Friend held in jail due to false assault claims from female co-worker. (details in OP)

Aug 24, 2016
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One of my friends, who has the generic first name John so it shouldn't be revealing to mention his first name, had recently gone to a Hotel on business for his analytics company. In fact a group of employees went each sharing two-bed hotel suites.

My friend got into some trouble with the female co-worker he was paired with. Apparently he had gone out with his co-workers best friend, unknown to him, and broke up after some troubles. The Co-worker female who stayed with him at the Hotel was extremely close to Johns now Ex-Girlfriend (broke-up 5-6 months ago). So they planned a terrible trick on him.

John left the Hotel to do grab something to eat and this cretin had falsely called the police on him saying that he had attacked and Assaulted her as she was changing in the bathroom. The cops were waiting at the front door, once he gave his name they arrested him right there. She had apparently done something to her arms to make it look like they were red and bruised a bit, and this gave enough for the Cops to arrest him immediately..

It was determined due to the severity of the claim (she also said attempted rape and he was yelling threats among other things, but that's the only part I was told) and the so called "bruising" the police saw, that John would have to stay confined until the trial, this happened over 1 month ago, and John has already lost his job, and his kid is under the care of one of his relatives.

At a local mall a week ago, I saw the two together and though risky, tried slightly tailing them. They were in front of some clothing store and I was behind one of the plant structures they have in the middle of the mall. I recorded with my phone of the Co-worker and the EX girlfriend talking about shopping, and then the subject of John and how it was "sweet revenge" the Co-worker got him in jail, but that's all I could pick up as they entered the store. Also some people were looking at me weird and didn't want to stand out.

Now while that may not be enough to determine that the whole thing was a lie immediately, which it clearly was, the recording would be enough to help with making sure he does not get falsely convicted, and get an investigation started into these individuals.

However, I've been advised by several Police and Lawyers that the state law won't allow me to present the recorded audio/video since the law requires one witness to agree to a recording for it to be admissible in court, and they would just throw it out.

So I'm wondering what options I have to help out my friend who has been wrongfully held until his court date because of a false accusation by a person he didn't even know outside work, and even then barely. If I can't use the recording what other options are there? Can they convict him just based on what was said that day at the hotel and the "supposed" bruising?

This is also a similar situation that the head of this site went through (though more severe) so anyone here who has any ideas please let me know.
 
Jun 3, 2013
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#2
However, I've been advised by several Police and Lawyers that the state law won't allow me to present the recorded audio/video since the law requires one witness to agree to a recording for it to be admissible in court, and they would just throw it out.
The law is pretty weird sometimes.

"Officer can I use this secretly recorded publicly stated confession as evidence?"
"Only if the girls give you permission"
"They said no oddly enough, but it's decent evidence of a crime, nothing can be done?"
"Yeah we can't do anything with that, the criminals said no"
 
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Aug 24, 2016
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Your friend is screwed man. I’m sorry this happened. Do you know for a fact he didn’t do this and what they broke up about?
One of the Co-workers who he went out with to eat had time frames that contradict the reports, and I have the recording shown above, but I may not be able to use it:

Virginia Code § 19.2-62 only makes it a crime to "intercept or record" any oral communication unless at least one party to the conversation consents. Further, the person that knows of and consents to the recording can be the same person that made the recording

Again, this means that if you are participating in the conversation then you may record the conversation without the consent of the other parties, but if you are not participating in the conversation (the other parties do not know you are listening), then you need at least one party to the conservation to consent to the recording.
 
Jan 12, 2009
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#9
So was all that they said was:

"Revenge is so sweet, I got him in jail"?

Because something like that isn't enough, it doesn't prove anything.
 
Mar 10, 2015
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Aug 24, 2016
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Once again I'm gonna call BS on this. .
Seems like you're ignorant of state law if anything.

So was all that they said was:

"Revenge is so sweet, I got him in jail"?

Because something like that isn't enough, it doesn't prove anything.
It's a bit more than that, but I was thinking it would be enough to help him not get convicted, I know it likely' won't be enough for the other two to get charged.
 
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kiunchbb

www.dictionary.com
Aug 6, 2009
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And there's no lawyer in the whole thing? If there is a lawyer, he got locked up for a month without trial, with no prior abuse/violent/criminal history?

I doubt someone worked in the business world will be dumb enough to not use an attorney in potential criminal charges.
 
May 17, 2018
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What kind of irresponsible company pairs men and women to share a hotel suite in this climate. John should have protested that right there.
That just doesn't sound right. I don't see any company no matter how mom and pop let alone any corporation pairing a man and woman in hotel room.
 
Aug 24, 2016
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And there's no lawyer in the whole thing? If there is a lawyer, he got locked up for a month without trial, with no prior abuse/violent/criminal history?

I doubt someone worked in the business world will be dumb enough to not use an attorney in potential criminal charges.
You can be held in jail before the trial, or Remand

Some of the posts here seem to be people reacting without actually looking into how arrests work. The only way you'd be able to circumvent holding is if someone posts bail.
 
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Arkage

Gold Member
Sep 25, 2012
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#17
So she physically harmed herself to get revenge for him breaking up with her friend half a year ago? "They planned a terrible trick on him." Lol ok dude. I'm sure the hotel has cameras that will corroborate one of their timelines. Alternatively, maybe your friend is an asshole to women.

Also wtf stalking women and recording their conversations. What bizarro universe is this?
 
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Oct 1, 2006
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One of the Co-workers who he went out with to eat had time frames that contradict the reports, and I have the recording shown above, but I may not be able to use it:
He could just try to leak it anonymously on certain places to spread it around before the trial. Social media, etc. Try to get a broad exposure for it and generate controversy, particularly at a national level. Let that carry into any sort of juror selection.

So she physically harmed herself to get revenge for him breaking up with her friend half a year ago? "They planned a terrible trick on him." Lol ok dude. I'm sure the hotel has cameras that will corroborate one of their timelines. Alternatively, maybe your friend is an asshole to women.

Also wtf stalking women and recording their conversations. What bizarro universe is this?
Seems like it paid off, because she now appears to be a liar.
 
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Nov 18, 2013
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#22
You can be held in jail before the trial, or Remand

Some of the posts here seem to be people reacting without actually looking into how arrests work. The only way you'd be able to circumvent holding is if someone posts bail.
So, in addition to this amazing(ly unlikely) series of events, you're postulating that a guy with a family and an analytics job nice enough to get him sent to hotels can't post bail?

C'mon, dude. You don't gotta lie to kick it.

Or maybe I'm wrong? Why not post the audio? We're not a court.
 
Aug 24, 2016
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He could just try to leak it anonymously on certain places to spread it around before the trial. Social media, etc. Try to get a broad exposure for it and generate controversy, particularly at a national level. Let that carry into any sort of juror selection.
That only really works if you are one of those people with tons of facebook followers just to have facebook followers. It would likely get some dozens of people at best.
 
Aug 24, 2016
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So, in addition to this amazing(ly unlikely) series of events, you're postulating that a guy with a family and an analytics job nice enough to get him sent to hotels can't post bail?

C'mon, dude. You don't gotta lie to kick it.

Or maybe I'm wrong? Why not post the audio? We're not a court.
I mean as you quoted, most of you don't seem to know how things actually work in law, do you think bail is $400? That's not how it works at all. Especially for the accused crime. You may want to read up before sounding ignorant some more. Lesser (but still close in severity) crimes would be at (based on record) $7500-$10,000 on average. And that's with a Bondsman.
 

ilsayed

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So one month AFTER this incident, you spot them in a mall.

It just so happens that you're there, are recording them, and they stand outside a store talking about shopping and then, for some bizarre reason, switch conveniently to this completely unrelated specific incident that occurred a month prior before entering the store.

Meanwhile, you somehow stand far enough away that they can't see you peeking out from some potted plants like you're in a cartoon but close enough to pick up audio of their conversation in a fucking mall!?
 

Trojita

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#26
You told several policeman that you illegally recorded a conversation? Whaaaaaat.
 
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AV

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May 31, 2018
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    AV

This ain't the first time you've opened a thread with a completely ridiculous and unbelievable story. I can't find the other but it was a similar scenario about your "friend" that looked designed to stoke a response. Someone else called you out on something similar above. Sorry, but this reeks of BS.
 
Dec 8, 2018
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#29
You said he went out to eat so shouldn't he be able to use receipts/credit card statements to prove where he was at the time of the incident? Not to mention any cameras like hotel lobby, gas station, ATM or really any other number of places he could have been seen.

You can be held in jail before the trial, or Remand

Some of the posts here seem to be people reacting without actually looking into how arrests work. The only way you'd be able to circumvent holding is if someone posts bail.

I mean as you quoted, most of you don't seem to know how things actually work in law, do you think bail is $400? That's not how it works at all. Especially for the accused crime. You may want to read up before sounding ignorant some more. Lesser (but still close in severity) crimes would be at (based on record) $7500-$10,000 on average. And that's with a Bondsman.
Also you state that he was being held before trial which is why there was no lawyer involved but here your talking about he couldn't afford bail. Now for there to be bail there would have been a bail hearing which would have involved either a court appointed public defender or your friends lawyer.
 
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Aug 24, 2016
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#30
You said he went out to eat so shouldn't he be able to use receipts/credit card statements to prove where he was at the time of the incident?
This doesn't make anysense, usually when people make abuse calls, fake or truthful to the police, they usually call AFTER the event happened so I'm not sure what this means. The police already made the assumption the abuse happened before they arrived and nabbed him when he cam back waiting for his return.

As for your bottom point no, Lawyers don't get involved until later, the Magistrate (in Virginia anyway) initially, determines if you are qualified for bail (and whether you're held or free) before a lawyer is even involved, the lawyer would be for later to adjust the terms or to give reason to not hold the person charged with the crime.
 
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Dec 8, 2018
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#31
This doesn't make anysense, usually when people make abuse calls, fake or truthful to the police, they usually call AFTER the event happened so I'm not sure what this means. The police already made the assumption the abuse happened before they arrived and nabbed him when he cam back waiting for his return.
It makes perfect sense. She had to tell them a time frame for the incident to have taken place so if he has proof he was somewhere else than that would be taken into account. And if he has already had his arraignment then he would definitely have an attorney.
 
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Aug 24, 2016
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#32
It makes perfect sense. She had to tell them a time frame for the incident to have taken place so if he has proof he was somewhere else than that would be taken into account. And if he has already had his arraignment then he would definitely have an attorney.
he wouldn't have had his attorney there when he was taken in initially. NOW the lawyer could come in (if hasn't by now) but where wouldn't be a lawyer there at the start of this. The initial set-up is first-determination.

As for her, all she would have had to do is that it happened before he left. That along with the fake bruising (which actually is apparently for women to do and has been an issue looking into it many times in the past) was enough for the police to make a reasonable assumption and enough for the mag to put him in holding until trial.
 
Dec 8, 2018
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#33
One of the Co-workers who he went out with to eat had time frames that contradict the reports, and I have the recording shown above, but I may not be able to use it:
You literally said there was witnesses that contradict the times in the report meaning that she gave times and he wasn't there. So it stands to reason that any half competent lawyer could make a case using that witness plus receipts or security cameras.
 
Aug 24, 2016
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You literally said there was witnesses that contradict the times in the report meaning that she gave times and he wasn't there. So it stands to reason that any half competent lawyer could make a case using that witness plus receipts or security cameras.
That's not even close to enough to make a case since the actually trigger was the bruising. They'll likely use the standard "she was in hysterics" or other buzzword offense for the time and place contradictions since the current opinion is that this happened before he left.

My issue is: is the fake bruising claim enough to convict him, hence why I though the audio may at minimum help avoid a conviction if it doesn't do anything to get the other two in trouble. Because how do you prove he didn't touch her? I've been looking into it and it basically becomes a he said/she said usually siding with the women. Almost everything else can be filed under 'she panicked" which makes this really irritating. Of course there may be an easier solution than I'm thinking, which is why I made the thread.
 
Nov 18, 2013
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#35
I mean as you quoted, most of you don't seem to know how things actually work in law, do you think bail is $400? That's not how it works at all. Especially for the accused crime. You may want to read up before sounding ignorant some more. Lesser (but still close in severity) crimes would be at (based on record) $7500-$10,000 on average. And that's with a Bondsman.
Let's get this out of the way first. I've paid bail, on myself and others, with and without a bondsman.

So, your buddy is on $75000-$100000 bail. This is illuminating, both for how high the number is and what that means in the context of the case, and also that you have no idea what the exact number is. So your (hypothetical) buddy is not only considered unstable enough to not get PR'd, but he was slapped with a high bail in a case with (reportedly) weak evidence. This would indicate to me that he's A) A repeat offender, or B) He talked an absolute line of violent bullshit while being arrested.

How 'bout that audio?

Edit: Derp, silly me, that was all hypothetical! You have no actual numbers at all, do you?
 
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Aug 24, 2016
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#36
Let's get this out of the way first. I've paid bail, on myself and others, with and without a bondsman.

So, your buddy is on $75000-$100000 bail. This is illuminating, both for how high the number is and what that means in the context of the case, and also that you have no idea what the exact number is. So your (hypothetical) buddy is not only considered unstable enough to not get PR'd, but he was slapped with a high bail in a case with (reportedly) weak evidence. This would indicate to me that he's A) A repeat offender, or B) He talked an absolute line of violent bullshit while being arrested.

How 'bout that audio?

Edit: Derp, silly me, that was all hypothetical! You have no actual numbers at all, do you?
I'm sure the only hypothetical is your first sentence.

You have once again tried to act like you know something about law, by showing ignorance of the law, in a state you aren't from. With a useless post with random numbers, just to feed your ego.

Congrats?
 

Arkage

Gold Member
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#37
Because how do you prove he didn't touch her? I've been looking into it and it basically becomes a he said/she said usually siding with the women.
Well either the woman is insane because she was OK committing a felony via making false claims and abusing herself, in order to get revenge over a friends breakup from 6 months ago.

Or your friend is an asshole that tried to grab her up.

Guess which one I find more plausible, given the lack of any other credible information? Where's the transcription of the full audio?
 
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Aug 24, 2016
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#38
Well either the woman is insane because she was OK committing a felony via making false claims and abusing herself, in order to get revenge over a friends breakup from 6 months ago.

Or your friend is an asshole that tried to grab her up.

Guess which one I find more plausible, given the lack of any other credible information? Where's the transcription of the full audio?
Your first line only applies if i/he can use the PHONE recording in court. So in the courts eyes it would be your second line or she possibly lied but without anything to really show she did. Other than the time contradictions which may be waived as her panicking.
 
Feb 22, 2018
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Yeah we got no real basis with this story. You could be spinning fables OP. Even if true, there is nothing we can do. You do what you think you must.
 
May 12, 2007
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#49
This doesn't add up. Link the public record of the arrest or this is fabricated.

Companies don't have employees share rooms, especially not coed.
Why couldn't he post bail or why was he denied bail if he had no other history of anything like this?
No mention of his lawyer.
You just happen to see both women, tail them close enough to overhear their conversation and have your phone overhear their conversation (in my experience shit has to be loud for the phone to pick it up), and they just happen to talk about how they are guilty in that few minutes at the mall.
 
Sep 4, 2013
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#50
Ye my bullshit detectors were in the red while reading this story.

Not to say that something similar to this couldn't happen but I'm not buying your particular story op.