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|OT| Genshin Impact |OT| Legend of Gacha: The Whale Waker (free-to-play action RPG)

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They never balance a char over Abyss, just when the money hurts they do something about.

I mean, Zonghly get 3 buffs at row.
He's also the only character to ever be buffed though.

If MHY is expecting people to use Shenhe in Abyss in certain teams that are borderline unusable outside of that, and they never intend to change her kit... Isn't that pretty much the same as adjusting a character's numbers and skills based on two weeks of Abyss?
 

Fake

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He's also the only character to ever be buffed though.

If MHY is expecting people to use Shenhe in Abyss in certain teams that are borderline unusable outside of that, and they never intend to change her kit... Isn't that pretty much the same as adjusting a character's numbers and skills based on two weeks of Abyss?

There are still plenty of 4* chars with bugs and error between elemental skill/burst, but they never care. Zhongly get a buff, but I remember people over reddit complaining about rotine gameplay, like world monster, weekly boss, etc...

IMO that moment was the best part of the entire Genshin Impact community because people have being dennying about GEO element to be a total shit in the game, 'bruh man geo is defensive' bla bla bla, but when Zhongly get his banner people like 'OMG, is the GEO really that bad?'.

Instead of buffing Geo Element, boom, they buffed Zhongly.
 

Pejo

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I was just reading a thread on Reddit about the disappointment in Genshin's story lately, more accurately in how it relates to the story of Honkai Impact, which a lot of players regard as the more interesting story. Then I read this post that a guy made that makes a lot of sense. It's a good read.
The Traveller may be unvoiced, but they're far from a robot. The story has characterised them as stubborn, kind, cocky, curious and cautious. And I'm not talking about the choices, those are just traits of how the Traveller is written.

It's easy to pay less attention to it under the assumption that the traveller is a self insert, but once you distance yourself, Traveller is more of a rounded character than many an rpg protagonist.

That said, I think a lot of the "issues" with Genshin's story stem from two things:

  • It works like a stage play. Limited visual presentation due to things like download sizes mean they use a very minimalist style for a lot of the story telling. This combined with being stuck on one single character and an open world format, means things like time jumps feel less natural, and more suspension of disbelief is required (like with a stage play)
  • The game spells out its simpler concepts through Paimon's summaries, but not its more complex ones. The players tend to take a very surface level interpretation of the story, and then when more complex concepts come up, they take it as a mistake rather than an intent.
As an example: Eula's Quest, many people assume you're just meant to feel bad for her, and that her being dysfunctional is just the writers not knowing how to write. That's just not true. She's meant to be dysfunctional. A guy calls her out on it in extreme detail. But because Paimon says people are rude to Eula, players assume that should be the only takeaway. Even though Paimon is not a narrator, but a character who is often wrong about things.

Raiden's quest has a similar issue. People tune out because its initial premise is mundane, but neglect the amount of philosophy and introspection that goes behind it. They assume it's just a date because you're going through town, but it's always about her relationship with her people, not with the Traveller. Heck, a lot of people seem to have taken Yae's comment about Raiden being a sulking otaku at face value, even though it's pretty clear Yae loves spinning the facts, and Raiden hasn't touched a light novel in her life before the quest.

Same goes for Gorou and Kokomi. Yes, Kokomi is a genius. In theory. The issues she has with her army, and the ways in which things tend to go wrong, those do not disprove how she's smart, they just show the ways in which she isn't. Kokomi is a textbook gifted person: Smart on paper, very capable in what they're good at, consistently under- and overestimated by peers. But players quickly assume this is just an oversight, and Kokomi should be smart in all regards, even though it's the actual story that she's incapable of handling all aspects of the job.

--

Something important to consider is just how different Honkai and Genshin are at their cores. They share a lot of concepts and thematics. However, Honkai is like an anime series brought to multimedia through manga, game, VN etc... Where everything is built around the story.

Genshin on the other hand is an interactive world with stories inserted into it. A sandbox of lore if you will, with very different challenges. And imo, a lot of the criticisms leveled against it don't hold up well under scrutiny.

This also explains why events, and character quests focused on established characters are regarded much stronger storywise: They tend to be much more isolated and less introductory. Whereas Raiden needed her story quest to show us who she is as a person, Venti no longer needed that introduction. The current event takes us to a locale we're familiar with, using characters we already know, to play out a more traditional ensemble cast story, and it works.

This is why Genshin's writing will likely be an up and down process for many. Established ideas and characters are just much easier to process. New ones however, consistently have to live up to false expectations.
Thread can be found here:
 

Fake

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When I started playing Genshin Impact BETA, every part of the game was appealing, but knowing how the story would end was my main goal.

I not so sure about that anymore. Expecting a big plot revelation, but after Shogun feeling rushed, I have my concerns. Traveler indeed will show eventually how powerful he is.
 
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Reizo Ryuu

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The problem, well it's not really a problem, but the issue doesn't lie with the "sparse" story telling, or having more time to tell a story.
Yes it would be nice if character arcs in genshin were as badass as mei's in honkai, but a lot of that is also simply honkai having better worldbuilding.
The from software souls games do sparse story telling really well, and even something like Lost Odyssey's 'hannah's departure', is barely 8 minutes long, but manages to completely suck you in:

Genshin just sucks at worldbuilding because of them wanting to tell the story over, at least, 7 acts, spread out over characters that lose most relevance right after the next .x update.
All the interesting bits about the traveler are on a literal drip feed, but don't worry guys, the dragons are coming and it's gonna be sick! it's not
 
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Saber

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Maybe an overthinking, but the lore and bits of info of characters being gated by friendship levels also might be a downside in factor of story. I remember reading Kaeya and Sacarose interaction, but nothing outside of this happens because theres not much to do except waiting for story/sidequests events for a possibility of interaction between them. Also, the story of Kayea might be never go beyond what his friendship rewards tells you, unless they remember what he is and decide its important for the story.
 
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I was just reading a thread on Reddit about the disappointment in Genshin's story lately, more accurately in how it relates to the story of Honkai Impact, which a lot of players regard as the more interesting story. Then I read this post that a guy made that makes a lot of sense. It's a good read.
It's an interesting post, but I disagree with him. He says he finds criticism of the game's story to not hold up. I think it does.

If people feel sad for Eula or see Raiden's quest as a date, that's a direct result of the writing. Of course writers can't know for certain how the audience will interpret their story, but since a large portion of players come away with these conclusions, there's gotta be something in the writing that made that happen.

For example, I did feel sad for Eula because the Mondstadt populace treats her like shit. The quest reveals that's due to her heritage. We also know she tries to distance herself from that reputation. Her mannerisms are strange due to her upbringing and the alienation she experiences, but she's still shown as a morally good character. Is it any surprise then that people feel sorry for her? Eula might be dysfunctional, but so are Klee, Bennett, Fischl etc. who all have quirky personalities too. Another aspect is that many players will never get access to her full backstory, which is locked behind friendship levels. I don't have Eula so I don't fully understand her. It's impossible for me to. Unless I look it up online, which I've never thought about until now.

I also disagree with his take on Kokomi. The issue is that the genius part of her is never shown. When are her brilliant tactics ever shown off? That one time she showed up with reinforcements and healed everyone? Is that even tactics? It would have been way clearer and more impactful if she was shown to turn around a disadvantaged fight by making use of terrain or flanking. As it is, we know more about her faults than her strengths. Is it any wonder then that people have a one-sided view of her?

So whose fault is it when Eula, Raiden and Kokomi are misunderstood? It's not the player who's trying to engage with and understand these characters. That's shifting the blame IMO.
 

Pejo

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It's an interesting post, but I disagree with him. He says he finds criticism of the game's story to not hold up. I think it does.

If people feel sad for Eula or see Raiden's quest as a date, that's a direct result of the writing. Of course writers can't know for certain how the audience will interpret their story, but since a large portion of players come away with these conclusions, there's gotta be something in the writing that made that happen.

For example, I did feel sad for Eula because the Mondstadt populace treats her like shit. The quest reveals that's due to her heritage. We also know she tries to distance herself from that reputation. Her mannerisms are strange due to her upbringing and the alienation she experiences, but she's still shown as a morally good character. Is it any surprise then that people feel sorry for her? Eula might be dysfunctional, but so are Klee, Bennett, Fischl etc. who all have quirky personalities too. Another aspect is that many players will never get access to her full backstory, which is locked behind friendship levels. I don't have Eula so I don't fully understand her. It's impossible for me to. Unless I look it up online, which I've never thought about until now.

I also disagree with his take on Kokomi. The issue is that the genius part of her is never shown. When are her brilliant tactics ever shown off? That one time she showed up with reinforcements and healed everyone? Is that even tactics? It would have been way clearer and more impactful if she was shown to turn around a disadvantaged fight by making use of terrain or flanking. As it is, we know more about her faults than her strengths. Is it any wonder then that people have a one-sided view of her?

So whose fault is it when Eula, Raiden and Kokomi are misunderstood? It's not the player who's trying to engage with and understand these characters. That's shifting the blame IMO.
I see your point.

Maybe the real issue is Genshin's writers underestimating (or maybe being dead on with) the intelligence or interest level of the players. Genshin is a much more casualized game, aimed at a huge variety of audiences. If you make some really thought provoking, hard to understand but truly interesting story, you risk losing half or more of the playerbase that skips dialogue for non-essential quests, never looks at the character info in the menus, nor never reads flavor text on items.

Maybe what we get is just the most focus tested and easiest to digest story content. That leaves the Dark Souls like lore and worldbuilding to satisfy the more hardcore players that are looking for a real story beyond surface level stuff. So maybe both things are true.

Addressing some individual points that you brought up - In my opinion, Kokomi's talent isn't really being a genius. It's being autistic. Not in derogatory way, but she has laser focus to certain things while being oblivious to other things. She goes through planning and being prepared not because she's a strategist, but because it might be hard for her to think on her feet and make tough choices in the heat of the moment. That's what I got from her character anyways.

I think the date thing with Ei was way overblown. Sure the traveler was there and guiding her, but really it was mostly about her people and what they've been up to since her hybernation. I don't think they did a good job showing that eternity was "wrong" though, that part of the story was kinda poorly realized, but I get that it's what they were going for.

Eula I had no idea people just felt bad for her. I thought it was obvious that she knew she was making things harder on herself by acting how she does, but I took it as one of those things like "I know how to deal with people who hate me based on my lineage, but I wouldn't know how to react if they hated me because of my own personality or actions". The fear of being rejected on a personal level instead of a clan/family level probably drives most of her personality quirks. But yea, they do hide a lot of her inner workings and back story behind friendship levels which does require actually pulling her or reading it online. I don't hate that though, the idea of getting more character details for investing in them.
 

Pejo

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My brain is fried today so I can't really add anything, but they have another stupid web event
Didn't start yet for NA apparently.

 
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Pejo

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Rewards rivaling that of our first anniversary because they won some meaningless Playstation award.

*edit*

New crafting UI for 2.4
 
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Fake

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Rewards rivaling that of our first anniversary because they won some meaningless Playstation award.

Genshin Impact could easily won the mobile Game of the Year in the Games Award Show. The only barrier are the reviewers with those days are very 'angry' over those appealing games. 10% vote kill every change of those games won.
 
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BlackM1st

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I thought this was from the meme account GenshinImapct or something...
LMAO


Rewards rivaling that of our first anniversary because they won some meaningless Playstation award.

*edit*

New crafting UI for 2.4
That's just sad ahaha

New crafting looks OK I guess. Hope it's more usable.

But honestly, they need to completely revamp the Artifacts sorting/equipping etc. Comparably to how important artifacts are, their system is a total joke.
 
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crumbs

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Rewards rivaling that of our first anniversary because they won some meaningless Playstation award.

*edit*

New crafting UI for 2.4

Those UI updates are long overdue. Not that I spend much time with it, but hopefully they also apply this style to the teapot crafting menu.
 

Pejo

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Yea, she's pretty fun, but they ruined her midair hold ground smash in non-APHO. So unsatisfying. I also don't like her new ult, but I get why they changed it.

I was just finishing up SSS'ing Fischl too, so I thought I'd finally get a break on Gold Pin farming, but right back to the mines I go. Happy she's F2P at least. Her charge move gameplay is how I always had hoped a Himeko Augment would work.
 
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BlackM1st

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So apparently "Twitter" tried to cancel/ is actively redrawing Shenhe. And I missed all the fun because I was busy looking at her miserable numbers.

Apparently people were/is bothered by the lack of pants and panties on her model...


Hm... kinda makes me want to pull for the bird lady just to spite the hate brigade...

Not like I see anything particularly good or special about her, but the reactions she produced among the Twitter crowd is worthy of Cocogoat DMG numbers lol
 

Pejo

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So apparently "Twitter" tried to cancel/ is actively redrawing Shenhe. And I missed all the fun because I was busy looking at her miserable numbers.

Apparently people were/is bothered by the lack of pants and panties on her model...


Hm... kinda makes me want to pull for the bird lady just to spite the hate brigade...

Not like I see anything particularly good or special about her, but the reactions she produced among the Twitter crowd is worthy of Cocogoat DMG numbers lol
Literally the first day she was announced by the official twitter account, reddit had 2 threads up of redesigns to make her "less sexualized".

What the hell happened to people in the past 10 years. Now they want everything to be boring and ugly just like real life.
 
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I've heard of people trying to cancel Eula as well due to her backstory. Don't know if that's been discussed in this thread already. I mostly try to ignore that nonsense.

Shenhe's main issue is her kit right now. She doesn't seem worth the primos. A shame, her design is cool and I'd love to pair her with Ganyu in the future.
 

BlackM1st

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cancel Eula as well due to her backstory
Not even her own backstory. Something about her family owning a slaves 1000s years ago. Just 1 line of text somewhere in the obscure lore made people lose their minds lmao

What the hell happened to people in the past 10 years. Now they want everything to be boring and ugly just like real life.
IKR. Sad fucks want to spread misery around instead of enjoying the beauty.

her design is cool

Emotion Reaction GIF


Yeah, her design is awesome:



Some artists are doing phenomenal work with her art.
 
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Saber

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I wouldn't bother guys. This is the typical Reddit retard bullshit.

I remember once reading that people there was trying to put pressure on the devs because of "lack of husbandus" characters, claiming that Genshin was transforming itself in some kind of male gaze focused game.
 
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Fake

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Literally the first day she was announced by the official twitter account, reddit had 2 threads up of redesigns to make her "less sexualized".

What the hell happened to people in the past 10 years. Now they want everything to be boring and ugly just like real life.

Real life ugly is 'beauty' now, so games should follow the same thinking. The amount of hate Genshin Impact get on Twitter just because the girls is insane. I get tired and nuked my account.

I've heard of people trying to cancel Eula as well due to her backstory. Don't know if that's been discussed in this thread already. I mostly try to ignore that nonsense.

People was too busy playing the game, so IDK if this was even discussed here. They not only tried to cancel Eula, but the entire game via Twitter and Facebook. The backlash was after that Eula dancing video.
 
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YukiOnna

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I've heard of people trying to cancel Eula as well due to her backstory. Don't know if that's been discussed in this thread already. I mostly try to ignore that nonsense.

Shenhe's main issue is her kit right now. She doesn't seem worth the primos. A shame, her design is cool and I'd love to pair her with Ganyu in the future.
Yeah they were, it was brought up here. Of course, it was the twitter crowd who brought it up.
 

Pejo

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Interesting read on upcoming playable characters. From "all but confirmed" to some highly unlikely ones.

 

BlackM1st

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Paimon: Big titty adult Paimon will become a reality I SWEAR

Best part. Besides, I read some mad ramblings about Paimon being the Sustainer herself. We just traveled/were send back in time. So yeah, literally anything is possible lmao
 

Pejo

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Broken Pines in one 10 roll. Praise be.
Looks like your family gets presents this year after all.

The wrap up to the event was kinda shit. I expected them to take a different angle with Joserf, or at least expand on Durin a little more than just talking about him.




He knew exactly what he was doing.
 

YukiOnna

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Looks like your family gets presents this year after all.

The wrap up to the event was kinda shit. I expected them to take a different angle with Joserf, or at least expand on Durin a little more than just talking about him.




He knew exactly what he was doing.
I know right? and I just landed Witch Hat w/ Crit DMG Main and Crit Rate/HP Substat...

Is it me or Act 2's ending should have been the conclusion? or at least the final shot of Amber and Eula's thighs. I would take that, too.
 

Pejo

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I know right? and I just landed Witch Hat w/ Crit DMG Main and Crit Rate/HP Substat...

Is it me or Act 2's ending should have been the conclusion? or at least the final shot of Amber and Eula's thighs. I would take that, too.
They always kinda end these events with a fart though. Even the Archipelago event last quest was just a:



It wouldn't kill them to end on a high note once in a while.
 

YukiOnna

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They always kinda end these events with a fart though. Even the Archipelago event last quest was just a:



It wouldn't kill them to end on a high note once in a while.
When you're mimicking a Stage Play for the story but keep failing the last act...
 
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Pejo

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You could make a case for scenario 1, (in fact that's where I thought the story was headed when I first saw him) but for scenario 2 - has Albedo even ever met Joel's father? And especially - could he have given him memories of not only Joel but Joel's mother, who has been absent the entire game? Unlikely.

I do find Albedo's behavior kinda weird when they're back in Mondstadt though. I'm still not sure if that was real Albedo cracking a joke (unlike his character) or if it was Durin kinda flaunting "you don't know what the fuck to think, do you?". I hope it's more of the latter, insinuating that Durin is still out there and learning to blend in even better, making him an even bigger threat in the future. If it was Durin, that makes even more sense about the sunsettia speech.
 
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BlackM1st

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Played some mobile gacha games. Well, they all are fucking terrible and require way too much time and attention for something as simplistic as they are.

Played:

Final Gear.

Generous rewards, nice art but terrible everything else. Even on Fold 3 screen it's a micromanagement hell. New Evangelion collab is ridiculously bad. System on top of a System on top of a System within menu inside of menu.



Hilariously bad and hilariously hard to obtain the collab heroes.

Blue Archive.

GirlsFrontline killer which is VERY lttp because it's still uses chibi models (although 3d ones) while GFL 2 will use normal sized models.

Plus its world doesn't really make any sense.

I swear, some hentai Mangas have a better writing/universe building. BA is set in some kind of post apocalypse world which is strangely sterile and where there's just 1 mega high school exists and where everyone carries a lethal weapon but nobody dies. Plus elfs, plus talking anthropomorphic animals, plus just talking animals (small business owners) plus time travel plus WHAT DA FUCK.



Basically nothing makes any sense, they just needed a reason for girls to call you SENSEI and be cute while carrying some guns. Cardboard cutouts adventures. Now with guns.


Figure Fantasy.

Probably the best one among the trio. Because it's simple. It has a simple premise too: Toy Story but with anime figures and you're the only human who can actually interact with toys. Story is beyond idiotic, but can be ignored because the game is really just a 3D figure collecting sim. You can build your collection, arrange a display wall/cabinets and poke /play/ watch figures dance in AR.
Game is also probably the most "playable" and the least annoying in this mediocrity trio. Plus, it has fucking equipment sets/presets:


So I guess what I'm trying to say is that GI has absolutely nothing to worry about and trying other gacha games made me appreciate GI even more.
 

crumbs

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I know right? and I just landed Witch Hat w/ Crit DMG Main and Crit Rate/HP Substat...

Is it me or Act 2's ending should have been the conclusion? or at least the final shot of Amber and Eula's thighs. I would take that, too.

Yes, the tone at the end of Act 2 felt like an ending, plus it had an actual cut scene. Act 3 was more of an epilogue, although it did pack some interesting themes into a small bit of dialog.

It feels like the devs assume their player base has ADD and won't finish these events/stories, so they put all the good rewards/story bits in the middle rather than the end. All these events consistently end with a whimper rather than a bang.

I do appreciate that they seem to have reduced the amount of grinding required to get clear the event shop. Last year's Dragonspine flower boss seemed to require a lot of defeats to buy out the rewards compared to this year.

It is disappointing that we probably won't get more of this Durin/Albedo story until next winter. This is one of the more interesting side stories in GI, but it's hard to keep any momentum when you only get drips of story once a year.
 
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Pejo

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Played some mobile gacha games. Well, they all are fucking terrible and require way too much time and attention for something as simplistic as they are.

Played:

Final Gear.

Generous rewards, nice art but terrible everything else. Even on Fold 3 screen it's a micromanagement hell. New Evangelion collab is ridiculously bad. System on top of a System on top of a System within menu inside of menu.



Hilariously bad and hilariously hard to obtain the collab heroes.

Blue Archive.

GirlsFrontline killer which is VERY lttp because it's still uses chibi models (although 3d ones) while GFL 2 will use normal sized models.

Plus its world doesn't really make any sense.

I swear, some hentai Mangas have a better writing/universe building. BA is set in some kind of post apocalypse world which is strangely sterile and where there's just 1 mega high school exists and where everyone carries a lethal weapon but nobody dies. Plus elfs, plus talking anthropomorphic animals, plus just talking animals (small business owners) plus time travel plus WHAT DA FUCK.



Basically nothing makes any sense, they just needed a reason for girls to call you SENSEI and be cute while carrying some guns. Cardboard cutouts adventures. Now with guns.


Figure Fantasy.

Probably the best one among the trio. Because it's simple. It has a simple premise too: Toy Story but with anime figures and you're the only human who can actually interact with toys. Story is beyond idiotic, but can be ignored because the game is really just a 3D figure collecting sim. You can build your collection, arrange a display wall/cabinets and poke /play/ watch figures dance in AR.
Game is also probably the most "playable" and the least annoying in this mediocrity trio. Plus, it has fucking equipment sets/presets:


So I guess what I'm trying to say is that GI has absolutely nothing to worry about and trying other gacha games made me appreciate GI even more.
Never even heard of most of those. I enjoy the gameplay of Blue Archive though. I started it at GL launch and it's a really nice game to play for like 5 mins a day. I wish they'd stop doing PVP in gacha games, it's never fun.

Yes, the tone at the end of Act 2 felt like an ending, plus it had an actual cut scene. Act 3 was more of an epilogue, although it did pack some interesting themes into a small bit of dialog.

It feels like the devs assume their player base has ADD and won't finish these events/stories, so they put all the good rewards/story bits in the middle rather than the end. All these events consistently end with a whimper rather than a bang.

I do appreciate that they seem to have reduced the amount of grinding required to get clear the event shop. Last year's Dragonspine flower boss seemed to require a lot of defeats to buy out the rewards compared to this year.

It is disappointing that we probably won't get more of this Durin/Albedo story until next winter. This is one of the more interesting side stories in GI, but it's hard to keep any momentum when you only get drips of story once a year.
Agree with a lot of thee points. It sucks how they handle "to be continued..." quests. At least Dragonspine is drug out at roughly the same time of year. Look at Fischl and Mona, we haven't seen them in the game even once since Unreconciled Stars in 1.1, which ended with a "to be continued...".
 
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