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Gametrailers' "The Castlevania Retrospective"

I actually wouldn't mind Aria being remade with SotN-quality sprites for 3DS or something.

Nothing else changed, I just want slightly better sprite work.
 
Segata Sanshiro said:
I put Circle in the middle of the GBA pack. HoD is just so bland. It was a game made without any good ideas aside from "copy SotN". Aria of Sorrow, I think, is the best game IGA made (I don't give him credit for Symphony because he really doesn't deserve it :p). The soul system was good, the story was interesting, graphics and music were excellent. It really felt like its own thing.

Circle is good but it has serious balance issues. Considering it was an up-ported GBC game, it is pretty remarkable, though. It's challenging, which is nice for a Metroidvania. I had to play the damn game directly under a lamp the whole time, but it was definitely worth it. Harmony was so blah I thought I was sick of the whole Metroidvania concept. It was kind of the Ace Attorney 2 of Metroidvanias.
Circle was the best in my view, it sucks that you couldnt see shit when it came out though.
 
ShockingAlberto said:
I actually wouldn't mind Aria being remade with SotN-quality sprites for 3DS or something.

Nothing else changed, I just want slightly better sprite work.
I'd say ditch the pastel backgrounds and nonsensical castle layout as well. Aria is a great game that deserves credit, but its achievements are constantly overblown in comparison to the other GBA entries, just like HoD's shortcomings are usually overblown.
 
drizzle said:
Wait, this video actually make the 3D Castlevanias sound decent.

I only had a minor experience with One of the Nintendo 64's Castlevanias, but most of my hate towards the 3D iterations of the game come from reading how people through they were horrible.

They didn't highlight any of the major problems people always complain about. Weird.

The N64 games are very under-appreciated. Part 3 here wasn't nearly as positive about them as I'd be, but at least it wasn't as bad as I was thinking it might, considering how often Castlevania 64 and LoD get bashed...

But yeah, Legacy of Darkness really is a pretty good game. Yes, the framerate's not so good, particularly in High Resolution mode, but I at least don't mind N64 framerates, and I played the whole thing in high res. The graphics are pretty good (CV64 looks much rougher, but LoD definitely improved things a lot), the music's great (in both versions), and the gameplay and level design...

Well, that's where CV64/LoD are so, so different from the PS2 games, or the new PS3/360 game. Instead of being an action-focused hack and slash room clearing game with occasional jumping puzzles, as those are, it's a platform adventure game with lots of puzzles and jumping, with occasional action. Sure, you fight enemies, but the main focus of the N64 games is on platforming, exploration, and puzzle solving, above anything else. It really has a very different feel from the hack-and-slash action of the PS2 and beyond 3d Castlevanias. It's as much Mario 64 or Ocarina of Time inspired as it is anything, really, I think, there are definite influences from games like those, along with their own ideas. The game isn't at Mario 64 or OoT levels of quality, to be sure, but it is pretty solid even so, in my opinion.

Oh yeah, and there really is a lot of platform jumping... but it's intuitive and the jumping controls are great. While in many games 3d platform jumping can be quite tricky, CV64/LoD have some good controls. Your characters will grab onto any platform edge they get anywhere near, pretty much, so as long as you jump somewhere near where you want to go, you should grab on successfully. As long as you're careful and line up jumps a bit, jumping works well.

As for the combat, Cornell is extremely powerful, particularly in wolf mode. He has strong melee and ranged attacks, and in wolf mode even the bosses are mostly easy. As a result, until you finish his mode and play as Henry, Rienhart, or Carrie, who are weaker physical attackers than Cornell, if you manage your red crystals well the main challenge will come from the jumping and adventure parts, not so much combat. I don't mind that, myself, the combat is fun enough as it is and the rest of the game provides plenty of challenge.

I would recommend against playing as Rienhart, though. He has no ranged attack, and ranged attacks are much easier to use in this game than melee, so he's at a definite disadvantage.

Oh, he says that there isn't a map. That's true, but no map is needed. While you do a good amount of exploration within each level, CV64 and LoD are linear games made up of levels, and once you complete each level you can't return to the previous one. You can't get too lost.

From the video, I think that he found the N64 Castlevanias a bit too slow paced and dull. I guess I can see that, they are slower paced than most other Castlevania games, and they have more adventure game elements too (there are actual puzzles in this game beyond just jumping; they're not incredibly hard, but they are there), but I thought that the total package works really well, and really liked LoD despite my initial worries that it'd be as bad as so many people said it was. There are some flaws -- the melee combat, the framerate, etc -- but I think LoD is definitely much more good than bad. It is a flawed game for sure, but it has a good side too.

As for the PS2/Xbox ones, though... hack and slash action-RPGs. Completely different genre from the N64 games. Run straight along long cooridors, stop and hit attack for a while until the enemies die, rinse and repeat again and again and again. It gets boring very quickly, only the decent music and good art design (and playability, even if it's boring and mostly easy somehow it's playable) save it at all... but yeah, they are not good games overall. Just far too boring and repetitive. Hypnotically playable, I guess, but so bland and repetitive...

He says that LoI and CoD 'reminded people that Castlevania was all about action' or something, but I would say that that's not true. The NES/16-bit games were just as much about platforming as they were about action, but the PS2/Xbox games almost totally ditch the platforming in favor of running down innumerable cooridors and pathways. The N64 games are different too, but at least they have both platforming AND action as major components...

I think LoI/CoD were obviously inspired by the Metroidvania games as well as various 3d action titles, but it doesn't work nearly as well here as in 2d.
 

Phenomic

Member
Iga wrote out Circle of the Moon after it sold over a million copies... something apparently which nothing else before that did in the series. I never knew that but that begs the question... why would you write it out of the time line.
 

Celine

Member
farnham said:
handheld castlevanias are the best

especially dawn and aria of sorrow.
.

Phenomic said:
Iga wrote out Circle of the Moon after it sold over a million copies... something apparently which nothing else before that did in the series. I never knew that but that begs the question... why would you write it out of the time line.
lol wikipedia.
The source cited (IGN ) actually states 500K WW.
 

Boney

Banned
Please don't compare the atrocity that is Dawn with the perfection of Aria. It makes me sick. The only one that can touch it's ankles is Ecclesia.

Seeing this episode made me realize there's no new 2d Castlevania in the work :(

Shig said:
Wait, Aria has a nonsensical castle layout and people are too hard on Harmony? That's... so incredibly backwards. Aria has the most contiguous and natural flow of any Metvania castle by a wide margin, Harmony's is a total chore.
Absolute truth. Aria flows incredibly well, comparable to Super Metroid. Harmony is just awful.
 

Shig

Strap on your hooker ...
GrotesqueBeauty said:
I'd say ditch the pastel backgrounds and nonsensical castle layout as well. Aria is a great game that deserves credit, but its achievements are constantly overblown in comparison to the other GBA entries, just like HoD's shortcomings are usually overblown.
Wait, Aria has a nonsensical castle layout and people are too hard on Harmony? That's... so incredibly backwards. Aria has the most contiguous and natural flow of any Metvania castle by a wide margin, Harmony's is a total chore.
 
I've been doing write-ups on the games all month(well slacking now thanks to Fallout + other stuff). Anyway from what I've played

Castlevania IV - Yeah I can't bring myself to hate this game. Sure it's easy peasy but hell I still play through it everytime I pick it up. I can always stick to not using 8-way whipping or whatever else if I want to make it more challenging.
Castlevania Chronicles - Pretty much makes Castlevania 1 obsolete. Good lord does it get rough in the second half though.
Castlevania III - I still dig it but it's one of those games where at certain points I have to do certain things or face death. Remembering when exactly to jump in the clocktower stage is a good example.
Circle of the Moon - Can't stand it. I hate the stiff controls and the castle is mostly-filled with nothing.
Harmony of Dissonance - Piss-easy but at least the controls are better. Shame that the castle is an absolute mess to navigate. This is especially annoying at some points where I get dumped into different castles depending on what door I enter(and I ain't talking about those portals either).
Aria of Sorrow - Still class as far as the handhelds are concerned. It's my most replayed entry of the series...I'm on my 6th playthrough now.
Symphony of the Night - I've played through this game too many times to give even a good subjective opinion of it. At this point it'd be like talking trash about one of my vital organs.

Going to pick up Lament & Curse before too much longer. I still have to re-do Rebirth, Rondo, and Bloodlines as well.

The DS Castlevanias I'll get if I for some reason start hating myself. PoR I gave a pass originally because it was the first DS Castlevania I actually played(started getting bored when I reached the alternate Portraits). Dawn is a shitfest as far as I'm concerned. Ending bosses with a stylus-action is the worst idea ever and it's just so damn dull all the way. Apparently it's good in Julius mode but that requires a completed playthrough doesn't it? Not happening. Order is good but eh well maybe I'll give it another go later.
 

Negator

Member
Man, that episode really hit me with a nostalgia bomb. Circle of the Moon, Aria of Sorrow, Dawn of Sorrow, Portrait of Ruin, and Order of Ecclesia were all amazing games, and it makes me giddy when I think about a new 3DS Castlevania game.
 
Aria is still my favorite of the Castletroid, i remember playing SOTN after playing it expecting to get what people keep telling me was the best Castlevania in this style only to find a game inferior to aria of sorrow with pretty good music.
 

jett

D-Member
Nice ep as usual, has made me noticed that Lords of Shadow has a bunch of references from the portable games hidden in the characters' names, like Carmilla, Brauner and others.
 

Foffy

Banned
Phenomic said:
Iga wrote out Circle of the Moon after it sold over a million copies... something apparently which nothing else before that did in the series. I never knew that but that begs the question... why would you write it out of the time line.

He said it was because of it being designed like a side game. I think it and the N64 iterations of the franchise were reinstated into canon around 2006.
 

Phenomic

Member
Foffy said:
He said it was because of it being designed like a side game. I think it and the N64 iterations of the franchise were reinstated into canon around 2006.

Yeah I get the N64 ones maybe but Circle and the one with Sonia Belmont. Yeah no dice, I remember when he announced that, I declared lies and BS and I still declare lies and BS. It's Dracula + Whip + Castle = Canon.

Even if he had not worked on them perhaps he could declare this. It's not like something like Metal Gear for NES where it was made without Kojima or the blessing of Kojima.
 

MAtgS

Member
So what about Legends? I just went through the game's script & didn't really see anything that can't be easily retconned.
 

Foffy

Banned
Crewnh said:
This episode makes IGA sound really douchey with the whole "protecting the sanctity of his canon".

And Circle of the Moon looked way better than Harmony of Dissonance. I don't know what the fuck he's talking about visuals wise.

Note that when CotM came out, the GBA had an awful backlight, making the game difficult to fully see. The following games were made brighter to compensate for that.
 
For some reason I got into the DS ones more than the GBA ones (despite getting all at launch).

Have barely touched HoD, CotM played more so but no where near the time and love I put into Aria/DS ones.

Aria & Dawn just merge to 1 awesome game in my memory.
 

Sinople

Member
Some of you are a bit harsh with IGA about his time-line.
He was trying to have a coherent universe and decided not to include a couple of games to avoid it being an complete mess.
That doesn't mean those games magically vanished from reality.
 

Shig

Strap on your hooker ...
Sinople said:
Some of you are a bit harsh with IGA about his time-line.
He was trying to have a coherent universe and decided not to include a couple of games to avoid it being an complete mess.
That doesn't mean those games magically vanished from reality.
That might make sense if his changes actually made the timeline work. It's a complete mess with or without the subtractions he's made, so why bother discrediting others' work?
 
Foffy said:
Note that when CotM came out, the GBA had an awful backlight, making the game difficult to fully see. The following games were made brighter to compensate for that.
Hmm. I guess I didn't have a problem with that since I played it on the SP.

_dementia said:
what?
 

MechaX

Member
Just finished watching the vid.

Egh, it's absolutely criminal that Aria didn't sell nearly as well as it deserved to.
 

Salsa

Member
Nostalgia glasses off, GBA+DS games are the best since Symphony. I was a big old-school castlevania lover back then, but after SOTN i just prefer the metroidvania type.
 

Shig

Strap on your hooker ...
MechaX said:
Just finished watching the vid.

Egh, it's absolutely criminal that Aria didn't sell nearly as well as it deserved to.
Yeah, they released Harmony and Aria WAY too close together, only 8 months between 'em. Not really sure what they were thinking there.

FWIW, though, lots of people probably bought the CV Double Pack on the strength of Aria's reputation.
 

GatorBait

Member
SalsaShark said:
man
SOTN might just be the best game ever made
Remembering SOTN and now seeing these handheld Castlevanias for pretty much the first time makes me want an epic 2D Castlevania on a next gen system. Will never happen though. :lol
 
GatorBait said:
Remembering SOTN and now seeing these handheld Castlevanias for pretty much the first time makes me want an epic 2D Castlevania on a next gen system. Will never happen though. :lol
Maybe on xbla or something. How did HD fare?
 

Salsa

Member
Crewnh said:
And Circle of the Moon looked way better than Harmony of Dissonance. I don't know what the fuck he's talking about visuals wise.

I never understood this. Harmony always looked ugly as fuck to me.
 
Dawn of Sorrow was probably the best handheld title since Circle of the Moon because of Julius mode, a side mode far better than the main game.
Crewnh said:
And Circle of the Moon looked way better than Harmony of Dissonance. I don't know what the fuck he's talking about visuals wise.
Probably visual effects, which it seemed to have a lot more from the video.
 
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