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Games Journalism! Wainwright/Florence/Tomb Raider/Eurogamer/Libel Threats/Doritos
- Thread starter papersleeves
- Start date
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I think the fact of the matter is that they can't be profitable without taking gaming ads. I can't find any sources right now, but I know I've heard various people in the business say that the advertising from non-gaming sources simply isn't there in large enough quantities to keep sites running.
No. I fucking hate it. PR statements are written by robots.
Yes, I'd love to completely remove anything remotely PR from the game journalism side of things. Instead of another hype-inducing PR summary, we would get some actual reporting, exploratory interviews, proper critical and reflective criticism, etc.
You don't think games affect people in some way? Or toys for that matter? E.g. Barbie has contributed to a lot of ideas about gender roles, while the torture sequence in Splinter Cell: Blacklist has appalled many, many people. You don't think such phenomena need to be scrutinized, analyzed and criticized for the effects and cultural intentions they convey?
Antiwhippy
the holder of the trombone
RPS has their piece up.
http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2012/10/26/the-flare-path-blows-the-whistle/
http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2012/10/26/the-flare-path-blows-the-whistle/
NervousXtian
Thought Emoji Movie was good. Take that as you will.
I dunno.. let me load up Chud.com (I Robot ad).. and Aintitcoolnews.com (Cloud Atlas ad)... hmm... comingsoon.net bunch of blu-ray ads... yeah... not going to happen.
You think they can make enough money to pay for all that content with ads for Doritos?
No freaking way.
I agree. If he were to speak out against certain practices, he'd be very careful about not implicating people just because their colleagues/friends have participated in them, which would happen so quickly. He seems incredibly considerate and cautious.
I'm sorry if it seemed that I was insinuating you're threatening him. I simply found fault with the "going rogue" part and tried to point out how that could be understood, not that that was my understanding of it. My wording wasn't very clear, either.
NervousXtian
Thought Emoji Movie was good. Take that as you will.
How exactly do the journalists get access to games in development? PR is a necessary evil.. in EVERY industry... no company is giving 100% access with no restrictions. Name me one?
Going to be very few updates on that site if you remove all the previews, trailers, and game dev news.. because you won't have any.
Did I say they can't affect you? Still they are toys.
Totalbiscuit Thoughts on the debacle.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S2keHyS_Ooo
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S2keHyS_Ooo
faceless007
Member
Oh, awesome, OTM is a great show for anyone interested in media and Internet issues. They've also done some good episodes on video games. Looking forward to it.
The part about this that mystifies me is: why are people who review games for a living giving up their credibility and fucking each other over for a free 360/PS3? First of all, is that all your reputation is worth? $300-$500? That's it? Second all, don't these people already own game consoles considering they're instrumental components of their jobs?
I like RPS, but that's a mess of an article that doesn't really say anything. Here's another point, we can talk about these issues without having to tackle it from a "funny" "cute" "here are some goofy pictures" blog style. That's part of the problem. Or I'm just too hungover and grumpy. My head hurts.
No, they hired the girl. In the land of journalistic approaches and PR approaches to gaming sites, which side do you really think polygon falls on, seriously?
Cerebral Assassin
Member
Or they could fill the gap left by not carrying out the work of the PR department with content covering games in more depth than the stand shallow review.
Yeah, wonder how long it'll take for an article about misogny to appear on Kotaku (or a different site), totally missing the actual point.
Oh wow. Previously I actually wanted to make a comment like "Why is no one covering this, it's not like NPR will make a news story about this" but I guess I was wrong, lol
Again, it is great if you have perfect independence, but it is also about the consumer having faith in your review. It is not just about your personally and whether you have conscious bias.
CrunchinJelly
formerly cjelly
That seems like a very 'inside' article aimed at regular RPS readers and nobody else.
Antiwhippy
the holder of the trombone
Yeah, it is their style and I like their style, but sometimes they can get gratingly obtuse.
No, you're correct. That article was puerile.
Air Zombie Meat
Member
One of the guys who took part in the gma tweets mentioned he already had three ps3s. Greed and the universal appeal of free shit I guess. Also it comes back to accepted practices in the business. They don't see anything wrong if it's the norm. Thats why after it was pointed out as shady so many journos (including wainwright) took to twitter to say there was nothing wrong with it.
The appearance of corruption is enough in this case to calcify my, and others opinion of your outfit, whatever it may be. Ancedotally it's one of the reasons why I've long since given up paying attention to game mag reviews and just play whatever I've liked.
The biggest problem is the entanglement of the game industry with the reviewers. Part of it certainly the industries' fault -- they have pushed the boundaries of the relationship farther and farther from integrity at every turn.
However, reviewers are every bit as much to blame, possibly even more so as many of them are trained journalists -- they know what lines are seemingly unethical and yet they continue to cross them in a brazen fashion -- without any regard to appearance unless they get "caught" with their hand in the cookie jar.
Not your fault at all, of course. But just because you don't let the trip, the figurine, the 24 pack of mountain dew and the 10 bags of Doritos
influence you doesn't mean that others aren't out their trading their integrity for a bag of chips. And even if they aren't, it sure looks like it when people are brazenly displaying their industry credentials on their Linkedin for all the world to see.ShockingAlberto
Member
This...is not a good article.
faceless007
Member
I can't tell if this article is a stealth attempt to brag about all the worthless swag he gets or if he's mocking the entire idea that accepting swag is bad form for journalists. Either way, I'm surprised RPS would publish a piece that obfuscates the main issue here.
grimshawish
Banned
I thought people would have thought very carefully about what they post.
Dreadful article. I don't even understand half of it.
Their ignoring the larger issues and quite frankly adapting their own narrative over an issue where their narrative has already been debunked.
Yeah, those are the only 2 conclusions I can draw from it, and both are pretty disappointing.
Rather annoying read. Drudged through it, hoping for something, but nope.
Sputnik Sweetheart
Neo Member
This is not "The RPS Piece", this is a piece on RPS from one of their contributors rather than the core staff. I don't think it muddies the waters if taken in that context.
Thumbs down.
Ah. Still a shitty piece of writing.
grimshawish
Banned
Should be pointing out this article makes no mention of the fact Rab lost his job.
But yeh - its only a Yorkie bar (wait...that was the point...right?)
There was writing?
But yeh - its only a Yorkie bar (wait...that was the point...right?)
There was writing?
Air Zombie Meat
Member
Well that fell flat.
Can anyone translate what is happening here? Also, put down the Thesaurus man, woah.
Mister0079
Member
Who's Tim Stone? I've never seen him write an article for RPS before.
Antiwhippy
the holder of the trombone
Hmmm, still, would be disappointed if this is the only input they have in this matter.
Sputnik Sweetheart
Neo Member
I quite liked it, but it's definitely written regular readers of the site. Going by the reactions it clearly doesn't stand up without that context.
Jackben
bitch I'm taking calls.
I don't really get that article but it's just from one writer at RPS and it probably caters to more hardcore followers of that community. RPS is wonderful so I'm just going to ignore that since I don't understand it anyway.
Still waiting on a statement from Wainwright, MCV or Intent. Doubt we'll get anything but I hope people think twice about the integrity of these journalists and publications in the future.
Still waiting on a statement from Wainwright, MCV or Intent. Doubt we'll get anything but I hope people think twice about the integrity of these journalists and publications in the future.
Sputnik Sweetheart
Neo Member
Well John Walker has been covering this on his personal blog rather than RPS, that could be the case. Maybe a poor choice of topic from Tim with that in mind.
More Fun To Compute
Member
Oh my god the train simulator video.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=86PUB4u2s2A
I could watch that all day.
Osiris
I permanently banned my 6 year old daughter from using the PS4 for mistakenly sending grief reports as it's too hard to watch or talk to her
That RPS piece is just yet another example of the tired defense (used many times before) of "You take this shit too seriously".
You could almost play gamer press bingo with the responses used by various writers to defend the status quo.
"I'm incorruptible!"
"You're just jealous"
"You take this shit too seriously, let me mock you!"
Just two more to go and I've got a full line on my card, what do I win?
You could almost play gamer press bingo with the responses used by various writers to defend the status quo.
"I'm incorruptible!"
"You're just jealous"
"You take this shit too seriously, let me mock you!"
Just two more to go and I've got a full line on my card, what do I win?
*I win nothing, there's no winners in this game, only losers
The appearance of corruption is enough in this case to calcify my, and others opinion of your outfit, whatever it may be. Ancedotally it's one of the reasons why I've long since given up paying attention to game mag reviews and just play whatever I've liked.
The biggest problem is the entanglement of the game industry with the reviewers. Part of it certainly the industries' fault -- they have pushed the boundaries of the relationship farther and farther from integrity at every turn.
However, reviewers are every bit as much to blame, possibly even more so as many of them are trained journalists -- they know what lines are seemingly unethical and yet they continue to cross them in a brazen fashion -- without any regard to appearance unless they get "caught" with their hand in the cookie jar.
Not your fault at all, of course. But just because you don't let the trip, the figurine, the 24 pack of mountain dew and the 10 bags of Doritos
Totally agree with both of you. I know the current system is flawed, but it's a fun hobby that I don't want to lose (yet). I've met people like Rob did, who are quite corrupt, but they don't see the problem in it. It makes it harder for the people who are trying to be as unbiased as possible.
Our site is however very strict on these things. Our editor-in-chief really wants an independent site, how difficult that may sound. I think it's partial thanks to him that my views are different than the average doritos journalist. Comes to show that training is a vital issue as well, really. Pretty sure most (young) gaming reviewers just get the wrong idea and keep doing what they think is right.
This.
I also have to think if the integrity issue is this widespread, it has a lot more to do with the industry norms from within these online rags. I'm not saying it's right, but I can understand anyone facing intense pressure from an employer to "not" bite the hand that feeds as being a worthy reason for so many to just give them what they want.
On a side note, I worked for a brief spell at one such online blog and the environment was very indicitive of a good ole boys club. You were either in the group that received invites to all the events, free games and shwag, or you weren't. It's why I left, really. No scruples, no moral integrity.
asperger RPS crip sheet, re: tim stone's article.
it's a humour piece. tim stone is rps'/uk pc gaming's famed simulator grognard beardman gamer, it's a common theme for him to make light of how unglamorous and dry his field is, the piece is an extension of this theme which satirises the current narrative.
it's complex. don't hurt your head.
it's a humour piece. tim stone is rps'/uk pc gaming's famed simulator grognard beardman gamer, it's a common theme for him to make light of how unglamorous and dry his field is, the piece is an extension of this theme which satirises the current narrative.
it's complex. don't hurt your head.
Yeah... neither funny nor informative. I guess that's how seriously some of them take the issue?
Guy who did the shogun 2 review for EG I believe.
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