbow Six, or Destiny. They can even enjoy relatively niche games like Titanfall or Lawbreakers.
 

Catalix

And on the sixth day the LORD David Bowie created man and woman in His image. And he saw that it was good. On the seventh day the LORD created videogames so that He might take the bloody day off for once.
#59
Army Men

Sure I never played it but it felt like there was a new one every 6 months and it got ridiculous.

I was just about to post this. What a bizarre trend that was. Just an avalanche of pointless Army Men sequels and spinoffs one after the other.
 
#60
3DS version barely became a million seller on a 67+ million userbase, sorry but your userbase excuse don't hold any water, neither your MK comparison, as 3DS version sold 15.57 million, an attach rate of 1/4 of it's installed userbase. MP is nowhere near this.
Yeah, your Mario Party example is still wack. What you're basically saying is that MK is a "destroyed" or "fatigued" IP, based on massive sales drops between Wii/DS and Wii U/3DS, which is clearly nonsense. Your Mario Party example simply doesn't hold water. The series is doing fine. Many Nintendo franchises saw massive gains during the early years of Wii and DS, due to the massive popularity of those systems. Many of then contracted closer to their previous Wii/DS-era levels afterwards. This doesn't mean every single Nintendo franchise is now "destroyed" or "fatigued".

Also, there are two Mario Party 3DS games.
 
#61
Assassin's Creed.

Brotherhood could have just been big story DLC for II.

Rogue should have been the main game in place of Unity, the latter being delayed a year.

Syndicate shouldn't exist.
 
#62
I'd say Halo. I don't know if that's due to the existence of sequels or because Bungie weren't the ones making them though.

Either way, it's not 'destroyed' but it certainly isn't anywhere near to its former popularity.
Call of Duty blowing up between Halo 3 and 4 is I feel the biggest factor as to why Halo declined. Like Modern Warfare came out right after 3, and 4 came out the same time as Black Ops 2. 3's release was one of the biggest events of the generation while 4 felt like much more of a blip in comparison. Anecdotally I've known people who said they moved on from Halo since they got more into COD.

I will say though, the MCC seemed like a PERFECT opportunity for them to regain some lost ground, but, well...
 
#63
This is starting to hurt Ace Attorney in Japan - they've had a yearly release in the series since 2011 (except 2014, where they pushed the trilogy port on 3DS) and the sales have been slipping. Obviously there's other factors involved as well but I would be stunned if Capcom doesn't tap the brakes.
 
#64
Yeah, your Mario Party example is still wack. What you're basically saying is that MK is a "destroyed" or "fatigued" IP, based on massive sales drops between Wii/DS and Wii U/3DS, which is clearly nonsense. Your Mario Party example simply doesn't hold water. The series is doing fine. Many Nintendo franchises saw massive gains during the early years of Wii and DS, due to the massive popularity of those systems. Many of then contracted closer to their previous Wii/DS-era levels afterwards. This doesn't mean every single Nintendo franchise is now "destroyed" or "fatigued".
Ok then, I want to hear your explanation for why MP9 sold less than half from it's predecessor and why it berely managed to become a million seller on a 67+ userbase if fatigue isn't the reason... I'm listening...

Also, there are two Mario Party 3DS games.
Yep, Star Rush not even managed to sell 1 million, but, according to you, the series is as popular as ever. Ok, then...
 
#65
I will say though, the MCC seemed like a PERFECT opportunity for them to regain some lost ground, but, well...
It was a mistake to package that game with three (bad) outsourced ports, and a 343i-developed Halo 2 Anniversary. Seems to me that Microsoft was aiming for just H2A, but realized sales could really go up if they rushed out a collection of shoddy ports in time for the holiday. That really bit them in the ass, and got 343i a lot of undeserved flak.

There were three different studios working on ports in the MCC. Different studios were dedicated to Halo CE, 3, 4, and H2A multiplayer. Lots of serious performance issues and bugs followed, like diagonal aiming in Halo 3 having twice the acceleration from horizontal or vertical aiming (a bug that remains unfixed), and Halo CE's crippling performance problems at launch. Just a humongous, embarrassing mess overall.
 
#66
Call of Duty blowing up between Halo 3 and 4 is I feel the biggest factor as to why Halo declined. Like Modern Warfare came out right after 3, and 4 came out the same time as Black Ops 2. 3's release was one of the biggest events of the generation while 4 felt like much more of a blip in comparison. Anecdotally I've known people who said they moved on from Halo since they got more into COD.

I will say though, the MCC seemed like a PERFECT opportunity for them to regain some lost ground, but, well...
Yep, that's a very good point.

I do wonder what would have been if Bungie had made Halo 4 though. Was there ever a chance for Halo to be massive again?
 
#70
Ok then, I want to hear your explanation for why MP9 sold less than half it's predecessor and why it berely managed to become a million seller on a 67+ userbase if fatigue isn't the reason... I'm listening...
Mario Party 9 sold over 3 million units over a year after Wii had reached its peak. It's still the third best selling entry despite this, selling more than every single entry on N64 and GCN.

Mario Party: Island Tour (3DS) sold over 1.5 million units.

Mario Party 10 sold over two million units on Wii U, Nintendo's least successful console of all time. This is also a better selling entry than one game on N64 and one game on GCN.

Mario Party: Star Rush (the 3DS game you're talking about) sold close to a million and it just released late last year. It's not abnormal for late-era titles on a successful system to sell less than previous entries on the same platform, when a system has gone beyond its peak.

If you want to argue that Mario Party has seen a decline since Mario Party 8 on Wii and the DS game, sure, I don't think anyone would disagree with that. Both 3DS and Wii U caused many Nintendo IP to decline in sales, due to the nature of those platforms and their lack of success compared to the cultural phenomenons of the Wii/DS.

But you said this:

It was among Nintendo's top seller titles during the N64/GCN days, but Nintendo dropped the ball here.
Which is false. Nintendo really hasn't dropped the ball on Mario Party much, if at all. If you want to argue that Nintendo dropped the ball on the successor platforms to the Wii and DS, no one is going to take issue with that.
 
#71
Sonic feels this way.
I really like Sonc, but the way they kept releasing subpar games (and in some cases plain trash) is frustrating, and irreversibly damaged the series.

I see a lot of people talking about Mega Man, but for me, I will never say no to a Mega Man X game.
 
#72
Makes ya wonder how the Lego games do it. They've been averaging 3 games a year for a long time now (not even counting handheld exclusive or mobile software) and has 4 major releases this year plus Dimensions content. Still hasn't actually imploded yet.
 

nekkid

It doesn't matter who we are, what matters is our plan.
#73
This is a good one.

Makes ya wonder how the Lego games do it. They've been averaging 3 games a year for a long time now (not even counting handheld exclusive or mobile software) and has 4 major releases this year plus Dimensions content. Still hasn't actually imploded yet.
It probably helps that they're of different themes each time, which are often tied to movie franchises.

Also kids have a much higher tolerance to the repetitive.
 
#75
Halo.

Seriously. After Bungie left the franchise, it's been a joyless exercise in soulless installments. The setting doesn't even change regularly the way Call of Duty and Battlefield constantly change wars.
 

Einchy

semen stains the mountaintops
#78
Halo.

Seriously. After Bungie left the franchise, it's been a joyless exercise in soulless installments. The setting doesn't even change regularly the way Call of Duty and Battlefield constantly change wars.
They've only released 2 sequels, I'm not sure if I'd call that endless.
 
#79
Call of Duty blowing up between Halo 3 and 4 is I feel the biggest factor as to why Halo declined. Like Modern Warfare came out right after 3, and 4 came out the same time as Black Ops 2. 3's release was one of the biggest events of the generation while 4 felt like much more of a blip in comparison. Anecdotally I've known people who said they moved on from Halo since they got more into COD.

I will say though, the MCC seemed like a PERFECT opportunity for them to regain some lost ground, but, well...
That is a very good point. I might add that increasing the development cycle from three to five years, regardless of the reasons, contributed to that as well. By 2012, CoD was the game in the world of console FPS's and you'd feel that no game can touch it. Even more, MW3 released a year before Halo 4, and despite the game being a slight disappointment, it was the most successful CoD game ever sales-wise (according to this site). So, coming after that didn't really benefit Halo 4, not to mention that the game released like one week before BO2 which was also a huge game with tons of content and became eventually one of the most adored CoD games to this day.
 
#80
They've only released 2 sequels, I'm not sure if I'd call that endless.
I think some people forget that Halo 5 will be 2 years old in just 3 months with no showing of Halo 6 at all yet. While it's still possible we may get Halo 6 in 2018 it's also possible it may be a early 2019 title.

They really aren't coming out with as many sequels as some believe.

Halo Wars 2 and the two top down shooters don't really count as endless sequels.
 
#82
I can see a new campaign and co-op mode each year, but in an era where people are moving back to sticking with a particular shooter for years, throwing out progress annually in COD just seems nuts. I don't know what the solution is since they still sell so many copies each year, but maybe everything should feed into one XP pool where you can apply it to any game you want.
 
#84
Army Men

Sure I never played it but it felt like there was a new one every 6 months and it got ridiculous.

You forgot the PC ones :p...Man I missed these games.They weren't the best,but there was something about them that my friends and cousins all loved to play.Sarges heroes one of my all time favorite games too!


OT:assassins creed for sure..Man they pumped those out every year and for every system it seemed..I own 3 and unity but never played them.Maybe one day.
 

nekkid

It doesn't matter who we are, what matters is our plan.
#86
Ass Creed.
CoD (I only buy every 2-3 years now)

I enjoyed 5, but they should've let Halo die after Reach. Remastered collection and be done.
Why? So they could have avoided selling millions of copies of the sequels?
 
#88
Mario Party 9 sold over 3 million units over a year after Wii had reached its peak. It's still the third best selling entry despite this, selling more than every single entry on N64 and GCN.

Mario Party: Island Tour (3DS) sold over 1.5 million units.
You didn't answer my question and you are just confirming my point, as you can see here, both MP9 (to MP8) and MP:IT (to MP9) sold less than half it's predecessor on two platforms with huge installed userbase. Anyway, your claim that being release late on the platform is the reason for the drop is false. MP7, being released late on GCN, outsold both MP5 and MP6. What you're saying isn't a valid excuse.

Mario Party 10 sold over two million units on Wii U, Nintendo's least successful console of all time. This is also a better selling entry than one game on N64 and one game on GCN.

Mario Party: Star Rush (the 3DS game you're talking about) sold close to a million and it just released late last year. It's not abnormal for late-era titles on a successful system to sell less than previous entries, when a system has gone beyond its peak.
Again, you are confirming my point. While MP10 managed to bump the series sales a bit, it still managed to fall again with MP:SR, the only time the franchise ever managed to reach lower than the 1M+ mark. The fact it was released on Nov. 2016, a time of the year where games usually sell very well, Nintendo ones especially, and failed to sell 1M doesn't help it either.
 
#91
You didn't answer my question and you are just confirming my point, as you can see here, both MP9 (to MP8) and MP:IT (to MP9) sold less than half it's predecessor on two platforms with huge installed userbase. Anyway, your claim that being release late on the platform is the reason for the drop is false. MP7, being released late on GCN, outsold both MP5 and MP6. What you're saying isn't a valid excuse.
It's absolutely a "valid excuse", because I never said it always happened. I said it's not abnormal. Pokemon Black and White 2 sold just over half as many units as Black and White. I doubt you would have said the Pokemon IP was declining back in 2012. Rather, the system it was on (the DS) was long past its peak. This is not an uncommon occurrence and just because it doesn't happen every single time doesn't mean it isn't valid reasoning.

Thing is, we're basically running in circles now. Your entire premise is faulty. You stated Mario Party peaked during the Gamecube era and Nintendo "dropped the ball". You're wrong.

Yearly releases during the N64/GCN milked it dry and ever since, the franchise lives on the shadow of it's former self and Nintendo itself doesn't treat it as a major title like before.
This comment is just flat-out false. The series peaked during the Wii/DS era. And your argument that the series has declined due to "milking" is also wrong. Mario Party, like many Nintendo IP, declined during the past five years due to hardware that wasn't nearly as successful as the previous generation. "Milking" has little, if anything, to do with it.

So yeah, let's just say I strongly disagree with both of your arguments. And I would encourage you to bookmark this thread for the future, as Mario Party 11 on Switch will make my points abundantly clear.
 

Rhaknar

The Steam equivalent of the drunk friend who keeps offering to pay your tab all night.
#92
I wouldnt go as far as destroyed, not by a longshot, but fatigued?

In that case the Souls games.

:(
 
#95
Another: Command & Conquer.

Now, this is partially genre death, but they really cranked that shit out in the last years before EA shuttered it for good. In the decade following RA2/Yuri there was:

Renegade (the FPS hybrid)
Generals
Generals Exp
C&C3
RA3
C&C4
Generals 2 (cancelled)
 

nekkid

It doesn't matter who we are, what matters is our plan.
#98
Another: Command & Conquer.

Now, this is partially genre death, but they really cranked that shit out in the last years before EA shuttered it for good. In the decade following RA2/Yuri there was:

Renegade (the FPS hybrid)
Generals
Generals Exp
C&C3
RA3
C&C4
Generals 2 (cancelled)
I was literally about to suggest this, but I cancelled my comment because I didn't think it was the number of them that was the problem.
 

MMarston

Was getting caught part of your plan?
#99
I think Assassin's Creed takes the cake in terms of the last two gens.

And it's not just from oversaturation in the games market either. Ubi tried to take advantage of every single viable media orifice it could find for that series to touch and crank it to 11. I mean, Halo and Blizzard games were doing the same, but those had the benefit of already being around for a long time, with the latter already having close to 25 years of gaming legacy.


AssCreed tried to cram all that shit in a span of 8-10 years.