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Halo |OT 21| Battle is the Great Redeemer | LIVE. DIE. RESPAWN.

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Captain Friendo

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Jun 24, 2014
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Because at this point letting everyone they've sold a One to play the game without having to put money down on a game launched like this would go a long way towards rebuilding trust?
At the same time you'd lose trust of MCC owners who were assured via marketing beta exclusivity catered specifically to them.
 

Mace Griffin

Neo Member
Dec 7, 2012
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All this talk about smart scope/ADS etc. etc. and this is what the ADS argument boils down to basically. You're certainly right about it, but a few days ago I had a small epiphany regarding it and haven't really seen it touched on.

In Reach, the DMR was always complained about for having reticle bloom. When Halo 4 rolled around the DMR no longer had bloom and suddenly it was everyone's go-to weapon and could pretty much stomp other people at all but extreme close range. People cried about the DMR needing a nerf because of this too. Speaking hypothetically, what if the ADS thing for scoped weapons is yet another "balancing act" move explicitly BECAUSE it takes up valuable screen real estate and slightly hinders close-by awareness?

Just a theory of course. It could simply be to pull in players of other FPS games too. :p
The only thing wrong was how easy to aim the DMR was, a simple reduction in aim assist is all that was required. In terms of balance the best way to balance weapons is to adjust damage per second until they are well balanced, not introduce ADS, bloom or any of that nonsense.
 

-Ryn

Banned
Oct 14, 2012
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Because at this point letting everyone they've sold a One to play the game without having to put money down on a game launched like this would go a long way towards rebuilding trust?

I'm already operating from the point that all betas should be open. Just give an exclusive bonus to anyone that plays in the MCC-only beta period or plays via the MCC. It isn't that hard.

If Activision can let Bungie make Destiny an open beta in the last week, I think Microsoft could manage to let 343 do something similar.
So similar to how Halo 2 allowed players to buy maps for early access or just wait for them to be released for free only on a smaller scale?

I'm down with this. I'm getting the MCC because I want to play the MCC. If there are more people in the beta, then that is great imo. I don't give a shit how they got access.

This just in, the MCC is going to suck for even longer. I doubt they are even going to fix the framerate problems in ALL the campaigns and even halo 2 anniversary MP.

I'm pretty sure they are gonna make it functional and ditch it. Can't be bothered, which is why almost every aspect of the game was outsourced to different companies.

I use try to give them the benefit of the doubt but I don't trust them in the slightest anymore. From all the stupid decisions in Halo 4 to this broken promise of a game.
Pretty much. No hope for Halo 5

I probably need to call Microsoft support because my time for getting a refund is probably running out. I've had it 8 days and played 10 games. Not full ones, either. Or even teams. Just 10 games I've managed to get in to
Such salt.

I get the disappointment but how about instead of throwing all hope for a completely different game out the window you just hold off and give it some time?
 

RandyBobandy

Banned
Jun 14, 2014
3,653
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So similar to how Halo 2 allowed players to buy maps for early access or just wait for them to be released for free only on a smaller scale?

I'm down with this. I'm getting the MCC because I want to play the MCC. If there are more people in the beta, then that is great imo. I don't give a shit how they got access.



Such salt.

I get the disappointment but how about instead of throwing all hope for a completely different game out the window you just hold off and give it some time?
Thing is, I gave them the benefit of the doubt for Halo 4 and look how that turned out. On top of that, sprint is still in the beta, so obviously they weren't listening to complaints people had with 4. Not to mention the complete failure of a launch with MCC. They've had enough chances

I just wanna play Halo. I think wanting to be able to play it properly 8 days later is a reasonable request
 

Mace Griffin

Neo Member
Dec 7, 2012
137
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Was reading the thread before class and gotta say that I totally agree with Ram. I think its time for us to let go of the notion of going back to pure classic Halo. While the mechanics certainly still work, gaming has moved on. That's not to say future Halo games can't retain those elements and layer new ones on top of them. I think, thus far, Halo 5 is taking that approach and I'm fine with it.

I'm looking forward to seeing more of H5 and how they handle different elements of Halo multiplayer. Will flag dropping return, is the Flagnum gone, will Territories come back, etc. So far they've brought back descoping, the detailed combat log, static weapon spawns, and equal starts which have made me really happy. Halo 5 is off to a pretty awesome start, IMO. (Now I just got to play it to see how all the new stuff works together and how much they should tone it down.)
I'm calling descoping removed and an ADS accuracy buff when the CoD kiddies beta testing start complaining. Good job I didn't waste any money on an xbone for Halo.

Personally the reason I liked Halo was because I liked the mechanics of "classic" Halo, they made for good gameplay. I don't like the so called "modern" mechanics, they just serve to dumb down gameplay and appeal to the lowest common denominator, not fun in my opinion.
 

RowdyReverb

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Mar 27, 2014
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I don't know how to feel. On one hand, more time means more fixes in the patch, but on the other hand it sucks to wait longer. At least it will be in before the weekend. I'm only missing out on a potential couple hours of improved matchmaking because of the delay since it's during the work week.

Maybe it would be a good idea to make the Halo 5 beta open at this point.

Give MCC owners like, the first week to themselves since they were promised access to it via the MCC, and then open it up until the end for everyone.
Why not just wait and have an open beta sometime next summer to stress test matchmaking?
 

RowdyReverb

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Mar 27, 2014
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How did gamers of old deal when they were faced with a game with glitches and brokenness?
Games weren't allowed to sell if they were full of glitches and brokenness. Certification was much more strict. Smaller bugs and exploits were fixed by releasing "revisions" in stores, meaning that all newly printed games would include fixes.
 

MouldyK

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Games weren't allowed to sell if they were full of glitches and brokenness. Certification was much more strict. Smaller bugs and exploits were fixed by releasing "revisions" in stores, meaning that all newly printed games would include fixes.
I always wonder what would happen if someone like EA released the Earth Defense Force games now as they are known for weird, low-budget things and bad frame rate, but we expect that from the games nowadays.


What if we treated it more like a game nowadays where we'd beg for them to fix the frame-rate and make the game less buggy?
 

-Ryn

Banned
Oct 14, 2012
4,191
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Thing is, I gave them the benefit of the doubt for Halo 4 and look how that turned out. On top of that, sprint is still in the beta, so obviously they weren't listening to complaints people had with 4. Not to mention the complete failure of a launch with MCC. They've had enough chances

I just wanna play Halo. I think wanting to be able to play it properly 8 days later is a reasonable request
It's completely reasonable dude.
I just don't think you should count out 343 just yet. Give them more time to fix the game. Yeah it should've been working from the get go. However they are working their asses off to make it work like it should. And when it does you can play the Halo you've been wanting to. Plus you can give the beta a shot and see if it interests you at all.

If you decide to get a refund I don't blame you. I'd recommend checking in on it though to see if it's been fixed (which I'm sure it will be).

*edit*
As to the sprint thing, there's a flip side to that coin. There are a lot of people (myself included) who like sprint in Halo. I've been playing the games since Halo 3. CE and 2 were the first Halo's I ever owned and I loved both them as well. However I still enjoy sprint in Halo.

343 are trying to find a middle ground (which personally I think would've just been a toggle and having larger maps designed around sprint with small maps being designed around no sprint). They've shown they care and that they do listen. Halo 5 looks like it's really trying learn a lot from 4's mistakes and focus on competitive features.
 

Raide

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Oct 29, 2007
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Glad I bought CoD this past weekend. I don't think they'll be able to fix these issues with this game. Zero faith in you 343.
With the majority of people wanting to play online, when the matchmaking stuff is fixed, 99% of the issues are fixed. Then they just sort out the weird random issues and its fine. 343 are Bungie and they are known for keeping things updated and tweaking as they go. Way more than some much bigger developers do.
 

Mace Griffin

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Dec 7, 2012
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RowdyReverb

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With the majority of people wanting to play online, when the matchmaking stuff is fixed, 99% of the issues are fixed. Then they just sort out the weird random issues and its fine. 343 are Bungie and they are known for keeping things updated and tweaking as they go. Way more than some much bigger developers do.
It really feels like there is one major bug that's the root of all the online issues we've been seeing. If that's true, then it stands to reason that one patch could fix many issues at once. Also, since the individual studios are likely working on game-specific fixes in the meantime, I'm optimistic about the state of the game in the near future
 

Raide

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It really feels like there is one major bug that's the root of all the online issues we've been seeing. If that's true, then it stands to reason that one patch could fix many issues at once. Also, since the individual studios are likely working on game-specific fixes in the meantime, I'm optimistic about the state of the game in the near future
I guess this is the drawback of splitting a project between multiple studios. They all have to sort and patch their own issues.

Kinda funny since when a thread appeared about MCC redeeming 343, people jumped in and said they did not have a major part in it. Now there are tech issues, its all on 343 and not the several other teams.

I am guessing the overall backend of the system is 343 which covers matchmaking etc.
 

-Ryn

Banned
Oct 14, 2012
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So based off what we know, how do you guys think these new abilities will affect vehicle combat in Halo 5? If
when
the Chopper returns, I can see the thruster pack being a major pain for it to deal with. Though I do look forward to the eventual 1 Spartan vs 6 Chopper game type.
 

Raide

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Oct 29, 2007
24,342
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So based off what we know, how do you guys think these new abilities will affect vehicle combat in Halo 5? If
when
the Chopper returns, I can see the thruster pack being a major pain for it to deal with. Though I do look forward to the eventual 1 Spartan vs 6 Chopper game type.
Did not think about that. Hrmmmm. Either we have higher mobility vehicles, lock-on abilities against Spartans on foot, or its switched off for vehicle modes.
 

willow ve

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Jul 9, 2012
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So based off what we know, how do you guys think these new abilities will affect vehicle combat in Halo 5? If
when
the Chopper returns, I can see the thruster pack being a major pain for it to deal with. Though I do look forward to the eventual 1 Spartan vs 6 Chopper game type.
I think with unlimited sprint the ground based vehicles in BTB become less and less of a factor - which is a mistake for game design in my opinion. The way they could counter this is to make BTB maps even larger and make vehicles more robust. Larger maps is a mistake for game design as well.
 

-Ryn

Banned
Oct 14, 2012
4,191
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Did not think about that. Hrmmmm. Either we have higher mobility vehicles, lock-on abilities against Spartans on foot, or its switched off for vehicle modes.
I think the Warthog could do fairly well against it. Though mongooses, and ghosts might have some trouble. I really want to see the vehicles they've got planned (please more flying vehicles). High mobility is key like you said since I doubt they would turn these off for larger game modes. The lock on idea intrigues me though. An anti infantry vehicle with high mobility and lock on would be cool.

I think with unlimited sprint the ground based vehicles in BTB become less and less of a factor - which is a mistake for game design in my opinion. The way they could counter this is to make BTB maps even larger and make vehicles more robust. Larger maps is a mistake for game design as well.
I think if the maps are made even larger then the max player count would need to be upped to accommodate that. I agree that unlimited sprint is a mistake. I'd have preferred sprint have a limit as well. Though I can see the lack of shields while sprinting work in favor for larger maps since players will likely be more vulnerable.
 

TTUVAPOR

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Jan 28, 2014
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Halo 5 EMPIRE gameplay
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Uqqe-mKN6I

While I know this is probably old to many of you, my friend linked it to me last night and I just watched it this morning. Right off the bat, I think the AR and SMG are contributing to a very fast TTK (time to kill). While the player rarely does the ADS aiming, the game looks to me like a COD match with people hip firing full-auto weapons.

I like the speed of the game, I've always wished Halo was a fast paced game like Quake in terms of movement speed, but the TTK on these full auto weapons is ridiculous, I just feel like it's trying to cater to the COD crowd, which is NOT HALO.

All of my opinions on Halo 5 are based purely on watching videos, and I know my opinions may or may not change when I actually play the game myself, but going into it, I'm already having a negative reaction because of how closely it resembles CODAW.

The person naratting in this video claims it's still very much a Halo game...eh...I don't see it gameplay-wise. Cosmetically it looks like Halo, but the gameplay looks like sci-fi COD.

A faster TTK is great, but the weapons should require some challenge to them. It looks far too easy to spray the AR and SMG and get fast easy kills. You look at Quake 3's full auto maching gun that every player spawns with, it takes forever to drain a player's armor/health to kill them with that weapon alone, as it should. Though the Quake 3 MG's clip is basically one giant clip that never gets reloaded. My point though is that in Quake 3, the TTK is very, very fast, but the weapons all take some amount of challenge to use to achieve that fast TTK. I'mt not seeing that in the H5 footage other than when people use the BR, or snipe.

Also, going back to the video of the creative director interview, I found it interesting that he keeps saying "arena" when describing Halo 5, specifically the footage they're showing. Leads me to believe Arena is a specific style of Halo 5...so maybe there's going to be the classic play as well. Arena might very well be the specific mode that allows all of these new gameplay mechanics.

If 343 is following the industry trends right now, they'll probably offer classic Halo playlists just like CODAW has in their matchmaking. Because many, many COD fans do not like the new EXO suit movement, so they have the classic to fall back on for their classic COD.

Arena sounds like it's just the classification word for this particular Halo 5 gameplay. Arena isn't really being used to describe the game as a whole, it's being used more to describe specific mode of play.
 

TheXbox

Member
Aug 26, 2012
4,598
2
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Halo 5 EMPIRE gameplay
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Uqqe-mKN6I

While I know this is probably old to many of you, my friend linked it to me last night and I just watched it this morning. Right off the bat, I think the AR and SMG are contributing to a very fast TTK (time to kill). While the player rarely does the ADS aiming, the game looks to me like a COD match with people hip firing full-auto weapons.

I like the speed of the game, I've always wished Halo was a fast paced game like Quake in terms of movement speed, but the TTK on these full auto weapons is ridiculous, I just feel like it's trying to cater to the COD crowd, which is NOT HALO.

All of my opinions on Halo 5 are based purely on watching videos, and I know my opinions may or may not change when I actually play the game myself, but going into it, I'm already having a negative reaction because of how closely it resembles CODAW.

The person naratting in this video claims it's still very much a Halo game...eh...I don't see it gameplay-wise. Cosmetically it looks like Halo, but the gameplay looks like sci-fi COD.

A faster TTK is great, but the weapons should require some challenge to them. It looks far too easy to spray the AR and SMG and get fast easy kills. You look at Quake 3's full auto maching gun that every player spawns with, it takes forever to drain a player's armor/health to kill them with that weapon alone, as it should. Though the Quake 3 MG's clip is basically one giant clip that never gets reloaded. My point though is that in Quake 3, the TTK is very, very fast, but the weapons all take some amount of challenge to use to achieve that fast TTK. I'mt not seeing that in the H5 footage other than when people use the BR, or snipe.

Also, going back to the video of the creative director interview, I found it interesting that he keeps saying "arena" when describing Halo 5, specifically the footage they're showing. Leads me to believe Arena is a specific style of Halo 5...so maybe there's going to be the classic play as well. Arena might very well be the specific mode that allows all of these new gameplay mechanics.

If 343 is following the industry trends right now, they'll probably offer classic Halo playlists just like CODAW has in their matchmaking. Because many, many COD fans do not like the new EXO suit movement, so they have the classic to fall back on for their classic COD.

Arena sounds like it's just the classification word for this particular Halo 5 gameplay. Arena isn't really being used to describe the game as a whole, it's being used more to describe specific mode of play.
I think you've got it backwards. Arena is most likely a separate hopper from the rest of the game, but it's probably as close to traditional Halo as you're going to get. I'd put money on the rest of the game having loadouts, attachments, instant respawns, killstreaks, perks, and all that other fun stuff.
 

ElzarTheBam

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Feb 27, 2011
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I honestly cannot understand the lack of basic transparency from 343.

It's filled with awesome and smart people, yet, it is probably at the bottom of my list as far as AAA developers go, and again that's down to transparency.

It stretched back to awful handling of the playlists in Reach, to finding out from some Mexican that campaign theatre was cut in 4.

Throughout the announcement of the MCC, everyone here wanted to know which versions of Halo 1and 2 were in the game, and WE had to analyse via clips which version was in the MCC.

No one likes bad news, I get it, but be honest in how you interact with your community. Yes they'll initially be let down, but they'll get over it.

Finding out the MCC was able to launch in the state that it was, is like a slap in the face to your fans.
 

TTUVAPOR

Banned
Jan 28, 2014
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I think you've got it backwards. Arena is most likely a separate hopper from the rest of the game, but it's probably as close to traditional Halo as you're going to get. I'd put money on the rest of the game having loadouts, attachments, instant respawns, killstreaks, perks, and all that other fun stuff.
One thing I forgot to mention, the auto-callouts by the announcer, I really do hope that can be disabled.

A couple reasons why:

1. It's not teaching any new players anything, it's giving them a crutch instantly to depend on for when weapons respawn
2. The whole point of map control/weapon control is to be able to mentally keep track of timing the items as they spawn and when they will respawn...the announcer basically takes that out of the player's hands

As for the teammates doing auto-callouts, I think it's similar to Shadowrun where you could press a direction on the D-pad to call out an enemy location to the rest of your team and the announcer (female by the way) would say "enemy spotted long hall", etc.
 

TTUVAPOR

Banned
Jan 28, 2014
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I'm not mad, I'm just disappointed.



There's two possibilities.

Hipfire and ADS function identically in which case ADS is a pointless addition.

There is some benefit to ADS, meaning there is some penalty to hipfire, which is not the same as traditional zoom.
According to the Halo 5 producer's tweet, hip fire remains exactly the same as we know it in all previous Halos. The ADS is not a true ADS, it's purely cosmetic.

True ADS requires the follwing:

1. Slight zoom-in on site of gun
2. Actual movement speed of aiming is slowed down
3. Graphically, the environment around your sight/scope is blurred to give off a realism effect
4. Actual bullet trajectory is tighter to mimick precision aiming as opposed to hip fire spraying

If Halo 5's ADS doesn't have all of those, then it's cosmetic.

In other words, with the SMG, if I choose to aim with classic aiming, e.g., hip fire, the spray of the bullets should be no different from aiming down the sights. If there's a difference, then Halo 5 has incorporated a true ADS mechanic...which in my opinion deservces no place in Halo...ever.

But like I said, the producer said in his tweet that regular aiming works exactly the same as classic Halo. If ADS gives more advantage than just basic zoom...then we've got issues.
 
Jun 26, 2014
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According to the Halo 5 producer's tweet, hip fire remains exactly the same as we know it in all previous Halos. The ADS is not a true ADS, it's purely cosmetic.

True ADS requires the follwing:

1. Slight zoom-in on site of gun
2. Actual movement speed of aiming is slowed down
3. Graphically, the environment around your sight/scope is blurred to give off a realism effect
4. Actual bullet trajectory is tighter to mimick precision aiming as opposed to hip fire spraying

If Halo 5's ADS doesn't have all of those, then it's cosmetic.

In other words, with the SMG, if I choose to aim with classic aiming, e.g., hip fire, the spray of the bullets should be no different from aiming down the sights. If there's a difference, then Halo 5 has incorporated a true ADS mechanic...which in my opinion deservces no place in Halo...ever.
Let's say ADS is identical to hipfire in every way, then what is the fucking point?


Anyway, if you don't believe that there will be benefits to ADSing, you are lying to yourself.
 

Gabotron ES

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According to the Halo 5 producer's tweet, hip fire remains exactly the same as we know it in all previous Halos. The ADS is not a true ADS, it's purely cosmetic.

True ADS requires the follwing:

1. Slight zoom-in on site of gun
2. Actual movement speed of aiming is slowed down
3. Graphically, the environment around your sight/scope is blurred to give off a realism effect
4. Actual bullet trajectory is tighter to mimick precision aiming as opposed to hip fire spraying

If Halo 5's ADS doesn't have all of those, then it's cosmetic.

In other words, with the SMG, if I choose to aim with classic aiming, e.g., hip fire, the spray of the bullets should be no different from aiming down the sights. If there's a difference, then Halo 5 has incorporated a true ADS mechanic...which in my opinion deservces no place in Halo...ever.

But like I said, the producer said in his tweet that regular aiming works exactly the same as classic Halo. If ADS gives more advantage than just basic zoom...then we've got issues.
From the gameplay I have watched and even some impressions from some members this is actually not the case.
 

TTUVAPOR

Banned
Jan 28, 2014
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Let's say ADS is identical to hipfire in every way, then what is the fucking point?


Anyway, if you don't believe that there will be benefits to ADSing, you are lying to yourself.
The point is to appease the COD gamer. It's all about familiarity. At first they will think it helps them, but if what the producer says is true, people constantly using ADS, which is basically re-skinned scoping, will get destroyed like they normally would in previous Halo titles.

Again, if it's purely cosmetic, then it's just a gimmick to attract the so-called "modern" gamer. It's a disguise.
 

Detective

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Mar 3, 2014
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I think you've got it backwards. Arena is most likely a separate hopper from the rest of the game, but it's probably as close to traditional Halo as you're going to get. I'd put money on the rest of the game having loadouts, attachments, instant respawns, killstreaks, perks, and all that other fun stuff.
IF that happen then its better to play COD instead.

I dont buy Halo to play Halo with COD mechanism, I buy Halo to play Halo.

They can forget about my money and others I know, Not that I know millions.

So I will take a stand and vote with my wallet..

Of course all of that is a wait and see progress.. I didn't think a time would come where me and others resemble Halo to COD. To painful.
 

TTUVAPOR

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Jan 28, 2014
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From the gameplay I have watched and even some impressions from some members this is actually not the case.
Well then we have issues because the producer is being full of crap if it's not purely cosmetic.

I'm hesitant to believe anything because no 343 employee has actually come out and said "We do not have traditional aim down the sights gameplay mechanics in Halo 5. How you're used to seeing ADS used in games such as COD and Battlefield, it is not that way in Halo 5."

Simple statement for them to say, but the fact they haven't actually said something like that leads me to believe otherwise.


EDIT:

Ill go further and say, if you were to ask me if the sky is blue and I didn't give you a direct "yes, the sky is blue" answer...then the sky isn't freaking blue...if I designed the sky. ;)
 

Akai__

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Jun 14, 2012
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Finally bought a chat adapter. Now I can use my Astro headset for chat and game sound.

Wished it wouldn't require this clunky chat adapter. I still don't understand why there is no chat support for USB headsets.
 
Jun 26, 2014
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The point is to appease the COD gamer. It's all about familiarity. At first they will think it helps them, but if what the producer says is true, people constantly using ADS, which is basically re-skinned scoping, will get destroyed like they normally would in previous Halo titles.

Again, if it's purely cosmetic, then it's just a gimmick to attract the so-called "modern" gamer. It's a disguise.
So you have faith in a developer that used one of the precious few buttons on a controller to add a feature that does absolutely nothing?
 

TTUVAPOR

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Jan 28, 2014
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So you have faith in a developer that used one of the precious few buttons on a controller to add a feature that does absolutely nothing?
I do not have faith in them at all, they're still being too vague. I'm simply drawing a hypothetical based off the information they have stated through video interviews and tweets.

The prodcuer flat out said:

"No penalty to hip fire in H5, no movement penalty when scoping/zooming, no flinch."

Vague. But, also he didn't say you don't get an increase in accuracy if you ADS, you just don't lose any accuracy in hip fire.

At this point man, I don't know what to think anymore.
 

willow ve

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I do not have faith in them at all, they're still being too vague. I'm simply drawing a hypothetical based off the information they have stated through video interviews and tweets.

The prodcuer flat out said:

"No penalty to hip fire in H5, no movement penalty when scoping/zooming, no flinch."

Vague. But, also he didn't say you don't get an increase in accuracy if you ADS, you just don't lose any accuracy in hip fire.

At this point man, I don't know what to think anymore.
From game play video the reticle quite obviously constricts when using ADS on auto weapons. It's not 100% cosmetic.
 

TTUVAPOR

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From game play video the reticle quite obviously constricts when using ADS on auto weapons. It's not 100% cosmetic.
If that's the case, then they actually did what I thought they would eventually do, added ADS gameplay to Halo. Still fathoms me. The day would come though.

I'm really anxious to see how the general community reacts to this. Halo 4 didn't have ADS, it was just a really bad, bad game. If Halo 5 continues that trend of being bad, then I feel bad for the future of Halo.

At least we have MCC in semi-working condition.
 

op_ivy

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From game play video the reticle quite obviously constricts when using ADS on auto weapons. It's not 100% cosmetic.
it does on all weapons though. that is not evidence it effects anything
 

Kampfheld

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Feb 19, 2014
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I think with unlimited sprint the ground based vehicles in BTB become less and less of a factor - which is a mistake for game design in my opinion. The way they could counter this is to make BTB maps even larger and make vehicles more robust. Larger maps is a mistake for game design as well.
These guys probably read damn much The Fall of Reach, looked at each other and said: well, these fights are huge. And now, let's bring this scope into the multiplayer game. In fact, you can not bring the scope of a book into a video game - but you know what I'm trying to say here.
That's all I can tell you in terms of size.
 

Sephzilla

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i totally understand people's gripes with MCC right now and being upset the patch got delayed a few days. but, for perspective, the big "fix most of the things" patch for Halo 2 came out six months post launch. wish people would be more patient, but neogaf.gif.
 

tootsi666

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These guys probably read damn much The Fall of Reach, looked at each other and said: well, these fights are huge. And now, let's bring this scope into the multiplayer game. In fact, you can not bring the scope of a book into a video game - but you know what I'm trying to say here.
That's all I can tell you in terms of size.
Don't do this to me
 

Saganism

Banned
Oct 6, 2014
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These guys probably read damn much The Fall of Reach, looked at each other and said: well, these fights are huge. And now, let's bring this scope into the multiplayer game. In fact, you can not bring the scope of a book into a video game - but you know what I'm trying to say here.
That's all I can tell you in terms of size.


Kampfheld dropping bombs...
 

dwells

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Dec 9, 2013
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I honestly cannot understand the lack of basic transparency from 343.

...

Throughout the announcement of the MCC, everyone here wanted to know which versions of Halo 1and 2 were in the game, and WE had to analyse via clips which version was in the MCC.

No one likes bad news, I get it, but be honest in how you interact with your community. Yes they'll initially be let down, but they'll get over it.

Finding out the MCC was able to launch in the state that it was, is like a slap in the face to your fans.
Yep, this is a big part of it for me, as well. They still won't answer questions about what versions of the games were used, what changes were made, how netcode was adjusted for dedicated servers, etc.

It's ridiculous. All this talk about it being a "love letter to Halo" and fan service, but they won't answer real fan questions, they've gone back on or changed so much of what they said before, and there's no transparency whatsoever on all of this mess.

Seriously, a real honest apology that takes full blame and admits that the game was unfinished and should've never seen the light of day in its current state would go a long way for me.

But this ridiculous rhetoric of "issues surfaced at launch" is just flat-out insulting. There's really two possibilities with that one.

  1. They're telling the truth and somehow missed all of these various problems, many of which were immediately obvious and many of which are clearly game bugs and not server issues. Some of them are things that happened in previous builds (like freezing and crashing at public demos and tournaments) and quickly swept under the rug of "it's an old build, stop fussing and don't worry about it."

    Even with almost no QA or testing whatsoever, a lot of this stuff still would've been known one way or another. Halo 4 and Halo CE's campaign experiencing serious frame drops, sometimes to the point of being unplayable, for example. Halo 4 crashing hard to a black screen with red console text advising a reboot? I've never seen anything like that in a shipped console title.

    But they expect us to believe that they weren't aware of any of this. If that were somehow true, it just means that they're guilty of absolute gross incompetence in testing and quality assurance. Sorry if that sounds harsh, but it's the truth. If you miss dozens and dozens of serious bugs, including multiple major game breaking ones and crashes, then something is very, very wrong at your studio.
  2. They knew about the game having problems, they knew it was unfinished (scrambling to finish a 15GB patch after the game went gold), and for whatever reason they released it anyway. This is pretty obviously what happened. But instead they'll keep lying to use with the "issues surfaced at launch" nonsense.

The whole thing is ridiculous. I get that things don't go as planned and that there's a ton of pressure to get things out the door. But if they could just be honest and upfront about the whole thing, I think a lot of us would be a lot more understanding and empathetic.Treating your customers like idiots and expecting them to buy into some "oh, we had no idea there were any problems at all" line is just insulting.
 
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